Mafia Fire in the Garden: Kanto Starters Mafia: Endgame, Bulbasaur Victory

[Zexy]

I understand and agree with the sentiment, but I am a bit shifty at you for following another player's suspicion with a vote for the second time in the game. Especially because you are abandoning an original stance to do so. Granted, not too much since this is only pressure and you said you may return to Lich King later in the phase, but enough that I wanted to point it out & your slot has been kinda nagging at me in the back of the head all game, like I've said before.

Fair enough, but honestly I do not have much to work with. I only really have info on one player, my case for LICH is mostly a meta hunch I am trying to reason based on how they jokingly interacted, and the rest are attempts to pressure inactives or coasting players into doing more.

The more I think about it the less I like Zexy's vote on ExLight. If you agree that both ExLight and Snowy need to be pressured, and you're already complaining about not being able to pressure enough people because there are a bunch with 1 vote on them, why vote ExLight, which just adds another player with 1 vote on them, and not add to the pressure on Snowy?

Is it because Zexy didn't want to look suspicious placing a second vote on Snowy directly after the first one was placed?

Already explained that, feel like pressure works better when too many people are at the same amount of votes. If Snowy is town and gets 2+ votes it is only getting easier for scum to just wagon Snowy and be done with it. When I say pressure vote I do not mean "I think you are scum and need to talk" but "I need you to just talk". Any "null" read is just 70% town 30% scum/indep at this point.

Speaking of pressure

VOTE : gentlefeather

This is not related to them voting last moment. Just trying to get them talk more.

 

[Zexy]

Sorry if I come off as hostile or jumpy, I am just somewhat frustrated at the lack of activity from half the players and am trying a more agressive startegy to make more things to get posted.

Personal sorry to Raven for the misgender, got carried away based on what LICH said.

Caps has a point against Piko. But I am not so sure about Caps himself either. Still, cases like his are the kind of thing that move the game forward no matter how they end up.

I honestly do not mind coming off as a bit suspicious, worst case scenario I get mislynched which OK is not the best thing but after my flip what I said stays and you all can work with it. As long as there are enough actives to make something of it.

Which is why I am pressuring gentle now. LICH and either one of Caps/Piko provide far more info than a gentle flip, but there is lots of time left in the phase and I want to see how this goes for a while, before making final decisions.

 

[RavenRaziel98]

follow the finger of suspicion, because if jaison is scum, wissen is 100% scum because there's no other way he would know (unless he got extremely lucky)

Reminds me of a certain game where a jester who fakeclaimed cop and gave a fictional result ended up killing the godfather XD

Personal sorry to Raven for the misgender, got carried away based on what LICH said.

Don't sweat it, it happens, especially with a photo that's as unrecognizable as mine lol
Just wanted to clarify this because I'ld kinda feel like a catfish otherwise ^^'

 

[ExLight]

you didn't, it's all good lol
I'm also frustrated from the low posting

 

[RavenRaziel98]

VOTE: JamieIsBored

The only inactive without a pressure vote, also I feel like this slot kinda slips the radar so this is a great way to create pressure+keep the slot relevant imo.

 

[TheCapsFan]

 

[Zexy]

VOTE: JamieIsBored

The only inactive without a pressure vote, also I feel like this slot kinda slips the radar so this is a great way to create pressure+keep the slot relevant imo.

I was planning to get on this one after gentle, just so you know. In fact the only reason I singled them out is because you avoided making a case on them yesterday when you pushed the other inactives. I would rather not worry too much about this case, but I wouldn't sleep on it either.

 

[TheCapsFan]

Caps has a point against Piko. But I am not so sure about Caps himself either. Still, cases like his are the kind of thing that move the game forward no matter how they end up.

Can you explain, clearly and fully, what your hesitation with me is?

In my mind, we are in very much the same boat. We both look bad from yesterday's flip.

I can't help but feel like your subtle scumreads of me are so you can wait for someone else to vote me first, then turn around at the end of the day and be like "oh, well he looks bad because of yesterday and his flip will give info sooooo might as well lynch him here" ignoring that you pretty much did the same thing I did yesterday - though you did switch off jaison a bit, you did still end on him. Despite my best efforts to solve the game and push the gamestate forward this phase.

I suppose that it's possible that Piko was the one who visited you, and then fypov you would see my vote on Piko as me "just pushing another townie," but you also say that a Piko flip would give good info. So I'm a little confused.

 

[Zexy]

Can you explain, clearly and fully, what your hesitation with me is?

In my mind, we are in very much the same boat. We both look bad from yesterday's flip.

I can't help but feel like your subtle scumreads of me are so you can wait for someone else to vote me first, then turn around at the end of the day and be like "oh, well he looks bad because of yesterday and his flip will give info sooooo might as well lynch him here" ignoring that you pretty much did the same thing I did yesterday - though you did switch off jaison a bit, you did still end on him. Despite my best efforts to solve the game and push the gamestate forward this phase.

I suppose that it's possible that Piko was the one who visited you, and then fypov you would see my vote on Piko as me "just pushing another townie," but you also say that a Piko flip would give good info. So I'm a little confused.

That you could kill dawn dusk to make me think LICH is leaning scum. This is the main reason I suspect you.

And, no. Me voting you is not something that happening today. It might be something that happens d3 if at least one of LICH or Piko (or Mido?) flip town tho.

Another intriguing thing is Mido who voted for you before and for me now, but not sure what to make of this yet. Could be her scum, or you scum, doubt we all are town and someone as experienced as her made two mistakes in a row.

I should not really tell who visited me, but no I will say clearly that my slight suspicion of you has nothing to do with the visit.

 

[TheCapsFan]

That you could kill dawn dusk to make me think LICH is leaning scum. This is the main reason I suspect you.

And, no. Me voting you is not something that happening today. It might be something that happens d3 if at least one of LICH or Piko (or Mido?) flip town tho.

Another intriguing thing is Mido who voted for you before and for me now, but not sure what to make of this yet. Could be her scum, or you scum, doubt we all are town and someone as experienced as her made two mistakes in a row.

I should not really tell who visited me, but no I will say clearly that my slight suspicion of you has nothing to do with the visit.

WIFOM but...Bro I would have just killed you or Mido. Specifically you probably. Removing the most active player from a game that's already incredibly inactive could have let me control the narrative as the second most active person by posts. Also it would drain the WIM of people like Ex who already don't like dealing with inactive towns. But I digress. There's not much to say in my defense here besides just WIFOM.

Glad I get another day to live I guess. Let's hope I'm right today.

I have a feeling Mido thinks >=1 scum between us. I could see that from her perspective but I'm also interested to see what she thinks of the rest of the people who spoke up today, namely Ex, Piko, LICH, and Raven.

 

[Zexy]

That is exactly the kind of problem with WIFOM logic, I could see scum!you killing dawn dusk and hope Mido and I target each other instead of you while you go for Piko instead. Killing me if you are scum would make Mido (if she is town) way too wary of you.

Agreed that Mido should give us more reads on the not-so-actives, gotta admit you and I did that more.

 

[DawningWinds]

@Elieson is subbing for wissen schatler. Please confirm once you have received your role

 

[Elieson]

@Elieson is subbing for wissen schatler. Please confirm once you have received your role

Nobody tells me what to do and gets away with it What do I look like; some pokémon on a battlefield?

##Vote DawningWinds

In all seriousness, I haven't read a thing past page 5 (yet), so you'll get content out of me but not for a couple of hours, as I'm still at work for another 4.

 

[TheCapsFan]

Heyo Elie.

 

[RavenRaziel98]

Ahoy Elieson!

 

[Midorikawa]

Yeah I know who

Why the vote though? Does the claim make you suspect me? Please elaborate.

One of the reasons. It’s just too convenient.

Not much more than a hunch again,

So you think voting and making a case on a hunch is a good ideas after the last one that failed spectacularly?

A bit reluctant, but I will place a vote for now to hopefully push them into posting more

If you’re reluctant then why? If you’re reluctant then you shouldn’t be voting them since it means you’re not confident.

Wissan would be my second choice. Confidently stating that they know that someone is scum in day one is a little suspicious.

Or maybe it was a joke post? We’ve seen plenty of jokes like that on here. And is that the only reason?

dawn dusk being the kill option has to be related to all this, either LICH themselves or someone who wants us to believe LICH did it. A scum team without at least one of those in it really had no reason to waste a kill on low activity dawn dusk that only interacted with those people in a way that could easily set up a case on any of them, rather than one of the highly active people who try to solve the game

Wasn’t LICH mafia just a few posts ago, now they’re just a scapegoat?

wissen was probably just a troll. A particularly bad troll that tried to do inside jokes with jaison and LICH and all of them had lots of interactions with dawn dusk.

…now Wissen is a troll but not yesterday?

wissen was probably just a troll. A particularly bad troll that tried to do inside jokes with jaison and LICH and all of them had lots of interactions with dawn dusk.

Didn’t mean to quote it twice

LICH is my big scum lean, wissen a smaller one...

And now they’re both scum again. One second they’re a scapegoat and troll and then they’re scum. Real consistent.

Do you still believe we should lynch it without it even being able to claim if need be?

Why do you question this now when you were fine doing just that yesterday?

Yeah ExLight and Snowy seem like they could give us more. Could be busy, could be coasting, not sure...

UNVOTE : LICH KING
VOTE : ExLight

Probably going to change again, but I think LICH is the kind of frustrated that won't give us more to work with if town and I would rather not give others a chance to tunnel there yet. Maybe later in the phase.

So I will pressure ExLight a bit more. Please contribute more to things that are not just the setup. Not that Snowy is not worth pressuring, but with votes at 1 on many people, scum are more likely to be on eggshells and slip up

Since when is 1 vote any pressure? I also don’t like that “maybe later in the phase” and the fear of having more than one vote on snowy. As though you’re confident he’ll be lynched.

That hypothesis is now wrong
Jaison was not scum
Please stop using this argument, it just does not hold anymore as a reason for wissen to be more scum than anyone else

It never held up in the first place. But it does hold evidence of you as mafia. And you trying to get the topic to stop means you don’t want people analyzing your conjecture theory.

Did you really just say that half the town could be scum?

I don't really have a lot to say, honestly. I've always sucked at mafia All I really have is that Zexy is actively scum hunting, Mido is targeting Zexy because of Zexy's scum hunting, and wissan made some kind of weird joke in day 1.

can’t remember why I originally quoted this but matching it with Zexy not wanting to pressure snowy definitely makes them look very buddy buddy.

already explained my stance on the previous day lynch, and I think it's bizarre this is being ignored while Zexy's hypocrisy in voting out someone barely active D1 is bring rewarded with a town lean.

If you know he’s being a hypocrite then why not vote him with me?

Snowy sometimes becomes more active, so prolly not him; but would definitely go after Wissen or Jamie first.

….what? Why the inactives? How does that help?

Don't sweat it, it happens, especially with a photo that's as unrecognizable as mine lol
Just wanted to clarify this because I'ld kinda feel like a catfish otherwise ^^'

You totally should have cat fished them.

VOTE: JamieIsBored

The only inactive without a pressure vote, also I feel like this slot kinda slips the radar so this is a great way to create pressure+keep the slot relevant imo.

….really? Didn’t you realize yesterday how bad this is?

I was planning to get on this one after gentle, just so you know. In fact the only reason I singled them out is because you avoided making a case on them yesterday when you pushed the other inactives. I would rather not worry too much about this case, but I wouldn't sleep on it either.

And you didn’t think that was suspicious yesterday? Especially after what I pointed out about Raven? Wouldn’t it make sense to push him on the fact that he wants to lynch inactives but blatantly ignores one?

Could be her scum, or you scum, doubt we all are town and someone as experienced as her made two mistakes in a row.

What mistake did I make? I’m not the one that lynched a townie based on ridiculous conjecture. My record is clear.

Unvote
Revote x10 Zexy

He’s straight up contradicting himself, and is spouting stuff but being non committal. I also wouldn’t be surprised if him and snowy are scum buddies with how they are acting.

 

[Midorikawa]

Agreed that Mido should give us more reads on the not-so-actives, gotta admit you and I did that more.

Seriously? Have I really not made my thoughts clear? Are you blatantly ignoring everything I’ve said since d1?

 

[Zexy]

Seriously? Have I really not made my thoughts clear? Are you blatantly ignoring everything I’ve said since d1?

New phase, new reads. Lots of things have happened since you voted for me, do you still have nothing to add?

 

[Zexy]

So you think voting and making a case on a hunch is a good ideas after the last one that failed spectacularly?

If you’re reluctant then why? If you’re reluctant then you shouldn’t be voting them since it means you’re not confident.

Or maybe it was a joke post? We’ve seen plenty of jokes like that on here. And is that the only reason?

Wasn’t LICH mafia just a few posts ago, now they’re just a scapegoat?

…now Wissen is a troll but not yesterday?

Didn’t mean to quote it twice

And now they’re both scum again. One second they’re a scapegoat and troll and then they’re scum. Real consistent.

Why do you question this now when you were fine doing just that yesterday?

Since when is 1 vote any pressure? I also don’t like that “maybe later in the phase” and the fear of having more than one vote on snowy. As though you’re confident he’ll be lynched.

It never held up in the first place. But it does hold evidence of you as mafia. And you trying to get the topic to stop means you don’t want people analyzing your conjecture theory.

can’t remember why I originally quoted this but matching it with Zexy not wanting to pressure snowy definitely makes them look very buddy buddy.

And you didn’t think that was suspicious yesterday? Especially after what I pointed out about Raven? Wouldn’t it make sense to push him on the fact that he wants to lynch inactives but blatantly ignores one?

What mistake did I make? I’m not the one that lynched a townie based on ridiculous conjecture. My record is clear.

Unvote
Revote x10 Zexy

He’s straight up contradicting himself, and is spouting stuff but being non committal. I also wouldn’t be surprised if him and snowy are scum buddies with how they are acting.

It is better than the nothing we would have otherwise.

Sometimes votes are just for pressure and helping discussion from others flow.

So your entire case is that I might be buddies with Snowy? Why not vote for Snowy then instead? He has more votes than me, could be an easier case for you to push.

Yeah, now that we know jaison flipped town, wissen was a troll. Before the flip there was no way to know if it was troll or scum slip.

That is the entire point, we can no longer be like "but you were SURE wissen was a scum slip". Reality has proven us wrong. So you cannot use the fact that I no longer believe that as a reason I am jumpy. Not believing that anymore is a direct result of the objective truth.

By the time gentle got to post, the wagon on jaison was hard to reverse, and I just thought that flip was more useful info wise.

The mistake is targetting me. Nothing else for now.

...

Whatever, I will TLDR my defense with two points
1) why not target Snowy instead first if you are so sure we are buddies, considering Snowy has one more vote than I have?
2) why do you hold the supposed contradiction about jaison against me so much when Caps advocated for that lynch too? And in general, why drop the rather bold case on Caps yesterday? You have not made any progress on that front today

...

Anyway, you are either misguided town (which is OK, I am rather misguided too, which is where lots of the jumpiness comes from), or... Maybe buddies with Caps? Making a case from active buddy to active buddy early d1 when there is little risk of it getting wagoned, then taking it back and trying to bury it with new cases (you on me, and Caps on Piko) instead, is a good way for whoever of you flips mafia in the future, the other one can say "but I suspected them d1!"

 

[DawningWinds]

Mid Phase Votals
Pikochu (1) - TheCapsFan
Mint Elv (1) - Snowy
JamieIsBored (1) - RavenRaziel98
Zexy (1) - Mint Elv
Snowy (1) - Pikochu
gentlefeather (1) - Zexy
Elieson (1) - ExLight
DawningWinds (0) - Elieson