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Mafia Cells at Work Mafia - Endgame (09/02/2020)

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MegaPod said:
Speaking of HumanDawn again, I caught an interesting claim by ExLight about HD’s motives:

I mean, I think this was already argued about anyways, but this seems like faulty reasoning, whether or not Felly’s D1 Lynchproofness was taken into account.
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I wonder what they have to say to Felly voting me lol

Officer Snake said:
Delly's vote feels slightly OMGUS-y
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Why does it feel Oh My God U Suck-y? @Felly It means that you are voting a person because they tried to get you killed, not because of any reason in particular.

Officer Snake said:
HD justified well why he wanted the vig kill
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Cool, who would you vote now?

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I'm not sure I buy Megapod's excuse for access but I can't deny that. That said, I don't really have any firm scum reads. Kender and Felly could be lying together but I feel like that's unlikely because Kender then just risked getting counterclaimed by an actual Town vigilante, so I think it's more likely that both of their roles are at least checked out.

UNVOTE: MegaPod
VOTE: Snowy

this isn't a vote to defend or save KingOfSparta I swear

KingOfSparta has only one post with one vote, but Snowy and Officer Snake I feel like are "just there" in the game so far. They are players, but they may as well not be. Out of the two, Snowy is the most eye-brow raising.
 
Well, I won't change my vote, like already said, before mid-day vote counting, because I want to confirm that you can be lynched or not @Felly . You made very good arguments too. Well for why I did try to shoot you last night is because I simply didn't know those kinds of restrictions exist. I mean about not saying a word D1 and N1. Also, since the context of the game, it would have pretty much sense a Virus/Bacteria would evolve enough to be mostly undetectable, and need to be Vig killed. Yeah, that was a bold and maybe stupid move, but what I lack in experience, I try to make it out by sometimes taking risky move.

Like I already said, I'll wait for the vote count, and then, for now, I'm convinced enough to consider to change my vote. I'll continue to make my mind by reading you all. How many Mafia is there you think? 3?
 
Snowy said:
I feel betrayed That's not an unfair assessment, HD. I've been loosely following along, but I've been busy in the real world.

Vote: Felly

Felly's explanation of their day 1 immunity doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I know this game is bastard but I feel like it's possible Felly is an anti-town itp.
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I am not going to lie, I feel like I am scrapping at the bottom of the barrel. I tried making a reads list after Megapod's post and felt like I fell short in any solid scum reads.

Yeah, her immunity has just been proven, but her "not being able to talk" hasn't. I think I might sound contradictory to Felly in saying this... but now that we know Felly's role and it really isn't active anymore... Can Mafia or an Independent really benefit from such a role in the long-term with it being just until N1? I feel like if Felly was an anti-Town ITP , she would also have a killing role (which would also be anti-Mafia too, btw).

Snowy, do you have any other reads?

KenderCharmeleon said:
Unvote : Felly
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That's fine. Do you have anyone in mind to vote?
 
HumanDawn said:
Snowy, do you have any other reads?
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I don't but I am very suspect of exlight. I've been scum with him in a couple of games and he's really good at hiding. I know this sounds like player-related paranoia, and it is... but always be suspect of exlight.

Not sure I have any other reads that are useful.

HumanDawn said:
Can Mafia or an Independent really benefit from such a role in the long-term with it being just until N1
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In theory, it could be a 2x death proof... or it could be a limited-time deathproof to allow the ITP time to set up.


HumanDawn said:
I feel like if Felly was an anti-Town ITP , she would also have a killing role (which would also be anti-Mafia too, btw).
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Cultist is an anti-town ITP without a killing role that isn't anti-mafia (since it can't recruit mafia)
 
Sorry about being a little inactive. I've been fairly busy and I believe that a lot of the posts haven't been showing up in my notifications.
Yes, I kinda just jumped on the bandwagon with the Felly vote. From what I had read, I just thought that that had seemed the safest vote for me at the time.
And, well, as Felly had guessed, I'm new to this game, and if I'm being totally honest I didn't realize that I could abstain from the vote.
I'm assuming that I'm gonna be lynched either way, but I don't really have any suspicions at the moment so I'll just wait to see what is said now
 
MegaPod said:
I mean, I think this was already argued about anyways, but this seems like faulty reasoning, whether or not Felly’s D1 Lynchproofness was taken into account.
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I don't get why it is faulty

She wasn't lynchproof, she was unvotable
and this was something LG had already considered:
Lone_Garurumon said:
or that it negates votes on her entirely
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In fact that was the only reason for him to fear getting lynched when he noticed AE still had his vote on him since if Felly was a -1 she would've still get lynched

if any other wagon had another vote Lone would've been able to shift the lynch instead of sacrificing himself who he knew to be guaranteed town
any person that had a 1-vote vote wagon on them would've become a viable option for a lynch
people dissolving them last time is pretty suspicious to me because it reduces the amount of viable options for that day
 
About Felly's claim
I think I have never seen a role that encourages inactivity like that

Even when someone gets silenced they can usually react or vote/unvote or quote stuff
So I don't know, It's kinda iffy but I'm willing to trust it for now

I feel like I'm still fine with voting HD tho. But, I'll reread D1 to see if we can find something in the wagonomics that might change my mind.

HumanDawn said:
I feel like if Felly was an anti-Town ITP , she would also have a killing role (which would also be anti-Mafia too, btw).
Click to expand...
Jesters and Unjesters are some examples of relatively anti-Town ITP that don't have a killing role tho
And Zinn always gets creative with them, so
 
Snowy said:
I don't but I am very suspect of exlight. I've been scum with him in a couple of games and he's really good at hiding. I know this sounds like player-related paranoia, and it is... but always be suspect of exlight.
Click to expand...

Okay, noted.

Snowy's points about what ITP Felly could be make sense. Felly could literally be Cancer. If that's the case, I'm not sure if it would be better to leave the Mafia to kill her or not out of paranoia? Exlight ,a Jester that can't die until after N1 makes no sense to me. Unjester seems more anti-Mafia than Town, unless it takes a vigilante kill.

ExLight said:
I don't get why it is faulty

She wasn't lynchproof, she was unvotable
and this was something LG had already considered:

if any other wagon had another vote Lone would've been able to shift the lynch instead of sacrificing himself who he knew to be guaranteed town
any person that had a 1-vote vote wagon on them would've become a viable option for a lynch
people dissolving them last time is pretty suspicious to me because it reduces the amount of viable options for that day
Click to expand...

But what does that have to do with anything with my vote? My vote would not have changed the lynch, and it would have made it more likely for Lone_Garurumon to make a tie instead of voting Cyanide, who again... I was voting, and then somebody could blame Lone_Garurumon for making the lynch in the last minute (again, assuming no other votes would be made and Lone_Garurumon wanted a lynch). I can't tell if you are genuinely being obtuse or not. It doesn't seem like you want to evolve your argument, even when I give you the opportunity to do so. It doesn't seem like you have any reads either.

ExLight said:
About Felly's claim
I think I have never seen a role that encourages inactivity like that

Even when someone gets silenced they can usually react or vote/unvote or quote stuff
So I don't know, It's kinda iffy but I'm willing to trust it for now
Click to expand...

It would defeat the purpose if you can react.

ExLight said:
I feel like I'm still fine with voting HD tho. But, I'll reread D1 to see if we can find something in the wagonomics that might change my mind.
Click to expand...

I will hold you to that. Do you have any reads?
 
HumanDawn said:
Exlight ,a Jester that can't die until after N1 makes no sense to me.
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Why not?
1580392335199.png


once I claimed delayed Jester people said the exact same thing
it certainly feels more balanced to me

HumanDawn said:
But what does that have to do with anything with my vote? My vote would not have changed the lynch, and it would have made it more likely for Lone_Garurumon to make a tie instead of voting Cyanide, who again... I was voting, and then somebody could blame Lone_Garurumon for making the lynch in the last minute (again, assuming no other votes would be made and Lone_Garurumon wanted a lynch). I can't tell if you are genuinely being obtuse or not. It doesn't seem like you want to evolve your argument, even when I give you the opportunity to do so. It doesn't seem like you have any reads either.
Click to expand...
If he was really worried about just tying votes instead of getting someone lynched then why didn't he vote anyone and took the lynch instead? Clearly because it gives more info than a D1 No Lynch. So yes, he would probably have voted for Cyanide.

And if he got lynched for the last minute lynch he can just explain his actions. I feel like not allowing yourself to get lynched is what everyone would do no matter their alignment, and I don't see how that would be AI. It would be weird if he didn't attempt to avoid his mislynch.
Not only that, but why are you so sure Cyanide is town and that Lone would've received backlash? One vote wagons can easily be formed around scum too, and you were scumreading Cyanide; why the change of heart?

HumanDawn said:
It would defeat the purpose if you can react.
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it really wouldn't
silenced people being able to react is super common
 
I disagree that it's that impossible for Felly to have an anti-town role, but I don't have enough proof for that, besides the fact that in our cells-based setting a cell that is undetectable till it's too late might be bad news. I can't really come up with a cell based role that would have that ability and be pro-town. Also she comes across very defensive in her posts. But again, that's not enough proof.
 
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ExLight said:
Not only that, but why are you so sure Cyanide is town and that Lone would've received backlash? One vote wagons can easily be formed around scum too, and you were scumreading Cyanide; why the change of heart?
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I am not sure that Cyanide is Town, I am explaining it in a "what if scenario" if I am scum and knew about Felly's role and wanted to decrease Town's options (when Lone Garurumon could have saved himself when i would assume he would if there was a conspiracy), then I as scum, would have gotten Town likely mislynched anyway no matter if I kept my vote on Cyanide or not. I have no motive to change it, unless Cyanide is my scum partner and I wanted to save him from Lone_Garurumon potentially changing his vote to him, which you haven't yet supported. If I kept it, and Cyanide is Town, and Lone_Garurumon changed his vote to Cyanide, then Cyanide would get mislynched and Lone_Garurumon would be especially scummy.

Let's look at it like this:

a) I am scum with Felly because I knew about Felly's role and wanted Lone_Garurumon to get him mislynched.

So what do I do? I change my vote to Felly, but this doesn't change that Lone_Garurumon would still have the most votes, and even if he considered that the votes are completely negated, he could still make a no lynch by voting somebody else, but he didn't because it slipped his mind. It was also your idea for Lone_Garurumon to vote himself in the first place!

b) I am scum with Felly to decrease the viable lynch options to trap Lone_Garurumon into him now potentially saving himself or getting mislynched

But what happened is that instead, I made it easier for Lone_Garurumon to make a No Lynch, and the only thing my change of vote did is make it less likely for Cyanide to be lynched if I knew about Felly's ability.

c) I am scum with Felly & Cyanide because I unvoted Cyanide to save him from Lone_Garurumon potentially voting him and make a no lynch or get himself mislynched

This would be the only thing that makes sense for me changing my vote, but Exlight hasn't supported this anywhere.
 
CyanideCrystal said:
I disagree that it's that impossible for Felly to have an anti-town role, but I don't have enough proof for that, besides the fact that in our cells-based setting a cell that is undetectable till it's too late might be bad news. I can't really come up with a cell based role that would have that ability and be pro-town. Also she comes across very defensive in her posts. But again, that's not enough proof.
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The player you voted on has been subbed out. Thoughts?
 
Still think a point that we are all not taking seriously enough is that it's Snowy vote that doomed LG. I also suspect Felly being Anti Town, and I really suspect that if we wait too long before lynching her, it will be too late. I know I'm going a bit meta here, but that Anti-Lynch thing seriously ressemble how a disease would act, being Cancer or whatever. So I think for now, I'll vote Felly anyway for now.

Vote : Felly
 
KingofSparta39 said:
Sorry about being a little inactive. I've been fairly busy and I believe that a lot of the posts haven't been showing up in my notifications.
Yes, I kinda just jumped on the bandwagon with the Felly vote. From what I had read, I just thought that that had seemed the safest vote for me at the time.
And, well, as Felly had guessed, I'm new to this game, and if I'm being totally honest I didn't realize that I could abstain from the vote.
I'm assuming that I'm gonna be lynched either way, but I don't really have any suspicions at the moment so I'll just wait to see what is said now
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@MegaPod @Lone_Garurumon

Thoughts? Do you want a claim from KingofSparta?
 
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