• Bubapedia Error 503 Backend fetch failed

    Our technical staff are continuing to monitor the wiki to try and resolve these ongoing issues that are impacting page and image loading. We apologize for the inconvenience. We'll update as soon as we've got more information on this for you.

  • Check out our new Mysterious Garden forum style if you haven't already - we're sure you'll love it!
  • All members are allowed to express their opinions, no matter how unpopular, so long as they respect others and do not claim their opinion is the only valid opinion. While we understand that there is debate regarding Goh, someone posting an opinion you disagree with does not give you the right to attack them or report the content for trolling/baiting. This notice will serve as a 0-point warning and as such, Anime & Manga staff reserve the right to jump immediately to point warnings. For more information regarding our stance on arguments and debates, see this PSA.
  • If you are finding yourself unable to log in, you should be able to fix the issue by following the following process.
    1. Close all browser tabs with any part of Bulbagarden open.
    2. Delete all Bulbagarden.net cookies (and if possible, any cached site data for Bulbagarden) from your browser.
    3. Close and reopen your browser, open a new tab, and log into the forums on the new tab.
    If you've followed this process and are still having issues, please contact us via the "Contact us" link at the bottom of the forum.

Controversial opinions

Ghost Diplocaulus

Detroit SMAAAASH! Eevee style.
Joined
Sep 22, 2020
Messages
2,485
Reaction score
8,647
Pronouns
she/her

Enzo

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2020
Messages
1,592
Reaction score
6,283
Pronouns
He/Him
At least the haircut that Lana gave it works a bit thematically since, hey, she's a 8-10 (?) years old kid with a pair of scissors. Ofc it's not gonna be amazing and is even gonna look a bit wonky.

In fact, compared to my cousin when she decided to give one to herself when she was 7, Lana might as well be a Paris Fashion Week level professional hairdresser lol.
 

Unireon

僕の心は 君のもの
Joined
Aug 4, 2020
Messages
1,356
Reaction score
1,895
Journeys make it true.

Bring back Citron, Shouta and every one of those Cotd from OS to XY.
Let them found the Satoshi Fanclub.

Joke aside; the Cotd that admires or grows close to Satoshi traces back to Johto, at least.
It comes with being the 'Hero', common trope.
 
Last edited:

Rainbow-Rain

LEADER OF THE INTELEON DEFENSE SQUAD
Joined
Jun 19, 2020
Messages
2,336
Reaction score
5,174
Okay a really really REAL Controversial Opinion right here!


Sobble and Raboot's Friendship was by far more Organic than the Forced Friendship Lucario and Cinderace have and I'll never not be mad at how their genuinely sweet brotherly relationship got tossed to the dumpster for Shallow Shillmon pandering
 

Ghost Diplocaulus

Detroit SMAAAASH! Eevee style.
Joined
Sep 22, 2020
Messages
2,485
Reaction score
8,647
Pronouns
she/her
Okay a really really REAL Controversial Opinion right here!


Sobble and Raboot's Friendship was by far more Organic than the Forced Friendship Lucario and Cinderace have and I'll never not be mad at how their genuinely sweet brotherly relationship got tossed to the dumpster for Shallow Shillmon pandering
But when's the last time that Lucario and Cinderace were even in the same frame together? Literally the only times they were a true duo was in that one episode with the fake Pikachu and in the most recent episode with Morpeko where they both had their doubts about it. That's it. I understand your frustration over a Pokemon you like not getting any screentime (heck, at this point it's honestly easier to list the Pokemon that haven't had screentime issues in Journeys), but it's not like Ash's Lucario has anything to do with that, since its bond with Cinderace isn't actually being constantly shoved down our throats like you seem to imply.
 

Unireon

僕の心は 君のもの
Joined
Aug 4, 2020
Messages
1,356
Reaction score
1,895
The only thing between Lucario and Aceburn that was really forced, was them evolving at the same time.

They shouldn't have done that.
At least they realized their mistake after attempting to experiment with creating a dynamic and decided to shaft the idea.
 

Rainbow-Rain

LEADER OF THE INTELEON DEFENSE SQUAD
Joined
Jun 19, 2020
Messages
2,336
Reaction score
5,174
But when's the last time that Lucario and Cinderace were even in the same frame together? Literally the only times they were a true duo was in that one episode with the fake Pikachu and in the most recent episode with Morpeko where they both had their doubts about it. That's it. I understand your frustration over a Pokemon you like not getting any screentime (heck, at this point it's honestly easier to list the Pokemon that haven't had screentime issues in Journeys), but it's not like Ash's Lucario has anything to do with that, since its bond with Cinderace isn't actually being constantly shoved down our throats like you seem to imply.
You also forgot the Mewtwo episode

But anyways I never said this was Lucario's fault.

But the two are often shown marketed as Duo, not helping is the Fanbase making it it out to be some kind of Pokémon version of Ash and Gou's relationship.

Speaking of which, it only feels like the reason why the idea of them being a Duo is a thing in the first place is because they're Ash and Gou's Aces and both are Shillmon. That's pretty much it.

I just personally find it artificial imo.

But that's just my opinion anyways
 

Ghost Diplocaulus

Detroit SMAAAASH! Eevee style.
Joined
Sep 22, 2020
Messages
2,485
Reaction score
8,647
Pronouns
she/her
Speaking of which, it only feels like the reason why the idea of them being a Duo is a thing in the first place is because they're Ash and Gou's Aces and both are Shillmon. That's pretty much it.
To be fair, that's not the only similarity they have: both Lucario and Cinderace are anthropomorphic mammalian animals whose designs partially draw from an aspect of human culture (Lucario from Egyptian Boxing, Cinderace from Soccer), and they both have signature moves that involve round objects of elemental energy being thrown at the opponent (Aura Sphere and Pyro Ball). There's also the factor of them having some interesting contrasts with each other that in theory makes them good foils: Lucario is stoic and serious while Cinderace is friendly and outgoing, Lucario's main colors are blue and black while Cinderace's are orange and white, Lucario's signature move involves the use of hands (or, well, forepaws) while Cinderace's involves the use of feet, Lucario's animal basis is a carnivore while Cinderace's is an herbivore.

Then again, I'm a person who tends to see weird patterns where none really exist (or were intended by the creators), so yeah :p
 

Sweet Veil

Bright Days
Joined
Jun 26, 2010
Messages
4,613
Reaction score
112
Gacha Vending is perfectly fine and a nice serviceable way to add a bit of variety and interest to reductive Rocket appearances (which PM has fallen back into it seems.) I can at least get some interest because these Pokémon are portrayed as a threat or interesting in some fashion thematically.

  • Drawing two Dark-type "evil" Pokémon to intimidate Messon with Inteleon, the James Bond hero, showing up and saving the day.
  • Two big-eared, cute lagomorph rodent and rabbit to tag battle against Gou and Satoshi's rabbit and rodent.
  • They managed to not to get wiped out by Thunders and made themselves useful thanks to Ground-type picks.
  • Supersonic from Jibacoil had the boys paralyzed but Messon's own type of high pitched crying subdued TRio back.
  • Whaloh's usage of Splash.....was eccentric a nice way to cause trouble leading to an evolutionary climax save.
Rewatching DP so many episodes are literally, "Poison Tail! Needle Arm/Bullet Seed!" then a quick Thunderbolt response to the face and blast-off. If you're going to fall back into a pattern of using TRio as an episode-by-episode plot device. You can at least add variety to the appearances.
 

Enzo

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2020
Messages
1,592
Reaction score
6,283
Pronouns
He/Him
The thing about Lucario and Cinderace is because to me, they tried soooo impossibly hard to make this two seem like "equals" and they failed at that. They evolved together, battled Eternatus together, and there was even that hint of ''jokester x grumpy'' dynamic that they tried to do in that one Unova episode, they even but them both in the intro... all for nothing cuz the idea has been pretty much scrapped at this point :X3:

Also, didn't they mentioned how they didn't really knew what to do with the Galar starters in JN? Maybe pairing Cinderace, who I think TPCi intended to be the ''shillmon starter'' of the generation (until they were proven wrong by Inteleon) with Lucario, an extremely popular Pokémon that everybody and their mom wanted Ash to have for over 10 years was their plan for it?
 
Last edited:

R1ke

D U C K
Joined
Sep 6, 2020
Messages
727
Reaction score
2,651
I don’t see the problem with Ash vs Valerie. Hawlucha just used the momentum from gyro to power his X-scissor and break trick room. They even explained that it was a bug vs psychic move. It’s pretty logical if you ask me. This type of stuff happens in the anime all the time. I find it weird how in the same series Ash’s pokemon have cancelled sleep+poison powder, climbed draco meteor and dodged future sight then hit the opponent with it, but this is where people draw the line.
 

KenzeyEevee

Be kind and change the world!
Joined
Jan 8, 2016
Messages
2,640
Reaction score
2,421
JN has what I call, fillers with a twist. They act like fillers, but at the end a character catches/releases or a pokemon evolves. Examples JN066, JN047, JN070. JN066: until Flabébé evolves and stays behind, JN047: until Skovet evolves, JN070:until James catches Morpeko. There are alot of those in JN. Dont get me wrong, I like focus episodes, but in JN they feel like fillers until the end where something unexpected happens
 

RetroPokeFan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2016
Messages
2,389
Reaction score
4,868
Koharu/Chloe is honestly my favourite of the main Journeys characters. Goh is alright character wise but his goal is dull as dishwater and Ash has become so much of a boring ass non-entity this series that I forget he's even there half of the time.

Sure, she has her own share of problems like hardly ever showing up because the staff are still in that Shin Yoshida esque phase of not caring much about female leads at all but she's very likeable and I'm more intrigued by her now more than the main two.
 
Last edited:

KyseL

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 25, 2013
Messages
615
Reaction score
1,292
JN has what I call, fillers with a twist. They act like fillers, but at the end a character catches/releases or a pokemon evolves. Examples JN066, JN047, JN070. JN066: until Flabébé evolves and stays behind, JN047: until Skovet evolves, JN070:until James catches Morpeko. There are alot of those in JN. Dont get me wrong, I like focus episodes, but in JN they feel like fillers until the end where something unexpected happens
I honestly feel DP was worse in that department.
 
Top Bottom