• A new LGBTQ+ forum is now being trialed and there have been changes made to the Support and Advice forum. To read more about these updates, click here.
  • Hey Trainers! Be sure to check out Corsola Beach, our newest section on the forums, in partnership with our friends at Corsola Cove! At the Beach, you can discuss the competitive side of the games, post your favorite Pokemon memes, and connect with other Pokemon creators!
  • Due to the recent changes with Twitter's API, it is no longer possible for Bulbagarden forum users to login via their Twitter account. If you signed up to Bulbagarden via Twitter and do not have another way to login, please contact us here with your Twitter username so that we can get you sorted.

Controversial opinions

If they do, please make her a battler. We haven't truly had one since dawn and iris (sorta) imo.
It would go a long way if they actually implemented the in-game Rivals properly this time. Nemona looks like she could be either a fun Rival or travelling companion to Ash.
 
I just don't see them hanging out together if it wasn't for goh. The fact that ash never talked to her about just keeping evee the way it is, instead of Lana says alot.
I thought that it made sense for Lana to have that talk with Chloe instead. The entire appeal behind Eevee is to decide which way to evolve it, but Lana is one of the few characters who didn't choose to evolve their Eevee instead. Plus, Ash was still supportive of Chloe learning about Eevee's different evolutions in order to find out which path it wanted from the start.

The fact that he missed her contest .Which is something I don't see him doing to dawn or Serena. And she is never interested in any of his battles. I dont even think they had a personal conversation together. It might be better accurate to say they aren't close friends.
To be fair, I remember Ash missing a couple of May's Contests back in AG because he was focused on training his Pokemon. Chloe has never been interested in battles in general. She hasn't shown much interest or support for Ash's goal, but I feel like that's more to due with Chloe's lack of screentime and how they never wanted her to consider becoming a battler rather than an indication of how poorly her friendship with Ash is.

This is the same reason why many think Serena and clemont weren't particularly close. In SM , they made sure ash had individual time with every cast member. That's 5 characters right there. For some reason they only did that with Chloe once. In the Amazon special. And if you don't have Amazon, good luck knowing that
I thought that Serena and Clemont were pretty good friends. They didn't have a lot of one-on-one interactions, but they still supported each other and the group chemistry was still pretty solid. Ash got more one on one time with the SM cast. but I thought that some of those individual connections were a bit weak. The SM cast felt like a group of friends, but at the same time, I wouldn't say that Ash had the strongest connection with characters like Mallow or Sophocles on an individual level if that makes any sense.
 
I thought that it made sense for Lana to have that talk with Chloe instead. The entire appeal behind Eevee is to decide which way to evolve it, but Lana is one of the few characters who didn't choose to evolve their Eevee instead. Plus, Ash was still supportive of Chloe learning about Eevee's different evolutions in order to find out which path it wanted from the start.


To be fair, I remember Ash missing a couple of May's Contests back in AG because he was focused on training his Pokemon. Chloe has never been interested in battles in general. She hasn't shown much interest or support for Ash's goal, but I feel like that's more to due with Chloe's lack of screentime and how they never wanted her to consider becoming a battler rather than an indication of how poorly her friendship with Ash is.


I thought that Serena and Clemont were pretty good friends. They didn't have a lot of one-on-one interactions, but they still supported each other and the group chemistry was still pretty solid. Ash got more one on one time with the SM cast. but I thought that some of those individual connections were a bit weak. The SM cast felt like a group of friends, but at the same time, I wouldn't say that Ash had the strongest connection with characters like Mallow or Sophocles on an individual level if that makes any sense.
Yeah but that was a major flaw with ash. He was impatient and that's why may and him would argue. He was still maturing at that point. By XY he is pass being impatient like that. He held of a gym battle for Serena showcases didn't he? So for ash to just miss her contest says alot about their relationship.

It's just the fact it would be more meaningful if Ash said it. Chloe has never met lana. It would of been fine if they established some relationship in the first Alola return but she wasn't there. The fact that ash was sitting right there the whole time in JN and he or Chloe never talked about not evolving evee once is a baffling writing decision. She doesn't need to become a battler for her to have the covo. She didn't become a coordinator to talk to Serena or dawn. Ash is no excuse

I feel the group dynamic wasn't bad. But it's weird they barely had those two interact without ash. They were fine friends, but I don't see them hanging out without ash. Im not saying he was super close to all the SM cast. But it's the fact that they took time to have him have a one on one with every one of them. But yet can't spare any screentime for ash and Chloe?
 
Yeah but that was a major flaw with ash. He was impatient and that's why may and him would argue. He was still maturing at that point. By XY he is pass being impatient like that. He held of a gym battle for Serena showcases didn't he? So for ash to just miss her contest says alot about their relationship.
It feels less like Ash was still maturing and more so that Ash's characterization usually changes between series. He was already over that out of character impatient behavior by the time DP started. I don't really see Ash missing her Contest as that major of an issue, or at least that it reflects that poorly on their relationship.

It's just the fact it would be more meaningful if Ash said it. Chloe has never met lana. It would of been fine if they established some relationship in the first Alola return but she wasn't there. The fact that ash was sitting right there the whole time in JN and he or Chloe never talked about not evolving evee once is a baffling writing decision. She doesn't need to become a battler for her to have the covo. She didn't become a coordinator to talk to Serena or dawn. Ash is no excuse
Yeah, there would be more meaning behind Ash talking to Chloe about how she doesn't have to evolve her Eevee since he has Pikachu, but I don't think it's that bad that they waited until she met Lana either. Lana actually has an Eevee that most likely won't evolve at this point, so that might stand out more to Chloe after meeting all of Eevee's possible evolutions. Since he has supported Chloe throughout her storyline, or at least since she got Eevee, I just don't think not having that conversation with Ash is really that bad. Like I mentioned before, it feels like the real problem is the lack of screentime for Chloe, as well as having most of her focused being exclusively on Eevee evolutions, more so than anything else.

I feel the group dynamic wasn't bad. But it's weird they barely had those two interact without ash. They were fine friends, but I don't see them hanging out without ash. Im not saying he was super close to all the SM cast. But it's the fact that they took time to have him have a one on one with every one of them. But yet can't spare any screentime for ash and Chloe?
It is a shame that they didn't give Ash and Chloe more one on one interactions. Not having her be a proper main character or even joining Ash and Goh on their adventures more often after she became a trainer is such a baffling decision. That would have given her more time to bond with Ash, Goh and explore different parts of the world to understand more about Pokemon and find her path with Eevee.
 
Yeah but that was a major flaw with ash. He was impatient and that's why may and him would argue. He was still maturing at that point. By XY he is pass being impatient like that. He held of a gym battle for Serena showcases didn't he? So for ash to just miss her contest says alot about their relationship.

It's just the fact it would be more meaningful if Ash said it. Chloe has never met lana. It would of been fine if they established some relationship in the first Alola return but she wasn't there. The fact that ash was sitting right there the whole time in JN and he or Chloe never talked about not evolving evee once is a baffling writing decision. She doesn't need to become a battler for her to have the covo. She didn't become a coordinator to talk to Serena or dawn. Ash is no excuse

I feel the group dynamic wasn't bad. But it's weird they barely had those two interact without ash. They were fine friends, but I don't see them hanging out without ash. Im not saying he was super close to all the SM cast. But it's the fact that they took time to have him have a one on one with every one of them. But yet can't spare any screentime for ash and Chloe?
Dont forget Chloe is a childehood friend of Goh.. and they are not having enough friendship-screentime. They could be brother and sister, or even not knowing each other at all, and it would work for 95% of the season..
Something was written wrong here.
 
It feels less like Ash was still maturing and more so that Ash's characterization usually changes between series. He was already over that out of character impatient behavior by the time DP started. I don't really see Ash missing her Contest as that major of an issue, or at least that it reflects that poorly on their relationship.


Yeah, there would be more meaning behind Ash talking to Chloe about how she doesn't have to evolve her Eevee since he has Pikachu, but I don't think it's that bad that they waited until she met Lana either. Lana actually has an Eevee that most likely won't evolve at this point, so that might stand out more to Chloe after meeting all of Eevee's possible evolutions. Since he has supported Chloe throughout her storyline, or at least since she got Eevee, I just don't think not having that conversation with Ash is really that bad. Like I mentioned before, it feels like the real problem is the lack of screentime for Chloe, as well as having most of her focused being exclusively on Eevee evolutions, more so than anything else.


It is a shame that they didn't give Ash and Chloe more one on one interactions. Not having her be a proper main character or even joining Ash and Goh on their adventures more often after she became a trainer is such a baffling decision. That would have given her more time to bond with Ash, Goh and explore different parts of the world to understand more about Pokemon and find her path with Eevee.
I guess my issue is the contrast. Ash put a gym battle on hold for Serena. Yet for Chloe he just completely forgot about her first contest. I feel AG was still maturing. He still has that snarky, impatient, attributes carries over from os. But yeah I agree ash character isn't always consistent. The Chloe example is one of them.

My issue with the Lana thing is that it was never indicated that her evee didn't want to evolve. It just didn't happen but I never saw the thing outright rejecting the idea of evolution. With ash, Pikachu actually is making a choice. Heck it would be better if she talked to illima. Who actually made a choice to not evolve evee.

I don't think screentime is even an issue. Korrina has way less screentime than Chloe. Yet she feels much more closer to ash than Chloe is. It feels that they just refuse to develop their relationship. Heck her relationship with Goh is barely developed. And we're supposed to believe they were friends for a long time?
 
The more I see Ash and Chloe's dynamic throughout JN being criticized, the more I feel like Bea could've been the second companion instead. Both narratively and personality-wise, I feel like there'd be way more they'd be able to do with her.
 
The more I see Ash and Chloe's dynamic throughout JN being criticized, the more I feel like Bea could've been the second companion instead. Both narratively and personality-wise, I feel like there'd be way more they'd be able to do with her.
If they actually gave us a Sword and Shield series instead of Journeys, she could have been a good candidate for a companion.
 
Considering her role in the games I would have loved to see Sonia as the traveling companion. She has a connection to Leon, the fact that she travels in-game and already has a goal means she would have been easily implemented, and said journey could have been more fleshed out than it was in said games. Also we might've been able to see what she's like as a battler. Its said that she and Leon were rivals and you can find notes about her in Opal's gym, so she must've made it decently far,

Also, unless they aged her down, it would've been the first time an older woman was part of the main cast instead of an older man, like Brock/Tracey/Cilan.
 
I think the problem is people keep viewing Koharu as a traditional female companion, but she wasn't meant to be one. Ash and Go are the main characters whereas Koharu is more of a recurring character hence her only appearing in 45 out of 120 Journey eps so far.

Yeah they should have made her an important character from the start but since she was never intended to be one it doesn't bother me. It's like saying the side characters in older sagas don't get much focus because they aren't meant to be. So the way they handled her I'm indifferent because I don't really see her as a "main female companion" like all the others
 
I think the problem is people keep viewing Koharu as a traditional female companion, but she wasn't meant to be one. Ash and Go are the main characters whereas Koharu is more of a recurring character hence her only appearing in 45 out of 120 Journey eps so far.

Yeah they should have made her an important character from the start but since she was never intended to be one it doesn't bother me. It's like saying the side characters in older sagas don't get much focus because they aren't meant to be. So the way they handled her I'm indifferent because I don't really see her as a "main female companion" like all the others
Calling her a side character has always felt weird to me because she’s gotten about as many or even surpassed actual companions (i.e Clemont, Cilan, DP Brock) in focus episodes and the marketing features her pretty prominently

I at least feel like they planned it at one point in production because it feels like she’s been in an awkward in-between of a main character and a supporting character
 
My issue with the Lana thing is that it was never indicated that her evee didn't want to evolve. It just didn't happen but I never saw the thing outright rejecting the idea of evolution. With ash, Pikachu actually is making a choice. Heck it would be better if she talked to illima. Who actually made a choice to not evolve evee.
Considering that Lana got Sandy for Let's Go Pikachu/Eevee promotion, I kind of assumed that it wouldn't evolve. Granted, it would have been a lot better for the show to actually confirm that beforehand, but Sandy didn't really get much focus after being caught oddly enough. Pikachu actually making the choice to not evolve would make it a more fitting comparison to Eevee, but I don't see it as that big of a deal either. It's another example of keeping Chloe's focus primarily on Eevee evolutions more so than an example of how poor her relationship with Ash is.

I don't think screentime is even an issue. Korrina has way less screentime than Chloe. Yet she feels much more closer to ash than Chloe is. It feels that they just refuse to develop their relationship. Heck her relationship with Goh is barely developed. And we're supposed to believe they were friends for a long time?
To be fair, Korrina does have more history with Ash than Chloe does, so that would make a difference. I still think that the screentime is a big issue since that does limit what they can do with her character and her relationships with the rest of the cast, but refusing to develop her friendships with Ash and Goh are part of that problem too.
 
I frankly don't think they ever really wanted to do anything with her, period. They clearly never wanted her to be anything more than the occasional side character in Ash's and Goh's story. I feel like they started to include her more because the higher ups wanted more female representation in the series.

And I believe I've talked about this before, but Chloe's goal is atualy pretty convenient for the writers to get away with not including her as much: she's only in the ep if said ep offers something that catches her eye, which means they can not include her for long periods of time and handwave it as "She just happened to not care for whatever happened in these 10 eps, so she didn't showed up".
 
It's kind of a shame really. Chloe bringing up the idea of the kids having schoolwork to Gou at the beginning of Journeys could have been something interesting to explore with her character, the idea of having to balance chasing your dreams versus the expectations of society. You could have still had her in a supporting role, but actually justify it by her commitment to her education which prevents her from hanging out with the lads as much as she might want to.

It brings to mind an episode from Digimon 02, where the kids are trapped in an underwater facility and the only one who can save them is Joe, who is currently taking his exam to fulfil his family's insistence of him becoming a doctor. When he realises that Cody had hesitated in telling him the dire situation, he reassures the lad by saying something like, what kind of a doctor would I be if I chose an exam over my friends' lives.

I will clarify my position in that Chloe is one of the best things to come out of the anime out of recent memory, but still they could have done even better with her. :unsure:
 
It's kind of a shame really. Chloe bringing up the idea of the kids having schoolwork to Gou at the beginning of Journeys could have been something interesting to explore with her character, the idea of having to balance chasing your dreams versus the expectations of society. You could have still had her in a supporting role, but actually justify it by her commitment to her education which prevents her from hanging out with the lads as much as she might want to.

It brings to mind an episode from Digimon 02, where the kids are trapped in an underwater facility and the only one who can save them is Joe, who is currently taking his exam to fulfil his family's insistence of him becoming a doctor. When he realises that Cody had hesitated in telling him the dire situation, he reassures the lad by saying something like, what kind of a doctor would I be if I chose an exam over my friends' lives.

I will clarify my position in that Chloe is one of the best things to come out of the anime out of recent memory, but still they could have done even better with her. :unsure:
It would be interesting if they actually explore how school works in the anime
 
You know, I've said I don't like how they've been sticking way too closely to the games when it comes to villain plots and such, but Journeys has made it worse in general when it comes to sticking more closely to the games cause even battles now are being done way too closely to the games.
 
You know, I've said I don't like how they've been sticking way too closely to the games when it comes to villain plots and such, but Journeys has made it worse in general when it comes to sticking more closely to the games cause even battles now are being done way too closely to the games.
How so?
 
Back
Top Bottom