SPECULATION: Lillie's Original Region

[Ereshkigal]

Lusamine and Guzma do not resemble Pheromosa and Xurkitree, at least not within the story. Those Ultra Beasts had never been seen until Lusamine used Cosmog to open wormholes all over Alola. Only Nihilego and Guzzlord had made prior appearances, and we know that the circumstances of Guzzlord's appearance weren't related to the Aether Foundation. Which leaves Nihilego. The one Beast that has been spotted prior to the events of the story, and the one Beast that Mohn's papers were said to be about, and the one Beast that Lusamine is surrounded by and fawns over when she is in Ultra Space.

She's obsessed with Nihilego, but not with being Nihilego. That's why she doesn't imitate it herself; she sees it as something she wants to care for in the warped way that she "cares for" her children.

I'll cover the issue of Nihilego being spotted in the next quote.

If Lusamine is surrounded by Nihilego that she dresses people to resemble it, then why does none of the rest of the Aether Foundation resemble Nihilego?

And if she doesn't want to be it, then why does she take the first opportunity to merge with it in Ultra Space? Some would suggest the poison, but I really don't see any sign of her acting any differently during that moment than she had prior in the game.

It couldn't have had regular contact with anybody. It never appeared in the normal dimension until halfway through the story. Judging from her reaction, that's the first time that Lusamine has seen one for herself, and if even Lusamine hadn't met one until then, then Lillie damn sure hadn't come across one.

Nihilego acting like a little girl is just another small embellishment, to add a touch of symmetry between it and Lillie. Lusamine is essentially replacing Lillie with a more "ideal" "daughter," so it follows that Nihilego acts like a prospective daughter.

Alright, and here's where the entire idea of Lillie being dressed like Nihilego falls apart again: If Lusamine had never seen one before but is dressing Lillie up to resemble what's in some scientific papers, then why is there no indication she did the exact same for Gladion? We know she controlled his appearance, but there's no indication he was dressed exactly the same as Lillie. Why does she not do the same for anyone else in the Aether Foundation she cares about? Why does she only pursue Lillie to get Cosmog back instead of pursuing Lillie to get her daughter back? For someone who supposedly wants to care about a Pokemon like she cares about her children, she shows no sign in the game of actually caring about her children.

If anything, throughout the game she consistently acts uncaring toward her children and unafraid to use and dispose of them for her own advancement.

You're also forgetting that Nihilego can possess people. Even if they never had met in person, the Pokemon could still have had her as the little girl it interacted with most through it possessing Mohn. We don't know if the creature can pick up memories or not from people, but its acting like a little girl provides the possibility it can. We know, from in-game evidence, that Nihilego can massively change its appearance. We've seen this happen. We have no indication that Nihilego had its current appearance when Mohn first met it, rather than taking on that appearance at that meeting.

And that provides a simple explanation for all of the Ultra Beasts and any appearance similarities: They are trying to mimic people. That's why Lusamine and Pheromosa look so similar. That's why Guzma and Xurkitree look so similar. And Nihilego looks like Lillie not because she was dressed after it, but because it's trying to mimic her, and even looks a bit like her, after learning about her from her parents. And Lillie is dressed as she is because her mother dresses her like she's part of the Foundation. Simple, easy, effective, doesn't leave any contradictions.

Edit: And I'm noticing we've completely derailed this thread >.<

Want to take the topic to a different one so this one can get back on track?

 

[Esserise]

If Lusamine is surrounded by Nihilego that she dresses people to resemble it, then why does none of the rest of the Aether Foundation resemble Nihilego?

Again, the symmetry is meant to be between Nihilego and Lusamine's children, not Nihilego and Lusamine's entire sphere of influence. She doesn't dress the Foundation members like it for the simple reason that it's not what the story is intending for her character to do.

And if she doesn't want to be it, then why does she take the first opportunity to merge with it in Ultra Space?

She didn't "take the first opportunity," though. She was in Ultra Space for quite a while before we showed up, and didn't merge with it until she decided to battle us. It was a power move.

then why is there no indication she did the exact same for Gladion? We know she controlled his appearance, but there's no indication he was dressed exactly the same as Lillie.

There's no indication one way or the other as to how she dressed Gladion, so you can't say that she didn't dress him like Nihilego any more than you can say she did.

Why does she not do the same for anyone else in the Aether Foundation she cares about?

Frankly, I never much got the sense that she had any particular feelings toward the other Foundation members. The story doesn't explore that area at all.

Why does she only pursue Lillie to get Cosmog back instead of pursuing Lillie to get her daughter back? For someone who supposedly wants to care about a Pokemon like she cares about her children, she shows no sign in the game of actually caring about her children. If anything, throughout the game she consistently acts uncaring toward her children and unafraid to use and dispose of them for her own advancement.

Um... yeah? That's kinda the whole point... Gladion ran away, and then Lillie ran away, which Lusamine, in the midst of her warped grief-turned-obsession, perceived as being rejected by them. As she sees it, they decided they didn't need her anymore, so she feels she no longer needs them. Mohn is gone, her kids ran away from her, and all she has left is her obsession with the Ultra Beasts.

> Lusamine: My... You do say such incomprehensible things. Calling me mother? I don't have any children! Certainly not any wretched children who would run off and reject my love!

> Lusamine: Maybe if you really had been a daughter to me, I would have listened to you... Too bad.

> Lusamine: The daughter who stole my Cosmog from me and the son who took my Type: Null! All I ever did was give you two all the love I had, and all you did was betray me! You have no right to ask for my attention now!

You're also forgetting that Nihilego can possess people. Even if they never had met in person, the Pokemon could still have had her as the little girl it interacted with most through it possessing Mohn.

It didn't possess Mohn... There's no suggestion that Nihilego or any other UBs appeared when Mohn opened a wormhole to Ultra Space, or that Lusamine was even present at that moment. Mohn didn't get possessed, he tried to open a wormhole, but the experiment went south and he fell in, leaving behind Cosmog and his research papers about Nihilego. Some time later, he popped out on Poké Pelago with no memory of who he was.

And that provides a simple explanation for all of the Ultra Beasts and any appearance similarities: They are trying to mimic people.

Mimicking people from a different dimension with whom those UBs have never come into contact? (And why would they do this? Why would four Pheromosa decide to style themselves after Lusamine, or two Xurkitree style themselves after Guzma, or an entire horde of Nihilego style themselves after Lillie? And why only those three species of UB? Moreover, how? Only Nihilego is said to have shapeshifting capabilities.)

Want to take the topic to a different one so this one can get back on track?

Sure. Anywhere in particular?

 

[Ereshkigal]

Sure. Anywhere in particular?

Lillie, Lusamine, Ultra Beasts, Doppelgangers (Spoilers abound)

 

[SinnohEevee]

How about Kanto?

 

[Alola]

LOL remember when this was a thing.

That being said, Lillie's home region may be explored in Ultra Sun & Moon. I don't believe we ever got confirmation on this in Sun & Moon...

Or was it confirmed she and her family originated from Aether Paradise, basically?

 

[Silktree]

Her grandfather founded the Aether Foundation, so it is not unthinkable that even Lusamine grew up in the paradise. It seems likely for her children, at least.

 

[KaylaBaraonda]

Lusamine's father founded Aether Foundation, Lusamine's mother was propably also part of the same. So it's likely that Lusamine, Gladion, and Lillie were always from Aether Paradise. Mohn could have grown up in Alola, too. Colress is propably related but his side of the family stayed in Unova instead while Lusa's father and mother went to Alola.

Originally they're of Kalosian descent, and\or some PokéGermany or PokéSwitzerland descent. So Gladion and Lillie are the Pokéworld vague equivalent (vague because well, Unova\Kalos\Alola just have a New York\France\Hawaii motif) of German-American people (with also some French, British, and Scandinavian descent) living in Hawaii.

 

[TechSkylander1518]

Originally they're of Kalosian descent, and\or some PokéGermany or PokéSwitzerland descent.

Where was this confirmed?

Colress is propably related

The only basis to that theory is "science blondes must be from the same family". If Colress was really related, wouldn't he have some passing significance while he was in Alola?

 

[KaylaBaraonda]

Mostly vague headcanon and wishful thinking.

After all, they were designed separately, and hair and eye colors (and sometimes even skin) in the Pokéworld mostly seem to follow anime rules moreso than actual genetics.

I like to think of Colress being Faba and Wicke's son, or Grimsley's brother, but I know that most likely nobody of them are related unless there is an in-game family connection.

 

[Matleo]

blond hair, affinity to ice types and to pseudo-legendary pokemon?
based on nordic, full ice clima region?

 

[TechSkylander1518]

blond hair, affinity to ice types and to pseudo-legendary pokemon?

?????????
Only one of those things describes Lillie.

 

[Matleo]

?????????
Only one of those things describes Lillie.

she has a alolan vulpix? that would suggest ice type trainer.
She probably will have a relation with Solgaleo.
Her brother has Type Null-->Silvaly.

Only wishfull thinking about a nordic, icy region with more new ice types.

 

[TechSkylander1518]

she has a alolan vulpix? that would suggest ice type trainer.

In the anime, not in the games. And one Ice-type does not make an Ice-type specialist.

She probably will have a relation with Solgaleo.
Her brother has Type Null-->Silvaly.

None of which are pseudo-legendaries.

Only wishfull thinking about a nordic, icy region with more new ice types.

Then post that on the threads made for speculating about future regions. Don't try to force it to fit into a different subject.

 

[PkmnTrainerV]

I think it’d be safe to assume she's from Alola.

If not, then I'd think it’s Kalos or a German region, like some have said earlier.

 

[Foxwarrior]

I think she's from a region that we never visited yet, like poke Germany, poke Canada or poke Scandinavia, but the possibilities are countless.

If she's from a known region, i'd bet she's either from Unova, Sinnoh or Kalos.
Lillie mentioned Kanto, so if she were from that region she would say it.

Hoenn has magma/aqua as the scientists, and also the Stone family. Taking account the plot i don't think Lusamine's big business would compete with Devon as Aether was never even mentioned previously.

Johto... i can't see it, it's a very "traditional" region, not science and business oriented at all, but not impossible.

 

[SinnohEevee]

Maybe Gen 8's region.