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Not super relevant to the discussion at hand, but I want to point out that Misty's "Water Pokemon Master" goal only existed in the dub prior to the Orange Islands arc. For over 90 episodes, she really didn't have a stated goal (other than shaking Ash down for a new bike).
Information courtesy of @Dogasu.
For all the flaws in Iris’ progression, I can’t deny that JN has succeeded in making her endearing to me. Something BW failed miserably at.
Emphasis mine.In the Kalos League finals, Satoshi's Gekkouga and Alan's Lizardon went up against each other in one of the most outstanding battles in the history of the Pocket Monsters animated series, one that people are still talking about even now.
Gee, I wonder why…Dogasu translated this interview with Alain's voice actor:
I can't help but laugh at this part though:Nico Nico News: Kensho Ono Interview
dogasu.bulbagarden.net
Emphasis mine.
Well, yes. That's factually true.
I think it’s worse over there tbh but I don’t really knowDo people over in Japan hold that battle-and Alain for that matter-in the same regard as people here in the west do?
It's true, but probably not for the reasons they wanted or expected when the battle first premiered.Dogasu translated this interview with Alain's voice actor:
I can't help but laugh at this part though:Nico Nico News: Kensho Ono Interview
dogasu.bulbagarden.net
Emphasis mine.
Well, yes. That's factually true.
I'm not sure myself. I'm positive that the majority of the initial backlash to the battle was from the western fanbase. I do remember that they disabled likes and comments on the official YouTube channel showing the next episode previews shortly after that battle, so I wouldn't be surprised if they were getting complaints from fans all over the world if they felt the need to do that.Do people over in Japan hold that battle-and Alain for that matter-in the same regard as people here in the west do?
I'm not so sure about that; I recall seeing a lot of anger on Japanese sites right after, I believe I read that Alain became a pariah on the Japanese chans, and some of the staff responding to it seems to point to it being a major issue there, too.I'm positive that the majority of the initial backlash to the battle was from the western fanbase.
Hearing how excited he was to be taking part in the Masters Tournament made me sad considering how pathetically Alain was treated. It seems like he considered Alain to have left XY on a high note, and now his reputation is permanently soiled. On the other hand, I forgot about him being married to Koharu's VA, so maybe that increases the character's chances of sticking around for a while since availability seems not to be an issue.Dogasu translated this interview with Alain's voice actor:
I can't help but laugh at this part though:Nico Nico News: Kensho Ono Interview
dogasu.bulbagarden.net
Emphasis mine.
Well, yes. That's factually true.
I believe there was controversy about Hoenn at the time (I was very annoyed about it, I remember), but:Between Tobias, Cameron and Alain I find it a little funny that three of the most controversial battles in the anime just so happen to be the last league battles of their respective series. Considering the status quo the series was still in at those points many likely assumed Ash would lose in the end, but still how does it happen three times in a row? You don't really hear people talking about the battles from Kanto-to-Hoenn, just these three. Probably because Tobias was just a walking deus ex machina that came after one of the battles that people often consider one of the best in the series, Cameron's just a god damn idiot that brought five pokemon to a six-on-six battle and the battle between Ash and Alain was hyped to hell.
I didn't know that they were married. That would make it easier for Alain to show up again. It would be weird if he just left after losing since he has a connection to both Ash and Steven. Wanting to see their battle and talk with Ash in-between the rest of the battles sounds reasonable, but since Alain was seemingly brought back just to hype up Leon, that still might not happen. I'm still baffled at their decision to use Alain like this. The reactions towards the battle, at least from what I've seen, have been less "Wow, Leon is super strong" and more like "Wow, Alain was nerfed super hard to make Leon look good" If that's what they wanted to do, they could have easily included Raihan in the Master Class instead. Saving Alain as a surprise for the Master Class also still feels so weird if they weren't going to have him battle against Ash.Hearing how excited he was to be taking part in the Masters Tournament made me sad considering how pathetically Alain was treated. It seems like he considered Alain to have left XY on a high note, and now his reputation is permanently soiled. On the other hand, I forgot about him being married to Koharu's VA, so maybe that increases the character's chances of sticking around for a while since availability seems not to be an issue.
It is strange that Chloe didn't want to go cheer on Ash in person. She doesn't have the strongest connection with him, but wanting to support him during this tournament still would have been a nice gesture and allowed her to see more battles in general. As much as she says that she wants to find different paths to take with Eevee, I suspect none of them will involve battles.Speaking of which, why couldn't Koharu watch the tournament with Gou? For someone who's story arc revolves around trying many new things, she's really avoided battles like the plague. Scratch that, she's not allowed to leave the house unless an Eeveelution is involved.
People used to complain a bit about Ash using Pokemon against Ritchie after he was chased around by Team Rocket and I think that there were some complaints about Pikachu losing to a Meowth in the Hoenn League, but in general, I think it helped that Ash still got some major victories in those respective series. People claimed that the Orange Islands didn't count, but he still defeated a top trainer in his first full battle. Ash defeated the Battle Frontier, which I still think is his most impressive accomplishment thus far. People were still upset that he lost Leagues, but I think having some victories afterwards helped, even if it felt like fans ignored those as the years went on. The Sinnoh, Unova and Kalos League defeats probably would have been infamous regardless, but not having a major victory within those series probably didn't help matters either.Between Tobias, Cameron and Alain I find it a little funny that three of the most controversial battles in the anime just so happen to be the last league battles of their respective series. Considering the status quo the series was still in at those points many likely assumed Ash would lose in the end, but still how does it happen three times in a row? You don't really hear people talking about the battles from Kanto-to-Hoenn, just these three. Probably because Tobias was just a walking deus ex machina that came after one of the battles that people often consider one of the best in the series, Cameron's just a god damn idiot that brought five pokemon to a six-on-six battle and the battle between Ash and Alain was hyped to hell.
I'd also add that Ash's losses felt pretty reasonable prior to DP, either due to inexperience or using an underpowered team. Starting in DP, Ash has realistically been good enough to win every league. His losses (and the characters who delivered them) began to feel a lot more contrived, as if the universe itself was impeding him, rather than any failing on his own part.Between Tobias, Cameron and Alain I find it a little funny that three of the most controversial battles in the anime just so happen to be the last league battles of their respective series. Considering the status quo the series was still in at those points many likely assumed Ash would lose in the end, but still how does it happen three times in a row? You don't really hear people talking about the battles from Kanto-to-Hoenn, just these three. Probably because Tobias was just a walking deus ex machina that came after one of the battles that people often consider one of the best in the series, Cameron's just a god damn idiot that brought five pokemon to a six-on-six battle and the battle between Ash and Alain was hyped to hell.
Honestly, this is one of those recurring things I see writers keep doing and audiences keep seeing right through it, knowing either the antagonist will suddenly seem a lot weaker when he fights the protagonist or some sort of plot device will save the day.The reactions towards the battle, at least from what I've seen, have been less "Wow, Leon is super strong" and more like "Wow, Alain was nerfed super hard to make Leon look good"