What do you think about TRio in Best Wishes?

[Garren]

I think the problem is, no matter how super serious they are, they're pretty much doing the exact same stuff they've done the last 10 years, only now they're stoic and boring while doing it.

 

[Dogasu]

So I guess you thought DP092 was OOC as well? This is the exact same situation. Not to mention they were like this in the "Love and Origin of Youth" side story as well as episode two of the original series.

So three episodes (and I disagree with you about DP 092, by the way) supersede the other 600+?

 

[Yoshi-san]

So three episodes (and I disagree with you about DP 092, by the way) supersede the other 600+?

Yeah because seeing the same thing 600+ times is VERY refreshing right Dogasu?

Like I said before it's just 4 episodes. Give them a chance.

 

[Musashi]

So three episodes (and I disagree with you about DP 092, by the way) supersede the other 600+?

I'm just saying it shows that that attitude is within them and they just don't have a chance to show it much.

And why do you disagree about DP092? I think that's the perfect example of showing how they can be serious and competent when they need to be.

 

[Hellion]

And this attitude did pretty much come out of nowhere.

Did it really? They wanted to help Team Rocket take over Hoenn and Sinnoh. That's not new. They want to please Giovanni and further his goals. That's not new. They are not above stealing, lying, etc. to get their way, that's not new.

To me, I sorta see Team Rocket's new attitude as Jessie's newfound focus in contests in DP. In AG she was entering them without being super serious, she cheated on numerous occasions. But in DP, she took it much more seriously prompting some amazing character developpement for her. That's what I think this arc will be for them. Team Rocket is getting more focused on their goal and therefore recieve more plot which ultimately leads to some character developpement.

I think it's still really early to pass judgement on them like that. For crying out loud, we're in episode 4 and they've already had a few crowning moments of awesome and been responsible for a few laughs like Meowth in the last episode.

I'm sorry but their personalities haven't vanished. Just because they are not blasting off and trying to steal Pikachu every damn episode like they did althrough Johto and they are now actually recieving some focus and some storyline, doesn't mean it's a bad thing. They're recieving character developpement. OFF WITH THEIR HEADS.

Some people are always complaining that the show is stuck, that it's static, that it's not moving and whenever it does, you automatically have people whining.

The show's evolving, get with it or stop watching.

 

[Daren]

The only thing I dislike with their sudden burst of competance is that Ash still suffered from New Region Regression Syndrome (NRRS). It just seems "odd" to me.

 

[Hellwarden]

Well, I don't think the show ever said how much of a break there was between the end of DP and the BW was did? For all we know, Team Rocket was trained extensively by the Rocket elites. Plus Team Rocket has always been shown to be somewhat competent trainers in their own right when they matched up against a legitimate enemy.

 

[Dogasu]

Yeah because seeing the same thing 600+ times is VERY refreshing right Dogasu?

Old Rocket-Dan wasn't the same thing 600+ times. No more than Satoshi has been doing the same thing 600+ times.

It's very easy to make blanket statements like "they just try to catch Pikachu in every episode," but the truth is that that's not even close to being all they do.

Like I said before it's just 4 episodes. Give them a chance.

I am giving them a chance. Have you not seen all the posts I've made where I say that I'm aware that we're still very early in the series? I've been saying that over and over.

I'm just saying it shows that that attitude is within them and they just don't have a chance to show it much.

Still, when the overwhelming majority of the material out there shows them being funny and lovable, then that's what their personalities are. The episodes you listed are exceptions, not the rule.

And why do you disagree about DP092? I think that's the perfect example of showing how they can be serious and competent when they need to be.

I've never complained about them being competent. I'm talking about personality here. Not competence.

And they still had their personalities intact in DP 092. I can't imagine Best Wishes! Rocket-Dan gorging themselves on food to the point where they get cartoonishly fat. I can't imagine Best Wishes! Rocket-Dan stuffing Monster Balls into a venus fly trap thing. I can't imagine Best Wishes! Rocket-Dan having a Boss Fantasy.

Did it really? They wanted to help Team Rocket take over Hoenn and Sinnoh. That's not new. They want to please Giovanni and further his goals. That's not new. They are not above stealing, lying, etc. to get their way, that's not new.

Yes, and they did all that while still being themselves.

But in DP, she took it much more seriously prompting some amazing character developpement for her.

Yes, she took Contests more seriously. But she was still Musashi.

I don't understand what's so hard about this.

They're recieving character developpement. OFF WITH THEIR HEADS.

Throwing away thirteen years of precedent and lobotomizing a couple of characters is not "character development."

 

[Cybersai]

Well look at it this way, they sure did find a way to have Jessie give up being a coordinator despite being successfull in them now.

I remember we all wondered what Jessie would do now that Contests are gone, but they did away with her contest persona quite well.

 

[Hellion]

I am giving them a chance. Have you not seen all the posts I've made where I say that I'm aware that we're still very early in the series? I've been saying that over and over.

Yeah... but that's half the truth. In all of those posts, you were like, "Bla bla bla, hate the new rockets, they're dull, bla bla bla polysyllabic bla. Oh yeah, but it's still early, they might still have a chance to bring back the old Team Rocket soon."

No, be honest you are not giving them a chance. Giving something a chance is accepting the change that's been done and waiting to see where the writers are going with it. You're not doing that. Embrace the new for a while, accept that the Rockets really have changed and see where it's going.

Yes, and they did all that while still being themselves.

Did you even look at the episodes? Take this week's episode. Meowth disguised himself and made a fool out Don and his cronies. Jessie and James trying to run with Pikachu like it's nothing. They still are the same character, just a bit more mature, a bit more edgy.

Throwing away thirteen years of precedent and lobotomizing a couple of characters is not "character development."

Rehashing the same old stuff isn't exactly character developpement either. I'm sorry but I fail to see how the organization of Team Rocket and Giovanni actually playing a bigger part thus influencing JJM into taking themselves more seriously and being more and more dedicated to their mission cannot be seen as character developpement.

When they learn that they couldn't have their pokemon, they might have not started crying like children, but they still were startled by this. Meowth even going as far as being worried to be separated from Jessie and James. They still care about their pokemon and they still cared about each other. Then we actually saw Meowth fight. When's the last time we saw that? So much for no character developpement.

I'm not missing the repetitive blastoffs now I've got deltaplanes, I'm actually enjoying James holding a gigantic glass of wine while saying he's the pure heart of darkness. I like this turn of events and I'm curious to see where the writers are going with this just as I was curious to see where they would go with Jessie taking contests seriously in DP. I actually want to see more of Team Rocket now.

Their personalities, their appeal, it's still there. You just have to not turn a blind eye on it.

 

[Cybersai]

Team Rocket really didn't even try to capture Pikachu that much in DP. Sure it happened from time to time, but it wasn't in every single ep anymore like in the Johto saga.

 

[PDL]

Team Rocket has change a bit, but at the same time, change is a good thing. Most people complained how Team Rocket has become a useless addition in the show due to how ineffective they were in normal episodes. Showing that they can be competent is a good way to earn their addition back.

To be honest, I think that Giovanni has plans for TRio to do something that isn't involved with stealing Pokémon like they think they're doing. It's very strange that the boss who had almost forgotten them at the begining of DP is now using them in a special project in a region where they have no presence. Not to mention that there has to be more with that secretary, she's sure appeared alot for a minor character.

Once that real plan is revealed, their old goofy personalities might return, but this won't happen until perhaps a few episodes or maybe even a third or half-way through Best Wishes.

Koromori is a odd choice for characters who are ment to become serious. Seeing that it's basically the cross between Zubat, Bidoof and Slowpoke plus it seems to be Pokémon that isn't too bright (it's abilities include Klutz, Unaware and Simple.)

 

[Cybersai]

This is why I can't wait till Butch/Cassidy appear in BW, just to see their reactions to the trio.

Butch/Cassidy have appeared at least once in every saga, so I think them getting a BW appearance is likely.

 

[NeoMiniTails]

Honestly, the pokemon series and the TRio have always hinted how serious they were before they met the twerps. And they got goofier with each series and even on the episode when they went back to Kanto ways in DP, they showed how much damage they could put on the main group if only they hadn't use recycled machine parts for the machine.

And now that their plans are based off Giovanni and not off the group trying to please him, it makes sense that the show won't allow Giovanni's plans to be foiled as easily...

 

[Dogasu]

Yeah... but that's half the truth. In all of those posts, you were like, "Bla bla bla, hate the new rockets, they're dull, bla bla bla polysyllabic bla. Oh yeah, but it's still early, they might still have a chance to bring back the old Team Rocket soon."

No, be honest you are not giving them a chance. Giving something a chance is accepting the change that's been done and waiting to see where the writers are going with it. You're not doing that. Embrace the new for a while, accept that the Rockets really have changed and see where it's going.

I actually am giving them a chance, though. I watch each episode desperately searching for things to like, but so far the list is pretty freaking short. I like the new motto. I like seeing how they're going to exit the episode (smoke bombs, para-gliders, etc.) each week. I like Musashi's Koromori, the one time we've seen it. I like that Nyasu is still Nyasu, more or less.

I am trying, but the parts I don't like are kind of overshadowing all the parts I do like.

Take this week's episode. Meowth disguised himself and made a fool out Don and his cronies. Jessie and James trying to run with Pikachu like it's nothing. They still are the same character, just a bit more mature, a bit more edgy.

I've stated, time and time again, that Nyasu is the only member I feel is actually acting in-character. His Blackee disguise was great, and the interactions between him and Don George were funny.

I'm not seeing how Musashi and Kojirou calmly walking away is something that any other thief character wouldn't have done, though.

When they learn that they couldn't have their pokemon, they might have not started crying like children, but they still were startled by this.

I actually wish we had seen them be told that they couldn't bring their old pokemon with them. The episodes where the Rocket-Dan release their pokemon always show them bawling their eyes out when they leave, but it seems like they just handed them over with no question before the start of Best Wishes!. Maybe they didn't and actually had this big dramatic parting, but we won't ever know because the writers didn't think it was important for us to see the Rocket trio part with pokemon they've had for hundreds of episodes.

Then we actually saw Meowth fight. When's the last time we saw that?

DP 178, which will air in the US in about two weeks.

I'm not missing the repetitive blastoffs now I've got deltaplanes, I'm actually enjoying James holding a gigantic glass of wine while saying he's the pure heart of darkness.

I like all that stuff too. But, we shouldn't have to sacrifice their personalities to get that stuff. We've seen Musashi-tachi exit an episode without blasting off before, and we've seen Kojirou holding gigantic wine glasses in the past. As for cool lines during the motto, check out the Japanese version of the DP motto sometime.

It's like the writers have this "they can only be cool if they're not funny" mentality going on, and I think that's bullshit. As I've said before, they can be cool and mature and sexy and competent while maintaining their goofiness and silliness and endearing personalities. They've done it before.

This isn't an either/or situation, yet so many people are acting like it is.

 

[CommanderPigg]

It's like the writers have this "they can only be cool if they're not funny" mentality going on, and I think that's bullshit. As I've said before, they can be cool and mature and sexy and competent while maintaining their goofiness and silliness and endearing personalities. This isn't an either/or situation, yet so many people are acting like it is.

I find their seriousness to be amusing in its own way.

Amusing = in-character enough TR for me. I don't see it as much different from how they acted in the Chronicles special.

Anyways, I'm expecting bits and parts of their "old personality" to leak out as the series progresses (especially once they find out Giovanni's true "mission" for them...bait for Plasma-dan).

 

[Falconwing]

After so many years of the same old thing, it's nice to see a change and get what I freaking wanted for once.

 

[Ichigo Kurosaki]

I think they look cool, but I wish they would still get blasted off again once in a while

 

[Cybersai]

Makes you wonder why they're doing this NOW.

Why wasn't this done back in the DP era? I guess we had Pokehunter J to steal the show back then.

 

[Buizelfan!]

Just wondering, what does OOC stand for?