A more faithful adaptation of the video games?

[PokeDot517]

Better connection with the main series video games?
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Does the anime require a better adaptation of the video games like PKMN trainers using TMs or HMs to teach their Pokémon moves? Or maybe just feature more of the mechanics found in the games? Or maybe take the protagonists from the games and use their storyline but expand on it more and do things that weren't feasible in games?

Or you do you prefer how the show is now and like how it's not completely like the games and how it tries to do it's own thing and bring in new ideas?

I admire how the anime uses new ideas and incorporates story elements in the games from time to time. Unfortunately there are quite a few problems that keep the anime from being good (IMO) however I shall not disclose them here. While the show's main demographic is children, that's no excuse for how the show's problems never seem to be rectified. Some may find it complaining but I see it as constructive criticism. The shows ratings are mostly positive and while it's good to see the show still receiving good reception despite many years being on television, it may if not already give the production staff a shared mindset of keeping the show the same instead of pursuing a more complex and developed direction in fear of driving away their main audience but I digress.




PS. Sorry if my grammar is bad...but WATCHA GUNNA DOO?

 

[Dogasu]

One of the main reasons the TV series we have at the moment is so great is because it doesn't follow the games to the letter.

If I want the game plot then I'll just play the games.

 

[Osprey]

I don't think a show should be completely limited to the game's story, since that story honestly isn't the most interesting this to follow in every exact way. Maybe it could be more faithful in terms of how battles work (i.e. Pokemon in their basic evolved forms shouldn't defeat final forms ) and maybe not be so filled with CotD's with no in-game counterparts. As of now, the anime isn't very appealing to any fans who've been with this longer than Gen V. It is mostly a big promotion parade, albeit one that makes all Pokemon fans look childish and dumb. Now, if we could get a show that follows a story like some good fanfictions around here... then we might have a good show. Even if it still ignores the rules of the game at times.

... Besides, where would we get the character development? Most of it is pretty minor stuff with NPC's, and absolutely none of it goes to the PC. Not much to go on there if you want development and fidelity at the same time.

 

[XYZ Nexus]

For once I agree with Dogasu here. The games and anime should be forever different as the anime being a 1:1 adaption of the games would become insanely dull. I've already played through the games about more a dozen times, I do not want to see it animated. And besides, we've seen how badly the games handle characters barring Gen 5 and maybe Gen 6. At least the anime makes game characters like Misty, Brock, Clemont, Serena and May feel like human beings rather than one note punching bags like in the games. Plus a lot of things in the games just don't make sense in the anime, like having living beings be nothing more than robots that need EXP, that use discs to learn moves, and needing things like freaking Combusken needing to learn Cut to slice a tree, when he could, oh I don't know, set it on fire? Plus there's barely any character development in the games anyway barring a few, so that's also a moot point. And having a serious story wouldn't make any sense considering the show is made for kids, to advertise video games that are for kids. If you want mature stories, go read some generic fanfictions with your description of serious or read the *gags* manga.

I'm fine with the anime as it is since it doesn't have as many ridiculously idiotic mechanics like the games. Such as being unable to fly on your dragon Pokemon because he doesn't have Fly, being unable to hit a bird Pokemon like Hawlucha with a ground typed bone since its ground type, etc. Sorry for the rant, but I'm sick and tired of the people who keep asking for the anime to become as stale as the games.

 

[Almonds]

A faithful anime adaptation of the games like Pokemon Origins was a good idea. But it was good because it lasted for just four episodes, summarizing only the important events making it fast-paced, and even then it included elements that weren't present in the games. While it's refreshing to see the plot of the games on screen, I'm not sure if I want to see the protagonist's journey - or rather, my journey - from the games continue on for 600+ episodes when I know what's exactly going to happen.

 

[SammyW27]

It wouldn't really work. At least not in the Show's format. It would be better suited for the usual 13-26 episode style, but not a series that cranks out episodes week after week after week after week. Otherwise, the games' shallow, simple stories just DON'T have what it takes to carry a 3-4 year long series with a new episode almost every week :dead:

And as Kyraiki so well pointed out, who really wants to watch the games story to the letter when they've experienced it first hand?

 

[CrystaI]

And as Kyraiki so well pointed out, who really wants to watch the games story to the letter when they've experienced it first hand?

I would.

That is because the in-game protagonist was set out to be a silent protagonist. Putting he/she on-screen will make him/her not silent anymore, which means giving the PC a personality and make he/she into a living character on their own. I'm interested to see what kind of canonical personality the in-game protagonist will get when they are made onto anime, and that what kind of personal story he/she will get outside the general in-game plot being the basic skeleton of the overall story.
As a very good example of the Pokemon Special manga, it basically adapts rather faithfully from the game plot, yet it has its own twist for all the minor story outside the main plot. Well even for the main plot, all the conversations are now different from what was set in the game. Each characters have their different reasons to start a journey, hence they are interesting on their own because they are not the stereotyped "Challenge gyms and Pokemon League to become the strongest trainer". They do grow as they travel, and each grow in a different pace, they are full of different emotions which makes them much more lifelike than Ash Ketchum.
Well, but then here comes the biggest problem from the anime scriptwriter's side, is that are they creative enough to give each different PC a different personalities and different reason to travel, other than what was set out in the game?

But on the opposite, I will not like the anime to adapt the game system mechanic at all if possible. Just like everyone said, Pokemon are supposed to be living creature, they are not machines and data. All the gameplay system mechanics such as EXP and levels, stats like HP/ATK/DEF/Sp.ATK/Sp.DEF/SPE, also the TM/HM, they are not making any sense in terms of real-life understandings. Keep those mechanical gameplay elements only in the game catridge. When writing a story set in the realm of realistic common knowledge, one needs to jump out from the thinking of mechanical gameplay, rebuild such gameplay system in an alternative realistically rational manner, then battle can become much more interesting than one experienced in the gameplay.

For the battle creativeness, the current anime was rather doing a good work, especially for many moves executing in non-mechanical ways, or having moves hitting things other than the opponent Pokemon, or that creatively combining different moves to produce unexpected alternative effects. Adapting the game mechanics mechanically will rather ruin the battle in a super anticlimactic way (For many time in the anime, I really hate the activation of abilities).
But it really need to be careful of not being "over-creative" to the point of neglecting common knowledge (e.g. Thunder Armor).

And finally, just like mentioned by SammyW27, the in-game story is not suitable for long anime extended to the period of 3~4 years of airing time. The maximum I would accept is up to one year period of ~52 episodes. The longer it gets, the more filler episodes are needed, and hence poorer it gets in the overall plot quality.

 

[XYZ Nexus]

I would.

That is because the in-game protagonist was set out to be a silent protagonist. Putting he/she on-screen will make him/her not silent anymore, which means giving the PC a personality and make he/she into a living character on their own. I'm interested to see what kind of canonical personality the in-game protagonist will get when they are made onto anime, and that what kind of personal story he/she will get outside the general in-game plot being the basic skeleton of the overall story.

How can you be so confident that's even likely considering Origins and the B2W2 trailer had the same generic characters with generic lines? Making it more like the games doesn't mean you'll get automatic quality, considering how well recieved the original series anime was even though it didn't follow the games at all. And as for personal story, there isn't any! All you get are tibits from your mother or some other character in your hometown and that's it, you're supposed to fill in the blanks for yourself. Obviously the canon personality is just a generic ten year old like how Red was, there isn't much you can look into.

As a very good example of the Pokemon Special manga, it basically adapts rather faithfully from the game plot, yet it has its own twist for all the minor story outside the main plot. Well even for the main plot, all the conversations are now different from what was set in the game. Each characters have their different reasons to start a journey, hence they are interesting on their own because they are not the stereotyped "Challenge gyms and Pokemon League to become the strongest trainer". They do grow as they travel, and each grow in a different pace, they are full of different emotions which makes them much more lifelike than Ash Ketchum.

Then just read that instead of complaining about the anime isn't an extended Origins, alright? The manga and anime aren't even comparable as the manga isn't restricted to appealing to the fans while advertising the games, and the manga doesn't even follow the games that well. Does the games have a league similar to the kind in the RGBY Chapter where you have fight one on one matches till you get out on top? Does Yellow Version take place a few years after the main character in RGB was frozen over? Nope, not at all, so there really isn't anything close to the games as possible, plot wise. Aside from Origins and the BW2 trailer. Oh and look, the obligatory Ash insult, cause you can't have a post without that, because he's the only bland character in the whole franchise. Red and co. have clearly defined personalities and with the best written dialogue in the whole games and anime...oh wait.

Well, but then here comes the biggest problem from the anime scriptwriter's side, is that are they creative enough to give each different PC a different personalities and different reason to travel, other than what was set out in the game?

Just copy and pasting the manga would surely work considering they don't really care as long as they're paid, or make them the generic Red clones which are far more likely.

(For many time in the anime, I really hate the activation of abilities).
But it really need to be careful of not being "over-creative" to the point of neglecting common knowledge (e.g. Thunder Armor).

The activation of abilities are just as random as they are in the games for the most part, such as Static. Some abilities are made out to be a big deal such as Infernape's Blaze in the anime and did receive a good amount of focus about that.
As for Thunder Armor, I'm sure we can all agree that was random as heck. But Swellow was shown to be very resistant against Electric attacks in his debut episode, not to the extent where he's immune, but just enough to overcome type disadvantages with willpower. He simply braced all the damage from Thunder, but yeah the Armor part, I have no explanation for that.

And finally, just like mentioned by SammyW27, the in-game story is not suitable for long anime extended to the period of 3~4 years of airing time. The maximum I would accept is up to one year period of ~52 episodes. The longer it gets, the more filler episodes are needed, and hence poorer it gets in the overall plot quality.

Yes, because fillers always mean they're the worst episodes to ever exist and need to burned to a crisp, while plot episodes are always well done on the basis of being plot, when that's clearly not the case.

 

[YamiiDenryuu]

If you want mature stories, go read some generic fanfictions with your description of serious or read the *gags* manga.

Just to clarify, the only "the manga" that's like that is Special (and I'm honestly not sure where the impression that it's mature even comes from aside from "it's not the animu and it's more like the games so therefore must be better"). Others, like DPA, can be more lighthearted as well as looser adaptations of the games.

Incidentally, I'd put Special forward as an example of super-direct game adaptation being a terrible idea, as it increasingly feels like a checklist of game features and events that's just badly pretending to be a story. It tries to do a few of its own things sometimes, but it mostly just gets shoehorned in along with as much content as it can crib from the games and it just becomes an uninteresting, undercooked mess. Also, the characterization of the Pokemon is atrocious, if you can even say it exists.

But, I digress.

 

[CrystaI]

How can you be so confident that's even likely considering Origins and the B2W2 trailer had the same generic characters with generic lines? Making it more like the games doesn't mean you'll get automatic quality, considering how well recieved the original series anime was even though it didn't follow the games at all. And as for personal story, there isn't any! All you get are tibits from your mother or some other character in your hometown and that's it, you're supposed to fill in the blanks for yourself. Obviously the canon personality is just a generic ten year old like how Red was, there isn't much you can look into.

As a very good example of the Pokemon Special manga, it basically adapts rather faithfully from the game plot, yet it has its own twist for all the minor story outside the main plot. Well even for the main plot, all the conversations are now different from what was set in the game. Each characters have their different reasons to start a journey, hence they are interesting on their own because they are not the stereotyped "Challenge gyms and Pokemon League to become the strongest trainer". They do grow as they travel, and each grow in a different pace, they are full of different emotions which makes them much more lifelike than Ash Ketchum.

Then just read that instead of complaining about the anime isn't an extended Origins, alright? The manga and anime aren't even comparable as the manga isn't restricted to appealing to the fans while advertising the games, and the manga doesn't even follow the games that well. Does the games have a league similar to the kind in the RGBY Chapter where you have fight one on one matches till you get out on top? Does Yellow Version take place a few years after the main character in RGB was frozen over? Nope, not at all, so there really isn't anything close to the games as possible, plot wise. Aside from Origins and the BW2 trailer. Oh and look, the obligatory Ash insult, cause you can't have a post without that, because he's the only bland character in the whole franchise. Red and co. have clearly defined personalities and with the best written dialogue in the whole games and anime...oh wait.

Well, but then here comes the biggest problem from the anime scriptwriter's side, is that are they creative enough to give each different PC a different personalities and different reason to travel, other than what was set out in the game?

Just copy and pasting the manga would surely work considering they don't really care as long as they're paid, or make them the generic Red clones which are far more likely.

(For many time in the anime, I really hate the activation of abilities).
But it really need to be careful of not being "over-creative" to the point of neglecting common knowledge (e.g. Thunder Armor).

The activation of abilities are just as random as they are in the games for the most part, such as Static. Some abilities are made out to be a big deal such as Infernape's Blaze in the anime and did receive a good amount of focus about that.
As for Thunder Armor, I'm sure we can all agree that was random as heck. But Swellow was shown to be very resistant against Electric attacks in his debut episode, not to the extent where he's immune, but just enough to overcome type disadvantages with willpower. He simply braced all the damage from Thunder, but yeah the Armor part, I have no explanation for that.

And finally, just like mentioned by SammyW27, the in-game story is not suitable for long anime extended to the period of 3~4 years of airing time. The maximum I would accept is up to one year period of ~52 episodes. The longer it gets, the more filler episodes are needed, and hence poorer it gets in the overall plot quality.

Yes, because fillers always mean they're the worst episodes to ever exist and need to burned to a crisp, while plot episodes are always well done on the basis of being plot, when that's clearly not the case.

What are you getting so heated up in your text for one person saying I'll watch such game-adapted Pokemon anime? Seems like you are thinking I'm too simple-minded to the point of ludicrous, aren't you?

Listen, I watched many game-adapted anime that are faithful to its source material. So as long as the original source material already had a well-established story, the anime will not be worse than its game.

I personally enjoy the storyline of the game much much MUCH more than the current Ash Ketchum anime. So even they are meant to put the generic Red-like personality for every single PC for each saga, I'll still watch such anime. At the very least, I have 100% guarantee that during somewhere in the middle of the whole story, a super epic battle will definitely happen. Not yet to mention, I enjoy watching the Origin much better than current Pokemon anime, I experienced the excitement I never felt for the Pokemon anime, even though it was only for 4 episodes.


For one thing about the Pokemon main series games which unlike many other RPG games, is that the PCs of the Pokemon games are all silent characters, meaning they have no default personalities. Because of that, the protagonist are basically a complete blank slate, so it is possible for the writer to insert different kinds of personalities, and each have different story and different pace of growth. What makes you think that every single PC should have the generic 10-year-old Red-like personality?

Besides, do you even know that within the fandom, there are different opinions of personalities of Red before Origin aired? Just go and look at the Pixiv!Red......

As you just mentioned yourself, the in-game protagonist is avatar of the player, hence it is the player to fill in the blanks by themselves.
Each single player play in different style, and each single player catch different Pokemons along their ways, and raise the Pokemon differently.
When making it into anime, all those "blanks" are now needed to be filled in by the scriptwriter(s), so now what we are going to watch is the journey of the scriptwriter(s), and that is what I'm interested to see.

I am really not that worry about the in-game protagonist will have a bland personality when it make into anime, because it just will not happen for two reasons: 1) The in-game absence of characterization must be fixed then before the anime story is established. 2) For many of the series anime having different protagonist of each saga, they never have two consecutive protagonists having same personalities.

Even it is not happened to be like Pokemon Special manga, I'm fine for such faithfully game-adapted Pokemon anime. At the very least, I have confidence that it will have better overall story than the current Ash Ketchum anime.

 

[Muur]

I'd be a little miffed if after so long everything was changed but I'd be for things like TMs, more in game stories being done by Ash and etc.

Or even just another origins side series.

 

[Four/Tris]

I prefer how the anime is not adhering 100% to the games. Several video game mechanics like TMs and a required number of badges to make your Pokemon obey just would not work in a TV series. Therefore, I prefer the main anime the way it is. Like XYZ Nexus said, a 1.1 adaptation of the games would be super dull. As much as I find Origins over-hyped, I believe the reason this extremely faithful adaptation was so well-received at least here on the Internet in comparison to the anime was because it was only 4 episodes and not ongoing. And even if the protagonists were to be changed once their story was over to bring the new ones from the games in, I don't think I could be attached them as much as I have with Ash due to the less screen time.

 

[pokemon fan 132]

I already think pokemon anime follows games too closely. With writers not having that much liberty and independence in tailoring story to their own accordoing like they did in older sagas., Such as 4 move limit implemented per pokemon in battles.Type disadvantage playing much higher predominance in difference between winning and losing rather than skill and innovative strategy. Game story and changes being transfered to main series in much higher volume, Ash travel companions being replaced now after just one generation unlike before where older ones could stick around for longer having more stable cast(like Brock).Etc.

We already had in a sense closer to games animated product in form of pokemon origins and i wasnt much of a fan honestly. Disliking presence of HP bars in battles, not much deviation from game storyline feeling like im following animated playthrough of what i already experienced in playing pokemon Red and Blue games. Lacking unpredictability, sense of adventure and diverse relationship betweern characters exiting like its case with main series.

Im of opinion how there should be more to pokemon anime than just seving purpose as 20 minute advertizing gimmick. There should exist variables, different set of rules and differences to make it more original, captivating and fulfilling to follow.

With writers being allowed to have liberty in creating who is going to be in main cast, which characters we as viewer are going to follow and come up with their own ideas, concepts and ways how to do pacing , storyline, development of characters and implement unique, anime exclusive elements.

So that you can say how your following actual anime with its principles, original directions under which region and characters are unfold and have sense of continuum, stable protagonists in who you can emotionally invest and overarching stoiry which contnues and use past as inspiration in growing forward.

For that reason alone i appreciate and recognize value behind Ash being kept as main series star even after he stopped being in games long time ago. Giving out impression how this anime has big long adeventure which has its beginning, middle and end. Which leaves you fulfilled and enchanted as viewer making you glad that you were privileged to see characters you like be explored and advanced over long perios with all this struggling, effort and various obstacles eventually bringing him/her somwhere.

Along with plot and storyline having certain doze of artistic liberty, originality and thought process poit into it allowing writers to develop their imagination and creativity to bring unexpected changes, alternative route through which something from games could be explored(such as contests having battle rounds for example, Whirl Islands having ancient tournament introducing lore about water masters, Team Rocket interfering with Team Plasma plans)etc.

Witnessing to long on going story where characters, introduced struggles, problems and dreams gradually develop and unfold over long period of time.

Similar how One Piece, Rave, Naruto or Dragon Ball did.

Only and main issues with current formula this anime has for me are:
-stagnation of main protagonist(Ash) not allowing him to grow forward, win league and explore more on his past and meaning of becoming pokemon master
-lack of originality and thought in writing criminal organization like TR, to serve as something more than joke comic relief . Delivering them substance.
-highly poor continuity for anime which has stable protagonist and story set in same timeline and universe. Such as replacing companions leaving them forgotten and rot in past(see Misty,. May, Max, Brock etc, etc) Leave their stories unresolved and defeat point of adding them in first place if your going to pretend like their friendship with Ash, their own dreams and unfinished aspirations, untapped potential to take them to higher, never seen before spheres of character deverlopment never happens or get acknowledged.

But aside from that i still appreciate pokemon series having somewhat of independence from pokemon games having its own universe, timeline and direction to follow not being completely succumbed by games. Building that way on sense of suspence and excitement of not being able to predict in what way protagonists and plot will unfold out.

 

[CrystaI]

I think everyone in this thread had a very major misconception about the concept of "adapting the game", as everyone in here merely discuss the adaption of game mechanics, but not anything about adapting the game story.

For all the game-adapted anime I ever watched (excluding all the Romance Adventure games), their original games also have their in-game systematic mechanics for playing purpose. The Tales of series, Xenosaga, Rockman.EXE and Ryuusei no Rockman, Super Robot Taisen OG, even the very few people ever heard of the Shin Megami Tensei Devil Children. Do not tell me that their in-game player characters doesn't have HP bar and whatever energy bar, and also many other in-game statistical parameters to express the characters' strengths. But, do they ever mention these in-game mechanics when they are made into anime?

For me, I also don't like the idea of adapting only the game mechanics to full details, so particular which showing HP bar during battles, utilizing only 4 moves during a battle, the Pokemon suddenly forget a move upon learning a new moves, activation of abilities in the mechanical way such as immediately upon HP decreased to at certain degree, showing the statistical ATK/DEF/Sp.ATK/Sp.DEF/SPE/EV/IV/etc to the exact value, even the TM/HM disc that teaches a move to a Pokemon by placing it on the forehead. NO!!!! NONE OF THESE!!!!! Keep the in-game systematical mechanics to game-only, it is not for outside the game catridge.

As I was enjoying watching the Origin, in fact I did had a pet peeve in the 1st episode where during the battle between Red and Brock, it shows the HP bar of the Pokemon. If they could eliminate this unnecessary mentioning of game mechanics during the show, I would have give it a much higher rating.

All those anime I ever mentioned, they adapt rather faithfully to their in-game story. Even if the overall story is not 100% resembles the in-game story, still all the in-game character are used and being consistent in their personalities, and all the major in-game events are included.
What I want is, the Pokemon anime that faithfully adapt the in-game story, but not too much into the game mechanics. Please, Pokemon are living creatures, it doesn't need the in-game system in order for the battle to make sense. The scriptwriter(s) should develop a different "battle mechanics" that will make sense in the realistic common sense realm. I don't think that is anything difficult to do, as myself being a fanfic writer, I found that neglecting the in-game system will rather increase the liberty of creativity, making the battles much more interesting. Do not tell me it is impossible to neglect the game mechanics, it is the job of the animators to be creative. And when other game-adapted anime can pull off nicely without the in-game system, why Pokemon cannot? The current Pokemon anime already did a fine job in neglecting the stats and having their own twist of combining moves, they just need to extend more to things like move limits and abilities.

I wanted to see the canonical journey of Gold/Ethan/Kris/Lyra going to chase down the rival that stole the Pokemon from Professor Elm's Lab, where during the journey they are going to defeat the reviving Team Rocket, and for whatever reason he/she go to have a major final showdown with Red in Mt.Silver.
I wanted to see how the scriptwriter(s) will pull off with the canonical journey of Brendan/May, how the two grow during their journey, and how they are to stop Team Magma/Aqua from waking the Legendary Groudon/Kyogre in order to prevent the sea being dried up or the overflow of sea level, how they are going to stop this major disaster of ecosystem of Hoenn being destroyed.
I wanted to watch the journey of Lucas and Dawn, during their travel of challenging gyms of each cities, they got involved with Team Galactic, being unsuccessful in stopping the Galactic Admins from drying one of the lake, hence they must go to stop Cyrus at top of Mt.Coronet to prevent him gain control of Dialga/Palkia using the Red Chain. Or, being drag by Giratina to the Distortion World, and have a major showdown with the Rebellious Deity.
I wanted to see the 15~16 years old Hilbert/Hilda (canonically speaking the oldest PC in current Pokemon game history) going on the journey, meeting Team Plasma and N, and being questioned by keeping Pokemon inside the Pokeball is just making them miserable, and then he/she is troubled by such moral doubt, at the end finding out that such moral doubt is only a hypocritical excuse of Team Plasma used to take Pokemon away from everyone.
And then, I wanted to see the anime set in 2 years later, how Nate/Rosa going to stop Neo Team Plasma which their hypocritical disguise is taken off, and most interestingly all the involvement of N during the events.
Giving the newest XY saga, I wanted to see the canonical story of the 5-person group of Calem/Serena/Shauna/Tierno/Trevor, how they support each other during the journey, also learning about Mega Evolution, Team Flare, the ultimate weapon, the war of 3000 years ago, and AZ. And more importantly I wanted to see how is the canonical battle between the PC and Lysandra.

All of the meat and juice of the in-game story, are just never ever happened in the light-hearted carefree story of Ash Ketchum.

 

[henrymidfields]

I am going to say that I would like some bits to be adapted, but not others. It really depends on whether the adaptation is going to contribute, or detract from the story.

Main Aspects:

I don't mind if Ash stays throughout the whole story. I think the bigger elephant in the room is how Ash's development has been reset by the writers when the noob could have been Brendan, Lucas, Iris and Serena, with the main viewpoint shifted accordingly. This would have made better sense with the overall show. (For that, I'm really glad that the writers for once wised up, and actually wrote Ash as a badass who rescued a rampaging pseudo-legendary with XY001-002.) And to be fair, Ash was briefly a mentor to May in the early days of AG - I think having Brock barge in was the wrong decision that TV Tokyo made, when that could have been Brendan, and Ash taking sweat in looking after two mentors. And Ash would make mistakes in his mentoring, but hey, at least that would be new (and more advanced) ones.

Also, I think Team Rocket should have stayed in Kanto as well. In the case of AG, more frequent encounters with Team Magma and Aqua would have been nice. Perhaps someone who is more competent than the TRio, but uses even more outrageous antics, that you'd think "Ain't gonna work stup- holy s***! That was brilliant!" And perhaps not having them appear all the time. Of course whenever Ash is back in Kanto, TRio can do their laughably evil deeds to their heart's content. Alternatively, DP could have serious villains, and TP could have a mixture of both.

The league episodes for DP onwards could have been tweaked further with more dignified endings for Ash. Even if Ash stopped at Top 4 in Shinnoh, that still Top 5% of all league participants - and his actual percentile would be higher considering that there are much more that don't even make it. A third place match (like what sometimes happens in real-life) could have been held, with Ash winning, and bringing home a bronze trophy. And, what about a National Competition with the best trainers (Top 4 to be exact, so Ash is included too) being invited to the Shinnoh Battle Facility? And Ash battles Jimmy/Brendan? And him coming in Top 2, if not outright win and bring home a silver medal?


Other aspects that warrants a more faithful adaptation:

Speaking of the Shinnoh League, Tobias bringing his legendary was one thing that we could have done without. For that the game rules can be brought into the anime where Legendaries are actually not allowed. Have Tobias use a Tyranitar, or any other Pokémon that is OU from Smogon. Or use a non-Legendary Pokémon that has been known to wreck the competition in VGC/in-game Singles.

PWT could have been another thing that warranted a more game-faithful adaptation. Actually showing Ash battling Misty (and maybe Sabrina and Erika - who Ash didn't finish his battle with), and having both go all-out would have been a great way for Ash, and for us to look back through the past episodes and see how far Ash and we have come. Actually showing Misty/Brock battle against Marlon/Roxanne or other leaders who use the same types would be exciting to see.

Finally with Ash's Pokémon (not) evolving, there could have been more conscious decisions in whether evolving or otherwise. For example, Ash could give Pikachu a Light Ball so that at least we can understand how Pikachu manages to take down bigger opponents with ease; in fact, this is my anime headcanon. On the flipside, this means that Pikachu will go down in one hit, so Ash and Pikachu could hone Pikachu's dodging skills. (Unfortunately, XY017 was a missed opportunity - one of my few minuses for the XY arc.)
Likewise, Ash could keep his Pokémon from evolving so that said Pokémon could learn better moves faster. This is what I have done in Y and Black 1+2: for example, I only evolved my Pikachu to a Raichu when she learned Thunderbolt in Y, and my Snivy in Black 1 only evolved after he learned Coil/Dragon Tail in his Lv 40s. At least now, Ash has better battling skills so him actually putting in some thought about this wouldn't be out of place.


Aspects that can/should change:

Bone Rush is one move which I don't mind having being tweaked. If anything, I always wonder why the move in the game is ineffective against Flying-type Pokémon, when the move is essentially throwing a projectile. Similarly, Dig should have normal effect against Flying-types as well, considering that the few times I've seen said moves being used in battles, it involved the Pokémon leaping into the sky and body-pressing the opponent. Besides, we've already had Pikachu electrocute a Geodude in the very early days of OS, anyway.

Each Pokémon having turns should also stay in the games as well, considering that any sort of 1-vs-1 duels (boxing, karate etc) are always done in real time. Having turns just make the Pokémon look like robots.

I also don't mind certain strong Pokémon losing to weaker ones, as long as it doesn't happen too often. Because let's face it, even the best boxers, the best football team, the best martial artists make mistakes and lose sometimes. I actually missed most of AG, and all of DP and BW, so I actually don't know how often Ash lost random COTDs, but as far as I am aware with XY, Ash('s Pikachu) seems to lose more to actually strong opponents this time around. So while Ash could improve his win-to-loss ratio, I don't find his loss as bad as some other people make it out to be, since there is better justification. Keep in mind that we've got at least Viola and Grant who are on Duke-level, and Korrina who seem to spend a longer time with her Lucario than Ash and his Pikachu, and at a younger age too. Speaking of which, I always regard experience in living and training with Pokémon to be a major factor in winning, not just the actual Pokémon strengths.

The Elite Four, are well, just that, the four most elite Pokémon trainers in the region. Again, I have no problem with regular trainers being curb-stomped against the E4 and the Champion, because, well, they have the skill and the experience that make them stand out. The relatively lackluster skill of the CPU-controlled game E4s who the PC can curb-stomp with sheer level differences can stay in the games.

Likewise, I also consider Pokémon training to be a lifelong journey/career/learning, just like actual jobs and sports. Many things in life takes ages to master. Being from an architectural background, I know that architects don't start building masterpieces until from their 40s. Even in sports, where the peak performance age is the 20s, it would take years to be a professional athlete. I think the main problem is that most of the main characters in the anime don't show their progression. So as long as there is some form of progression from one to the next, and that the characters are wrapped up in a dignified way, regardless of win or loss, we can bring ourselves to actually like said characters. Because if winning is everything, that would mean most of our sports athletes are mediocre, save a couple of people who had consecutive/constant wins. (Like, say Lance Armstrong before his doping was discovered, or perhaps Mike Tyson for most of his boxing career.)

 

[gritty stunfisk]

The further away the anime is from the constriction of game mechanics / plotlines / advertising, the better it will be. As good as it can be, it's seriously lacking a creative force which can easily be found in the absence of some really arbitrary limitations it has right now.

 

[pokemon fan 132]

After reading through whole thread again i think its all matter of personal preference and taste i guess. To some people recreating memories and basic skeleton of storyline they experienced when playing games using playable characters which can be customized contains certain uniqueness and charm injected into it.

Such as following Ethan journey, special errand assigned to him by prof. Elm which resulted in meeting prof. Oak. His rivalry with Silver, travels through Johto and Kanto eventually challenging Red.
Following Lucas adventure in stopping Team Galactic, having big ambitions and eventually taking on Battle Tower.
Hilda relationship with Cheren and BIanca, encounters with N and taking on Unova league etc, etc.

But for me that doesnt seem especially attractive, let alone creative. Sure you could create all kind of different personalities for playable game characters but basic directions, guidelines and background is already known. With faith of each of this characters being enshrined in stone limiting on variety and how much in reality you can alter their storyline and construction of development.

Doing faithful game adaptations on more steely basis limits imo artistic liberty, innovation and outlet through which writers for some anime can excercise their skills, imagination and certain independence to tailor story, characters, conflicts, atmosphere and plot to their own according.

For example if pokemon anime did faithful adaptation of games some of my favorites in show which are NPC characters in games would never receive chance to shine, develop, deconstruct on what exterior may have hidden and gain more depth to themselves. Like Misty, Brock or Cilan passing of as nothing more than side minor selfservice through which main character would obtain necessary resources to qualify for league.

I like fact that in pokemon main series limits on who can be main character doesnt really exist(Brock and TR case, especially Ash proved that), how who is in games or isnt doesnt always decide which protagonists will make cast and there exists undertone of original touch to it.

I very much like and will always be for writers having liberty in straying away from in advance prenconceived route characters in games are destined to follow . Creating anime exclusive storylines such as Orange Islands Orange Islands which radiated with pirate like atmosphere. Featuring hidden bays, haunted ships in mist telling story of dead captain (who was once champion of Orange league). Real Pirates attacking on open sea etc.

Whirl islands featuring prestigue water tournament which draws connection to ancient times , past water pokemon masters and magical items which can awaken energy of all sea creaures at one place.

Don George battle clubs which were open for absolutely any kind of trainer measuring their skills against others and serving as excellent way to train pokemon and develop more innovative battle strategies helping you in endeavors of achieving dreams you pursue.

Pokeringer which revealed how beautiful, exciting and fluent competiton between flying types can really be. Etc.

But i also cannot deny how without games source material this show would lose main backbone to rely on and sense of security to warrant keep going.

Hence why in my opinion ideal solution would be gold middle as cliche as it may sound on first glance.

Taking good use of major plots and changes introduced in games. Rather than let it go to waste and massacrate perfectly good storyline gamers introduced.

One of better examples was display of Team Aqua and Magma plot carrying out powerful and interesting message of increasing selfwareness for environment and how playing with nature forces can backfire very badly on anyone. But through show we had few episods dispersed across Hoenn saga , half of impotant villain members not being even introduced wrapped with anticlimactic, rushed conclusion.

Or World tournament for example. Which got introduced as most important tournament ever known to exist in games combining all trainers who were worth something making every generations seem in some way connected and intertwined with each other. But instead of pokemon series taking advantage of benrefit and new dimension such features could bring to story, it was ciompletely wasted instead of making big adventure. Returning various past gym leaders, Frontier Brains, E4 members and all kind of powerful experts, older popular characters forming significant, memorable and exciting story out of it.

Establishing somesort of consistency and synergy between anime and games. Remaining faithful to big changes , competitions and groundberaking plots games introduce through which already existing cast could advance forward and add more content to plot.

Intriducing properly E4 members, gym leaders and potential rivals game offer to use.

But also not doing letter by letter adaptation in paying too much atention to games mechanic, cutting down on chances where writers and development team could deliver more flavor and originality to narrative through their own ideas. Letting their imagination sping out and provide certain twists to development of their characters and stopry.

Having independent storyline which has its own direction and consistent characters to follow. Only using games material as supplement to enrich on narrative, protagonists and surrounding.

Because for me to its more rewarding and significant for any anime including pokemon if there exists character which stay long enough that i could be emotionally invested, care for their journey and root for overcoming various challenges, struggles and temptations theyre faced with on long journey which leads somewhere eventually.

Tangible storytelling which builds on maturity, knowledge and collected experience protagonist gained in previous sagas applying it to new situations and going through deeper, multi dimensional growth evolving as person and trainer. While keeping ties withn past, important older characters and their unfinished stories having sense of continuity.

Something which couldnt be achieved if for pokemon anime changed main hero and did complete revamp with cast every time new hero/heroines are introduced following entirely different continuity and restart of plot, development and story from zero through Johto, Hoenn, Sinnoh, Unova, Kalos and every new generation.
Which would be happening if anime became more faithful to games than it is already.

Not saying current format and way on going story set in same universe and continuity with constant hero is doing particularly good job either, far from it.

But between this and alternative im still in favor for current option with prefix on doing better job out of it of course. Simply preferring more such type of formats under which protagonists, storyline and ideas are played out.

 

[Ampharos King]

There are certain video game elements, such as using TMs and storing Pokémon into your PC, that do not make sense outside the confines of said game.

For instance, why would a Pokémon respect you more if you win gym badges? If you win gym badges by having those and other captured Pokémon battle OTHER captured Pokémon, wouldn't the Pokémon naturally resent you more? I haven't seen or read a story of one animal in real life that enjoys being forced into battle with other animals. Why would a Pokémon be any different?

Game-wise, this element was included to prevent trainers from using high-leveled traded Pokémon to complete the game. But in terms of an anime universe simulated on our world, having Pokémon obey you for winning gym badges doesn't fit at all.

As for Pokémon learning TMs and HMs, how would that work in the anime exactly? If we are using the game mechanics, the Pokémon literally absorbs the TM into its body upon learning the move (according to FLRG). But as of Gen V, all TMs are reusable, which means the absorption process doesn't happen. If the anime were to simulate this process, how would they retcon this for a Gen V anime if the Pokémon were shown learning TMs in anime based on pre-Gen IV?

 

[Pandora]

Here speaks a person who doesnt like much the anime. I watched as a kid, but now isnt fun, is childish, the female characters are futile, generic. Ash is charismatic but lacking development. The anime does a good role to be games advertising, besides this, both are two very different universes, but with similar elements.

Anyway, adapt the manga wouldnt be a bad idea. Sometimes it seems like a bad fanfiction, though it has it good moments and is much better than the anime. Unfortunally, is the best pokemon adaption until now. But if a better plot more faithful to tha games could be made, it would be dreamy. It should be serialized, with counted episodes, probably a game each season, not weekly. And certainly the audience wouldnt be as large as the Ash Ketchum anime, because of thousands reasons.

Yes, I would like to see a more faithful adaptation to the games with the due artistical licenses to not turn the narrative mechanical. With a more mature storyline. As said before, I want to see the story of Red and Leaf, how exactly they become Giovanni enemies. I want to see Silver training in the dragon Den, Lyra and Ethan infiltrating Team Rocket hideout. I wanna see May fighting her father, the serious Steven Stone with his failed plans to save the world, and Brendam capturing Rayquiazza and Deoxys. I wanna see Lucas and Dawn entering the distortion world, Hilda moral issues with N, Hilbert awekening the legendary dragon and becoming the Unova hero. Rosa and Nate preventing the world from freezing. Serena and Calem with philosophical questions about immortality, and in a hurry tryng to avoid a genocide. This is the pokemon plot, not really Ash Ketchum and his Pikachu.

 

[CrashBash]

I personally enjoy the storyline of the game much much MUCH more than the current Ash Ketchum anime. So even they are meant to put the generic Red-like personality for every single PC for each saga, I'll still watch such anime. At the very least, I have 100% guarantee that during somewhere in the middle of the whole story, a super epic battle will definitely happen.

No, I 100% guarantee it would be boring and most people would lose interest. If Red was silent and had no personality whatsoever, he'd make a terrible protagonist.

Why? Think about this...in games, they can get away with a silent protagonist because the player is pretty much controlling his every move. If I recall what the director of the Legend of Zelda series once said correctly, the aim is to make the player feel like they are Link himself...and I'm pretty sure that's the same for Red, and the other Pokemon protagonists. They don't have personalities, but that's because the player IS their personality.

But why wouldn't this work in an anime? Because the watcher has NO control over their actions. They're literally just watching someone do things. If the protagonist is silent and has no defined personality....well, I 100% guarantee that you can't feel a connection for them. At all.

And before anyone says anything, yes, I am aware there ARE silent protagonists in other fictional media besides games. But think about it...why do they work? The answer is because they have a clear personality. Usually with silent characters in media, they tend to play the slapstick card - the guy isn't very intelligent, the guy is bumbling, the guy does very silly things that otherwise seem to make no sense - but I've seen many other cards being played. But whatever it is, the character works because he or (rarely) she has a clear personality. Something which a perfectly replicated from-game-to-anime Red wouldn't have. At all.

There's a reason why Tom & Jerry were so well loved during their history, even when they almost never spoke.