American Politics Thread

[Volphied]

Actually... that's one instance where Trump is right.

But if you like CNN's brainwashing, power to you!

Where is he right, and how is it brainwashing?

 

[Boss1708]

Where is he right, and how is it brainwashing?

CNN (and NBC, and many others) are masters of the subtle indoctrination of the masses. With people like Don Lemon, it's extremely easy to see what I mean, unless you intentionally decide to ignore the overwhelming evidence.

Anyway, the discussion was fun for a short while, but it has become quite annoying and circular, at this point.

 

[Volphied]

CNN are masters of the subtle indoctrination. With people like Don Lemon, it's easy to see.

Once again, baseless claims aren't gonna work on me.

Trump has screamed "fake news" every time a new scandal surrounding his administration erupts. Naturally, he declared news media "the enemy of people", stright out of a fascist manual. The only brainwashing going on right now is when Trump has another rally.

 

[noworry]

There’s also quite a few cases where Trump himself has given out actual fake news. There’s even a Wikipedia page on it. That’s kinda ironic..

 

[Weiss]

There’s a reason nationalism has become a negative word to many.

I live in a very proud country. You’ll have to look for quite a while before you find a Norwegian who isn’t proud of Norway. Yet most would be cautious if anyone refered to themselves as a «nationalist». I think to many it doesn’t just mean «my country is the most important to me» but also «I don’t care about other countries nor do I care about those entering mine».

It creates a «we» and «them» mentality. It’s good to care about your own country but when you start being hostile to others because of it it does create fear, and that hostility is something I’ve seen in not only my own country but many others.

I remember Trump being clear about «America first» and while yeah ofc you’d put your own country and people first you have to consider everyone around you.

As for what your own nationality. It depends a lot. It depends on roots to some degree, but it’s more than your roots. It depends on language, parents, where you live, where your heart lies (so to speak). Besides, I’m only part Norwegian, yet everybody considers me more Norwegian than my part Romanian friend simply because my hair is blonde, and that’s kind of silly

I get what your saying but the Us and Them thing is exactly the point of a nation. I have Norwegian family on my Father’s side so I can understand what you mean. That said I always reply to this kind of logic with for example

Why are you not Swedish?

The fact you are Norwegian and not Swedish a distinctively is made. I don’t find being “exclusive” a bad thing again I was born in Japan but I’m not considered Japanese. Europe and America play these word games trying not to offend anyone but what is and what ought to be is too different things. We are handicapping ourselves no other nations play by these rules and they exploit our “diversity”

 

[Weiss]

There’s also quite a few cases where Trump himself has given out actual fake news. There’s even a Wikipedia page on it. That’s kinda ironic..

Politicians lie all the time all of them. Clinton said she was shot at by snipers when she landed in Bosnia yet there is video of her landing and getting flowers from a young girl. She still is adamant that she was shot at. Bill Clinton and George W. Bush both famous liars and yet it was never called fake news.

I dislike Trump a heck of a lot but I don’t think the media is fair in the coverage. It might have changed but certainly Obama deported many illegals in the same way Trump is doing yet it was never mentioned. I feel it is a class thing Trump is popular among working class so therefor he must be bad.

He was fine to donate millions to the Democrats for years then again Democrats get their pictures taken with Klansmen...

 

[noworry]

I get what your saying but the Us and Them thing is exactly the point of a nation. I have Norwegian family on my Father’s side so I can understand what you mean. That said I always reply to this kind of logic with for example

Why are you not Swedish?

The fact you are Norwegian and not Swedish a distinctively is made. I don’t find being “exclusive” a bad thing again I was born in Japan but I’m not considered Japanese. Europe and America play these word games trying not to offend anyone but what is and what ought to be is too different things. We are handicapping ourselves no other nations play by these rules and they exploit our “diversity”

I am Swedish. My other half is Swedish ¯\(ツ)/¯

Why am I not Danish? Because I have never been to Denmark, I have never been able to speak Danish, and I don’t have any Danish family (adopted or otherwise). That makes it so that I have no relation to Denmark, it would make no sense to call myself Danish. Our king however have Danish roots. He’s not Norwegian if you only look at his roots, yet he’s the king of Norway, and we don’t really consider him Danish at this point, because this is where he was born and raised, speaking the Norwegian language.

That’s why this all depends on a bunch of other factors than «who are your parents and what’s in your DNA». Culture has a lot more to it.

 

[Volphied]

then again Democrats get their pictures taken with Klansmen...

What?

 

[Weiss]

But him targeting those women was racist because only one of them is actually from another country, but they were all of color, as opposed to say, my representative, who is very white but born in Europe.

I’m not familiar with them all but are they “all minorities” ?

 

[Beer&Nyquil]

This is mind blowing

 

[Weiss]

I am Swedish. My other half is Swedish ¯\(ツ)/¯

Why am I not Danish? Because I have never been to Denmark, I have never been able to speak Danish, and I don’t have any Danish family (adopted or otherwise). That makes it so that I have no relation to Denmark, it would make no sense to call myself Danish. Our king however have Danish roots. He’s not Norwegian if you only look at his roots, yet he’s the king of Norway, and we don’t really consider him Danish at this point, because this is where he was born and raised, speaking the Norwegian language.

That’s why this all depends on a bunch of other factors than «who are your parents and what’s in your DNA». Culture has a lot more to it.

Oh I must have misread I thought you were Norwegian sorry. My point was you being Swedish is makkng an us and them out of anyone who is not Swedish. I have no problem with this but to have issue with nationalism because it draws a line between those who are the same and those who are not is silly. It’s just like belonging to the Democrats or Republicans or Manchester United vs Manchester City fan.

People like to be with people they are like for the most part and should have control over who is allowed in and gets to stay.

I agree with you on the other factors that why ai don’t think it’s racist to say if you don’t like it here go back home.

 

[Volphied]

@Weiss

I don't know which "klansmen photo" you could have meant, but is it the one with Biden?

 

[zoroarctic]

As a professional journalist, I find the right-wing “fake news!” screeds nothing short of eye roll-inducing. Anyone who’s ever spent time in a newsroom knows this idea that we just make up stories to hurt Trump is total garbage. That’s just not how it works. Now, are most mainstream outlets in the US left-leaning? Sure, but so is reality.

In what way?

He gave an inflammatory speech, and the congresswomen he’s attacking get flooded with death threats on a regular basis. Throw in the sharp rise in right-wing violence the US has seen over the last decade, and it’s easy to imagine someone getting hurt, or worse, down the road.

@Weiss

I don't know which "klansmen photo" you could have meant, but is it the one with Biden?

Probably Hillary Clinton with Robert Byrd. That’s usually the most-cited.

 

[Volphied]

Probably Hillary Clinton with Robert Byrd. That’s usually the most-cited.

Biden was also photographed with him, which is probably why Weiss mentioned it, since this photo recently went viral.

Anyway, Weiss, do you know the story behind Robert Byrd?

 

[noworry]

Oh I must have misread I thought you were Norwegian sorry. My point was you being Swedish is makkng an us and them out of anyone who is not Swedish. I have no problem with this but to have issue with nationalism because it draws a line between those who are the same and those who are not is silly. It’s just like belonging to the Democrats or Republicans or Manchester United vs Manchester City fan.

People like to be with people they are like for the most part and should have control over who is allowed in and gets to stay.

I agree with you on the other factors that why ai don’t think it’s racist to say if you don’t like it here go back home.

No, I am Norwegian too. My mom is Swedish, my dad is Norwegian. While I was born in Norway we have always celebrated Swedish traditions too, we’ve gone to Sweden often, and I feel at home there too. I speak both languages fluently as well.

And I do think telling people to «go back home» is rude. Maybe even racist depending on scenario. I have friends who live in Norway who have come from countries of war. People I met as kids who have lost their family and their home. My uncle himself has told me stories of how he and his family had to evacuate their home when Nazi Germany burned it to the ground. Those things are still happening today. Of course they miss people at home and of course it’s hard to adjust to a new place. I’d never tell them to just «go back home» if they told me they didn’t like my country. It’s not an insult to me. If they could they might rather have stayed at home where their family and culture is but that’s not always an option, you know.

 

[Weiss]

As a professional journalist, I find the right-wing “fake news!” screeds nothing short of eye roll-inducing. Anyone who’s ever spent time in a newsroom knows this idea that we just make up stories to hurt Trump is total garbage. That’s just not how it works. Now, are most mainstream outlets in the US left-leaning? Sure, but so is reality.


He gave an inflammatory speech, and the congresswomen he’s attacking get flooded with death threats on a regular basis. Throw in the sharp rise in right-wing violence the US has seen over the last decade, and it’s easy to imagine someone getting hurt, or worse, down the road.

Probably Hillary Clinton with Robert Byrd. That’s usually the most-cited.

She does see very anti-American if she loves her country of origin so much no one is stopping her moving back. I don’t see it as inflammatory if you don’t like where you are move it’s simple

I think the rise in right-wing violence is mostly a response ro the black bloc types no? Not defending either they are both two sides of the same coin but to point out the rise in one side and not the other when an anti facist attacked a immigrant centre last weekend? With petrol bombs and I believe he was armed is strange.

 

[Volphied]

She does see very anti-American if she loves her country of origin so much no one is stopping her moving back. I don’t see it as inflammatory if you don’t like where you are move it’s simple

Why do you think she's anti-American? And she's not going anywhere, she said so herself. The USA is her home

I think the rise in right-wing violence is mostly a response ro the black bloc types no? Not defending either they are both two sides of the same coin but to point out the rise in one side and not the other when an anti facist attacked a immigrant centre last weekend? With petrol bombs and I believe he was armed is strange.

Right wing violence is still overwhelmingly more frequent that left wing violence. Trump has directly inspired multiple attacks not just in the US but around the world, such as the mail bomb scare that targeted democratic politicians.

And what black bloc are you referring to?

 

[Weiss]

No, I am Norwegian too. My mom is Swedish, my dad is Norwegian. While I was born in Norway we have always celebrated Swedish traditions too, we’ve gone to Sweden often, and I feel at home there too. I speak both languages fluently as well.

Ah that’s cool! =) This is similar to my family situation.

And I do think telling people to «go back home» is rude. Maybe even racist depending on scenario. I have friends who live in Norway who have come from countries of war. People I met as kids who have lost their family and their home. My uncle himself has told me stories of how he and his family had to evacuate their home when Nazi Germany burned it to the ground. Those things are still happening today. Of course they miss people at home and of course it’s hard to adjust to a new place. I’d never tell them to just «go back home» if they told me they didn’t like my country. It’s not an insult to me. If they could they might rather have stayed at home where their family and culture is but that’s not always an option, you know.

I sympathise I had family in Germany to. What do you mean by those things and where are they happening? Most violence in Germany towards Jews is from the newly arrived immigrants they try their best to cover this fact but I have friends that have left Germany because of it.

It’s not racist to tell people if they don’t like it here leave. Like I said if America and Europe worked like the rest of the world the people Trump was talking about likely would have no claim to citizenship (can’t speak for all).

Other countries protect their culture and way of life I fail to see why it’s not ok for Western “White” countries to do the same.

=)

 

[Weiss]

As a professional journalist, I find the right-wing “fake news!” screeds nothing short of eye roll-inducing. Anyone who’s ever spent time in a newsroom knows this idea that we just make up stories to hurt Trump is total garbage. That’s just not how it works. Now, are most mainstream outlets in the US left-leaning? Sure, but so is reality.


He gave an inflammatory speech, and the congresswomen he’s attacking get flooded with death threats on a regular basis. Throw in the sharp rise in right-wing violence the US has seen over the last decade, and it’s easy to imagine someone getting hurt, or worse, down the road.

Probably Hillary Clinton with Robert Byrd. That’s usually the most-cited.

I think some outlets do invent stuff most don’t. The right wing is also guilty of this the whole Obama birth certificate thing was nonsense in my opinion. That said there is a documented left wing bias in news I’d say across the western world. So even if the story is true it can be “spun” in away that is most advantageous to the publication ie what their audience wants to hear.

Just look at the ratings drop after the “Russia” conspiracy was debunked.

 

[Volphied]

It’s not racist to tell people if they don’t like it here leave. Like I said if America and Europe worked like the rest of the world the people Trump was talking about likely would have no claim to citizenship (can’t speak for all).

Other countries protect their culture and way of life I fail to see why it’s not ok for Western “White” countries to do the same.

It's racist if it's only done to non-white people because it's a "White country".

That said there is a documented left wing bias in news I’d say across the western world.

That's absolutely not true.

Just look at the ratings drop after the “Russia” conspiracy was debunked.

That wasn't "debunked" at all.