Controversial opinions

[Rainbow-Rain]

A lot of people talk about how hard it would be to bring Serena back,

But has anyone here actually thought about what the writers are going to do with Misty when she inevitably returns?

I feel like it's probably too late for me to see Misty high up in the PWC and They already had her battling with Ash in SuMo so I doubt they'd do it again.
Maybe they could give Dracovish development through her? But personally I'd much rather that be reserved for Nessa instead

I can't think of any reason for her to bond with Goh other than maybe she might find an interest in Inteleon since it's a Water Type she's never met before?

Lastly there's Chloe, who I can see getting along with Misty well, but what could Misty possibly add to Chloe goal that Dawn already hasn't? And I doubt Chloe would be interested in being a Water Type Expert.
And I doubt she'd really inspire Eevee either since Eevee has already met a Vaporeon


Only thing I could see is maybe Misty's former Togetic somehow returning???

We haven't gotten an episode focusing on the Togepi line yet so maybe

Or maybe they just go the Dialga/Palkia route where there's a Legendary causing trouble in Cerulean City Misty adds nothing to the episode besides being a Nostalgia bonus

 

[UltraDoyle64924]

A lot of people talk about how hard it would be to bring Serena back,

But has anyone here actually thought about what the writers are going to do with Misty when she inevitably returns?

I feel like it's probably too late for me to see Misty high up in the PWC and They already had her battling with Ash in SuMo so I doubt they'd do it again.
Maybe they could give Dracovish development through her? But personally I'd much rather that be reserved for Nessa instead

I can't think of any reason for her to bond with Goh other than maybe she might find an interest in Inteleon since it's a Water Type she's never met before?

Lastly there's Chloe, who I can see getting along with Misty well, but what could Misty possibly add to Chloe goal that Dawn already hasn't? And I doubt Chloe would be interested in being a Water Type Expert.
And I doubt she'd really inspire Eevee either since Eevee has already met a Vaporeon


Only thing I could see is maybe Misty's former Togetic somehow returning???

We haven't gotten an episode focusing on the Togepi line yet so maybe

Or maybe they just go the Dialga/Palkia route where there's a Legendary causing trouble in Cerulean City Misty adds nothing to the episode besides being a Nostalgia bonus

You mean like that "legendary" fish pokemon? But jokes aside there's absolutely no reason to bring back misty unless you use her let's go design.

 

[CharizardFan7]

Facepalm People who don't know what forums are and use Twitter Reddit etc are the bad apples in the Pokemon fandom. Ash x Serena is adorable. That's exactly why I came here to have real and honest conversations.

They're VERY toxic and I got flamed for pointing out people like to sexualize Cynthia. Mad huh?

Uggh, I'm sorry to hear that. Don't listen to those people, they don't know what the hell they're talking about and there are certainly people who like to sexualize Cynthia who use Twitter and Reddit. Don't worry, the people here have conversations that aren't utter nonsense. That aside, I also find Ash x Serena to be adorable, I think it's one of my favorite ships in all media.

 

[Rainbow-Rain]

You mean like that "legendary" fish pokemon? But jokes aside there's absolutely no reason to bring back misty unless you use her let's go design

Misty is one of the few (if not the only) former companion who I feel is 100% finished in terms of development/arc

Unlike most other ex-companions, I can't see anywhere they could take her character any further than where it already is.

 

[UltraDoyle64924]

Misty is one of the few (if not the only) former companion who I feel is 100% finished in terms of development/arc

Unlike most other ex-companions, I can't see anywhere they could take her character any further than where it already is.

Everyone said that about Ash when XYZ wrapped up and here we are. The anime is as timeless as a few other cartoons/anime and the writers can be creative enough they can tell us they don't care about patterns because apparently they don't. Soon Dawn will have returned four times in journeys ( which I find to be too much...)

 

[Rainbow-Rain]

Everyone said that about Ash when XYZ wrapped up and here we are. The anime is as timeless as a few other cartoons/anime and the writers can be creative enough they can tell us they don't care about patterns because apparently they don't. Soon Dawn will have returned four times in journeys ( which I find to be too much...)

Difference is, Ash's Goal of being a Pokemon Master is already kinda vague

Misty never really had any concrete goals other than being an awesome Water Type Specialist (which she already is)

 

[cricketlaxwolvesbandy]

Honestly I feel like most Amourshippers (especially on reddit) only ship the ship because they self-insert as Ash and have the hots for Serena and use the ship as an excuse.

 

[UltraDoyle64924]

Honestly I feel like most Amourshippers (especially on reddit) only ship the ship because they self-insert as Ash and have the hots for Serena and use the ship as an excuse.

Um buddy your culprit is Twitter/amino. I've never seen people simp for Serena on the amour sub reddit but then again it's been over 5 months.

With that said I don't let self inserts bother me personally because we all insert ourselves into Pokemon every now and then. But yes people can get carried away with it.

 

[CharizardFan7]

Honestly I feel like most Amourshippers (especially on reddit) only ship the ship because they self-insert as Ash and have the hots for Serena and use the ship as an excuse.

See now, I could never do that. Even accounting for self-inserting, she's Ash's girl, and that's that.

 

[CharizardFan7]

Um buddy your culprit is Twitter/amino. I've never seen people simp for Serena on the amour sub reddit but then again it's been over 5 months.

With that said I don't let self inserts bother me personally because we all insert ourselves into Pokemon every now and then. But yes people can get carried away with it.

Oh, BTW Coastal Wonderer, cricketlaxwolvesbandy is a girl. (Just as an FYI.)

 

[UltraDoyle64924]

Oh, BTW Coastal Wonderer, cricketlaxwolvesbandy is a girl. (Just as an FYI.)

I didn't use any pronouns (?) but that's nice to know!

 

[CharizardFan7]

I didn't use any pronouns (?) but that's nice to know

Oh sorry, it's just when people use the word "buddy", I assume they're talking to a guy.

 

[CharizardFan7]

Misty is one of the few (if not the only) former companion who I feel is 100% finished in terms of development/arc

Unlike most other ex-companions, I can't see anywhere they could take her character any further than where it already is.

Yeah, Misty's story is pretty much over. They could bring her back, but it would pretty much just be for nostalgia's sake. (I still wish I could hear Rachel Lillis voice her one last time, really miss that woman.)

 

[PkmnTrainerV]

In terms of battles his team is not handled much differently than usual. In SM Poipole did nothing till it was released and came back, Melmetal was only there at the tail end of the series. In XY Goodra only lasted 10 eps on the cast and just got ties in the league. Noviern never got a Gym battle and just ties in the league. In BW half his extra captures did very little. In AG Torkoal and Glalie were only around a short time before being dumped. Johto got rid of Heracross early and it and Phanpy never got Gym battles. Etc.

Honestly I feel this is a distortion of facts, I'd have gladly used a less extreme term but this seems like cherry-picking to make Journey's issues seem mild and "as usual" in comparison. Literally all Pokémon you mention were the outliers in their series which are almost universally agreed to have received an unusually bad treatment compared to their teammates. In fact, they’re pretty famous for that when compared to their teammates that get a lot of focus. I repeat it’s not meant to be an attack at you personally, but this list imo is really cherry-picked to try to "equate" other sagas to JN while ignoring all the other well-handled Pokémon in the respective sagas.

The fact that you have to compare the entire JN Team to the very few outliers in each saga that are almost universally agreed to be the worst handled Pokémon in their respective sagas in terms of focus speaks a lot. Each of them had at least a minimum of 3 Pokémon who received a good, well rounded story, if not overblown focus. In JN literally no Pokémon had that. You could make an argument for Lucario being shoved down people's throats but it’s nothing compared to other regional aces or birds even.

No offence but I heavily disagree that the JN handling of the team in terms of battles is "as usual" for the show. The fact that you have to pick heavily specific group of Pokémon who're quite literally famous for being shafted to illustrate your point doesn’t help. For each Pokémon you point out, the respective series had at least 3 Pokémon that got ample focus on battles if not more.

I could just as easily raise comparisons with the Kanto starters, Pikachu in all sagas, Infernape, Staraptor, Swellow etc. etc. etc. to easily disprove your point.

 

[UglyToast]

Um, wow. I sincerely apologize. Please realize I was only joking. I kinda was just throwing a crazy idea out there. I don't seriously intend for the fans to replace the writers. Perhaps I have become a little jaded reading all the negativity surrounding this series, and all the negativity in the world in general, and I've become a little fed up with it all. It's just that, I'm so....disappointed with this series, and with Pokemon in general.

Now, I've been watching the Pokemon anime for over 18 years, and been playing the games for 16, and only very recently have I started to feel disappointed with them. I know they're capable of more. And sure, people can use the pandemic as reasoning, or corporate greed, or any number of reasons. Perhaps it's just that Pokemon has become too successful for its own good. All I know is, it used to better than it is now. That's why Sword and Shield got so much flack, and why Journeys gets so much grief, because they both feel so.....half-assed. I know they are capable of far more than what we got out of Gen 8, both with the games and anime.

But don't get the wrong idea. I don't blame the writers of Journeys entirely for the mess it's become. Nor do I blame the developers of Sw/Sh or Gamefreak for that mess of a game, either. It's not any one person's fault, obviously. Actually, I partially blame the fans themselves (no offense to any of you) for expecting new games before they're ready, as was evident with Sw/Sh, and denouncing new Pokemon designs too much, and being too obsessed with the old ones (looking at you, people who bashed Gen 5 when it first came out, only to say 10 years later, "Gen 5's the best generation ever! Wow!") You would not believe how many people I've run into in my life who told me, "Gen 5 designs are trash. Pokémon's hit a new low. Garbodor, Vanilluxe, they all suck." People spat on Gen 5 so much when it first came out, and whined and complained so much, just because they were different. And of course, because they couldn't use their beloved Gen 1 pokemon during the main story, god forbid. (Sorry all you Genwunners out there, I mean you no offense, I respect you, but I'll never understand the Gen 1 love, I started in Gen 3 myself.) And because of all that Gen 1 praising and Black and White bashing, I think that's when things started to change for the worst. The games started getting easier, there was less focus on new Pokemon, and more focus on Kanto than ever before. Notice how the Kanto starters got Megas, but the Kalos starters, who debuted in the same region as Mega Evolution, did not, and how every single Alolan Form was of a Kanto Pokemon. And let's not forget the ridiculous amount of focus Kanto got during Gen 7. It was insane.

Now look, I like Kanto. I really do. I get it, it's the first region, it's where many people first ventured into the world of Pokemon. And it's not a bad region by any means. Hell, my favorite Pokemon, Charizard, is from the Kanto region. So I get why so many people love it so much and defend it to the death. That said, it's not so special that it invalidates every other region by default, either. For example, remember how I said my favorite Pokemon comes from Kanto? Well, my least favorite(s) come from Kanto, too. Namely, Jynx, Mr.Mime, and Hypno. And when people bashed Gen 5 for its, "lazy designs", they seemed to forget that their precious Gen 1 had such Pokemon as: a rock with arms, a Poke Ball with eyes, a magnet, and a pile of sentient sludge. So while Kanto is special yes, they're plenty of other Pokemon out there in the other Generations who are just as good, if not better, than the 'mons of Kanto.

All in all, I think it's a combination of fan demand/requests, success, corporate greed, and a bunch of other stuff that is causing the problems right now with the Pokemon franchise. It's just kinda sad to see it come to this. I think all of us fans, new and old, deserve better than what we're getting. And to all those out there who say that Pokemon is mainly aimed at kids (especially the anime,) that may very well be true. But, it can be for all ages, and, just because it's aimed at kids firstly isn't an excuse for lazy writing in the anime's case, or dumbed-down difficulty in the case of the games. Kids can appreciate intelligent writing in a show or anime, and difficulty in a video game, too. Just look at me. I started with the original series of Pokemon, and when I was 8 years old, I got my very first Pokemon game, which was one of the hardest Pokemon games there is, Pokemon Colosseum. (In fact, perhaps this is a bad example, as I kinda sucked at video games when I was younger, and Pokemon Colosseum stumped me not even halfway in, and as a matter of fact, I never beat the main story, either.) And after Colosseum, I got Pokemon Emerald, also regarded as one of the hardest Pokemon games out there. And let me tell you, Pokemon Emerald and Colosseum whupped me good. I lost all the time. But I gradually got better, after each defeat, I'd improve. And this was when was only 10 years old, mind you. My point being, I think kids are coddled just a bit too much today with Pokemon games, and perhaps everything. But they, and us older fans who've been with the series a long time, deserve better. OK, rant's over. And I'm sorry if I caused any discontent with my statement of the fans replacing the writers, again, I was only kidding.

I want to take this response and nail onto my wall

 

[Soniman]

Amourshipping isn't even close pedophilia and let me explain
Most people who like to throw hands against amour shipping are mostly manga fans ( from my experience) and that quite has quite a bit of shipping
And the episode where Serena dresses as ash? The same thing happened with Duplica and even Team rocket dressed as Ash before it's just a silly anime trope!

Honestly pretty much most shipping is harmless fun and there's nothing weird about it as long as its not hurting anyone. Live and let live as far as I'm concerned

 

[UglyToast]

I don't know If this is an controversial opinion (or an actual opinion at this point) but I want to let it out on this forum.
My controversial opinion is : Spin-Off anime series is not what mainline anime is "supposed" to be, Everyone keep praising on them like Holy Bible or something from God meanwhile bashing on the Main Anime for a lot of reasons, like Ash staying in the anime or having too much "fillers"

And at this point I'm tired of seeing comments on Youtube videos starts with "Why Mainline Anime cannot be like this?" or "This is better than Mainline Anime series, Ash ruins the Pokemon Anime" Etc. they make it sound If any of those animes turned into Mainline Anime, it would be much better but I disagree, in fact I think it would be worse than what we are having right now.

Imagine If new anime suffered from "fillers" not changing Protagonist, narrative perspective and list goes on... But everyone thinks either making one of the side series as mainline wouldn't suffer from this or retiring Ash is gonna instally solve every single problem Anime has right now and at this point it started to irritate me.

 

[Blob]

I don't know If this is an controversial opinion (or an actual opinion at this point) but I want to let it out on this forum.
My controversial opinion is : Spin-Off anime series is not what mainline anime is "supposed" to be, Everyone keep praising on them like Holy Bible or something from God meanwhile bashing on the Main Anime for a lot of reasons, like Ash staying in the anime or having too much "fillers"

And at this point I'm tired of seeing comments on Youtube videos starts with "Why Mainline Anime cannot be like this?" or "This is better than Mainline Anime series, Ash ruins the Pokemon Anime" Etc. they make it sound If any of those animes turned into Mainline Anime, it would be much better but I disagree, in fact I think it would be worse than what we are having right now.

Imagine If new anime suffered from "fillers" not changing Protagonist, narrative perspective and list goes on... But everyone thinks either making one of the side series as mainline wouldn't suffer from this or retiring Ash is not gonna instally solve every single problem Anime has right now and at this point it started to irritate me.

It's why I don't like the side series at all. They can end up contradicting things, like giving Looker a Pokémon other than Croagunk or just rush through most important battles like in Origins. The issue isn't just Ash, it's also the writers and what they're doing. The side series are fine as snippets, but that's it.

 

[HiroHunter]

I don't know If this is an controversial opinion (or an actual opinion at this point) but I want to let it out on this forum.
My controversial opinion is : Spin-Off anime series is not what mainline anime is "supposed" to be, Everyone keep praising on them like Holy Bible or something from God meanwhile bashing on the Main Anime for a lot of reasons, like Ash staying in the anime or having too much "fillers"

And at this point I'm tired of seeing comments on Youtube videos starts with "Why Mainline Anime cannot be like this?" or "This is better than Mainline Anime series, Ash ruins the Pokemon Anime" Etc. they make it sound If any of those animes turned into Mainline Anime, it would be much better but I disagree, in fact I think it would be worse than what we are having right now.

Imagine If new anime suffered from "fillers" not changing Protagonist, narrative perspective and list goes on... But everyone thinks either making one of the side series as mainline wouldn't suffer from this or retiring Ash is not gonna instally solve every single problem Anime has right now and at this point it started to irritate me.

I don't watch any of the Spin off anime because after Origins I could care less. But I don't get how people can think that making any of them the main anime would fix the anime's problems, hell theirs a better chance that they would be worse.

 

[SlyGecko]

The only thing I can think of the spin offs do better than the main anime is the art style. Though that's mainly because I'm not a fan of Sun & moon and Journeys's art styles.