Anime & Manga General Discussion

[FinnishPokéFan92]

I'm pretty sure this Eevee can't evolve though. They tried stones and everything, yet nothing worked.

True, but the fact that Eevee is a Pokémon known for multiple potential evolutions is enough. She's just like Chloe: lots of potential, but no idea which option to pick.

 

[Unireon]

That's a sign of the Kyodaimax factor.

If that's the case, moot point then.

The lesson is that you're unable to change, even after finally deciding on something.

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

That's a sign of the Kyodaimax factor.

If that's the case, moot point then.

The lesson is that you're unable to change, even after finally deciding on something.

We don't know if it is because of Gigantamax Factor. And even if it is, their chosen path could end up being something other than evolving.

 

[Unireon]

We don't know if it is because of Gigantamax Factor. And even if it is, their chosen path could end up being something other than evolving.

Then using Eevee's multiple evolutions to make a point makes no sense.

It is like highlighing how this series is breaking trends, and still praising the Mandatory-Eevee-for-the-Girl one.

There is no other known thing that prevents a Pokemon from Evolving by Stones.
Besides the Everstone, but it is clear that that is not the case.

 

[Hidden Mew]

I'm actually enjoying Ash not getting a Galar starter. It allows his team composition to be less predictable.

I've never understood this notion that not having a Galar starter makes his team less predictable. This is mainly because I don't recall people being annoyed or upset over getting at least one new starter per generation before. One of the most popular form of speculation for each new generation is wondering which starter Ash is going to get. People still wanted Ash to get Sobble and to a lesser degree Grookey too.

Besides all that, I don't see how making Ash's team composition less predictable is necessarily a good thing. On paper, giving Ash a bunch of popular older Pokemon, some of which fans wanted him to get for years, sounds cool, but when they don't interact much or get much screentime outside of their captures. evolutions and battles, it feels kind of hallow and shallow. Being different for the shake of being different doesn't mean it would be better than going through a more traditional team for Ash. Even if a full Galar team would have been more predictable by comparison, I would have preferred that given how little attention Galar and the eighth generation as a whole has in Journeys. Pokemon like Dragonite, Gengar and Lucario are popular enough to where they didn't really need the anime to boost their popularity/merchandise, but plenty of new Galar Pokemon needed that attention. If the series was able to provide a better balance between the old and new Pokemon, then Ash's team probably wouldn't bother me that much, but when Galar barely gets much attention and they aren't making better use of older Pokemon and especially different locations, it just kind of makes me wish that Journeys had been at least set in Galar, if not just a traditional journey through Galar.

The writers have been horrible when it comes to how they've handled the Pokemon this series in general. Its more like Pokemon in a human's world. Its frustrating after Sun and Moon did so well with them especially. They've really dropped the ball on the Pokemon. Being honest though, I'd rather see a half assed arc than nothing. Its like you said, at least Ash would be able to show off the starters in a more interesting way than Goh has.

I wouldn't say that it's more like Pokemon in a human world. I don't think that the Pokemon are nearly that much of an afterthought or that the world is more akin to the human world now. But I agree that the issue of how Pokemon are handled has been a big issue for the series as a whole. That's why it isn't exclusive to just Ash or Goh. Unless a Pokemon is being captured, evolving or getting an upgrade like Mega Evolution and Dynamax, they usually won't get much, if any, focus, which is a pretty huge problem for a number of reasons. That's a big reason why I think giving Ash a team of mostly fully evolved Pokemon was a terrible idea in retrospect. I don't know if his team would have been better received necessarily if they started out all unevolved, but by making them all evolve relatively quickly, it really limits how much they can really do with them, especially with the limited amount of focus episodes on Pokemon in general.

 

[LuxrayOfTheWild]

I wouldn't say that it's more like Pokemon in a human world. I don't think that the Pokemon are nearly that much of an afterthought or that the world is more akin to the human world now. But I agree that the issue of how Pokemon are handled has been a big issue for the series as a whole. That's why it isn't exclusive to just Ash or Goh. Unless a Pokemon is being captured, evolving or getting an upgrade like Mega Evolution and Dynamax, they usually won't get much, if any, focus, which is a pretty huge problem for a number of reasons. That's a big reason why I think giving Ash a team of mostly fully evolved Pokemon was a terrible idea in retrospect. I don't know if his team would have been better received necessarily if they started out all unevolved, but by making them all evolve relatively quickly, it really limits how much they can really do with them, especially with the limited amount of focus episodes on Pokemon in general.

I don't necessarily agree with that first thing because compared to past series, the Pokemon in this series aren't exactly treated as their own characters that have their own stories and their own relationships like they used to be. And its like you just said. Pokemon only get focus if its for a capture, evolution, or an upgrade. I'd also add a PWC battle. They don't get episodes for just goofy interactions or personal development, for example, Drizzile never got the time to overcome the depression he experienced and we didn't see him regain the motivation to evolve. He was shoved away into a cave and next time he shows up, he evolves without doing anything to earn it.

Also in terms of Ash getting fully evolved Pokemon, it wasn't the best decision. Part of the problem is the PWC. Due to the nature of it, he kinda needed to have stronger Pokemon, which wasn't the best choice. Maybe if they did it differently it might have allowed him to use newly caught unevolved Pokemon more, like they they spent time like...with qualifying rounds or something. The PWC is very messy.

 

[Ghost Diplocaulus]

Yeah but I'd argue that this came a little too late

At this point Eevee has been so tired and overdone.

(Maybe if Lana hadn't been given that pointless Sandy people would be more accepting.)

True, but the fact that Eevee is a Pokémon known for multiple potential evolutions is enough. She's just like Chloe: lots of potential, but no idea which option to pick.

I do get that Eevee does fit Chloe pretty well, but I do have to agree with Rainbow-Rain that the "girl companions get Eevee" trope is so overdone at this point that it's kinda hard to find merit on the pairing being an ideal match this time around. Mind you, this is me speaking as someone who is a huge shameless lover of the Eevee line (look at my freaking avatar ffs), so it really says a lot that even I'm tired of the trend. Maybe it wouldn't be so much of a problem if Chloe and by extension Eevee weren't so underfocused AND Yamper hadn't been needlessly shoved into borderline nonexistence, especially seeing how Yamper was the entire reason Chloe got to bond with Eevee in the first place, so it feels harsh that the writers just keep excluding him from the Eeveelution arc.

I'm so genuinely tired of girl companions catching Eevee that I seriously hope that either Ash or the male companion get the Eevee for next saga or it just isn't part of the main cast at all, if only for the sake of something being different with the darn things. Even the Pikachu Clones started being distributed outside of the MC girls to the point that the recurring antagonists were the ones who caught the newest one this time around, so why is Eevee still so needlessly restricted to girls when it comes to its presence on the main cast?

Granted, I am glad that at least this Eevee is actually doing something, but still. Burnout is a thing, and I think it's beyond clear that the writers need to shake up the Eevee formula for the next saga because by now it's gotten too stale. Why not let Ash catch the Eevee next time and let Pikachu become its mentor or something and then the Eevee is inspired to evolve into Jolteon because of that? That'd be breaking two trends for the price of one: not only does Eevee not go to the girl this time around, but Ash officially obtains another Electric-type besides Pikachu. And that's just one possibility.

All that aside, I think that Chloe's arc could have been represented by other Pokemon besides Eevee: I've already said many times how I think Sobble is a decent fit due to the development it undergoes as it evolves, and another option I've been ruminating on is a shiny Wooloo, seeing how it's a black sheep, so it'd neatly represent Chloe being seen as the "black sheep" of her family by other people due to her disinterest. Also, Wooloo's braids also kinda look like Chloe's ponytail, so there is that. They could have also just let her catch that Galarian Ponyta. Gen 8 really needs better prominence.

 

[thomaswiencek]

Ash's Bayleef and Quilava had never actually fully-evolved, while his Totodile had never actually middle- or fully-evolved. So, I wonder why you think, and what you think is the most popular of all three fully-evolved Johtonian starters?

 

[Rainbow-Rain]

Ash's Bayleef and Quilava had never actually fully-evolved, while his Totodile had never actually middle- or fully-evolved. So, I wonder why you think, and what you think is the most popular of all three fully-evolved Johtonian starters?

The most popular is Typholosion by a wide mile

I have no idea why they only reached their middle stages

 

[Daren]

The most popular is Typholosion by a wide mile

I have no idea why they only reached their middle stages

I think it's just because the original series really liked to hammer on Ash's underdog status, and fully evolved starters were seen as very powerful (now in-game Snorlax and Tauros were actually better back then, but appearances matter more in writing). That's why Charizard didn't listen to him at first and then was removed early in Johto with none of the GS starters fully evolving to replace him.

 

[Hidden Mew]

I don't necessarily agree with that first thing because the Pokemon in this series aren't treated as their own characters that have their own stories and their own relationships. Compared to past series. And its like you just said. Pokemon only get focus if its for a capture, evolution, or an upgrade. I'd also add a PWC battle. They don't get episodes for just goofy interactions or personal development, for example, Drizzile never got the time to overcome the depression he experienced and we didn't see him regain the motivation to evolve. He was shoved away into a cave and next time he shows up, he evolves without doing anything to earn it.

To me, Pokemon in a human world would feel much more tacked in or the world would be much more realistic. Even with the minimal amount of screentime Pokemon get, I don't think that they're treated as that much of an afterthought. But the minimal amount of screentime and focus most Pokemon get definitely doesn't help the issue regardless. It is hard to be invested in even Ash's team when they barely get any screentime outside of a handful of episodes.

Also in terms of Ash getting fully evolved Pokemon, it wasn't the best decision. Part of the problem is the PWC. Due to the nature of it, he kinda needed to have stronger Pokemon, which wasn't the best choice. Maybe if they did it differently it might have allowed him to use newly caught unevolved Pokemon more, like they they spent time like...with qualifying rounds or something. The PWC is very messy.

I really don't believe that he needed to have stronger Pokemon because of the PWC. Outside of Bea and technically Iris by virtue of being the current Unova Champion, Ash hasn't really faced off against that many powerful trainers. While Korrina and Volkner are powerful trainers too, Ash already defeated them in their respective series, so even with Volkner being in the Hyper Class, I don't think he needed stronger Pokemon to defeat him. The majority of the Normal and Great class matches were one-on-one battles against one shot characters done either on or off screen. He didn't really need a Dragonite, a Gengar or a Lucario to defeat the majority of his opponents.

I agree that the PWC is quite messy. If they wanted to make it seem like a big world wide tournaments against the strongest trainers in the world and justify Ash getting mostly fully evolved Pokemon this time around, they really should have hit the ground running right off the start instead of waiting until they got to the Hyper Class to make him battle more consistently against powerful trainers. It's hard for me to take it seriously when half of the tournament was against random trainers.

 

[Enzo]

They could have also just let her catch that Galarian Ponyta. Gen 8 really needs better prominence.

This just reminded me that they completely forgot about this plot line. I know it's JN's m.o to introduce genuinely interesting things and then just don't do anything with it and forget about it, but that still sucks.

 

[Reborn Talonflame]

If we had to count the amount of plots dropped, then we should mention Horace; I really hope he is a hidden member of Project Mew. I forget the guy exists, and despite being more into Celebi, there’s nothing to say the researchers wouldn’t investigate into other mythicals, perhaps finding parallels in order to track between them.

If they don’t, not only is that episode completely random, but it’s just utterly infuriating to what they were potentially going to do. It showed Goh being quite hard to accept other people in, as well as his mechanism of coming across as a know-it-all to impress the said stranger, as well as his issues with gaining friends, as he becomes emotional by the fact they could easily leave him, without a word. That reflected the occurrence in which Goh met Ash - boated about his knowledge, and was fairly adamant of his way, only for Ash to do the opposite, leading to a fight.
So, it built bridges for Goh’s state of mind, and what have they done since? As I said, Horace is literally forgettable, that is not an overstatement.
It’s quite thrilling to think of what they could have done, made him a rival from the get-go in the trials, or given the chance to find Celebi and travel back to their past to give more time towards what makes Goh so resilient in the face of adversity, etc. Give some moments of envy/jealousy from Goh, or have Horace become a traitor, and signify Goh’s misery of trying to make new friends (bit forced, I know).
Basically, please, just expand on this storyline, Jourenys. Goh desperately needs it.

 

[R1ke]

I used to think the rationale behind giving Ash fully evolved pokemon was that he’d need that sort of firepower to keep up with the PWC, since it would be filled with difficult trainers. But then he started using Pikachu for everything so idk.

Korrina’s like the only one he ‘needed’ them for. Otherwise he’s still fine using unevolved pokemon like Riolu and Farfetchd, even in super class. By the time he’s also using Dragonite/Gengar now, it’s so late that there would’ve been ample time to fully evolve them in the first place anyway.

 

[Rainbow-Rain]

Allister is coming!

https://twitter.com/anipoke_PR/status/1465153607444332544?t=TMjTdSKc2Ve1-8539q-OvQ&s=19

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

Allister is coming!

https://twitter.com/anipoke_PR/status/1465153607444332544?t=TMjTdSKc2Ve1-8539q-OvQ&s=19

LETS GO

 

[Sai]

This just reminded me that they completely forgot about this plot line. I know it's JN's m.o to introduce genuinely interesting things and then just don't do anything with it and forget about it, but that still sucks.

They did bring up Ponyta again in the recent Opal/Alcremie episode so they clearly haven't forgotten about it. I do think it's quite possible we may see her reunite with it eventually.

 

[R1ke]

Allister is coming!

https://twitter.com/anipoke_PR/status/1465153607444332544?t=TMjTdSKc2Ve1-8539q-OvQ&s=19

Yeah that’s fair. Ash had dodgy plays here but I gotta rewatch it before I can say for sure. Same thing with the rest of the series.

Despite all I’ve said I don’t dislike this fight. Tbh it’s similar to Ash vs Alain for me, in that I enjoyed watching it but didn’t like some of the decisions made. It had a great climax but the road there was shoddy. Compared to Volkner it had higher highs but lower lows. For now Ash vs Volkner still remains the best battle in the series imo. I’m glad they gave Lucario his battle to shine, because even he needed that right now. But not much else. Just putting my faith in the next one to shelf these two for now and gmax Gengar is a good sign.

Speaking of which, I’m actually curious as to who Ash’s next opponent is. They keep teasing master class trainers but he can’t battle them yet. If he’s using Gigantamax, then it needs to be set in galar. So another Galar character? They also like matching types. Allister maybe?

AYYY CALLED IT

 

[PkmnTrainerV]

I'm actually enjoying Ash not getting a Galar starter. It allows his team composition to be less predictable.

I'll take "well developed" even if it means more predictable. Journeys clearly believes a fully evolved Pokémon is a stagnant character, so Ash would work better with a 3 stage Pokémon that’s at its base on capture.

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

I get bothered how in most of the movies Ash’s companions do NOTHING and are treated like side characters.
Also Ash in JN Artstyle looks wrong.