Back to Basics! Endgame(28/6/2015)

[Zexy]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@jackatlasred; What do you think of the three problems I thought your plan had?

And yeah, that like above proves that SM is lurking.

 

[HumanDawn]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@CrackFox; What do you think about Melpomeme's comment about there not being any point in posting your reads if they were pretty neutral?

@jackatlesred; You should reread what Flop has been saying, because I got a different impression and understanding from what they've been saying.

EDIT: Yeah I saw two likes too...?

 

[Zexy]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@Sword Master; Seriously, as soon as I mentioned you are lurking because you liked those posts, you took the likes off.
Wouldn't it be a better option to try to defend yourself for a change? And if you are town, say something that might help the town!

 

[TylerM]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

I'm voting for Sword Master because of his inactivity and defensiveness. Unvote: jackatlasred Vote: Sword Master

 

[jackatlasred]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

Problems
1) who in their right mind would of checked pikachu? The pikachu would of not gotten other claims unless HD was mafia.

2) you guys Would believe me if you saw it on a public
thread. I can only mobile screenshot as of now.

3) so you're telling me I trust a person, I give them something only they understand, the doctor is killed I don't look suspicious for voting them? What mafia can't resist a power role kill with almost no repercussion?

I have read the whole thread many times, and I can say I stick with my options. Just pike for many I'm scum, and for many I'm not, everyone can have their opinions.
@Zexy; @HumanDawn;

Edit: Also I was busy but I'm good for about 2 hours now.

Oh and I would like to point out the last time I changed my vote because of all of you they ended up being mafia.

 

[Melpomene]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@Soulmaster; Are you okay with telling us whether or not Sword Master is the one being subbed out? I mean, like, it just feels really unfair to lynch them just when their sub is coming in, and if there's a sub, I think they deserve at least some sort of chance, y'know?

Oh and I would like to point out the last time I changed my vote because of all of you they ended up being mafia.

What happened in a completely unrelated game has no real bearing on this game, though? You being right and not being able to convince an entirely different group of players that you were right doesn't mean it's the same thing now and there's no reason to believe that it is (the same thing, that is).

 

[jackatlasred]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@Soulmaster; Are you okay with telling us whether or not Sword Master is the one being subbed out? I mean, like, it just feels really unfair to lynch them just when their sub is coming in, and if there's a sub, I think they deserve at least some sort of chance, y'know?

Oh and I would like to point out the last time I changed my vote because of all of you they ended up being mafia.

What happened in a completely unrelated game has no real bearing on this game, though? You being right and not being able to convince an entirely different group of players that you were right doesn't mean it's the same thing now and there's no reason to believe that it is (the same thing, that is).

You're right but if it were to happen again I would feel it could effect my future games, I'd rather stand my ground and be wrong.

 

[Doctor Floptopus]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@jackatlasred; may I also remind you that last time you went mad on me we were both town, so that argument is invalid.

@Flopjack; yeah, your explanation was pretty bad too, contradicting.

So, I trust pikachu's judgement. Pikachu (or most people) wouldn't trust a claim because they trusted them less than halfway through day 1, after literally one or two posts. However, her claim was there. I knew she wouldn't trust some "doctor", so she had to be lying. Does that make more sense?

As for SM what else do you consider your vote for? I only see one real post, and other little ones with no content at all. If anything his inactivity didn't catch eye from you until now.

Read my reads. That gives my reason for voting him. I'd not say he's definitely scum, but he's the most scummy of us in my eyes.

If we where focusing on meta then the pikachu wouldn't of even be a though when we lynched her. If someone is looking like mafia and you claim meta not to vote for them then do it every time. I don't care if you don't vote for me or if you do, what I have a problem with is that you are being inconsistent.

I don't understand what you mean. How would using meta make Pikachu less scummy? If anything, meta would make Pikachu more scummy due to her being paranoid to the point of correctly guessing the godfather as town and risky as mafia.

Can you do me a favour? Look at some other people. Assume, hypothetically, that I am town and think of who else could be mafia that's not me or a potential scum buddy for me. I'm not asking you to ignore your opinion on me, just to put it aside for five minutes.

Edit: it's affect, not effect sorry but that gets in my nerves

 

[Froakie]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

Unvote: Seppe

Vote: Sword Master

Liking posts but lurking/not defending yourself, then taking those likes off? I can't see that as anything not scum...

 

[Figgles]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

I was gonna wait until they defended themselves, but... Well, yeah.

VOTE: Sword Master

 

[jackatlasred]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@Flopjack;

First of all I would like to point out this is nothing personal, last game I just tried to get someone else out, since I was the doctor.

Secondly, I do have other people that I suspect, some that don't have anything to do with you.

Third I don't know if you just want me to take my vote off of you or not, but as it is now until I suspect someone more than you (such as pooch before) I will keep my vote.

And my last point would be that I kind of also disagree with the sm lynch.

 

[Soulmaster]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

He is one who requested to be subbed out, I can say that much.

 

[Zexy]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

Sword Master VII (HumanDawn, Flopjack, Zexy, CrackFox, TylerM, Froakie, Gafigglethorp)
Flopjack I (jackatlasred)

Spoiler

1) who in their right mind would of checked pikachu? The pikachu would of not gotten other claims unless HD was mafia.

If she survived, I guess someone could. Yet, this is not what I said (or at least tried to). If you claimed cop to Pikachu, she might have not trusted you and say in thread “I’ve got a cop claim. Any counterclaims?”. This could potentially make the cop out themselves the same way Tyler did, which would be outright bad.

2) you guys Would believe me if you saw it on a public
thread. I can only mobile screenshot as of now.

I don’t really get this, you could either PM HumanDawn who the “doc” is or vote for them, and he could decide to trust you or not the same.

3) so you're telling me I trust a person, I give them something only they understand, the doctor is killed I don't look suspicious for voting them? What mafia can't resist a power role kill with almost no repercussion?

Not really, I meant that since only you Human and Pikachu would know, if the doc got killed it would be reasonable for each one to suspect the others. Mafia CAN resist a power role kill for two reasons:
1 We are talking about doctors here, they can protect themselves (and most probably will since they are CC’d out)
2 If there was a CC between Pikachu’s doc and Tyler, one of them would be mafia. This means that if the real doc got killed, we would immediately lynch the other. Mafia could handle the CC better than this.

Last but not least @Melpomene; I guess you saw that post Soulmaster made. Are you going to say anything more on the matter? Like, stop us from lynching Sword Master? Or vote someone else, the person you think should be lynched?

… Anyways, I would like to ask @Soulmaster; if he intends to place a sub for Sword Master before the update. He didn’t even put Equinox in who is willing to join in right away (not even in Denial’s place). It’s bad that people don’t get subbed in fast when it is so important. I am tempted to unvote Sword Master, I can’t help but think that his sketchy behavior may just stem from the way he plays, and not scuminess. And I would like to cut his sub some slack (if they even show up). Yet it looks like SM had some kind of “plan” to avoid his lynch by requesting to get subbed out. Which he did privately, besides a pretty large portion of the playerbase wants him lynched, with the most important imo being TylerM who is my top town read and has no problem with lynching him at all.

 

[jackatlasred]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

1) I'm sorry @Zexy; but if that were to happen then I would say this game was unwinable from the start, the cop was well you know the rest.

2) Ok let's say that the mafia failed to kill the doctor, then I come in and tell you guys everything. Would you guys believe me if the whole thing was in PM or if some of it was out in the open? Also I did not know if HD would agree to the plan, or even contact me.

3) ok so you say the doc can protect themselves and your points seem valid. Only something wrong with that. We all knew this doctor was suspicious so what are the odds that I go and tell him my plan?

 

[Melpomene]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

Last but not least @Melpomene; I guess you saw that post Soulmaster made. Are you going to say anything more on the matter? Like, stop us from lynching Sword Master?

I really can't decide how I feel about lynching Sword Master now--like, not posting even in the face of being bandwagoned (I don't mean that negatively, necessarily, although it does feel like everyone's just piling on him) just feels like... When I get really anxious and nervous, I just shut down and avoid absolutely everything, and Sword Master's avoidance of the thread just reminds me of that a lot, right? And I feel like Sword Master would at least be trying to defend himself if he were mafia (since he has that burden of responsibility/obligation to do anything he can to stay alive), while avoiding the thread as town doesn't feel so shameful/wouldn't cause as much guilt, as one member lost when it's not LYLO can be rectified, if that makes sense? Like, to avoid the thread out of pure anxiety comes across as a town-ish thing, since I've done that as town in the past (and I'd never be able to rationalize that as mafia), and I feel horrible about lynching him if he's really that afraid (to the point of subbing out!), although that's... really not an appropriate reason to refrain from voting him. But even disregarding that, the lynch on him just feels off.

But at the same time, he could be subbing out as a manipulation thing/buying time, since, as I've mentioned/as you acknowledged, people would feel badly about having someone sub in just to have them die without even being able to play, so if SM's mafia, then maybe he's just trying to buy time since he doesn't think he can save himself otherwise? And maybe he's avoiding posting because he's afraid that he'll somehow mess up further and maybe interact/avoid interacting with someone in such a way that it makes it very obvious they're town/mafia... There's a flipside to every argument I have, and I just can't decide which makes more sense to me (although the subbing out to buy time bit feels like it's a bit of a stretch), so it's just... I'm excessively conflicted and I haven't been able to stick to one side, even though I've thought about this for a long time. Despite that I get why people want to vote him, I don't feel right enough to vote him, but I can't convince myself to feel strongly enough that it's wrong to think I have the right to try to stop it, since I'm not firm in my opinion regarding him whatsoever.

Or vote someone else, the person you think should be lynched?

This might be a bit hypocritical, but everyone seemed very set on Sword Master, and I've already posted my reads and discussed why I think x/y/z are scummy and who's most to least scummy/who I'd be okay to vote, so if any of those reads had clicked with someone, they'd probably have mentioned it by now. And, well, voting someone just for the sake of voting someone when I've already established who I scumread and why just seems pointless, so I didn't feel the need to do so.

 

[Zexy]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

1) I'm sorry @Zexy; but if that were to happen then I would say this game was unwinable from the start, the cop was well you know the rest.

I don’t get it.

2) Ok let's say that the mafia failed to kill the doctor, then I come in and tell you guys everything. Would you guys believe me if the whole thing was in PM or if some of it was out in the open? Also I did not know if HD would agree to the plan, or even contact me.

Assuming that Pikachu’s doctor was town and Tyler is scum. Besides, since the doctor is supposed to stay HIDDEN, you wouldn’t know if they protected themselves or someone else. In any case, making up such a plan to learn of a doctor that you would only out if they manage to self-save is very risky and there is not much point, the doc could have make sure to inform the town of the save themselves or through Pikachu. Why did you bother sending him the PM in the first place? If he didn’t agree/contact you, Pikachu would’ve been lynched (which actually happened) and the plan would never really take place at all… which again actually happened.

3) ok so you say the doc can protect themselves and your points seem valid. Only something wrong with that. We all knew this doctor was suspicious so what are the odds that I go and tell him my plan?

Did you expect Pikachu to tell you who the doc is without telling them? Come on, if you were the cop and they were the doc you would sure interact more than you think.

---

Melpomene, I get that you think that maf!SM would feel obliged towards his partners… but if we count the votes on him (7), himself (8), taking you and jack into consideration (10), that some people are already dead (12) and that there are two inactives (Denial, Rabbit) (14) who could have also voted for him were they active, the only person that seems to not have bothered with voting or at least accusing SM is Seppe (and jack, but he is so focused on flop there is no point). Thing is, I believe that if he is maf, his buddies have already decided to bus him HARD, and some of the people who voted for him should be scum. Besides, it’s not like any of the Mafiosi has a role, so it won’t do his buddies too much bad to get him bussed.

 

[TylerM]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

I'm personally still for the lynch on Sword Master. The fact that their behavior was scummy doesn't change because of them being subbed out. Are there any other cases that someone wants to make for a player?

edit: also should i post reads? they'll probably be really simple and bad but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Seppe]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

@Soulmaster;

Sorry, Coach, but I'm going to have to withdraw from this game :/

Thanks for having me, though, and good luck to the rest of y'all! Wooo

 

[jackatlasred]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

Well umm, so we have three withdrawals.
@TylerM; sure everyone loves to have someone's view in the game.

 

[Soulmaster]

Re: Back to Basics! Day 2(19/6/2015)

Yeah sorry, was busy and only just saw the yes. Do y'all want an extension with someone coming in for Sword? Otherwise I will update in 30 minutes or so.

EDIT: Hearing nothing voting locked update pending.