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Controversial opinions

I seriously hope Ash vs. Champion Cynthia isn't just gonna be Ash's team getting pummeled the ENTIRE battle, while having all of their moves being countered, doing no countering themselves, and getting a lucky one shot. I wanna see him struggle, but I want to see him have moments where he can outsmart Champion Cynthia and get the upper hand for short moments at a time. Not just getting lucky one shots. That's been one of my biggest issues with a number of battles for Journeys.
The battle against Volkner was exactly like that. And all the battles against Bea. And Drasna. And Iris.

Yeah, you get my point. Man, I really hate how Ash is written in JN, istg. He's wayyy too focused on brute force and relying too much in lucky hits.
 
I seriously hope Ash vs. Champion Cynthia isn't just gonna be Ash's team getting pummeled the ENTIRE battle, while having all of their moves being countered, doing no countering themselves, and getting a lucky one shot. I wanna see him struggle, but I want to see him have moments where he can outsmart Champion Cynthia and get the upper hand for short moments at a time. Not just getting lucky one shots. That's been one of my biggest issues with a number of battles for Journeys.
Ditto. This is why I will hate Ash vs Cynthia and all of Ash’s JN battles.
Also that it’s going to be Mega Ash Lucario’s time to shine makes me sick.
 
The battle against Volkner was exactly like that. And all the battles against Bea. And Drasna. And Iris.

Yeah, you get my point. Man, I really hate how Ash is written in JN, istg. He's wayyy too focused on brute force and relying too much in lucky hits.
Ash has basically become the avatar of RNJesus. More than he was before, anyway.
 
I dunno, Yugi Moto kept pulling exactly the card he needed to turn things around.
Muto*.

Yugioh also in-universe runs on "If you believe in your deck and treat it with care and love, it will always reward you when you need it." (Also Yugi is a genuine gigabrain. He caught Aigami in a permanent loop in DSoD.) The cards and cardgame in that show are nothing more than just the tools to fight instead of a cardgame first. It's not comparable to a guy who takes 8 super-effective hits without dying and then wins in one-shot with a resisted move.
 
That's exactly how the Pokémon anime treats it, though--if you love and respect your Pokémon they'll pull off miracles for you when the chips are down.
No, it doesn't. Cause this is also what Ash's opponent's do with way more experience and training under their belt. Ash just gets wins against these trainers no matter how much it makes no sense or shouldn't be possible just cause it's required to. Not cause there is anything else at play.

Comparing Yu-Gi-Oh! to a badly written anime like Pokémon is genuinely putting dirt on it. (Let alone comparing Yugi, of all people, to Ash. The disrespect.)
 
No, it doesn't. Cause this is also what Ash's opponent's do with way more experience and training under their belt. Ash just gets wins against these trainers no matter how much it makes no sense or shouldn't be possible just cause it's required to. Not cause there is anything else at play.
The show made it clear from the beginning that Ash is unusual in just how far he goes, throwing himself into serious danger with reckless abandon to help Pokémon in a way we do not see many of these more experienced trainers do. Throwing himself in front of Spearow to protect his newly partner who hates him, jumping onto balloons to fight with adults, sneaking onto a murderous criminal's airship.

(Let alone comparing Yugi, of all people, to Ash. The disrespect.)
Don't blame me, he came to mind because when his show was new the two were compared a lot online (Yugi was hated by fans of the TCG for the exact same reason Ash get bashed. I never played the card game so not sure how valid that was).
 
Not sure if this is controversial, but most of Journey's battles are better than every previous series besides DP and XY (the very best ones from those).

Many battles from OS-AG haven't aged too well besides the best ones, BW's were always a mixed bag, and SM doesn't have too many major battles (we only had 4 Kahuna fights), till the league. A lot of the complaints I see people bring up about some battles now (pokemon going down in a few hit, or a pokemon losing bad), is the same exact thing that happened in every previous series. I just wonder if people simply forget. The very oldest seasons of course also have the problem of the writers largely ignoring type match up from the games, which is why electricity hit ground pokemon, ghosts would get hit by normal attacks, etc. This even continued through AG.

I do think DP and XY have the best overall battles of the series though. So JN is probably in third for that.
 
Not sure if this is controversial, but most of Journey's battles are better than every previous series besides DP and XY (the very best ones from those).

Many battles from OS-AG haven't aged too well besides the best ones, BW's were always a mixed bag, and SM doesn't have too many major battles (we only had 4 Kahuna fights), till the league. A lot of the complaints I see people bring up about some battles now (pokemon going down in a few hit, or a pokemon losing bad), is the same exact thing that happened in every previous series. I just wonder if people simply forget. The very oldest seasons of course also have the problem of the writers largely ignoring type match up from the games, which is why electricity hit ground pokemon, ghosts would get hit by normal attacks, etc. This even continued through AG.

I do think DP and XY have the best overall battles of the series though. So JN is probably in third for that.
I think it's less that people forget that battles in other series have those problems and more like it seems to be more common with the battles in Journeys. The fact that Ash's Journeys team isn't that well developed and arguably has more plot armor as opposed to believable strength probably doesn't help matters either. With his Pokemon really only getting attention on the battlefield unless they're being captured, evolving or getting an upgrade, there's also less emotional attachment to his team for the audience compared to most of his other ones that have more consistent focus and development over the course of a series.

I've only seen the Netflix release of the dub, so I can't comment on any of the more recent battles, but I don't think that there are a lot of standout battles in Journeys. That isn't to say that there aren't any good battles. Ash vs. Korrina was the first PWC match that I actually enjoyed, all of the Bea battles were pretty solid, Ash vs. Volkner is easily the best battle in the series thus far and despite my issues with the one-on-one battles against one shot characters, there were a couple that where actually pretty good like Ash vs. Rinto. Even so, for a world wide tournament, I don't think that the battles are a huge highlight of the series. A large part of that has to do with the pacing of the series. Ash vs. Iris is not a bad battle by any means, but I do think it was a bit too fast pace and if it was three-on-three instead, I think it would have been a better battle.
 
I really hope that come the Scarlet & Violet saga, whatever school Ash ends up enrolling in has someone work with him on his articulation skills. I'm getting real tired of him speaking in onomatopoeias to describe intangible things, when he rarely did that before.
Thaaaank you. Glad someone finally addressed that, it's made Ash sound like such an idiot in recent years. (And it sounds even more idiotic when it's dubbed into English. :cautious:) And like you said, he only rarely talked like that before.
 
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No, it doesn't. Cause this is also what Ash's opponent's do with way more experience and training under their belt.
Didn’t DP portray this problem realistically? While Ash relied too much on the power of friendship with his battling, Paul spent days training his Pokémon. The Lake Acuity battle strictly worked out in Paul’s favor due to this.
 
Didn’t DP portray this problem realistically? While Ash relied too much on the power of friendship with his battling, Paul spent days training his Pokémon. The Lake Acuity battle strictly worked out in Paul’s favor due to this.
It was arguably done as early as Lt. Surge, since Ash's faith in his partner after Pikachu refused to forfeit despite how outmatched he was just led to the mouse waking up in a hospital and they needed to come up with a counter strategy to beat Raichu.
Faith and trust is clearly intended to give an edge but doesn't completely replace everything else. It's more realistic than that, being effectively more like morale where the Pokémon fight harder and tough it out longer because they know you have their back and would risk yourself to help them.
But studying military history shows that morale can win battles where you should clearly have lost on paper.

Edit: The other issue, of course, is that the series isn't always great at portraying how skilled a trainer is supposed to be since it loves turnabout wins and to some extent I don't think the writers had a consistent idea of how good a trainer Ash was meant to be at various points. He could defeat Frontier Brains (including two Legendary Pokémon) then get utterly embarassed by a Gym Leader with an unevolved team.
 
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Just curious if this happened today:

d59526196375cbbedc256d80020b20b869029aa7_00.gif


Turtwig beating Roark's Rampardos who just evolved by throwing it by its tail into a wall, would people complain about it like some battles in JN? Keep in mind this Gym battle was only 16 episodes into DP, so Ash's Turtwig hadn't even been around that long (it was caught in the 5th episode of DP)

It seems people were ok with Ash's unevolved starters being powerhouses even immediately after being captured (again Ash only had Turtwig for about 10 eps at this point and it didn't even have that many battles prior since most eps were about Dawn or Pikachu/Paul), so...?
 
Just curious if this happened today:

d59526196375cbbedc256d80020b20b869029aa7_00.gif


Turtwig beating Roark's Rampardos who just evolved by throwing it by its tail into a wall, would people complain about it like some battles in JN? Keep in mind this Gym battle was only 16 episodes into DP, so Ash's Turtwig hadn't even been around that long (it was caught in the 5th episode of DP)

It seems people were ok with Ash's unevolved starters being powerhouses even immediately after being captured (again Ash only had Turtwig for about 10 eps at this point and it didn't even have that many battles prior since most eps were about Dawn or Pikachu/Paul), so...?
I always saw that as more of an example of the anime ignoring physics instead of a sign of Turtwig being a powerhouse or unbelievably strong. That and they were probably going for a dramatic finish to the battle after they had hyped up Roark's Rampardos. I don't know if people would complain about that now or how much people complained about it back then. It feels a bit too much like cherry picking an example to me, especially when the battle itself was still pretty good all things considered.
 
I always saw that as more of an example of the anime ignoring physics instead of a sign of Turtwig being a powerhouse or unbelievably strong. That and they were probably going for a dramatic finish to the battle after they had hyped up Roark's Rampardos. I don't know if people would complain about that now or how much people complained about it back then. It feels a bit too much like cherry picking an example to me, especially when the battle itself was still pretty good all things considered.
I have no problem with the battle myself, but I get the feeling if say this battle happened nowadays, people would post a whole bunch of rants that a tiny Turtwig shouldn't be able to throw a much heavier dinosaur pokemon by its mouth like that, or even be powerful enough to take it out when it was evolved. I'm trying to remember what battles Turtwig had in early DP prior to the Gym battle and I think it only battled 1-2 times unless I'm forgetting something. There was only 10 episodes between its capture in the 5th episode and the Roark Gym rematch too.
 
I have no problem with the battle myself, but I get the feeling if say this battle happened nowadays, people would post a whole bunch of rants that a tiny Turtwig shouldn't be able to throw a much heavier dinosaur pokemon by its mouth like that, or even be powerful enough to take it out when it was evolved. I'm trying to remember what battles Turtwig had in early DP prior to the Gym battle and I think it only battled 1-2 times unless I'm forgetting something. There was only 10 episodes between its capture in the 5th episode and the Roark Gym rematch too.
I'm pretty sure that people pointed out that Turtwig shouldn't have been able to throw around a heavier Pokemon like that the more I think about it. Because the battle was good, I don't think it would have necessarily been a deal breaker for a lot of people. Ash spent time on and off screen training his Pokemon and learning the spin dodge from Dawn was the first example of how their battle styles would inspire each other's strategy throughout the series. That's kind of why I see it as physics being thrown out the window instead of Turtwig being unbelievably strong.

I have my doubts that people would be upset over Turtwig defeating a fully evolved Pokemon though. That was really not that common in the anime by the time DP rolled around. That doesn't mean that it's always believable or handled well, but generally speaking, Ash's unevolved Pokemon defeating fully evolved Pokemon is pretty typical in the anime. In this case, I don't think it would have caused a problem. Rampardos had already battled before facing Turtwig, so it wasn't entirely due to Turtwig's strength that they won. Rampardos was shown to be a powerful Pokemon, but it also was not unbeatable. Ash already defeated it as a Cranidos and we saw Paul defeat it in his match as well. It had evolved by the time this rematch happened, but the point is that it was not some unbeatable powerhouse before Turtwig threw it around.

I understand that it can be annoying to see complaints on the battles in Journeys. I can't comment on all of them or if all of the arguments against them are valid. I still think that this is a case of cherry picking one moment of a battle that kind of ignores why it works, or why at least Turtwig throwing Rampardos around isn't necessarily a problem, and kind of ignores why some of the battles in Journeys don't work for some people.
 
I have my doubts that people would be upset over Turtwig defeating a fully evolved Pokemon though. That was really not that common in the anime by the time DP rolled around. That doesn't mean that it's always believable or handled well, but generally speaking, Ash's unevolved Pokemon defeating fully evolved Pokemon is pretty typical in the anime. In this case, I don't think it would have caused a problem. Rampardos had already battled before facing Turtwig, so it wasn't entirely due to Turtwig's strength that they won. Rampardos was shown to be a powerful Pokemon, but it also was not unbeatable. Ash already defeated it as a Cranidos and we saw Paul defeat it in his match as well. It had evolved by the time this rematch happened, but the point is that it was not some unbeatable powerhouse before Turtwig threw it around.
In addition to all of the above, Turtwig also has the type advantage over Rampardos, and generally it's much easier for an audience to buy an unevolved Pokemon beating a fully evolved one if the latter's type is weak against the former's, as it sort of evens out the pre-evolution disadvantage.
 
Just curious if this happened today:

d59526196375cbbedc256d80020b20b869029aa7_00.gif


Turtwig beating Roark's Rampardos who just evolved by throwing it by its tail into a wall, would people complain about it like some battles in JN? Keep in mind this Gym battle was only 16 episodes into DP, so Ash's Turtwig hadn't even been around that long (it was caught in the 5th episode of DP)

It seems people were ok with Ash's unevolved starters being powerhouses even immediately after being captured (again Ash only had Turtwig for about 10 eps at this point and it didn't even have that many battles prior since most eps were about Dawn or Pikachu/Paul), so...?
That’s because Ashs Torterra is a powerhouse. Just look at the fight it gave Bertha’s Hippowdon.
I will stan the big tortoise till the day I die.
 
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