BDSP Pokémon Brilliant Diamond and Shining Pearl General Discussion

[KirbyBulba737]

I will buy something that is called Adventskalender in german. It's basically something you buy for children and it works kinda like a countdown til christmas eve (in Germany you get presents at christmas eve already). It is numbered from 1 to 24 and it contains a piece of chocolate (usually, but there are all kinds of stuff nowadays, like Lego, or pokemon trading cards for example) for each day. I'll use it as a countdown for the release date instead.

We those in Italy too, and we call it: "calendario dell'avvento" in English: "Advent Calendar"

 

[SinnohEevee]

Masuda said that people are nicer in the Pokémon World.
But they did have a nuke 3000 years ago.

 

[zoroarctic]

and that's something that could ruin children's innocence.

Nah, something that ruins a child’s innocence would be getting hooked on Captain Planet and then learning one of your parents works in the oil industry.

 

[Puddle]

I've seen a few news outlets claiming that BDSP will have "placeholder music" which requires a patch on release day. Personally though, I believe the MIDI-like soundtrack is an artistic choice designed to replicate the feel of the original games, much like the chibi art style.

 

[BigBadButterfree]

I've seen a few news outlets claiming that BDSP will have "placeholder music" which requires a patch on release day. Personally though, I believe the MIDI-like soundtrack is an artistic choice designed to replicate the feel of the original games, much like the chibi art style.

Honestly, I hope they update the midi. Midi comes in all kinds of sounds, realistic and not. Game Freak has always used midi. It doesn't surprise me. But if they can't update the gen 4 soundtrack to use DECENT midi, I will frankly be disappointed. The OST from DPPt is one of my favorites, and it's only hindered by the garbage DS-quality midi. I wanna hear Cynthia's theme on the most realistic piano they can find. I want to hear the difference between the strings and the voices in the Old Chateau.

One complaint I have though, when they update midi for a remake, they tend to worsen it, so I'm worried. I'm looking at ORAS specifically. Everything good about the original is washed out by their new midi. They honestly should've just rearranged everything for their new sound library. The active basslines and intricate countermelodies are completely washed out by the balance of the new midi used. I do NOT want that to happen to my beloved Sinnoh soundtrack.

Edit: should be noted, I have not (and probably won't) checked out the demo in question, I'd rather experience the music for myself in the full game.

 

[Alola]

I saw the recent playthrough footage released last week and I'm quite disappointed the EXP All feature still seems ingrained in the gameplay; I'm really hoping they go back to the Gen 6 & 7 method of letting that be optional. Why, Game Freak? There is literally no reason not to have it as an optional feature - not everyone wants an overleveled party for a game not scaled for such gains; or blanket EV distribution for that matter. Having a toggle literally satisfies every player.

 

[KirbyBulba737]

How is this worse than any other RPG, at least any RPG that has a party? Every time you win a battle, your whole team gets experience unless they were defeated.

Because we had the option to turn it off, and because in most RPGs the whole party fights, not only one at a time.

 

[Greninjaman]

because in most RPGs the whole party fights, not only one at a time.

That might be the main issue/complaint! It's one on one battles, unlike in games like Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest, where (as you said) the entire party battles the monsters together.

 

[Nodqfan]

Yeah, I almost wrote that it wasn't a main series game, BTW you're just adding fuel to my fire that maybe it's time Game Freak stepped down and let somebody else handle the Pokemon games for good. I mean just look at the at the aforementioned XD and Colosseum as examples. They were much better (or maybe just tougher?) games than anything we've gotten from Pokemon in quite some time.

I don't ever see Game Freak stepping down as developer of the main series of Pokemon games if the BDSP remakes are successful. I could see them handing off the development of remakes to other studios while they focus on games like Legends Arceus and other new mainline Pokemon games to keep the series fresh.

Really unless Nintendo decides to buy Game Freak and their stake in the Pokemon Company I see them being involved with Pokemon in one form or another for a long time to come. and there's almost no chance that Satoshi Tajiri will ever sell.

 

[Alola]

Wow, so I completely missed all the news last week:

• Going back to limited TMs is interesting. I won't mind if they are truly as plentiful as claimed to be. But if they aren't, that's really a two-step forward one-step back decision. But what else is Pokémon known for, really... That being said, it does make sense if Game Freak is trying to establish a reward for Trainers to work towards in-game, to increase replayability etc. 100% sure it's going to be tied to the Underground for additional TM copies; as long as they don't require BP through the Battle Tower, I'll be good.
• Amity Square is restricted to "cute" Pokémon after all? Really? Honestly there is nothing to say aside from this being a stupid and lazy decision - y'all have the models, and even an enclosed space to use them for. But even that was too much. It's also quite the subjective take that you would think they would account for regardless of "nostalgia."
• The midi-style tracks don't sound bad, but I did expect something grander for the Sinnoh remakes music-wise, akin to what ORAS did with their lovely tracks.
• I've noticed that some people are happy for the EXP All to be back, with their argument being for grinding up new team members. However, wouldn't using EXP Candy achieve the same effect for you with even less time? I would think there would be more explicit interest and inquiries into the candies coming back if grinding is that off-putting for players.
• Badge shining returning is appreciated.
• No National Pokedex again.

I don't know. Some of these changes, yet juxtaposition of current QoL updates, are making for an oddly-made game feature-wise. Is it a 1:1 remake? An enhanced remake? What's the angle, haha.

 

[KirbyBulba737]

Like what? I've seen Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest swapping party members. Even in Super Mario RPG (you just can't do it in battle) and Paper Mario.

Don't those RPGs have EXP only for party members paricipating in battle?

 

[Alola]

Don't those RPGs have EXP only for party members paricipating in battle?

I think for the most part yes (which just makes sense narratively, too), but there are a couple of exceptions that don't. For example, everyone gains "EXP" in Final Fantasy XIII regardless if they were in battle, or that chapter, or not.

 

[Daren]

Exp sharing is common nowadays in other RPGs--heck, I'm currently playing the otherwise old-school hardcore Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous and even that does it--but Pokémon has proven poor at balancing the new system, and considering the Sw/Sh expansion pass made the problem worse I don't have high hopes fixing it is a priority, and since gen 4 was before they started drastically lowering the number of trainers in the game I'm concerned BDSP is going to break if you don't either skip most of the content or swap constantly.

 

[Alola]

Exp sharing is common nowadays in other RPGs--heck, I'm currently playing the otherwise old-school hardcore Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous and even that does it--but Pokémon has proven poor at balancing the new system, and considering the Sw/Sh expansion pass made the problem worse I don't have high hopes fixing it is a priority, and since gen 4 was before they started drastically lowering the number of trainers in the game I'm concerned BDSP is going to break if you don't either skip most of the content or swap constantly.

This so much. When I first played Shield, I began to overlevel after the fourth Gym naturally. For half the game, I was overleveled compared to everyone else until we reached Leon, who they boosted up in level to suddenly "scale" me to something appropriate; it was a pretty upsetting and lackluster experience. I later did a new game after getting the DLC, and stopped at the Isle of Armor because I wanted to enjoy the isle and Galar simultaneously (which I think is pretty neat to do narrative-wise with your Kubfu and all) as well as get a Squirtle to use. I was surprised when Mustard and Honey threw this EXP. Charm at me that I did not need or ask for, not five steps in the island; of course you can't turn it off. So, for that playthrough, I had to actively avoid Trainers for the first time in my Pokémon playing experience to not be grossly overleveled again.

I don't see signs of the Exp. Charm in BDSP, yet anyway, but yeah - something tells me these games were not made with a consideration to balance at all (esp. if you consider the EXP boost you will also get from Affection, I'm sure).

 

[CynthiaLover]

I've noticed that some people are happy for the EXP All to be back, with their argument being for grinding up new team members. However, wouldn't using EXP Candy achieve the same effect for you with even less time? I would think there would be more explicit interest and inquiries into the candies coming back if grinding is that off-putting for players.

I need to point out something: we don't know if EXP Candies are in these games or not. From what we've seen so far they aren't and even if they are there isn't any real reliable way to farm them outside of maybe the Underground. But even then they won't be nearly as plentiful as Sword/Shield, as the Max Raids gave EXP Candy by the bowlful while if (and I mean IF) EXP Candies can be farmed in the Underground they'll be almost drip-fed to the player due to how mining in the Underground works. Especially since you have a "time limit" to harvest everything in the mining minigame, so if EXP Candies can be farmed in the Underground they'll be no where near as plentiful as Sword/Shield. Especially if things like TMs are down there, which would be more valuable to a player than EXP Candy due to the change back to one-time use. But if they aren't then the auto EXP Share still has value for mitigating the need to grind excessively, something that the Gen 4 games were notorious about. So, the point is, we don't know if EXP Candies are going to be even in BDSP or not. Thus, having the auto EXP Share does hold value if they aren't.

 

[Alola]

I need to point out something: we don't know if EXP Candies are in these games or not.

I don't know why this takes away from my point about it being discussed or desired, though. We didn't know, and still don't know, a number of things about BDSP, but that didn't/doesn't stop conversations from happening about possible or sought features.

From what we've seen so far they aren't and even if they are there isn't any real reliable way to farm them outside of maybe the Underground. But even then they won't be nearly as plentiful as Sword/Shield, as the Max Raids gave EXP Candy by the bowlful while if (and I mean IF) EXP Candies can be farmed in the Underground they'll be almost drip-fed to the player due to how mining in the Underground works. Especially since you have a "time limit" to harvest everything in the mining minigame, so if EXP Candies can be farmed in the Underground they'll be no where near as plentiful as Sword/Shield. Especially if things like TMs are down there, which would be more valuable to a player than EXP Candy due to the change back to one-time use. But if they aren't then the auto EXP Share still has value for mitigating the need to grind excessively, something that the Gen 4 games were notorious about. So, the point is, we don't know if EXP Candies are going to be even in BDSP or not. Thus, having the auto EXP Share does hold value if they aren't.

This is all mostly speculation though, in which I or anyone else could equally speculate in return; you have no proof as of yet of there being methods to farm them and for how much or how little. For example, what if you can exchange one sphere for several candies, with different candies based on the size of the sphere? Obviously the EXP All holds merit for faster leveling, but I don't seen an issue with contemplating faster ways of leveling given the current methods to do so.

 

[CynthiaLover]

I don't know why this takes away from my point about it being discussed or desired, though. We didn't know, and still don't know, a number of things about BDSP, but that didn't/doesn't stop conversations from happening about possible or sought features.

This is all mostly speculation though, in which I or anyone else could equally speculate in return; you have no proof as of yet of there being methods to farm them and for how much or how little. For example, what if you can exchange one sphere for several candies, with different candies based on the size of the sphere? Obviously the EXP All holds merit for faster leveling, but I don't seen an issue with contemplating faster ways of leveling given the current methods to do so.

I'm aware of that. I'm just pointing out that, from what we know so far, EXP Candies may not be a thing in BDSP. We're free to speculate if they are or aren't, that's perfectly fine. I was using the Underground as a form of that, as we don't know if EXP Candies, or even TMs, are able to be mined down there or not. If they are, then they could either be drip-fed via the mining minigame or exchanged for Spheres like you said (although I speculate that Spheres might be used more for the Secret Base statues over anything else, since their original use was Secret Base furniture). Or they could be rewards for certain tasks elsewhere, we don't know. However, considering how these remakes are being fairly (keyword: fairly) true to their source, it's possible that EXP Candies won't be part of it. I mean, they've brought back one-time use TMs, which is a very odd decision, considering ORAS had reusable TMs despite the original RSE having one-shot TMs. Considering some of the decisions they've made for BDSP pay homage to the originals, such as the one-use TMs, Amity Square's restrictions, HM's "returning", and the reintroduction of moves that were removed from Sword/Shield like Return, then it suggests that EXP Candy won't be in these games in order to keep them as true to the core source as possible. Or they could very well be in the games, too, and they just haven't revealed it yet to avoid any more potential backlash. But either way, the auto EXP Share still holds more value long-term in keeping teams leveled properly and reduce the need for endless grinding. And, like others have said, it's no different than many other RPGs. Breath of Fire 4, for example, gives the whole party shared EXP, even if the backrow doesn't actually participate in the battle (as in actually attack the enemy). And in the 3DS Dragon Quest 8 remake the party members that don't go into a dungeon still get EXP regardless. So why the auto EXP Share is such a hot issue when several other RPGs have already do the same thing for years I find strange, as it's the most practical thing.

 

[Alola]

And, like others have said, it's no different than many other RPGs. Breath of Fire 4, for example, gives the whole party shared EXP, even if the backrow doesn't actually participate in the battle (as in actually attack the enemy). And in the 3DS Dragon Quest 8 remake the party members that don't go into a dungeon still get EXP regardless. So why the auto EXP Share is such a hot issue when several other RPGs have already do the same thing for years I find strange, as it's the most practical thing.

Because Pokémon isn't like most RPGs. And I've never liked the term "practical" when used with Pokémon, because that was never the ultimate aim of the franchise. When you think of practicality with Pokémon, they aren't so much Pokémon anymore as they are "1s" and "0s", and which combination of said species, moves, IVs, EVs, natures, and items will complete the game or battle most effectively. Why pick Chikorita when it isn't the "practical" choice for a Johto playthrough? Why evolve your Eevee into a Vaporeon when it isn't the most "practical" option given the fact most games have Water-types as the most abundant type to encounter? Why use Pokémon that don't have 31 IVs in each stat as they aren't the most "practical" to win with? Why keep that Buneary with Klutz, an Ability that is quite impractical? Why use Pokémon with neutral or hindering natures, when that isn't very "practical" for their natural strengths? Everyone plays their own way and I believe Game Freak should try to accommodate as many players as they can for doing so, to make the most enjoyable games possible.

So when we take "practicality" out of the equation, several common reasons you're left with are:

• People find it off-putting how Pokémon they don't battle with magically get EXP. How a Pokémon, who may never see the light of day, suddenly evolves after a battle(s) it never participated in. As people immerse themselves in their gameplay, this can be jarring and disrupt the narrative sense. You aren't raising people in other RPGs as you are Pokémon, and some people prefer that direct interaction of growth that they give their party member. With your backrow example, and other similar games, those party members are still physically present for the fight realistically speaking; the game design just doesn't allow all of them to fight at once, in contrast to the Pokémon who are 100% away from any battle unless sent out.
• Overleveling. The games have been poorly scaled with the EXP All function, with XY being the first and best example of that - there's a reason why it's infamously known as the easiest pair of mainline games, and that's largely because people played with the EXP. Share on (supplemented with Affection's experience boosting). Throw in things like an EXP Charm, and you can steamroll most of the content without any difficulty (on top of largely easy games to begin with, outside of the Ultra games).
• EV placement goes askew as now everyone gets EVs regardless of it was intentional, or practical; naturally, this is moot if you're say, grinding for Special Attack EVs with a party of specially attacking Pokémon. It forces players to go out of their way to prevent that, such as growing and using EV Berries, managing Pokémon in and out of the PC box, or raising Pokémon at different times/areas.
• And lastly, and probably the most important, it takes away a choice unnecessarily. If the choice remained as it did in Gen 6 & 7, literally everyone would be happy; there's no plausible negative to having left that as a togglable option. But taking that choice away effectively alienates a portion of the fanbase as well as a degree of control for our own adventures within these games, which can be frustrating.

 

[RavenRaziel98]

• And lastly, and probably the most important, it takes away a choice unnecessarily. If the choice remained as it did in Gen 6 & 7, literally everyone would be happy; there's no plausible negative to having left that as a togglable option. But taking that choice away effectively alienates a portion of the fanbase as well as a degree of control for our own adventures within these games, which can be frustrating.

One reason that is a bummer for me about that thing is that by not giving me the possibility to choose that I won't be able to finish the one game with exp share and the other without exp share. This way I could do an easy play through and after I'm done I could play the other version with higher difficulty while knowing what to expect.

 

[zoroarctic]

And lastly, and probably the most important, it takes away a choice unnecessarily. If the choice remained as it did in Gen 6 & 7, literally everyone would be happy.

Unlikely. Plenty of people were complaining about the EXP Share even when it was optional.