Mafia Bristol Mafia Speedway- Endgame, mafia wins

[quagsire fan123]

oh crud ok at this point i think it is snowy just becuase of overwhelming evidence capsfan i think at this point you are town allined we need to vote snowy we have both stated evidence against them and space i think is the other mafia just becsause again previous evidence but at this point we need pikochu to vote snowy or else we are in trouble
Unvote:contrainer
Vote:snowy

 

[Snowy]

Well there goes my suspicions.

you admit it was anti-town -- again why did you even do the kill in the first place?

I do not admit it was anti-town. I am saying for the new guy that doesn't help town isn't the same thing as being scum. I thought it was the best course to take at the time.

Vote:snowy

Dude.

we need to vote snowy we have both stated evidence against them

You still haven't got a single piece of evidence against me, and plenty in my defence.

 

[quagsire fan123]

read my past posts accusing you i do

 

[Space]

is snowy the only one to have an actual ability...?

and space i think is the other mafia just becsause again previous evidence

what previous evidence?

I do not admit it was anti-town. I am saying for the new guy that doesn't help town isn't the same thing as being scum. I thought it was the best course to take at the time.

ahh okay. why was it the best course of action though? Jinjo was likely to be voted out anyway.

 

[Snowy]

ahh okay. why was it the best course of action though? Jinjo was likely to be voted out anyway.

At the time, i was operating on very little sleep, and thought jinjo wasn't acting like town jinjo.

We need to be careful with todays vote. We choose wrong and scum wins.

is snowy the only one to have an actual ability...?

i was wondering about that too, So far no one has mentioned using a cop ability.

 

[Contrainer]

Oh yeah I died
Don't really care

 

[Snowy]

Spoiler

The living:
@Snowy
@TheCapsFan
@quagsire fan123
@Pikochu
@Space

So we're in MyLo phase. If we mislynch today, we lose.

With that in mind, I want to bring up quagsire's vote. The very first thing they did this phase, after being told by the host that this phase is MyLo is to vote, without any discussion with the town. Up until now, I've given them the benefit of the doubt with being new... but to vote that quickly is reckless.

I want to hear the rest of town's opinions on the matter. If my calculations are correct, we should have either a 3v2 situation remaining. (Not sure if we can have an ITP)

 

[TheCapsFan]

I agree with Snowy that we have to be careful today, and that makes me wary of Quagsire’s vote. However I don’t think Snowy should be out from under the FoS.

 

[TheCapsFan]

What we also need is @Pikochu to get in here and give thoughts. The longer it goes without him coming in the more likely it looks to me like he’s mafia-aligned.

 

[quagsire fan123]

ok let me back up my vote on snowy they have claimed the ending the day early role and have claimed it as a good thing they ended the day when jinjo would be voted out but jinjo was innocent they probably ended the day early so that a vanilla townie would be voted out

 

[Snowy]

What we also need is @Pikochu to get in here and give thoughts. The longer it goes without him coming in the more likely it looks to me like he’s mafia-aligned.

Unfortunately, @Pikochu hasn't been on the forums since Wednesday last week. I'd venture a guess that the only reason he wasn't modkilled is because it'd throw the game, regardless of faction. And it's probably too late for Chevy to find a replacement.

ok let me back up my vote on snowy they have claimed the ending the day early role and have claimed it as a good thing they ended the day when jinjo would be voted out but jinjo was innocent they probably ended the day early so that a vanilla townie would be voted out

That is a fairly weak strawman. Assuming you're town, and not just scum trying to get an easy kill, then all you're doing is making guesses while ignoring my explanation. As I said, I did not have to come clean. I was under no obligation to tell people what I had done, and it drew attention to me which isn't what scum would want. Either I'm the worst scum in the history of scum, I'm a jester, or I simply made a bad judgement call. And if I was a jester, I wouldn't be trying to defend myself.

Also, dayvig doesn't care who had the most votes.

Chances are there are two scum left. We can't hear from Piko unless he decides to visit the forums in the next 24 hours, so I'd like to hear more from @TheCapsFan and @Space.

 

[quagsire fan123]

snowy that is fair but caps fan has been contributing a lot piko isnt gonna do anything and space hasnt done anything all that helpful
actually i think it might be space
Unvote:snowy
Vote:space

 

[Contrainer]

Oh yeah I died
Don't really care

(good luck town)

 

[Space]

i was wondering about that too, So far no one has mentioned using a cop ability.

it's very unusual -- is this what Chevy means by there being a unique mechanic...? there only being one ability? idk

With that in mind, I want to bring up quagsire's vote. The very first thing they did this phase, after being told by the host that this phase is MyLo is to vote, without any discussion with the town. Up until now, I've given them the benefit of the doubt with being new... but to vote that quickly is reckless.

he's still being reckless so I think that's just him, not indicative of alignment

snowy that is fair but caps fan has been contributing a lot piko isnt gonna do anything and space hasnt done anything all that helpful

hmm what would be helpful in your eyes? also just to point out: I voted MegaPod on the 2nd day phase and later MegaPod was modkilled and revealed to be scum. That alone might not mean much, but MegaPod voted me in the 1st day phase, and if a mistake hadn't been made, I would've been lynched thanks to his vote. (Correct me if I'm wrong on this I might be misunderstanding/not reading the votes right, but that seemed to be the case)

 

[TheCapsFan]

Snowy I see your callout, I’ll give thoughts and vote tomorrow.

 

[Snowy]

Snowy I see your callout, I’ll give thoughts and vote tomorrow.

Better be quick. we are running out of time.

 

[TheCapsFan]

I've read up, and honestly each player has points against them and for them. I'm going to talk through them to try and reason them. Most of this is about Snowy because I have the most thoughts about them.

First we have Snowy, who has the obvious accusations against them regarding the viability of their alignment given their role. I don't want to spend too much time on it, as myself, Quagsire, and DawningWinds have already said. Their main defense of this, if I remember correctly, is just "Jinjo was going to get lynched anyway so I sped up the process." Which, I can kind of understand this perspective, but it's not like Jinjo was inactive or unwilling to defend themselves. Had they been given more time it's possible that they would have managed to save themselves from a lynch, possibly by starting a counterwagon or bringing up better cases on other players, but Snowy took that away from them.

The recent interaction between Snowy and Space also just adds more confusion on the part of Snowy, in my opinion. Snowy was intentionally vague when they initially revealed they were behind the kill, and they are again intentionally vague on their reasoning for committing the kill, until they finally claim that they were tired when they made the kill, and did not consider the possible implications of their actions. I think had they been a bit more clear in how and why they made the kill, they would look a lot better, but they did not, perhaps because they were too concerned with getting towncred from their role.

The biggest points in Snowy's favor is the fact that admitting they made the kill brings attention to them, which scum would not want, but after some more thought I think this is moot when considering the scum motivation of getting towncred. A better point in their favor is their initiative that they've taken today in trying to get discussion going. I think I could see them on a scumteam with Space because the votes line up (especially the D1 vote which looks worse than it actually was because of the mistake), or Piko because it seems to me like Snowy's activity greatly increased as soon as Pikochu disappeared; perhaps they started doing more because they realized they had to in order to have a chance at winning the game.

Next we have Space. I agree that they haven't done anything notable, but they have been scumhunting more this game than most of the other players at the very least. IIRC they were under some decent suspicion D1 but survived; looking back at the votals, it appears that it should have been a tie between Space and Timaeus and therefore a no lynch. I do think it's odd that they've survived this long, though, as I think I would have expected them to be killed N2 over their MegaPod sus? The biggest point in their favor however is in D1 where MegaPod voted for them to send it to the tie, but that's not even much. I think I need to ISO this slot, but first I want to ask @quagsire fan123 if they could go in depth a bit more as to why they think Space is more likely over Snowy. I can see both as a scumteam but I think I could only realistically see Space with Snowy if at all.

Quagsire themselves have played a pretty clean game all game IMO, showing some good scumhunting and thought process. The only thing they've done that's been notable since D1 is vote early this phase, which I almost want to chock up to a rookie mistake because at least they are taking a stand. This is drawing attention to themselves in a way that makes them look much more town than Snowy's drawing attention to themself on Day 2 since it is a much more critical point of the game, I don't know if scum would be this careless here...but again, they are new, so we really don't know. I honestly don't know if I can see them with anyone else as scum, actually. Maybe Pikochu lol

Pikochu is a mixed bag and a complete unknown given their inactivity, but honestly I have to lean scum on them. The biggest reason for this I think is because I don't understand why they wouldn't have been modkilled yesterday, and that puts an odd taste in my mouth. really have no idea

 

[TheCapsFan]

Space ISO:

Spoiler

but is it really incorrect? aren't you trying to get others to hint at their roles then, since you asked if anyone had any useful information to share? you yourself apparently hinted at something about your role so by asking about useful information it seems you're wanting others to take a similar route in hinting. or were you saying that because you know something useful will happen because you posted first/taken the lead....?

Odd into to be honest, I can't put my finger on why though. I can see this as perhaps a bit of role fishing in hindsight, but to be fair Timaeus was role fishing first.

but what kind of information? can you elaborate on what the crowd cheering means or does that give everything away about your role?

agreed, but is there a reason you havent answered any of my questions lol

More of the same. They got called out for tunneling on this and yes, this is pretty clearly tunneling. I'm surprised no one mentioned that they were essentially doing the same thing as Timaeus was right back at them until I did in my intro post. I think that looks worse in hindsight given the amount of vanilla roles in this game.

somehow i missed this post. anyway, I'm not sure what Timaeus is getting at here with not wanting to allow any mafia to claim it first -- I guess that would imply mafia having a similar or same role as Timaeus, and Timaeus would be aware of that fact......? since the game has a unique "mechanic" that must mean Timaeus is not the only one involved in the mechanic, assuming what he said is a part of the mechanic and isn't just role specific.

This is good solving based on the result of their analysis, but still tunneling.

timaeus is a point of discussion when i've seen little else and I don't think it's weird to want answers from someone who is giving hints about their role but they're being cryptic about it. one could argue it's strange to ask so much about the role when it could potentially aid mafia, but if Timaeus was going to bring it up at all, I don't see why more information on it shouldn't be obtained

also part of me is just ????? at why timaeus has ignored my posts lol

Timaeus' vote is also pretty useless given a random vote is not likely to gain traction and it seems like an attempt to do something while not doing much at all, so with that all being said

Vote: Timaeus

yeah, this checks out. Nothing about their logic or the process to which they went to vote Timaeus really seems too sus in my opinion, given the way Timaeus was acting. If anything I'm surprised they didn't vote a little earlier given that it was D1 and votes are pretty liberal on D1.

the counterclaim thing is weird because the role apparently is out of the ordinary so why worry about it being counterclaimed unless they know someone else might have a role like them? also if Timaeus is going to bring up their role in the first place, you gotta expect someone to question it. honestly all I'd expect is for Timaeus to say they can't reveal anything more without full on claiming, but Timaeus hasn't done that so I want more info. Also my vote is partly because I find Timaeus' vote to be useless

interaction with MegaPod, doesn't really feel too forced. this combined with the vote on MegaPod on the next day calls into question why they would feel the need to draw suspicion and then go harder against them the next day if they are scum with MegaPod. I wonder what would have happened with the case on MegaPod had D2 evolved a bit further.

yeah Jinjo has been accusatory without actually going for anyone. Jinjo wasn't saying Timaeus has no power I don't think, just that Jinjo didn't think Timaeus was being serious with what he was saying. Which makes sense, given there's no way of knowing what Timaeus meant, other than the crowd cheering.

This is the first read on someone that is not Timaeus, and it's almost an OMGUS since Jinjo was the one that came at them for tunnelling Timaeus.

quagsire has done more than other players and had this post...so personally I'd think going after inactives would make more sense than singling quagsire out.

I feel like nobody else really took quagsire seriously besides me until Space said this, to which I remember giving a little +1 in my head to Space for the mindmeld there.

Vote: MegaPod

find it pretty odd that he points out how TheCapsFan is suspect of DawningWind's flipflopping but says he can see where DawningWinds is coming from + finds Jinjo suspect but is keeping an eye on her, but he ignored my reasoning on questioning Timaeus and my reason for voting him as well? Appears like he just had an idea to vote me and went with it, without responding to any of my posts.

Here is the MegaPod vote. The reason I think that these two can't be scum together is because Space brings up an additional case on MegaPod in addition to the more OMGUS-y "he didn't respond to my response." If they were both scum voting each other to distance, I don't think she would have felt the need to add the extra parts about his incomplete reads on other people. Making the additional case shows that there is more seriousness behind this vote, resulting in more genuine scumhunting in my opinion.

Damn, Space really had the most interactions with MegaPod out of everyone lol

Tunneling implies I was actively trying to go against Timaeus, while I was only seeking information. And it wouldn't had to have been multiple questions on my part if Timaeus had actually responded for once

I disagree on this definition of tunneling lol

You have a point, but to be honest I just don't see the inactives suddenly getting active. idk

I wouldn't go off of how general new players might act

I don't like Contrainer's vote on Jinjo. He's made no inclination of having read over the thread (which.... admittedly isn't much) and. though O don't agree with his reasoning, he could at least say why he thinks this is Jinjo's meta scum game.

More scumhunting here, nothing much to comment on.

thinking about it, I'm confused about Timaeus' role btw. Did he not have an ability I guess? Or....?

STILL talking about Timaeus a full day+ after his death; I suppose he did have an interesting role in hindsight given the rest of the game, but c'mon lol

you admit it was anti-town -- again why did you even do the kill in the first place?

more mindmelding...perhaps I am a bit biased because of the mindmelding but I just really don't see scum motivation in Space's game here besides the rolefishing day 1. If they're scum, then they're playing a really good scum game.

everything else is recent enough I don't feel the need to comment on it.

tl;dr: As I stated at the end, I really don't see a lot of scum motivation in the way Space has been playing this game besides light rolefishing on D1. Looking back, I don't think that the MegaPod interactions were forced, which is enough to make me think Space is unlikely to be mafia with them, and enough to push me in the other direction.

I don't really see quagsire as scum, and Pikochu is a useless vote. Therefore, VOTE: Snowy.

 

[Space]

well I dont think it's quagsire and Snowy is the only one to have an ability it seems which is... odd, for lack of a better word, and I know Snowy has explained the Jinjo kill, but it's still difficult for me to look past that, especially when we have no info on Pikochu, & Quagsire seems genuine to me.

Vote: Snowy

 

[Snowy]

Well, that’s a game over. FWIW Vote: quagsire the only one really FoS worthy.