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Are the two sinnoh games a test?

Fairy Type Arceus

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I don't see Legends as a sub-serie. I think it's just a new main line serie. Consider that this game is developed by GF while the remakes (which are traditional main line games) are not. Nothing stops GF from making Gen 9 just a modern Pokemon Legends, with cities, trainers, League etc. but with the same mechanics of Legends (seamless battles and catching, new battle system, riding pokemon, open world/map etc.) and maybe bringing back some old ones (like pokemon abilities).
The two serie would be different just because of the time period. We just don't know what direction GF is going to take with gen 9.
Thing is adding the new battle system to the main line games would screw up vgc pretty badly. I can already see how broken agile style would be with vgc items and abilities.

"Enemy salamance used dragon dance
Enemy salamance used dragon dance
Enemy salamance hung on with its focus sash
Enemy salamance swept the opposing team"
 

Joker901

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Thing is adding the new battle system to the main line games would screw up vgc pretty badly. I can already see how broken agile style would be with vgc items and abilities.

"Enemy salamance used dragon dance
Enemy salamance used dragon dance
Enemy salamance hung on with its focus sash
Enemy salamance swept the opposing team"
I think you ignore the fact that some moves have already limitations in Legends. For example you can't use agile or strong style for some status moves (like sword dance) and for priority moves. So I don't see why they can't simply apply those (and others) limitations to gen 9 battle system.
 

Fairy Type Arceus

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I think you ignore the fact that some moves have already limitations in Legends. For example you can't use agile or strong style for some status moves (like sword dance) and for priority moves. So I don't see why they can't simply apply those (and others) limitations to gen 9 battle system.
Lucario used two calm minds in the trailer so by the looks of it you can spam swords dance then sweep
 

Joker901

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Lucario used two calm minds in the trailer so by the looks of it you can spam swords dance then sweep
Maybe you didn't understand. I'm telling you that there are restrictions for some status moves like sword dance and for priority moves.
The second and third move of Oshawott are Aqua Jet and Sword Dance. As you can see there's no style you can use on those moves:

aaa.png
 
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colours

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part of me wonders three things:

  • is L:A indicative of how future pokemon games are going to be designed?
  • is L:A probably going to be a one-off like Let's Go (as far as we know)
  • is BDSP the end of the line as far as remakes go?

as far as point one goes, i think it's reasonable to consider that Game Freak are likely going to build upon what made SwSh successful, hence the development/release of L:A. perhaps people expected L:A to be what SwSh could've been and had the potential to be, but here we are, anyway. i think i'm leaning towards this option the most given how positively SwSh was received (despite the criticisms).

point two is also understandable. basically, just because Game Freak does something "innovative" (so to speak), doesn't mean it's here to stay. as far as we know, another Let's Go game isn't in development nor are there any plans for it to be in development (as of the timing of this post), so maybe Game Freak would go for a completely different approach altogether after L:A and BDSP. it's definitely possible, although i'm not sure how likely this is.

for the third point, one would have to ask themselves how realistic of a possibility there would be for there to be Unova remakes, and then Kalos remakes, etc etc. how many remakes are we going to get? nostalgia sells, that goes without saying, but is there a line drawn where Game Freak focuses more on developing more mainline (not sure i like using this term but i dont have anything else to substitute it with) games instead of dedicating time and resources to remakes? even if BDSP sold really well, is it going to sway Game Freak one way or the other? "sinnoh confirmed" has been a thing for years now; i don't really see that type of meme-ry or demand on that scale as far as unova and other subsequent regions go.

if we're talking about art style, then i still think they may stick with what L:A is going for rather than go for chibi, but that's purely a guess.
 

Daren

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"sinnoh confirmed" has been a thing for years now; i don't really see that type of meme-ry or demand on that scale as far as unova and other subsequent regions go.
I expect the demand for BW remakes to start soon. Everyone was asking for Hoenn after Hg/SS and once it was out the requests for Sinnoh started ( "Sinnoh confirmed" was itself a reference to the older "Hoenn confirmed" meme, after all).
 

colours

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I expect the demand for BW remakes to start soon. Everyone was asking for Hoenn after Hg/SS and once it was out the requests for Sinnoh started ( "Sinnoh confirmed" was itself a reference to the older "Hoenn confirmed" meme, after all).
that's fair! time will tell if demand will reach sinnoh/hoenn confirmed levels, but i still wonder how many more remakes we're going to get, but i suppose that's a different discussion altogether.
 
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Esiouqrut

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point two is also understandable. basically, just because Game Freak does something "innovative" (so to speak), doesn't mean it's here to stay. as far as we know, another Let's Go game isn't in development nor are there any plans for it to be in development (as of the timing of this post), so maybe Game Freak would go for a completely different approach altogether after L:A and BDSP. it's definitely possible, although i'm not sure how likely this is.

Legends is conceptually different from Let's Go game, though. Let's Go is basically just riding the Pokémon Go craze at the moment, and dare I say it worked if only basing it on their and SwSh's sales. Legends, however, took something the fans (at least the vocal ones) wanted for a long time and made it a reality. I don't think the chance of them not doing more Legends games if it's successful is high, but it's definitely there.

for the third point, one would have to ask themselves how realistic of a possibility there would be for there to be Unova remakes, and then Kalos remakes, etc etc. how many remakes are we going to get? nostalgia sells, that goes without saying, but is there a line drawn where Game Freak focuses more on developing more mainline (not sure i like using this term but i dont have anything else to substitute it with) games instead of dedicating time and resources to remakes? even if BDSP sold really well, is it going to sway Game Freak one way or the other? "sinnoh confirmed" has been a thing for years now; i don't really see that type of meme-ry or demand on that scale as far as unova and other subsequent regions go.

Technically, it's not the matter of Game Freak anymore. I'd assume they'll pass the future remakes (if any) to ILCA, just like BDSP did. But yes, I think there will be a point when remake is not really necessary anymore, but that won't be soon and they will likely still make one since (as you say) nostalgia sells. Unova still needs remake tho, as it's the only one not in 3D. Kalos also needs one because the current one isn't satisfying enough.
 

colours

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Legends is conceptually different from Let's Go game, though. Let's Go is basically just riding the Pokémon Go craze at the moment, and dare I say it worked if only basing it on SwSh's sales. Legends, however, took something the fans (at least the vocal ones) wanted for a long time and made it a reality. I don't think the chance of them not doing more Legends games if it's successful is high, but it's definitely there.
don't forget there was quite the fervent speculation (even within these very forums!) of whether or not Let's Go was either going to be the standard moving forward, or whether there was going to be a sequel to it. the possibility of a LG continuation was very real given its positive reception and sales, and despite that, we haven't heard any news of such to this day.

conceptually they're very different yes, but the broader point being is that, again, don't always take trying something new to mean it's here to stay for good, as Game Freak may continue to experiment with what works. to be honest, i personally doubt that L:A is going to be some sort of one-off so this is far from a point i'm going to defend, but i feel it's necessary to provide additional context as to my reasoning. o:

Technically, it's not the matter of Game Freak anymore. I'd assume they'll pass the future remakes (if any) to ILCA, just like BDSP did. But yes, I think there will be a point when remake is not really necessary anymore, but that won't be soon and they will likely still make one since (as you say) nostalgia sells. Unova still needs remake tho, as it's the only one not in 3D. Kalos also needs one because the current one isn't satisfying enough.

ah fair point, but i dunno; i suppose i'm more wary of the future of remakes in general post-gen 4. the fact that there are people whos first game is a gen 5 game really raises the question as to how long Game Freak (they may not be the ones actively developing any future remakes, but it can be safely assumed they are very much in charge of who gets to develop it in the first place) wants to keep this up. i'll be honest, i think remakes should be stopped after gen 6. a bone should most definitely be thrown to the kalos fans who felt a pokemon Z was needed, but after that, i dont think remaking alola is necessary in the slightest.
 

Joker901

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Guys, remember that Legends was announced as "a new era for the Pokemon serie". I think it's obvious this serie is something they want to expand someway.
 

PikachuSmasher

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I’m sure they’re currently testing legends to see if the public likes these kinds of games. BDSP is just a new art style, but same game and with the art style being controversial, I doubt they’d pull that again. In terms of Legends, I think there’ll be more Legends with Mythicals. When BW remakes come out, I wouldn’t be surprised to get Pokemon Legends Keldeo
 

Joker901

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I’m sure they’re currently testing legends to see if the public likes these kinds of games. BDSP is just a new art style, but same game and with the art style being controversial, I doubt they’d pull that again. In terms of Legends, I think there’ll be more Legends with Mythicals. When BW remakes come out, I wouldn’t be surprised to get Pokemon Legends Keldeo
Keldeo had its own movie that basically explained all of its lore. It also had an in-game event with a new form and signature move, so I think that the swords of justice had their moment already. Maybe with the Unova Legends they'll cover something else like the ancient past of the monarchy in Unova and how the two brothers began to fight over truth and ideals.
 

Silktree

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I really don't think there's much that can be added to Arceus' lore despite its grandiosity (unless Game Freak are willing to deconstruct it), but Keldeo is just boring.

Reminder that no one in Sinnoh even knew about Arceus... Cynthia had to speculate about its existence. Team Galaxy will either have to hide its existence or this game is no prequel.
 

Shib

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My theory (and a little bit of hope) is that we’re seeing a new pattern of what sort of games are released where there will be a 3-4 part cycle of

1. Traditional Game (start of new gen)

2. DLC for that traditional game/historically “third version”

3. Experimental game that tests new mechanics and ideas which of popular could be expanded to the main game

(4. possible DLC for 3.)


If this is the new pattern I’ll be pretty happy - the experimental games aren’t always going to tick all the boxes for everyone but they will create good reference data for the what people want in the core games without needing to alter the formula too much for each new generation game which could be seen as too risky.

I also think that remakes now are more likely to always be farmed out to another dev instead of being given to the “B-team” unless a remake is used as part of the experimental game - like Let’s Go. This has become much more the standard for the games industry in general and allows for an easier cash in on the nostalgia market while keeping the other games flowing too. Part of me actually suspects that Legends probably started out as looking at how Diamond and Pearl could have been remade for the Switch until the scope based on possibilities and consumer expectations triggered a rethink.
But of course this is all just baseless speculation. :)
 

Articfoxgamez

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Unova still needs remake tho, as it's the only one not in 3D.
Just here to stay, that statement isn't fully true. Johto still isn't in 3D either. So i do think they should at least remake that one a second time like they did Kanto at some point. Just to have every region in 3D.
 

Almonds

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I'm all for GameFreak trying new things. Nostalgia and old things can be good, but in my opinion this has been going on for quite some time for Pokemon. For once I'm so glad Sinnoh is getting all the spotlight after so many years of Kanto pandering. Just one generation - or heck, even one game - without some form of Charizard shoved in my face and I'm good.
 

takoyaki

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I think that the open world things in SwSh were tests for something "new" they'd like to put in.
They had the idea to do things with Sinnoh, and to be honest, I think that they are pitting them against each other.
It'll honestly come down to which is more popular--at least for which gets the attention of GF.
If chibi wins, GF will (probably) use that going forwards, but if the "big-risk" style of PL:A wins, GF will focus on that (and who knows, maybe they'll ask ILCA for help more!).
 

Esserise

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Just here to stay, that statement isn't fully true. Johto still isn't in 3D either. So i do think they should at least remake that one a second time like they did Kanto at some point. Just to have every region in 3D.

While I would be all for HGSS taking on the BDSP "Make a Gen 4 game playable" Challenge, I feel like this would be a bigger deal if by "3D," we were talking about the other regions having all been rendered in Galar/Hisui-style 3D. But other than the action scenes, the extent of 3D that defines the worlds of XY or ORAS (or, quite frankly, LGPE and BDSP) really isn't that different from the "2.5D" of HGSS and BW. You're still, for the most part, limited to two axes of movement.
 
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