One of these days I'm going to come out of retirement and give you both a thrashing to remind you how the game is supposed to be played.You won the other game at leastAlso we both made ME mad with these scum wins of ours
I'm trying to take our shipping past the meta mislynches.
It's always been past that. You should try showing me more affection.
It's also the first game I've balanced on my own, so I'll get there eventually.
Bodyguard could still stop mafia from killing one of the 3 OP roles quickly. Since there are 3 OP roles mafia couldn't really dispose all of them until Night 3, so some of them would get the chance to make some really beneficial plays. Reloader could be very powerful; by the time we figure out it exists, decide it is worth killing, try to kill it and potentially hit bulletproof etc. it gets more than enough time to pull off really OP plays. It wouldn't benefit scum that much, all it took was one clear with a claimed 1x role and they would make sure only town would ever benefit from it. Two would have made it more balanced, for sure, but even then we had no way to know that from a Rolecop result the way you worded it; I would go for "Nights 1-3 1x Bulletproof" for clarity. 3 nights with both Cop and Reloader protected can be more than enough to pull off OP plays... we were indeed lucky with one of these, but in that case the Developer lives for too long; it's just too hard to dispose of all the major threats in time. With just a bit more coordination from town + claiming earlier there's nothing we could've done; we were close to that point anyway, as I stated in the QT Pikapika couldn't claim and get away with it while jd/WO/Caps made quite a core of chain confirmations by confirming they acted on each other at night.1. Let's imagine the setup without any bulletproof. Town has no protection other than weak hider, which can end in two deaths for a night. I personally don't think Reloader is that powerful, and I made sure it could also benefit scum. That's the only reason your role had it to begin with. So, I decided that if the cop died early, town didn't have too much power. And I decided to give it bulletproof. I knew that would've been too OP however, so I limited it to three nights. Would two have made it more balanced? And since Holly and Trouble are the same, I decided to give them both the same bulletproof status so town had some protection. After Night 3, however, they're unprotected without a doctor.
2. Developer starts off weak, and it's a role that relies on RNG luck due to the MUP modifier, which makes it swingy. Caps had pretty good luck, able to use Crazy Romantic and Sacrificer later in the game. If luck was truly bad, Caps might not have been able to use a role at all. And it's only because he survived that long that he was able to become so powerful. If he was killed early on, town would look to be quite underpowered. This is all following my belief that Reloader wasn't that powerful though. I based the entire setup around it.
3. I'll admit, Usurper is a pretty anti-scum role, but I loved the look of it so much and it fit the character perfectly. That being said, your explosive modifier was pretty OP as well. If you had to eventually die, that's a lot of power from the town gone for the next night.
4. Just to go back to the bulletproof thing, there aren't too many games where cops die in the first 2 or so nights. I just felt that early on, cop was the only good role town had, and if they died early, it would've made them UP until developer caught up. If developer was killed early, that would've prevented any reloading.
Thanks for the comments Zexy. They are really appreciated for my improvement
Bodyguard could still stop mafia from killing one of the 3 OP roles quickly. Since there are 3 OP roles mafia couldn't really dispose all of them until Night 3, so some of them would get the chance to make some really beneficial plays. Reloader could be very powerful; by the time we figure out it exists, decide it is worth killing, try to kill it and potentially hit bulletproof etc. it gets more than enough time to pull off really OP plays. It wouldn't benefit scum that much, all it took was one clear with a claimed 1x role and they would make sure only town would ever benefit from it. Two would have made it more balanced, for sure, but even then we had no way to know that from a Rolecop result the way you worded it; I would go for "Nights 1-3 1x Bulletproof" for clarity. 3 nights with both Cop and Reloader protected can be more than enough to pull off OP plays... we were indeed lucky with one of these, but in that case the Developer lives for too long; it's just too hard to dispose of all the major threats in time. With just a bit more coordination from town + claiming earlier there's nothing we could've done; we were close to that point anyway, as I stated in the QT Pikapika couldn't claim and get away with it while jd/WO/Caps made quite a core of chain confirmations by confirming they acted on each other at night.
The thing with luck is that luck won't always be good or bad; if it does it's OK, eh. But that's rare. In practice you may get lucky with one death (in our case LG's) but quite unlucky with one or both of the rest. Not to mention that upon killing either of the Bulletproofs you should expect to not see more Bulletproof PRs just because of how OP it seems and how swingy it looks when you only have half of the info. And yeah, guess that's our difference; I think Reloader could be very overpowered because almost everyone had good 1x abilities. Basing the entire setup around it was indeed a cool idea, and in that case I can see why it gets 1x Bulletproof... but Cop shouldn't have got it. Besides, Cop is considered so universally strong that you don't regularly try to make it stronger; if anything it is made weaker. Cop-centric games are an obvious expection.
Not sure how much it fits the character or not, if that's the case you should've included it but get it announced (else the game is technically bastard) and actually consider it quite pro-town when balancing. I don't think explosive was that OP, if it would also block the Bulletproofs that night then maybe.
There should still be the potential for Cop to die soon; Cop is strong by itself, as said earlier; there's almost never a good reason to make it stronger. Reloader is OP since early on imo, and you'd rather give Developer the 1x Bulletproof since it was a central mechanic than a plain Cop which is just something almost all games have.
Let's not also forget that Sensor and Spy can also be very pro-town because they're very unexpected in a way that can potentially out the entire team. In practice it is more probable they'll reveal less but if you have them both and they are reloadable they can be real trouble. We got lucky with them too.
You're welcome. Sorry if they sound a bit harsh but I honestly believe this game had a few points that should be avoided. For your first time alone you did well (might be less pro-town than XY&Z, with the way it played out it's hard to tell).
Also a note on indeps; they can be very disruptive and the most common ones, Survivor/Jester, can actually get more challenging with a Voteless modifier. It also gives them an interesting way to clear themselves by proving the votelessness if they want to try it. Which is why I like Voteless indeps and you'll probably be seeing them more in my games
Wouldn't that make it too easy for the indep?Also a note on indeps; they can be very disruptive and the most common ones, Survivor/Jester, can actually get more challenging with a Voteless modifier. It also gives them an interesting way to clear themselves by proving the votelessness if they want to try it. Which is why I like Voteless indeps and you'll probably be seeing them more in my games
Not necessarily. Keep in mind that non-factional indeps don't have to be balanced to have the same difficulty of winning as town/mafia. The balance comes from the fact that even if the role is easy to win as, anyone has equal chances of getting it. This is not the case for factional indeps such as Serial Killer, whose chances of winning affect town/mafia greatly.
Or in the case of the Spirit of Justice Mafia, Vanilla, which is what I claimed, while being scum.
I think it has to be this...
How cute you think yourself better than you are
