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Mafia Archie Sonic Mafia, Endgame: TBA (4/8/20)

Will put more effort after i get off work but for now, I have to act on this:

This feels to me like an obvious cover-up of a kill.

[VOTE]: Pika_pika42

h o w

please tell me you aren’t implying the mafia must have known snowy was the cop so they had pika claim that for some scum motivation i cant think of
 
h o w

please tell me you aren’t implying the mafia must have known snowy was the cop so they had pika claim that for some scum motivation i cant think of

...Yeah, that would require the mafia to have known Snowy was the cop, wouldn't it.

[UNVOTE]: Pika_pika42

What are the odds that Snowy just didn't listen to Pikapika and mafia kill got blocked?
 
What makes you think it couldn't just be the mafia targeting Snowy and getting lucky?
I'm not discounting that possibility, that's probably what happened, but knowing Snowy I can also see him doing something like targeting Pikapika anyway.
 
do you think they targeted you?
if he softed in thread that could be the case though
I'll reskim his posts to see if that was the case
What makes you think it couldn't just be the mafia targeting Snowy and getting lucky?
I'm not discounting that possibility, that's probably what happened, but knowing Snowy I can also see him doing something like targeting Pikapika anyway.

What do you think of Jinjo?

——

I can actually see Snowy targeting Pikapika anyway too.
 
yea, I don't see any softs
so he either targeted Pika which is NAI and maybe a townlean, or it's just a coincidence they died that night

What do you think of Jinjo?
I need to reread her, but I'm not finding her particularly scummy
maybe kinda under the radar but I feel like that's NAI for Jinjo most of the time

but I could get behind putting more pressure into her because I feel like she usually panics and avoids answering some stuff when she's cornered scum
 
Just been looking back over Jinjo's posts which I have to agree they are mostly just defensive or non relevant. In a lot of the posts she keeps taking about people using meta but isn't offering any reads or thoughts herself. She also didn't vote on day 1 which also makes it harder to draw conclusions.

Can see her posts being CWAC.

Vote: Jinjo

What are your current reads @Jinjo ?
 
@Pika_pika42 do you think that scum tried to make a wagon against you, and if so, who do you think is scummiest of your voters?
Tbh I am not sure if scum tried to make a wagon against me. While I think me voting Ex was blown a bit out of proportion, I can see it could come across as suspicious to others.
If I had to pick the scummiest out of my voters, I would choose DawningWinds, they were inactive throughout D1 but only came and voted me, which looked like a case of sheeping.

do you think they targeted you?
Not sure. I warned the cop not to visit me because there was a lot of risk involved.
The possibilities are:
1) snowy checked me and died and mafia kill was blocked for some reason
2) snowy didn't check me and was killed by the mafia
3) a combination of both i.e. snowy checked me and was killed by the mafia
 
Here is my ISO on Jinjo:

I seem to be late on day 1 starting.
I remember a lot of people saying that they thought this was a weird entrance. I didn't find it super weird.

The votes on Snowy did not look serious to me and they looked like joke votes and leaving a joke vote for too long by the end of day 1 can be seen as scummy. I can see why he responded to the votes well because the votes did not look serious and they would have probably eventually been removed and be getting into a serious vote later. You said he didn't seem panicked and I'm assuming panicking is a scum tell on what you are saying. Scum doesn't need to get panicked so soon because they can easily tell their scum buddies in the scum chat to coordinate votes when the day phase is close to ending and all vote the same player if one of the scum has the most votes and make a counter wagon. We may have different opinions here but I don't see players getting panicked is a scum tell on early days and mostly it is town who gets panicked more then scum when they have the most votes. Normally when scum start to get panicked with the most votes is when one of the scum player has already been lynched meaning the remaining scum won't be able to coordinate votes easily afterwards.

Subtle townread of Snowy amidst mechanic discussion, nothing much here.

You say here I came in late and it looked like it was still joke voting stage. I don't see anything scummy about coming in late not able to move the game along and I couldn't get any reads at the time during the joke voting stage and nothing pinged me at the time for me to get a scum read. I'm not the kind of player to move the game along by pressuring and I'm the kind of player who starts out slow on day 1 and if I see something that is really scummy then I would vote. Not sure if anyone here says if pressuring is towny but I don't see pressuring as towny because pressuring a player can also be a good way for scum to blend in and pressuring is mostly NAI.

Defense after a vote, on their actions coming into the day abruptly.

Recent games I have played with HD like for example that game hosted by ZinnLav his play was scummy and I was also scum reading you. It turned out HD was a scummy town on day 1 and I correctly scum read you. Some of his takes in past games I agreed with and others I didn't agree with.



It's been around a year since I've last played with you and I scum read Midori alot in past games since I disagree with her on some of the stuff she says and sometimes I correctly scum read her and other times she turns out to be town.



I've pretty much already said this on discord and whenever I see a player who has been getting town read too much or who has been very active when it is close to mylo/lylo, then this is the part when I start to get paranoid of the player being scum who is deep wolfing.

All responding to open questions put in the thread, nothing much on other players.

I see that some of the players have been talking about meta. Don't expect everyone to play the same like they do in their town or scum games since players wil always approach games differently. I have seen some players get scum read for meta for playing differently and they end up flipping town. I have been a victim for being scum read on meta for playing differently where I was town. I hated it so badly to the point when I immediately subbed out. I will not be focusing on meta reads and if I was to scum read someone in this game for meta it would be HD because he made a post that reminded me on what he did from Hollywood Mafia.

I think this has already been mentioned before by FA but it is quite ironic that Jinjo defended her entrance on D1 by using her own meta, yet here she literally says "don't trust meta." It almost reads to me that at this point she wants a bit of town cred, so she says something that will appeal to a lot of players to make her look better.

Still nothing really said about other players, or any attempts to gamesolve, really.

That post is not a meta read. When I asked what do the players think of HD, on the last sentence when Mido quoted to me talking about HD she said she tends to agree with HD alot but on some stuff I don't always agree with HD and the completed game hosted by Zinnlav was a good example where I didn't agree with HD.

Defending herself from a response to a response to a question she asked. nothing of note

On the first paragraph I made I was talking about Snowy saying he didn't look pressured explaining on why I think scum don't need to feel pressured explaining on what I think they would have done by coordinating votes and I pretty much brought my thoughts out on this and how could you say this paragraph was a defense? Did you even reread the game or not? On the second paragraph I defended myself against FA which were four lines I made and the other lines were me talking about not seeing pressuring towny because this could also be a good way for scum to blend in and this is NAI which is more thoughts I brought in. You said I defended myself against HD and I didn't defend myself against him and it was me correcting him on Pokemon Gen IV and then he mentioned he is pocketing FA and I assumed he was town reading FA and then afterwards I asked the players what do they think of HD. When I quoted to HD on day 1 how was that a defense when I pretty much explained above. Are you even reading the game or are you making stuff up?

I want you to explain on what you mean on me hasn't contributed much to any discussion. I brought out some of my thoughts when I quoted FA and when you mean hasn't contributed much to discussion did you mean you wanted me to interact more with the players?

So, here's where the argument falls a bit flat in my opinion. Jinjo seems pretty ticked by these accusations but going back and looking at her posts, I don't really see where she made any concrete reads about specific players. She mentions these defenses against FA as giving reads, but in reality they read as general mechanical statements that could be applied to any player in any situation in my opinion.

I'm unsure as to how to take this frustration/anger from Jinjo, though, they typically seem pretty collected.

HD is just sheeping and I don't know what he expects from me. There was this one post from him he made on day 1 which looked suspicious but I didn't bring it up because I felt as if HD were scum he would have tried to get me lynched and why the quick unvote he did on me on day 1.

This is about the only read on a player Jinjo gives all game and it feels OMGUS-y. And, if you're gonna use meta based on mafia!HD, in Champs he never really did any sheeping, that's why it took the town a while to find him, a lot of his votes were strategically placed and they were doing a lot of vote-hunting.

Oh wait, but I thought you were encouraging people not to use meta? But you already used meta, so I'll justify myself in using it here.

TLDR; Rereading her posts makes me feel a lot worse about her. She could really do with actively trying to gamesolve and give her thoughts about players. Enough for a vote, I think. [VOTE]: Jinjo
 
If I had to pick the scummiest out of my voters, I would choose DawningWinds, they were inactive throughout D1 but only came and voted me, which looked like a case of sheeping.

I have to say I am not a fan of DawningWinds at the moment either. It's interesting that they chose your wagon over the leading wagons of the day. It's possible they were trying to push you ahead of Fatima, maybe??? I don't know, we won't really know much about DawningWinds until they show up and make some reads @DawningWinds

I'd also like to hear more from @Pikochu and @Tood as I said yesterday. I know I called out Tood already but I'm unsure if I've called out Pikochu yet. Both have posted a bit more since yesterday, but I've seen them both a lot more active in other games, and I think their contributions could be much needed in helping to solve the game.

@Fatima Shadow Frost Witch I'm waiting on the edge of my seat for your big huge post you keep promising, don't keep me waiting much longer or I'll ask for a refund for my ticket.
 
I expect a vote, or at the very least a read. So far... nothing but self-defence and saying you’d scum read me based on meta you don’t want to explain because you say I would lynch you for it if you did.

I voted you and then unvoted you Day 1, yet I would have lynched you for sure if you explained a scum read on me if I was scum?

You know who is afraid of being lynched the most? Scum.

I said I would not be focusing on meta since I have seen players get scum read for meta and they flip town. Are you asking here you think my suspicion on you was because of your vote on me? That was not the reason on what I found you suspicious. If you want to know what was the post I thought was suspicious I can quote it.

I also don't really know who you actually town or scum lean on right now. Do you actually scumread Human for as often as you've mentioned him, or is it just paranoia?

On day 1 you and HD were the only players I town read and other players were null to me on day 1. Luminary's posts on day 2 made me suspicious of her and I wanted her to answer me first to see if she can clarify and I also wanted to catch a slip from her depending on how she answers my question. From what I remember I have scum read HD once before and never had a paranoia on him before.


Just been looking back over Jinjo's posts which I have to agree they are mostly just defensive or non relevant. In a lot of the posts she keeps taking about people using meta but isn't offering any reads or thoughts herself. She also didn't vote on day 1 which also makes it harder to draw conclusions.

Can see her posts being CWAC.

Vote: Jinjo

What are your current reads @Jinjo ?

You and Luminary are my scum leans at the moment. I pretty much explained to Luminary how I brought in my thoughts saying that my first paragraph was not a defense. Luminary said I defended myself against HD and I never defended myself against him. Luminary has been saying she has been rereading and if she has been rereading she would have seen that the only defense post I made on day 1 was on the second paragraph I made to FA which was a small defense and it looked like Luminary was contradicting herself when she voted me.


I thought I quoted Luminary's response for me to respond and it never showed up when I quoted it. Since these were the posts I quoted that only showed up I'll answer them first and then I'll have to check again on what Luminary said.
 
You and Luminary are my scum leans at the moment. I pretty much explained to Luminary how I brought in my thoughts saying that my first paragraph was not a defense. Luminary said I defended myself against HD and I never defended myself against him. Luminary has been saying she has been rereading and if she has been rereading she would have seen that the only defense post I made on day 1 was on the second paragraph I made to FA which was a small defense and it looked like Luminary was contradicting herself when she voted me.


I thought I quoted Luminary's response for me to respond and it never showed up when I quoted it. Since these were the posts I quoted that only showed up I'll answer them first and then I'll have to check again on what Luminary said.
You've explained why you think Luminary's thoughts on you make you think she's scummy but you've not said why you think I'm scummy, is it because I agree with some of Luminary's points?

If you think the two of us are scummy why not HD and Caps who have also voted you?
 
May or may not get a result, may or may not die.

how hard would it have been to say this before and not after Snowy died? Snowy's death could have been just due to a mafia kill but either way, saying this after the fact does not make you look good.

Zorchic ended up being town, so it's not like there was any need to protect Zorchic if Deku was mafia,

He could've been doing that to look towny though, knowing Zorchic would flip town.

Vote: Jinjo

Jinjo has been acting overly defensive and seems to be just scumreading Luminary & anyone else who is suspicious of them.
 
You and Luminary are my scum leans at the moment. I pretty much explained to Luminary how I brought in my thoughts saying that my first paragraph was not a defense. Luminary said I defended myself against HD and I never defended myself against him. Luminary has been saying she has been rereading and if she has been rereading she would have seen that the only defense post I made on day 1 was on the second paragraph I made to FA which was a small defense and it looked like Luminary was contradicting herself when she voted me.
Ngl it doesn't look very good when your two scum leans are the two who have voted you and when there's no other reasoning given aside from that fact. You also keep mentioning that I've said I would "reread" multiple times but I do not have a clue as to what you're referring to?? Can you quote me where I said that, because I don't remember.
 
? Not everything, no. I looked through your posts, I'm not even sure why you're bringing that post up again.


I don't know why you're talking about rereading the game, I never even said I was?

I'm still not even sure what "pocketing" means tbh and I. Don't even know what I'm supposed to respond to here.

???? What am I even trying to make up, I'm not sure what you're referring to at all. I mean, sure, you've said things in the game but I feel like you could also mention how you feel about the other players that have been talked about at length such as Zorchic (who was lynched, but still), Pika, and Fatima. That's what I mean by contributing, otherwise it just looks like lurking.

If you were to reread everything then you would have been able to fully understanding the meaning of my posts that you quoted at night. If you said you reread everything from the beginning of day 1 it would have looked like you slipped.

On the second paragraph you said here you said you don't know why I'm talking about rereading the game when you never said you were but at night you said you reread and I wanted to ask if it was just my posts or was it from rereading everything from day 1.

The Pika and Fatima wagon happened when I was asleep and the day ended when I came back. I can understand the suspicion on Zorchic and he already had alot of pressure and I was expecting him to come back and defend himself but he never came back.

You've explained why you think Luminary's thoughts on you make you think she's scummy but you've not said why you think I'm scummy, is it because I agree with some of Luminary's points?

If you think the two of us are scummy why not HD and Caps who have also voted you?

The reason on why I scum read you was because you said my posts were mostly defending myself on day 1 which was a small defense and the rest of my post responding to FA were my thoughts I brought out and I didn't defend myself against HD. You said you looked back through my posts and I want you to explain to me how the first paragraph quoting FA was a defense and how were my posts quoting HD were also a defense when I pretty much explained I didn't defend myself against HD on day 1.

Caps ninaja'd me and I didn't get a chance to see his post and HD I had as a town read on day 1.
 
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