Is the hatred for the vA's being replaced over?

[Misty Calls Masquerain]

I think the hatred is over for the most part, but it doesn't change the fact that to many people, the current dub is inferior.

 

[Team Gaara]

If it isn't by now, it's really pitiful.

 

[BlackButterfree]

As someone who has watched both casts... 4Kids is better, by far. But TPCi isn't all that bad. I mean, to be brutally honest... Veronica's Ash just sounds horrible in early Kanto and even the Orange Islands as opposed to Johto and Hoenn. Sounded like she had a frog in her throat. Anyways, I don't mind the switch, and I haven't really noticed a change in scripts, but then again I don't watch the show for the script. I watch it 'cause it's Pokémon. If I watched for the script, I'd skip over the 400 episodes with recycled plots.

While I'd take 4Kids back in a heartbeat, the fact that TPCi has let some 4Kids actors always voice their characters or even come back (I think Gary and Giovanni were never affected by the switch, and Rachel came back as Character of the Day's) hints that maybe one day if the current cast gets tired of doing the show, the original cast could come back. I don't know if they'd ever sound the same as before, though (we're talking 8+ years of not voicing this character, plus age and any other stuff that might've happened to their vocal chords). And after Maddie Blaustein (Meowth) died, I don't think I could accept any other Meowth than the current one.

I don't know but people getting their tits in a wrangler about voice actors is nothing new. Fans complain, writers replace voice actors, fans want old voice actors back.

I guess with this current one, it can be the same ;p

Actually, the old cast wasn't kicked out because we complained. They were kicked out 'cause 4Kids lost dubbing rights and TPCi used the 10th anniversary special as a guillotine for the voice actors. In fact, before the TPCi cast was permanently established, another TPCi cast did the original dubbing of MoMP, but because it got so much backlash (by fans who wanted the originals back) they instead did something stupid and established the now current cast. Or were you just saying in general? If so, then oops. My bad...

People complained because the Kalos Mewtwo had a different VA to the one in the first movie...

I've gotten used to the "new" VAs a long time ago now, plus they seem more confident in the roles. When they first started back in 2006 they did seem of a lower quality, but I had grown up watching the anime so that could just be me.

Well, 4Kids or TPCi, Mewtwo was going to have a different VA no matter what. Not only is this one female and not the same one from the first movie, it's implied she was made by Team Plasma as opposed to Team Rocket like the original. And plus, the chances of them successfully hiring the original voice actor from the original movie after like 14 years when he couldn't even be bothered to voice him in the hour long sequel the very next year? Extremely low. I know you're not personally saying anything but when people bring this up it just makes me mad.

Still prefer the likes of Eric Stuart, Rachel Lillis and Veronica Taylor but they have improved admittedly

Don't forget Maddie. She was probably the best one. ^_^

I still prefer 4Kids cast, but have grown used to TPCI.

I remember May's new VA was just awful, she sounded so horrible and high pitched, no one will ever be able to compare to Veronica Taylor.

This is true. Veronica is beyond compare. But like I said above, she wasn't perfect at the beginning either.

What they should've done was just have the new VAs for Battle Frontier (or however long it was before they realized it didn't matter) and then replaced them with the old cast ASAP.

This is the best idea ever. I'm sure with the massively negative fan reaction they had to have thought about this... I wonder what was the deciding factor in keeping them?

 

[Pokemaster97]

What they should've done was just have the new VAs for Battle Frontier (or however long it was before they realized it didn't matter) and then replaced them with the old cast ASAP.

This is the best idea ever. I'm sure with the massively negative fan reaction they had to have thought about this... I wonder what was the deciding factor in keeping them?

Because the new actors had a contract and TPCI didn't want to be pressured into laying off several people after a season just because people complained? Maybe some of the old actors didn't want to come back and were ready for to begin pursuing new roles and such. 8 seasons and 400 plus episodes is an extremely long time when you put it in perspective. Honestly, the Original version comes first and as long as the Japanese version is doing well, the dub will continue to be made. I imagine TPCI figured that majority of the fans who didn't like it would get over it soon enough, and those who didn't would be replaced by the younger fans coming in.

 

[Shadow Yoshi]

Better than laying off several people after 8 seasons.

While ideally they wouldn't have done this in the first place, it would've been better to end it as soon as possible.

I did make a thread some time ago about the atmosphere of 4kids versus TPCi's. While the original VAs would've been nice to have from BF onward, how would they have reacted to the changes TPCi was making?

 

[Bluelatios]

Basically what most people have already said, the hate and drama has (fortunately!) simmered down. However, while the major forums attract fans of the ongoing season and thus are more or less neutral towards this issue, a sizable majority of long-term fans to my knowledge still much prefer the old voices. Its no surprise either, its more than their good performance; the 4kids actors are associated by many to represent a time before Pokemon "jumped the shark" or at least began leaning heavily toward new audiences, ergo returning them would reassure alienated fans that the company has not abandoned them. Others who aren't quite as serious but still watched a long time generally have expressed that 4kids, whatever you make of their dubbing practices, had the better cast overall.

I personally believe that in light of the the many changes (and lack of) that the anime has had, Pokemon will soon need to evaluate where they are at in their show's direction and relationship to their total fanbase. If its to be believed Pokemon ain't going anywhere, that also means the voices will change yet again at some point. Its certainly possible as with all things that make the show, that could happen sooner rather than later. My hope is that the company will always be reminded that fans still hold interest in the old cast.

 

[Yoshi1001]

And plus, the chances of them successfully hiring the original voice actor from the original movie after like 14 years when he couldn't even be bothered to voice him in the hour long sequel the very next year?

Just an FYI, Phillip Bartlett died in 2001, which is presumably why he wasn't used in Mewtwo Returns or Melee. He does have small parts in Pokemon Live and Puzzle League, so it's almost certainly not the case that he was disinterested. They would probably have used a new VA for movie 16 anyway, but I felt the need to include this here.

Part of me would like to do a comparative study with other franchises or in other countries that have gone through similar transitions. Anyone know of any?

 

[Pokemaster97]

Better than laying off several people after 8 seasons.

While ideally they wouldn't have done this in the first place, it would've been better to end it as soon as possible.

Technically, TPCI never laid off/fired the old actors because they never hired them, they were under no obligation to hire the former actors. I find stances like this to be almost selfish, there's probably so many factors that we don't know about.

 

[Bluelatios]

Better than laying off several people after 8 seasons.

While ideally they wouldn't have done this in the first place, it would've been better to end it as soon as possible.

Technically, TPCI never laid off/fired the old actors because they never hired them, they were under no obligation to hire the former actors. I find stances like this to be almost selfish, there's probably so many factors that we don't know about.

Sad to say, this is quite true. I even did some investigating myself a few years back, even interviewed Larry Juris from TAJ productions, but I didn't get much further than anybody else did. Basically there were the contracts and a handful of actors who either broke them and ditched 4Kids, or didn't have them to begin with, but most of the actors couldn't afford to could lose their work from 4Kids. We probably won't ever know the rest of the logistics. Judging by what ultimately happened to 4Kids though, I wouldn't be surprised if it was just some poor business conduct with TPCi that lost them the rights.

 

[Lord_Mewtwo]

And plus, the chances of them successfully hiring the original voice actor from the original movie after like 14 years when he couldn't even be bothered to voice him in the hour long sequel the very next year?

Just an FYI, Phillip Bartlett died in 2001, which is presumably why he wasn't used in Mewtwo Returns or Melee. He does have small parts in Pokemon Live and Puzzle League, so it's almost certainly not the case that he was disinterested. They would probably have used a new VA for movie 16 anyway, but I felt the need to include this here.

Part of me would like to do a comparative study with other franchises or in other countries that have gone through similar transitions. Anyone know of any?

Dragon Ball Z & Sailor Moon went through the same thing in their initial runs.

 

[Meowstic]

And plus, the chances of them successfully hiring the original voice actor from the original movie after like 14 years when he couldn't even be bothered to voice him in the hour long sequel the very next year?

Just an FYI, Phillip Bartlett died in 2001, which is presumably why he wasn't used in Mewtwo Returns or Melee. He does have small parts in Pokemon Live and Puzzle League, so it's almost certainly not the case that he was disinterested. They would probably have used a new VA for movie 16 anyway, but I felt the need to include this here.

Part of me would like to do a comparative study with other franchises or in other countries that have gone through similar transitions. Anyone know of any?

Dragon Ball Z & Sailor Moon went through the same thing in their initial runs.

To be fair, CWi (The company that dubbed Sailor Moon S and Sailor Moon SuperS), tried to get back as many of the original voice actors. For example, the reason Terri Hawkes (Voice of Sailor Moon during Classic Sailor Moon and Sailor Moon R) didn't return to dub the next two seasons was because she was pregnant. So many people don't know this and have just assumed CWi wanted to make these changes. It was the exact opposite. CWi wanted the bring back all the original voice actors, it just couldn't be arranged with some of them, so they had to hire replacements.

SOS Campaign Headquarters - Letter From Optimum

 

[Lufenium]

I prefer the 4Kids dub. At least it tried.

While the quality of TPCi dubs has increased over time, I still find Ash's VA rather grating. It sounds so forced. Another issue I have with the TPCi dubs is that a lot of the dialogue just doesn't feel as fluid or funny as some of the 4Kids did. Maybe that's the original Japanese anime changing focuses over time, but the first few seasons are more entertaining and re-watchable imo.

As for hatred, I think that died a long time ago. I can't even say I ever hated the changes, I was more disappointed. I'll always be a bit saddened by the loss of such a great cast, but hey, it's an anime to help supplement the real attraction of this series: the games. And we'll always have the original dub seasons, so it's not that bad.

 

[Lord_Mewtwo]

And plus, the chances of them successfully hiring the original voice actor from the original movie after like 14 years when he couldn't even be bothered to voice him in the hour long sequel the very next year?

Just an FYI, Phillip Bartlett died in 2001, which is presumably why he wasn't used in Mewtwo Returns or Melee. He does have small parts in Pokemon Live and Puzzle League, so it's almost certainly not the case that he was disinterested. They would probably have used a new VA for movie 16 anyway, but I felt the need to include this here.

Part of me would like to do a comparative study with other franchises or in other countries that have gone through similar transitions. Anyone know of any?

Dragon Ball Z & Sailor Moon went through the same thing in their initial runs.

To be fair, CWi (The company that dubbed Sailor Moon S and Sailor Moon SuperS), tried to get back as many of the original voice actors. For example, the reason Terri Hawkes (Voice of Sailor Moon during Classic Sailor Moon and Sailor Moon R) didn't return to dub the next two seasons was because she was pregnant. So many people don't know this and have just assumed CWi wanted to make these changes. It was the exact opposite. CWi wanted the bring back all the original voice actors, it just couldn't be arranged with some of them, so they had to hire replacements.

SOS Campaign Headquarters - Letter From Optimum

While that is true there were still changes to main characters like Pokemon, but unlike Pokemon not all were replaced.

 

[Shadow Yoshi]

Better than laying off several people after 8 seasons.

While ideally they wouldn't have done this in the first place, it would've been better to end it as soon as possible.

Technically, TPCI never laid off/fired the old actors because they never hired them, they were under no obligation to hire the former actors. I find stances like this to be almost selfish, there's probably so many factors that we don't know about.

Sad to say, this is quite true. I even did some investigating myself a few years back, even interviewed Larry Juris from TAJ productions, but I didn't get much further than anybody else did. Basically there were the contracts and a handful of actors who either broke them and ditched 4Kids, or didn't have them to begin with, but most of the actors couldn't afford to could lose their work from 4Kids. We probably won't ever know the rest of the logistics. Judging by what ultimately happened to 4Kids though, I wouldn't be surprised if it was just some poor business conduct with TPCi that lost them the rights.

I'm not really being selfish - I get the fact that we don't know a lot about what went on, but not renewing the cast is essentially putting those people out of work. Not that that doesn't happen, though! The original cast was lucky enough to make it that far in the first place.

Anyway, I'm sure there's stuff that we don't know about, and it'd be interesting to see if there's any more reasoning behind why it happened other than "hiring sound-alikes for financial reasons".

 

[Dogasu]

I have actual experience with a 10 year old (my sister), and I'd say she and her classmates all sound like Veronica Taylor the most, I don't know if any 10 year olds have a voice like Sarah's.

To add to this, Rica Matsumoto's Satoshi sounds nothing like any 10 year old boy I've heard, either

None of them do. All three voice actors are grown women doing their best "cartoon little kid voice" spouting out lines written by other adults. They're *trying*, but neither Veronica Taylor nor Sarah Natochenny nor Matsumoto Rika sound like actual little kids. Claiming otherwise is just silly.

I will maintain, however, that Matsumoto Rika can act circles around those other two.

Part of me would like to do a comparative study with other franchises or in other countries that have gone through similar transitions. Anyone know of any?

As mentioned earlier, Dragon Ball Z went through exactly the same thing Pokemon went through a few years earlier. EXACTLY. The entire voice cast is kicked out so FUNimation could start using their inexperienced soundalikes, while they're at it they decide to redo the music and the way they write their scripts, fans flip the fuck out and try to launch poorly organized and ultimately unsuccessful fan campaigns to get the old VAs back, etc. etc. I knew the Pokemon situation was going to be a repeat of the Dragon Ball Z situation and even said as much at the time.

Judging by what ultimately happened to 4Kids though, I wouldn't be surprised if it was just some poor business conduct with TPCi that lost them the rights.

It's also probably because TPCI wanted to handle everything themselves instead of having to deal with a third party like 4Kids. They can do it cheaper, faster, more accurate (4Kids really did not know the game series well), etc.,so why not do so?

 

[XYZ Nexus]

None of them do. All three voice actors are grown women doing their best "cartoon little kid voice" spouting out lines written by other adults. They're *trying*, but neither Veronica Taylor nor Sarah Natochenny nor Matsumoto Rika sound like actual little kids. Claiming otherwise is just silly.

I will maintain, however, that Matsumoto Rika can act circles around those other two.

Seriously? I will agree on Rica and Sarah not sounding like kids, but Veronica actually made an effort to sound as close to the target audience as she could.

Disagree, Rica's acting isn't really good in XY nowadays, she gets the energy down, but something feels way too off. While Veronica's acting was more heartfelt, more emotive, and definitely more real. Sarah just sounds plain bored in the role so she's easily the worst out of this group.

As mentioned earlier, Dragon Ball Z went through exactly the same thing Pokemon went through a few years earlier. EXACTLY. The entire voice cast is kicked out so FUNimation could start using their inexperienced soundalikes, while they're at it they decide to redo the music and the way they write their scripts, fans flip the fuck out and try to launch poorly organized and ultimately unsuccessful fan campaigns to get the old VAs back, etc. etc. I knew the Pokemon situation was going to be a repeat of the Dragon Ball Z situation and even said as much at the time.

At least FUNi made an effort to make a good dub. TPCi still hasn't, nor will ever try to make it a meh-level dub at the very least. FUNi actually improved over time and became the best dub of DBZ and DBZ Kai. TPCi hasn't improved much since what, 8 whole years ago. Closest thing to trying was in their BF dub and BWS1 dub. Anything in between was probably among the worst dubbing I've ever heard.

It's also probably because TPCi wanted to handle everything themselves instead of having to deal with a third party like 4Kids. They can do it cheaper, faster, more accurate (4Kids really did not know the game series well), etc.,so why not do so?

TPCi has been a few errors in the past, such as, "It's an Earth-type attack". 4Kids got nearly everything correct. Anyone could've made those mistakes, and the whole "Arbok --> Seviper" thing, yeah it's easily forgivable since they're both snake Pokemon and someone who hasn't played the games hardcore, would've thought that too. Cheaper and faster doesn't mean better all the time, 4Kids ran on a lower budget than TPCi does, yet TPCi hasn't used that money to improve, at all.

 

[PockyAddict]

Aww I like Rica and Veronica.

Anyway tho, I agree with bluelatios on this topic.

 

[Muur]

I actually prefer most of the TCPI ones for the most part.

 

[Lord_Mewtwo]

It's also probably because TPCi wanted to handle everything themselves instead of having to deal with a third party like 4Kids. They can do it cheaper, faster, more accurate (4Kids really did not know the game series well), etc.,so why not do so?

TPCi has been a few errors in the past, such as, "It's an Earth-type attack". 4Kids got nearly everything correct. Anyone could've made those mistakes, and the whole "Arbok --> Seviper" thing, yeah it's easily forgivable since they're both snake Pokemon and someone who hasn't played the games hardcore, would've thought that too. Cheaper and faster doesn't mean better all the time, 4Kids ran on a lower budget than TPCi does, yet TPCi hasn't used that money to improve, at all.

To be fair that error was corrected for later airings & the DVD release. It's pretty obvious too as it's not Kayzie Rogers' voice as Max in that line. It's Emily Williams' voice for the one line as it sounds almost like Zoey.

 

[Dogasu]

Seriously? I will agree on Rica and Sarah not sounding like kids, but Veronica actually made an effort to sound as close to the target audience as she could.

The other two do as well.

Disagree, Rica's acting isn't really good in XY nowadays, she gets the energy down, but something feels way too off. While Veronica's acting was more heartfelt, more emotive, and definitely more real. Sarah just sounds plain bored in the role so she's easily the worst out of this group.

We'll just have to agree to disagree because the way you feel about Veronica Taylor is the way I feel about Matsumoto Rika.

4Kids got nearly everything correct.

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

Oh my God where do I even begin...misnaming attack names...misnaming pokemon...giving game characters new English names (Lorlei, Tabitha, Shelly) because they were too stupid to realize that they already had official English names...not understanding how Abilities work in Generation 3...the numerous Trainer's Choice gaffs (they really did not understand Type match-ups too well)...the list goes on and on.