SwSh Gen8 fossil discussion thread

[Phosphene]

What do you guys think of these redesigns for the fossils? Unfortunately I couldn't find the original artist--I got this from 4chan.

Spoiler

It seems like many of the people on the 4chan thread feel like it defeats the purpose of the fossils. I can definitely see that for the Arctovish redesign--it just looks like a normal fish monster. Some people in this thread have suggested evolutions for the fossils that are more streamlined (as though the 'mon is getting used to the fusion) and I could kinda see these work as that.

Also, here's a meme also courtesy of 4chan.

Spoiler

 

[TechSkylander1518]

I can definitely see that for the Arctovish redesign--it just looks like a normal fish monster.

TBH, regular Arctovish seems like a normal monster to me already. An unusual one, but the colors and body seem to flow much better, and I wouldn't have thought it was a mix and match if I hadn't known about it.

I think these fan designs still get the point of it, though, and would enjoy seeing them done like this.

 

[PocketMonster]

Another thing about the fossils: I find the science of them in the context of Pokemon rather absurd.

Aren't the body parts a fossil is composed of completely arbitrary on how they are brought back to life? Like, Anorith's fossil is merely a claw, and many dino-based fossil like Cranidos and Tyrunt only are parts of the head. Heck - Aerodactyl came solely from DNA in fossilized tree sap!

Also, to require 2 fossils to bring a franken mon back to life assumes loosely that,

a) The DNA itself is damaged for whatever reason inside the fossil,

b) Each fossil's 'supposed' form isolated its DNA into its individual body parts, so that only the physical body parts of the fossil get brought to life, and

c) The 'forgotten' parts of the fossil must have been impossible to find to actually use, or they somehow don't have extractable DNA.

I mean, I know Jurassic Park will remain a fantasy fiction for the years to come. But this is all blatantly inconsistent with the way the previous generations of Pokemon did fossils. And the curcumstances of making the frankenfossils without even knowing their original forms just sound hilariously ridiculous and improbable.

I think that is suppose to be part of it. like, way back when science wasn't as advanced people may have thought of the resurrection process to be different.

What do you guys think of these redesigns for the fossils? Unfortunately I couldn't find the original artist--I got this from 4chan.

Spoiler

I love it!!!!!!!! see, these are put together much smoother!

 

[PkmnTrainerV]

What do you guys think of these redesigns for the fossils? Unfortunately I couldn't find the original artist--I got this from 4chan.

I had an idea: these could either be high friendship evolutions, or evolutions while holding the Up-Grade or something.

Have the mis-matched fossils evolve with minimal stat changes- kinda like Type:Null and Silvally. Or if there’s danger of Eviolite abuse, give the mis matched pre-evos bad stats because they aren’t adapt at what they’re doing.

 

[BigBadButterfree]

TBH, regular Arctovish seems like a normal monster to me already. An unusual one, but the colors and body seem to flow much better, and I wouldn't have thought it was a mix and match if I hadn't known about it.

I think these fan designs still get the point of it, though, and would enjoy seeing them done like this.

I feel like they came up with this concept, then got to Arctovish and went "wait, it doesn't look mismatched enough." And then decided to flip its head upside down to make it less natural.

 

[Kallyle]

@BigBadButterfree @Sakuraa @Esserise
To me, the Pokédex entries are partially true; some of the entries came from old folktales, while the more ridiculous ones (Ex. Macargo being hotter than the sun) are what would happen if the Pokémon species were to realize its full potential so the Pokémon in question has to constantly regulate its energy to avoid destroying the environment around it. And then there's the Galar fossils, which are most likely speculation made by Cara Liss herself.

Another thing about the fossils: I find the science of them in the context of Pokemon rather absurd.

Aren't the body parts a fossil is composed of completely arbitrary on how they are brought back to life? Like, Anorith's fossil is merely a claw, and many dino-based fossil like Cranidos and Tyrunt only are parts of the head. Heck - Aerodactyl came solely from DNA in fossilized tree sap!

Also, to require 2 fossils to bring a franken mon back to life assumes loosely that,

a) The DNA itself is damaged for whatever reason inside the fossil,

b) Each fossil's 'supposed' form isolated its DNA into its individual body parts, so that only the physical body parts of the fossil get brought to life, and

c) The 'forgotten' parts of the fossil must have been impossible to find to actually use, or they somehow don't have extractable DNA.

I mean, I know Jurassic Park will remain a fantasy fiction for the years to come. But this is all blatantly inconsistent with the way the previous generations of Pokemon did fossils. And the curcumstances of making the frankenfossils without even knowing their original forms just sound hilariously ridiculous and improbable.

Lanstar, thank you for pointing out the unusual circumstances between how the Galar fossils work compared to the other fossils. This actually spurred a thought in my head that might explain why these fossils work the way they do (other than Cara Liss having no idea what she's doing):

What if each fossil initially existed as species independent of one another, but eventually grew desperate enough to survive that they tried to develop a Shellder-Slowpoke relationship?

I mean we've seen quite a few examples of symbiotic relationships between Pokémon that cause evolution in-universe such as the aforementioned Shellder-Slowpoke relationship causing them to join together for Slowbro/Slowking, Magneton apparently being the result of three Magnemite being bound together, Remoraid causing Mantyke to evolve into Mantine, and many more! Whose to say that there weren't examples of this that actually did more harm than good for certain Pokémon species?

As for why these fossil Pokémon look the way they do, they most likely aren't accurate representations of the original hybrids since there's quite a few parts missing from both species that most likely wouldn't have been dropped upon the actual evolution. What probably happened is that Cara Liss failed to account for the possibility of Galar's fossils starting out as separate species that had symbiotic evolutions, and thus ended up putting the base Pokémon together as if they were that evolution from the get-go. The result is what we see today: a mismatched pair of separate species made to act like their symbiotic evolutions. That's right folks, Cara Liss potentially made Dracovish worse than it was in prehistoric times!

tl;dr summary: The fossil Pokémon started out as separate species that tried to undergo symbiotic evolutions for survival (which is why they could be combined in the first place), but Cara Liss treated these fossils as if they single stage Pokémon that were always like that whenever she tried to resurrect them. She was careless not about whether these creatures existed, but rather the nature of these fossils.

 

[Poke Dragon]

I can kind of see these four individual Pokemon species being symbiotic for survival in the past. Heck, Nebby itself literately feels bad for Necrozma going through pain and thus, would wear Necrozma as some sort of armor to help lessen the pain, allowing both Pokemon to become stronger together.

If the opposite halves of the four Pokemon are introduced, then there can be 16 combinations available, but only four of those combinations are truly natural.

 

[Battista]

Can anybody tell me Cara Liss’ Japanese name? I couldn’t find it online though I didn’t look that long.

I’m all for punny names but they have to flow well. The Gym Leaders normally pull this off successfully. Cara Liss’ name is almost as awkward as her creations.

 

[Kyuu-Tales]

Can anybody tell me Cara Liss’ Japanese name? I couldn’t find it online though I didn’t look that long.

I’m all for punny names but they have to flow well. The Gym Leaders normally pull this off successfully. Cara Liss’ name is almost as awkward as her creations.

I can check, hopefully.

...Unless it was only stated once and I wasn't paying attention, which I hope wasn't the case. I remember seeing ウ... perhaps ウッカ? That would make sense as うっかり means "careless".

 

[Emmy]

Can anybody tell me Cara Liss’ Japanese name? I couldn’t find it online though I didn’t look that long.

I’m all for punny names but they have to flow well. The Gym Leaders normally pull this off successfully. Cara Liss’ name is almost as awkward as her creations.

Spoiler: There's Fan art of her already

As you can see, her name is "Ukattsu Hakase" which ignoring the Hakase/Professor bit, is a play on 迂闊 ("Ukatsu") meaning Careless, thoughtless, unobservant etc etc...

I double checked with JPN game footage btw just to make sure that is indeed what she's called in-game and not just in fanart.

 

[Kyuu-Tales]

Ah! I was close. I knew I saw "Uka"-something.

 

[prog rocker]

Spoiler: There's Fan art of her already

View attachment 129143

As you can see, her name is "Ukattsu Hakase" which ignoring the Hakase/Professor bit, is a play on 迂闊 ("Ukatsu") meaning Careless, thoughtless, unobservant etc etc...

I double checked with JPN game footage btw just to make sure that is indeed what she's called in-game and not just in fanart.

I tried looking for her name in the Spanish version to see if she also has a punny name, and her name is Carmen Babia there. Even though I'm a native Spanish speaker I have no idea what are they referencing with her.

 

[PartTimePokemonMaster]

I tried looking for her name in the Spanish version to see if she also has a punny name, and her name is Carmen Babia there. Even though I'm a native Spanish speaker I have no idea what are they referencing with her.

"Translate "Babia" to English: dreamland, cloud-cuckoo-land, cloudland
Spanish Synonyms of "Babia": la tierra de leche y miel, lugar de ensueños, mundo de ensueño, país de ensueños, país de los sueños, reino del ensueño, tierra de fantasía"

from wordmagic.com

 

[prog rocker]

"Translate "Babia" to English: dreamland, cloud-cuckoo-land, cloudland
Spanish Synonyms of "Babia": la tierra de leche y miel, lugar de ensueños, mundo de ensueño, país de ensueños, país de los sueños, reino del ensueño, tierra de fantasía"

from wordmagic.com

I don't think that might be it... Maybe it's an European Spanish pun?

 

[PartTimePokemonMaster]

I don't think that might be it... Maybe it's an European Spanish pun?

Meaning of estar en Babia? Learn Spanish with SpanishPodcast

It seems to be from an Idiom used in Spain "estar en babia" or to have one's "head in the clouds." There doesn't seem to be a direct translation, but being an "airhead" frequently comes up with the word. It also works with the pun of her being careless. Mind you I am not fluent in Spanish.

 

[prog rocker]

Meaning of estar en Babia? Learn Spanish with SpanishPodcast

It seems to be from an Idiom used in Spain "estar en babia" or to have one's "head in the clouds." There doesn't seem to be a direct translation, but being an "airhead" frequently comes up with the word. It also works with the pun of her being careless. Mind you I am not fluent in Spanish.

That might be it. Thanks!

 

[PkmnTrainerV]

would wear Necrozma as some sort of armor to help lessen the pain, allowing both Pokemon to become stronger together.

Even though Nebby feels bad and fuses with Necrozma, Nebby itself gets the shorter end of the deal- it literally sacrifices its very consciousness.
Lunala's even said to be "this unfortunate Pokémon" and "without its own will" in Sword and one of the Ultra versions respectively in the fusion.

 

[KaijuTyranitar54]

I was hoping one of them would be similar to baryonx. But Dracozolt looks like a
Eotyrannus
mixed with a
Dacentrurus

 

[ShieldFan]

Frustration post. I have some concepts to suggest to James Turner and his design team. The sadness kills me every time that I think about the wasted potential.

1 - Source: https://www.picuki.com/media/2184392199789497921

2 - Source: Restored galarian fossil pokemon by rizegreymon22 on DeviantArt

3 - Source: https://www.picuki.com/media/2184722285884195732

 

[Esserise]

I mean I guess it's easy for me to say this since I love the kooky mixed-up fossils, but to me, leaving them incomplete feels like a win-win - the actual games do something new and fun and interesting with a relatively played-out concept, and then I also get to see the range of cool interpretations that fans come up with in artwork.

Even though Nebby feels bad and fuses with Necrozma, Nebby itself gets the shorter end of the deal- it literally sacrifices its very consciousness.
Lunala's even said to be "this unfortunate Pokémon" and "without its own will" in Sword and one of the Ultra versions respectively in the fusion.

I'm surprised that they don't do more to mitigate this undertone, but on second thought, I guess Pokémon does rather frequently put mechanics over ethics. Still, it wouldn't be that hard to have someone distinguish that Nebby's consciousness is only forcibly suppressed when it happens in the wild during the story, and that under the Trainer's control, it's more like teamwork, or a DBZ-esque fusion. Have Colress say it when explaining the function of the N-Solunarizer, or something.

(Incidentally, I wonder what it feels like for Nebby to have its whole body temporarily converted into energy whenever Necrozma Ultra Bursts? Broken Necrozma and Woken Necrozma weigh the exact same, because only the prism armor pieces are composed of matter - the dragon body is made of light energy and is thus weightless. But Nebby's body used to be part of the equation, because the weight data for Dusk and Dawn Necrozma is indeed Solgaleo/Lunala's weight + Necrozma's weight. Does Nebby feel anything at all, or does having its consciousness suppressed make it feel basically like taking a nap?)