Mafia Xenoblade Chronicles Mafia - ENDGAME: Town and Survivor Victory!

[ZinnLav]

@ZinnLav How do you feel about Ex, anyway? I noticed you unvoted Human but haven't voted anyone else and I kind of would've expected you to maybe vote Ex for being against your claim.

Nothing he's been saying has struck me as unusual. He was wary of a claim that isn't usually claimed.

I can understand why Zinn's exasperated at getting vanilla twice in two separate role madness games

Exactly! I don't play Mafia to sit around not having anything fun to do during the night phases. Take a look at any game I host, I make every role have at least something, even if it's a 1x power. I just personally really hate Vanilla roles.

I don't know, it's been a while, but I'm pretty sure in larger games in the past there hasn't been more than one vanilla. Unless there's a vanilla + miller + restless spirit or something of the sort, but not straight up vanilla.

Good point, if not Vanilla, some sort of passive role.

 

[Feenie]

Saying something similar as in suspecting a vanilla claim? I haven't seen. Portal Mafia was one of those games where he was scum getting suspected and he talked his way out from getting lynched.

To be fair, you could say that about a few players so the basis is pretty flimsy.

You know, I'm gonna go with Human on this.

VOTE: Tood.

I'm not feeling great about Jinjo, though. Wouldn't be against voting her, either.

 

[Tood]

Finally all caught up on the thread, placing in a vote for now so no one can say I have not voted.
Vote: Jinjo

Do you have any thoughts to share so far?

This post what you did there is a chainsaw defense meaning you are defending a player by attacking their attacker and a player who does that is sometimes probably scum. You did that at the Chaos Mafia and you were an indie scum.

...Am I missing something?

I understand the general idea behind the chainsaw defense, but the example you gave from Chaos Mafia didn't even involve Space defending someone they were aligned with, since she was indep SK. I don't see how you can assume that it's that kind of defense from the get-go?

 

[Feenie]

Actually, wait. I completely missed Fennec's post and I'm kind of wondering why they didn't share more of their thoughts with their vote.

UNVOTE: Tood.

Kind of need to think about this.

 

[Jinjo]

To be fair, you could say that about a few players so the basis is pretty flimsy.

Elaborate over here because I'm not able to understand what you meant over here.

I understand the general idea behind the chainsaw defense, but the example you gave from Chaos Mafia didn't even involve Space defending someone they were aligned with, since she was indep SK. I don't see how you can assume that it's that kind of defense from the get-go?

The scum player doesn't have to be the same alignment as the player they are chainsaw defending.

 

[Jinjo]

coming after me because I said I don't trust a vanilla lynch under the excuse that me not blindly trusting someone that isn't easy to verify is scummy is downright nonsensical

and I made it pretty clear that I wanted to pressure Zinn to see how they reacted first, yall putting words in my mouth by saying I'm trying to get them mislynched

Pressuring a player is also a good way for scum to blend in and I have pretty much said this before in a completed game.

 

[Feenie]

Elaborate over here because I'm not able to understand what you meant over here.

I don't know the context behind Portal Mafia, but if you're scum then of course you're going to try to talk your way out of getting lynched.

 

[Feenie]

@Timaeus Any more thoughts to share?

 

[Emmy]

@Timaeus Any more thoughts to share?

Uh...Would this be the right time to say I've not played either Xenoblade games despite owning them?

Okay, more seriously. I can't say I'm completely convinced by the mounting votes against Jinjo yet. Especially for Fennec who has yet to divulge why they're suddenly throwing them under the bus.

 

[ExLight]

Pressuring a player is also a good way for scum to blend in and I have pretty much said this before in a completed game.

it is also a good way for town to get reactions and decide whether or not someone is scummy lol

 

[TheCapsFan]

Mid-day Votals:
ExLight: 2 (DawningWinds, Jinjo)
Jinjo: 2 (Space, Frozen Fennec)
ZinnLav: 1 (ExLight)
Tood: 1 (HumanDawn)

Day ends in about 24 hours.

 

[Space]

This post what you did there is a chainsaw defense meaning you are defending a player by attacking their attacker and a player who does that is sometimes probably scum. You did that at the Chaos Mafia and you were an indie scum.

I just pointed out that your reasoning of an easy lynch can be used against Exlight as well. And Exlight refuted a similar point regarding the easy mislynch thing. Also as Tood said, I was a serial killer in Chaos mafia trying to save my own skin, so there was nothing to defend there. I'm not trying to go meta, but the situation is not the same.

Okay, more seriously. I can't say I'm completely convinced by the mounting votes against Jinjo yet. Especially for Fennec who has yet to divulge why they're suddenly throwing them under the bus.

I wouldn't say mounting, it's only been 2 votes. Fennec's is weird though, since Fennec hasn't indicated suspicion toward Jinjo

 

[Jinjo]

I just pointed out that your reasoning of an easy lynch can be used against Exlight as well. And Exlight refuted a similar point regarding the easy mislynch thing. Also as Tood said, I was a serial killer in Chaos mafia trying to save my own skin, so there was nothing to defend there. I'm not trying to go meta, but the situation is not the same.

How is ExLight an easy lynch? Are you saying here he is too scummy to be scum and so he can't be scum? You mentioned you were trying to save your own skin in Chaos Mafia and when I caught you as scum on day 1 doing the chainsaw defense I was the only player who was suspecting you at that time and no one else was. You started to get suspected after the night kills.

 

[ExLight]

I'm literally the easiest D1 lynch
1/3 of my town games has me lynched D1

 

[Jinjo]

I'm literally the easiest D1 lynch
1/3 of my town games has me lynched D1

The Spongebob game is the only game I can remember where you got mislynched on day 1. Is it on ZeldaDungeon where you get mislynched?

 

[ExLight]

The Spongebob game is the only game I can remember where you got mislynched on day 1. Is it on ZeldaDungeon where you get mislynched?

across multiple sites, ig but yea mainly ZD

MS Paint Mafia 3, Batman Mafia, Fate/ZD Mafia...
I got lynched D1 as non-hostile indept quite a few times too

 

[DawningWinds]

coming after me because I said I don't trust a vanilla lynch under the excuse that me not blindly trusting someone that isn't easy to verify is scummy is downright nonsensical

and I made it pretty clear that I wanted to pressure Zinn to see how they reacted first, yall putting words in my mouth by saying I'm trying to get them mislynched

Okay, I get not blindly trusting her, but you're post where you said that voting a vanilla would be best sort of did imply that lynching her was your intent. I do sort of get why you wanted to pressure her, and reading back it does actually seem like that was your intent all along, with voting her off only being "optimal" depending on her reaction.

Unvote: ExLight

Finally all caught up on the thread, placing in a vote for now so no one can say I have not voted.
Vote: Jinjo

You're only voting so nobody can say you haven't? That feels a bit like... just overall bad. It's kinda scummy - trying to keep attention away from yourself by just throwing your vote in the ring, and kinda just bad play.

I'm also not a fan of Timeaus at the moment- he's sort of been showing up infrequently in a while and making some pretty meh comments. Like, he's given thoughts, but he's taken a near-completely neutral stance on every player, excepting kind of ZinnLav, even though he has talked about the wagons and stuff.
Vote: Timeaus
If not him I'd probably vote Frozen Fennec for the very blegh vote on Jinjo. Tood's not said anything that really makes me think she's town either so I'd be fine with that vote as well.

Jinjo I honestly don't think is really worth going after- her posts I think are pretty in line with town Jinjo, and I can see where she's coming from with most of her points. The chainsaw defense thing I don't really agree with (especially for Fennec, who is bad for ther reasons), but I can kind of understand it- Space's main reason for the Jinjo vote does seem to because she disagrees with the ExLight vote. I also don't really agree with her vote on ExLight anymore: he already explained why the easy mislynch argument doesn't make sense, and he doesn't seem like the kind of player to try to blend into the background, but I can still see where she's coming from.

Ex being easy mislynch does make sense, but I don't really agree that that's what Jinjo's going for.

Nah... 2? Unless there are 2 Mafia or a very powerful Town I don't see 2 Independents. Dickson would definitely be Town but Alvis I see more being an Independent, like, if there was one, it's him.

I agree with 2 being too many unless the Mafia is smaller, but why's Dickson "definitely town"? He's mentioned in the page I read on Alvis to have been a traitor all along.

 

[Space]

How is ExLight an easy lynch? Are you saying here he is too scummy to be scum and so he can't be scum? You mentioned you were trying to save your own skin in Chaos Mafia and when I caught you as scum on day 1 doing the chainsaw defense I was the only player who was suspecting you at that time and no one else was. You started to get suspected after the night kills.

An easy lynch specifically in how vocal he'd been about being apprehensive of the vanilla claim. It's easy to vote him out because there's many who disagree with his view on that, so getting a majority can easily occur. I don't see how Chaos Mafia is applicable to this. I was an independent there, not working with anyone -- do you think I'm an independent hostile here?

but I can kind of understand it- Space's main reason for the Jinjo vote does seem to because she disagrees with the ExLight vote.

I never said anything about disagreeing (I mean, I do disagree, but), it was how I see Jinjo trying to get an easy lynch on Exlight, and her not even addressing what Exlight said before about the trying to get an easy mislynch.

feels like I'm repeating my words a lot with 'mislynch' and 'easy' so sorry if this gets confusing

Ex being easy mislynch does make sense, but I don't really agree that that's what Jinjo's going for.

What do you think then? That she's genuinely thinking Exlight is trying to get an easy lynch?

 

[Space]

I'm also not a fan of Timeaus at the moment- he's sort of been showing up infrequently in a while and making some pretty meh comments. Like, he's given thoughts, but he's taken a near-completely neutral stance on every player, excepting kind of ZinnLav, even though he has talked about the wagons and stuff.

I agree with this, even this post:

I feel I should clarify that I'm talking Day 1 specifically here since the risk of blind lynching a Town is so much higher unless Mafia makes a serious blunder.

is neutral, since it's not even really about Zinnlav or the claim at this point. More like just pointing out how Day 1 lynches can be more dangerous for town.

 

[Tood]

So out of everything so far, I dislike Fennec's vote on Jinjo they most. I don't see why they couldn't have mentioned some kind of reasoning behind it at the very least.

I also don't get why they'd point out that they've caught up on a thread and then have absolutely nothing to say about anything that's happened. It just comes off as someone trying to avoid contributing to the discussion or someone who is trying to lay low, neither of which look good

Vote: Frozen Fennec
to try and get some kind of thoughts on literally anything out of them at least?

---

But...I admittedly still don't get the whole chainsaw case against Ex by Jinjo; doesn't the possibility of the defender being non-scum aligned significantly weaken the legitimacy of using a chainsaw defense as an argument against someone?

Like, I can see how you might argue it had happened if the person who is being defended had already flipped scum, but using it as a basis to vote someone D1 when we have barely anything to go off feels... odd to me.

I feel like I'm spending way too much time trying to make sense of this single point, and I'm tempted to attribute all of this to me having a small brain, but ehh

I agree with 2 being too many unless the Mafia is smaller, but why's Dickson "definitely town"? He's mentioned in the page I read on Alvis to have been a traitor all along.

This is kinda spoilery, but (iirc, I could be mistaken on some stuff):

Spoiler: Xenoblade spoiler

Dickson is some kind of disciple of the god of the Bionis, who wants to destroy all living things because reasons. He backstabs the party, but is not aligned with the Mechon at all.

So if mafia = mechon only, then it'd be kind of weird to have Dickson on their side?

Tbh Indep!Dickson might also be a possibility, but I don't know how feasible that would be in a game of this size.