Contest Contest-of-the-Week: Shiftry vs Ludicolo

[Winterdaze]

Welcome to Contest-of-the-Week! With the release of Pokémon Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire on the horizon, the attention of Pokémon fans everywhere turns to Hoenn, and all the cool and interesting Pokemon that live there.

Every week, we'll be looking at a few of the many Pokémon you'll meet along your journey through the Hoenn region, and asking for your opinions on them and how they stack up next to their counterparts or rival Pokemon looking to fill the same spot on your team.

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Once you reach Petalburg city for the first time, your father sends you back into Route 102 to help Wally catch his first Pokemon. Luckily for him, the first Pokemon he finds is the rare Ralts, but there are other useful Pokemon on Route 102 that are well worth catching. Seedot and/or Lotad can be found there depending on the version you're playing, and either makes a great addition to your team if you didn't pick Treecko as your starter.

Both are part of a three stage line that reaches its final stage by evolution stone. The tengu Shiftry has mixed offensive stats and a plethora of boosting moves that let it use both physical and special moves effectively. The happy-go-lucky Ludicolo enjoys a balance between offense and defence and can also serve as your team's Water type and Surf user, which is convenient if you didn't pick Mudkip. Both Pokemon are built to capitalise on the weather, which is sun in Shiftry's case and rain for Ludicolo.

Which version exclusive Grass type do you prefer, and why?

-Which has the better design?
-Which one is easier to train?
-Which is more useful throughout the game?
-Which do you think will be better in ORAS?
-Which is more useful in the competitive environment?
-Is the presence or absence of one of these Pokemon a deciding factor in which version of ORAS you're going to buy?

Let the contest begin!

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Next week: Swellow vs Pelipper

 

[cityvillain]

Design: I love Shiftry's more than Ludicolo. I've always wanted a Grass/Dark typing and Shiftry impressed me. I love the details and its origins. I thought it's more creative and unique than Ludicolo's silly "stereotypical" look.

Their presence/absence wouldn't matter as I'm buying both versions.

 

[Zeb]

Which version exclusive Grass type do you prefer, and why?

I love both, but Shiftry has the edge ever so slightly. I tend to like most Grass and Dark types, so a combination of both types, being based on a tengu, with a cute little acorn and a weird Pinocchio-esque child of the forest as its pre-evolutions is a winner for me. Ludicolo is incredibly fun though, and watching its dancing animation never gets old obligatory mention to Miror B

-Which has the better design?

Ludicolo has an incredibly fun design while Shiftry has the sinister looking design; they seem to be on opposite sides of the spectrum. Both designs are pretty much perfect, they don't go too overboard with their designs yet don't feel lacking. I love both.

-Which one is easier to train?

Ludicolo imo. The Shiftry line has bad level-up moves, basically requiring TM use (which isn't too bad since they are now infinite but it would like other options and back in Gen III it was terribly difficult to use especially as Nuzleaf) and is also pretty frail. Ludicolo has the right amount of bulk and offence to be useful and HM Surf is always handy giving it a powerful Water attack while also useful for getting through the game as it's basically a necessity.

-Which is more useful throughout the game?

As said above, Ludicolo is easier to train and can learn useful HMs, so let's go with that.

-Which do you think will be better in ORAS?

I can see Shiftry being a lot better than it was previously due to a few reasons: Steel no longer resisting Dark, meaning Grass/Dark isn't forced to switch by every Steel type you encounter, infinite TMs meaning you can teach it moves like Energy Ball, Dark Pulse and Focus Blast to help patch up the holes in its movepool it has and it now seems to learn Leaf Blade, so it looks like they might be fixing said holes it has.

Ludicolo will be just fine like before. Its level-up moves could do with some tweaking and adding, but it has a good type combination and stats for in-game use and the infinite TMs (plus reasonably available Surf mid-game) will mean it'll be just as easy to use, if not more so.

I think Ludicolo probably has the edge, but we'll have to see, Shiftry will be a good pick too if they can fix some of its level-up moves, I reckon.

-Which is more useful in the competitive environment?

Ludicolo is great on rain teams, seeing use in both VGC and Smogon's metagames. The Drizzle nerf makes it harder to use and in higher tiers players seem to prefer Kabutops and Kingdra as their Swimmers, but it's still a good one. I used a Rain Dance Life Orb Ludicolo in NU a few weeks back and it could clean up teams easily towards the end of the game. Shiftry isn't so hot in higher tiers, but in the lower tiers it's great. As I mentioned before, the Steel nerf helps it massively, spamming the overpowered move Knock Off when it needs to and being able to pick things off with Sucker Punch. It also has access to Defog to remove hazards if your team needs it. I used a Shiftry on a different team to the Ludicolo in NU a few weeks back too, and it's honestly one of the best Pokemon in the tier.

Ludicolo is viable in more tiers overall, but Shiftry does better in the lower tiers so far this gen.

-Is the presence or absence of one of these Pokemon a deciding factor in which version of ORAS you're going to buy?

I love both, but I prefer Shiftry. I was going with Omega Ruby for Mawile anyway, so Shiftry being there is a plus. I honestly wouldn't have mind either though, I do really like them both.

 

[Team Gaara]

I honestly don't really care too much for either of these Pokemon. I don't dislike them, but they certainly aren't my favorites. That said, I can't really say which has a better design since they're both rather peculiar, but I guess I'll go with Shiftree since it's a bit more appealing. As for which is easier to train, I only ever used Ludicolo in my Sapphire playthrough, and I can say it was pretty hard to train. It gets no good Grass-types moves to use and you're mostly stuck with Absorb for a large portion of the game and it can only be salvaged with the Surf HM as a decent attacking move until you find the TM of Giga Drain (which only has 5 PP). Then there's my own personal mistake of forgetting that Lombre evolves by Stone, meaning I had a Pokemon weaker than it needed to be for longer than it needed to be. I can't vouch for the Seedot line, but Lotad's is definitely hard to train.

I think Ludicolo is more useful only because it can use Surf. Otherwise, I honestly think there are better options to both of these Pokemon in terms of usefulness in battle. I think Ludicolo will also be better in ORAS because Shiftree's gotten an additional weakness to Fairy, while Ludicolo is, to my knowledge, only weak to Flying and Poison, meaning, with all of the new available TMs it can take advantage of, it'll be able to outshine Shiftree.

In competitive, I've seen Shiftree as a strong attacker while Ludicolo is an annoying troll. I've never used either, so just based on what I've seen, both have their uses depending on what you're going for. If I had to guess, with Shiftree being more geared towards offense, I'd say it's better in competitive battle.

Neither of these Pokemon have any deciding factor into which version I'm getting, as my choice was and still is based on my preferred Legendary of Kyogre over Groudon, despite the fact that I actually prefer Team Magma to Aqua. Though in the long run it won't matter since I'll eventually have both games in my possession, these Pokemon aren't affecting that choice, whatsoever, as I already mentioned that I honestly don't care for either.

 

[GhostFingers]

Lotad/Lombre/Ludi has three weaknesses: flying poison AND bug too. For a grass type this is strong defensively, unfortunately it now takes x4 damage from freeze dry too.

Seedot/Nuzleaf/Shiftry has a x4 weakness to all bug moves, as well as fighting, poison, flying, fairy, ice AND fire. Very difficult to defend with Shift, but offense is really more his thing.

In gens when TMs were breakable they were both equally difficult to battle with using level-up moves only, because they learn different moves depending on which stage of evolution they are in, resulting in using everstones (after getting fed up with B cancelling) for a while.

Although i like the dark evil design of Shift's entire line, i've voted for Ludi because of its unique typing (gen III also offered us Cacturne), and its happy bopping dancing. It has really good balance as offense and defense which suits me well.

 

[aliveatnight]

I don't really use either, so I can really only go on design, and I'd have to pick Shiftry for that.
However, I do think that Ludicolo is pretty cute too.

 

[that1chick]

I don't care for either that much... Though I went with Ludicolo. Not sure why since I'll always remember it as the annoyance from Colosseum/XD. Curse you Mirror B!!

-Which has the better design?
Eh neither are that appealing to me, but I really dislike Shiftry's design so Ludicolo.

-Which one is easier to train?
Never bothered to train anything from Ludicolo's line, but I did use a Seedot and Nuzleaf in XD. It was alright, but there are plenty of other grass types I prefer.

-Which is more useful throughout the game?
Eh neither have very overwhelming stats. Shiftry has a lot of weaknesses, though dark moves can be handy. Ludicolo's typing has more advantages. Not sure about their move pools and I don't care enough to do any more research beyond what little I've done. Both their abilities can be useful, though when done right Ludicolo can be an annoyance when it comes to regaining HP.

-Which do you think will be better in ORAS?
Neither I'll go with another grass type.

-Which is more useful in the competitive environment?
I think either can be viable. From what I've read on Smogon it depends on the set -- both have the potential to be Ubers. I think it would come down to preference and what the rest of your team looks like. Personally, I'd rather use another grass type.

-Is the presence or absence of one of these Pokemon a deciding factor in which version of ORAS you're going to buy?
Absolutely not.

 

[Integra]

I like the tengu design more, and Shiftry also has a more interesting offensive typing than Ludi. That said, Ludicolo gets a 10/10 for his dance moves...

 

[xXMelanie_HimeXx]

-Which has the better design?

They both have great designs. I can't compare!

-Which one is easier to train?

I wouldn't know xD

-Which is more useful throughout the game?

Probably Ludicolo. It learns Surf, and Waterfall, and it's a better Pokemon competitively.

-Which do you think will be better in ORAS?

Ludicolo~

-Which is more useful in the competitive environment?

Ludicolo by a mile! Ludicolo is one of the more prevalent sweepers that you will find in rain teams. Its Surf / Hydro Pump, Giga Drain, Ice Beam and Rain Dance / Focus Blast set is very capable of sweeping through teams even higher tiers - as long as you manage to avoid Blissey or Chansey. Shifty rarely gets use outside of the NU metagame, and very little at that!

-Is the presence or absence of one of these Pokemon a deciding factor in which version of ORAS you're going to buy?

Nope

 

[the_may_fan]

Unlike the Swellow/Pelipper matchup, I found it easy to select Ludicolo on the basis of its utility in competitive battling, design, and ease of training. Water/Grass is a superb typing, with I believe only 3 weaknesses to Flying, Poison, and Bug. Its ability to resist Ground, Steel, and Water type moves is also handy, since all three types are relatively common attacking moves. Being a huge fan of weather teams and the effects weather can have on a battle, it's clear Ludicolo benefits the most because of its ability Swift Swim / Rain Dish. The former, I have found, is far more common and useful - doubling speed almost always makes Ludicolo go from going last to first in many in-games battles in my experience, only being outsped by Pokemon boosted by agility.

Shiftry, while it has a good design, has weaknesses to Fire, Fairy, Fighting, Flying, Poison, Ice, and a x4 weakness to Bug. It's frail with regards to Defense and Special Defense, and doesn't get the opportunity as often to exploit its ability, Chlorophyll, since rain is ubiquitous compared to sun. It also suffers from a narrow movepool and never was very helpful on my in-game team - Sceptile was my grass type of choice and for Dark moves there existed many alternatives.

 

[Rainami]

-Which has the better design? ludicolo, by a landslide. It's a hilarious duck-palmtree-thing. Shiftry...well, shiftry exists, and that's about the best thing I can say about it. It looks semi cool, I guess, but it's really not anyfin gr8 at all. It's unique, I give it that.
-Which one is easier to train? probs ludicolo
-Which is more useful throughout the game? ludicolo I guess
-Which do you think will be better in ORAS? I guess ludicolo is better
-Which is more useful in the competitive environment? ludicolo has some use as the (2nd) coolest pokemon with swift swim, which shiftry is semi mediocre overall.
-Is the presence or absence of one of these Pokemon a deciding factor in which version of ORAS you're going to buy? lol I only buy games for sableye, though ludicolo being exclusive to the same version makes alpha sapphire even more superior than it already was

obviously I voted for ludicolo, but I do have a small soft spot for shiftry due to me using it in my first XD playthrough.

cacturne >>> shiftry

 

[Sakuraa]

Which has the better design?
I prefer Ludicolo's happy smile over Shiftry's creepiness.

Which one is easier to train?/Which is more useful throughout the game?/Which do you think will be better in ORAS?
Not sure, never trained either. I'd only guess Ludicolo because it has less weaknesses.

Is the presence or absence of one of these Pokemon a deciding factor in which version of ORAS you're going to buy?
Nope. I didn't use either in either game.

Ludicolo is my favorite of the two.