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Distribution of Generation III Pokémon set for March, April, May in Japan: ...

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Silktree

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Joshawott said:
If GameFreak wanted to move to a new console mid-generation, they would have made Black 2 and White 2 for the Nintendo 3DS.
Exactly. If anything, it would be more appropriate to associate the 3DS with sequels than with remakes. Since not even that is happening, anything but a new generation for the first 3DS entry would seem extremely tacked on.

It is high time that people accepted that this generation was designed for the DS.
 

Keldeo94

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Keldeo94 said:
Also I don't see why on Earth a train company would contact a gaming franchise, and ask them to give out Pokemon to celebrate the trains anniversary. Equally I don't see Pokemon developing a sudden fascination with train companies in regions based on Hoenn.
There's a simple reason for that: Pokémon is HUGE. A Pokémon distribution on the trains themselves (iirc, isn't the Pikachu actually on the train, not the platform?), means people will have to buy tickets to use the trains to get the promotion, which means that the initial intake for the new train line will be a lot larger.

I can't see Gen 6 coming out next year, I'll eat my woolly hat if it does.
Mind if I hold you to that? =D.

If it is pushed back to 2013, then why can't it be Gen 5 but on the 3DS. After all, I believe the first Pokemon games on DS weren't Diamond and Pearl. For example, I got Pokemon Ranger on DS before DP, but Pokemon Ranger was 3rd gen apart from the Manaphy egg at the very end. RS remakes could have something in them in the style of the Manaphy egg, or even a more recent example the Lock Capsule, although it was never utilised it was planned.
If GameFreak wanted to move to a new console mid-generation, they would have made Black 2 and White 2 for the Nintendo 3DS. The difference with Ranger also, is that Ranger is a spin off game, not a main series game.

If GameFreak wanted to move to a new console mid-generation, they would have made Black 2 and White 2 for the Nintendo 3DS.
No they wouldn't as that would be cutting through the middle of a story. There would be outrage if one half of the story was on one console and the other half was on a different one. No one would really care if remakes of a past game however were on a new console, that would be a good way to open the Gen as I said with HGSS and Poke Ranger, both had something in them leading on to the next Gen.

Also Joshawott, sure you can hold me to that if you want. But I'd also like to request something of you. If I am proved wrong, can I change the goal posts as you do so often?

First of all it's "oh they'll want to start the new console with a brand new gen." Then when its pointed out that they started the DS with games from the 3rd gen, suddenly you decide its only main games and that spin offs don't count. I'm guessing that if RSemakes are on 3DS before Gen 6, when it comes to Gen 7 you'll be saying "They'll want to start the new Console with a new gen, excluding spin off games, oh and excluding remakes of games"

Joshawott said:
If GameFreak wanted to move to a new console mid-generation, they would have made Black 2 and White 2 for the Nintendo 3DS.
Exactly. If anything, it would be more appropriate to associate the 3DS with sequels than with remakes. Since not even that is happening, anything but a new generation for the first 3DS entry would seem extremely tacked on.

So was Pokemon Ranger "tacked on". Where this whole idea comes from that New Gen = New console etc, is beyond belief when Gen 5 was on the same console as Gen 4. They wouldn't want to put half the story of Unova on one Console and the other half of the story on another, that's stupid and would likely cause a bit of outrage. Whether remakes are on DS, 3DS or whatever doesn't really matter.

I personally think, RSemakes could come out on DS this year, for their 10th anniversary. Or maybe in 2013 on DS, but also I don't discount the possibility of RS starting the 3DS off just as Pokemon Ranger started of the DS.
 

Silktree

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Keldeo94 said:
So was Pokemon Ranger "tacked on". Where this whole idea comes from that New Gen = New console etc, is beyond belief when Gen 5 was on the same console as Gen 4.
Generation V being designed for the DS doesn't go against the argument being made here. A transition to a new handheld system is a big deal in that it requires a sizeable demographic of players to buy not only the new game but also the system. How many people would do that for remakes? The answer is simple: Not as many as the number of people would do it for a new generation. So what reason is there to release remakes for a system that not everyone has yet? It would get some people to buy the 3DS, but it would also make other people ignore the remakes. With a new generation this problem would not exist. But more importantly, in late 2013 the 3DS will be 2.5 years old, so by then a main series game that utilizes its features well will be overdue. It is unlikely that Game Freak would go out of their way to add brand new features to remakes that would be replaced by a new generation a year later. I also doubt that Game Freak would want the remakes to make BW and B2W2 look bad by comparison.

The spin-off games are not relevant, as Game Freak have nothing to do with them. They obviously don't have to choose between them and a new generation.

They wouldn't want to put half the story of Unova on one Console and the other half of the story on another, that's stupid and would likely cause a bit of outrage.
Many people were convinced that a third version would be released for the 3DS, and to be honest, you remind me of them. If something like that created an outrage, it would be due to the fact that the game would seem like a port that might as well be released for the DS. I don't see how remakes would be any different in that regard. Also, by your own logic, it doesn't matter whether or not remakes are released in this generation, either. To release them for the 3DS would mean making them seem disconnected from the current games (even with compatibility), which is something that has never happened before and for a good reason.

RSemakes could come out on DS this year, for their 10th anniversary.
You criticize us for thinking that this generation may be shorter than the former two, and yet you have no problem coming up with this kind of prediction? A five-year gap between game releases is highly unrealistic for too many reasons to list. In contrast, Generation II lasted three years, and everything about the pace of the current generation implies that it will follow that example.
 
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Keldeo94

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Keldeo94 said:
So was Pokemon Ranger "tacked on". Where this whole idea comes from that New Gen = New console etc, is beyond belief when Gen 5 was on the same console as Gen 4.
Generation V being designed for the DS doesn't go against the argument being made here. A transition to a new handheld system is a big deal in that it requires a sizeable demographic of players to buy not only the new game but also the system. How many people would do that for remakes? The answer is simple: Not as many as the number of people would do it for a new generation. So what reason is there to release remakes for a system that not everyone has yet? It would get some people to buy the 3DS, but it would also make other people ignore the remakes. With a new generation this problem would not exist. But more importantly, in late 2013 the 3DS will be 2.5 years old, so by then a main series game that utilizes its features well will be overdue. It is unlikely that Game Freak would go out of their way to add brand new features to remakes that would be replaced by a new generation a year later. I also doubt that Game Freak would want the remakes to make BW and B2W2 look bad by comparison.

The spin-off games are not relevant, as Game Freak have nothing to do with them. They obviously don't have to choose between them and a new generation.

They wouldn't want to put half the story of Unova on one Console and the other half of the story on another, that's stupid and would likely cause a bit of outrage.
Many people were convinced that a third version would be released for the 3DS, and to be honest, you remind me of them. If something like that created an outrage, it would be due to the fact that the game would seem like a port that might as well be released for the DS. I don't see how remakes would be any different in that regard. Also, by your own logic, it doesn't matter whether or not remakes are released in this generation, either. To release them for the 3DS would mean making them seem disconnected from the current games (even with compatibility), which is something that has never happened before and for a good reason.

RSemakes could come out on DS this year, for their 10th anniversary.
You criticize us for thinking that this generation may be shorter than the former two, and yet you have no problem coming up with this kind of prediction? A five-year gap between game releases is highly unrealistic for too many reasons to list. In contrast, Generation II lasted three years, and everything about the pace of the current generation implies that it will follow that example.

A question =/= a prediction.

Many people were convinced that a third version would be released for the 3DS, and to be honest, you remind me of them

Well then clearly your not paying attention to what I'm saying, I think the whole of Gen 5 including RSmakes will be on the DS. I've been saying that for quite some time.

One thing that really confused me was this:
You criticize us for thinking that this generation may be shorter than the former two, and yet you have no problem coming up with this kind of prediction? A five-year gap between game releases is highly unrealistic for too many reasons to list.
Have you made a typing error cos I haven't got a clue what on Earth you are reffering too.

I asked, if it is possible to fit RSmakes, into this year. As in they would release them on in November 2012. In what way does that suggest I am predicting "A five-year gap between game releases"???
 

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I asked, if it is possible to fit RSmakes, into this year. As in they would release them on in November 2012. In what way does that suggest I am predicting "A five-year gap between game releases"???
Yes, I made a typo. But it shouldn't be hard to figure out that I meant to write "five-month gap".

Since you apparently just asked a question, then my answer is that the shortest release gap was 8 months with Blue and Emerald (which followed Red/Green and FireRed/LeafGreen). However, those were just third versions; B2W2 obviously required more effort than those games did, and as a matter of fact, so would remakes. Other than those examples, the usual gap is either one year or two years.
 

Joshawott

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No they wouldn't as that would be cutting through the middle of a story. There would be outrage if one half of the story was on one console and the other half was on a different one. No one would really care if remakes of a past game however were on a new console, that would be a good way to open the Gen as I said with HGSS and Poke Ranger, both had something in them leading on to the next Gen.
There wouldn't be outrage. HeartGold and SoulSilver was not an opening of a Generation; it was at the end of one and Ranger was not the beginning of a generation either, as it was a spin off game. Also, what did HGSS have that "led on to the next generation"?

Also Joshawott, sure you can hold me to that if you want. But I'd also like to request something of you. If I am proved wrong, can I change the goal posts as you do so often?
"Change the goal posts"?

First of all it's "oh they'll want to start the new console with a brand new gen." Then when its pointed out that they started the DS with games from the 3rd gen, suddenly you decide its only main games and that spin offs don't count. I'm guessing that if RSemakes are on 3DS before Gen 6, when it comes to Gen 7 you'll be saying "They'll want to start the new Console with a new gen, excluding spin off games, oh and excluding remakes of games"
It's not only from that point that I decided spin offs don't count and I didn't decide that anyway - look at Bulbagarden's template for generations. Besides, if we go with spin-offs - Super Pokémon Rumble is already on the Nintendo 3DS, so why isn't Black 2 and White 2? You're making way too many wrong assumptions about me and my thoughts.

Joshawott said:
If GameFreak wanted to move to a new console mid-generation, they would have made Black 2 and White 2 for the Nintendo 3DS.
Exactly. If anything, it would be more appropriate to associate the 3DS with sequels than with remakes. Since not even that is happening, anything but a new generation for the first 3DS entry would seem extremely tacked on.

So was Pokemon Ranger "tacked on". Where this whole idea comes from that New Gen = New console etc, is beyond belief when Gen 5 was on the same console as Gen 4. They wouldn't want to put half the story of Unova on one Console and the other half of the story on another, that's stupid and would likely cause a bit of outrage. Whether remakes are on DS, 3DS or whatever doesn't really matter.[/quote]
Pokémon Gold and Silver were sequels to RGBY in regards to Team Rocket and they were on a different console. Was there an outrage then? No.
 

Keldeo94

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I asked, if it is possible to fit RSmakes, into this year. As in they would release them on in November 2012. In what way does that suggest I am predicting "A five-year gap between game releases"???
Yes, I made a typo. But it shouldn't be hard to figure out that I meant to write "five-month gap".

Since you apparently just asked a question, then my answer is that the shortest release gap was 8 months with Blue and Emerald (which followed Red/Green and FireRed/LeafGreen). However, those were just third versions; B2W2 obviously required more effort than those games did, and as a matter of fact, so would remakes. Other than those examples, the usual gap is either one year or two years.

Oh I understand your point now. But Nintendo does seem to be getting faster at these things. Localization used to take years, now they can release localized games at the same time. Also, I'm sure the 1 year release gaps were there for sales, and to not throw everything in at once, hold some back, but if as you say the Generation is coming to an end in 2012, early 2013, then why wouldn't they rush it.

Also, developing a new game may take some time, but there's not really much to be worked out with remakes. They don't really have to think of much new stuff. Just update the graphics etc, they could probably use a lot of the same programming.

Also we already know they said they started working on Gen 5 quite a long time ago, BW2 could be almost complete already, they could already be working on RSemakes if planned for a november release. Also I fail to see no other reason why they decided to move BW2 up 3 months earlier in the calendar from their usual spot of releasing games in September unless they had something else they wanted to fit in at the end of the year.

Also they always do something to celebrate the 10 year anniversary of games. I'm sure they'd want to commemorate 10 years of RSE in November, and releasing a few Gen 3 pokes 8 months prior to the anniversary to promote a train, isn't gonna cut it I'm afraid.
 

Joshawott

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They would not be able to use a lot of the same programming - The Gameboy Advance and Nintendo 3DS are entirely different systems. They may reuse whatever engines they can (such as RNGs/IVs/EVs) etc, but the hard work of constructing each house in every city and each patch of grass in each route will have to be done all over again.

Also, they don't always do something to celebrate the 10th anniversary of a game - where was Red and Green's fanfare? The only thing that happened was a general 10th Anniversary for the franchise - not Red/Green itself. The distribution on the train has nothing to do with Ruby and Sapphire outside of Hoenn being based on Kyushu.

The reason Black 2 and White 2 are being released in June as opposed to September is blindingly obvious - so that they can also be released internationally in 2012 as well. To put it simply: An ordinary DS game would not sell in 2013. They can get away with a DS game in 2012, but not 2013. This is supported by the confirmed Autumn 2012 release period for both America and Europe. Yes, localisation time is getting shorter, but for Pokémon, it's still fairly long - and if we look at the calender, an Autumn 2012 release date does not change the length of the period we've seen in Gen IV and V so far.
 

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Pokémon Gold and Silver were sequels to RGBY in regards to Team Rocket and they were on a different console. Was there an outrage then? No.

That's not the same at all. If Gold and Silver were never released, say they jumped straight to Hoenn, no one would have noticed. RBY actually were quite complete. That's not true for Black and White, they are very incomplete and there's huge chunks not yet answered. Leaving it unfinished like that and then saying kids could find out the answers to their questions if they pay out $x would reflect badly on Nintendo, to the wider fanbase, not just the super fanbase on here, who seem to be fine whenever Nintendo does something that should aggravate them.

As for the other stuff Joshawott, I'm not really making assumptions about your character, I just feel personally that, when we seem to be discussing stuff, you will make a point, which if I then counter, it seems like you then add stuff on to change your original point. Maybe that's not your intention, maybe your just elaborating on your point, as you didn't explain it fully. An example would be the spin off thing. At first you just said games, then it became games not including spin offs. Maybe you did mean that to begin with and just forgot to explain that, or maybe it was something else, I don't know, but I don't really want to have a falling out over it.
 

Joshawott

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Pokémon Gold and Silver were sequels to RGBY in regards to Team Rocket and they were on a different console. Was there an outrage then? No.

That's not the same at all. If Gold and Silver were never released, say they jumped straight to Hoenn, no one would have noticed. RBY actually were quite complete. That's not true for Black and White, they are very incomplete and there's huge chunks not yet answered. Leaving it unfinished like that and then saying kids could find out the answers to their questions if they pay out $x would reflect badly on Nintendo, to the wider fanbase, not just the super fanbase on here, who seem to be fine whenever Nintendo does something that should aggravate them.
How aren't Black and White complete? I felt that the story was extremely tight - yes, it was open-ended in regards to N just flying off, but it had a very satisfying conclusion and there were no real plot holes. Yes, there were hints that there was more, like Ghetsis escaping, but endings can be open-ended and sometimes it's better for a story to end that way.

As for the other stuff Joshawott, I'm not really making assumptions about your character, I just feel personally that, when we seem to be discussing stuff, you will make a point, which if I then counter, it seems like you then add stuff on to change your original point. Maybe that's not your intention, maybe your just elaborating on your point, as you didn't explain it fully. An example would be the spin off thing. At first you just said games, then it became games not including spin offs. Maybe you did mean that to begin with and just forgot to explain that, or maybe it was something else, I don't know, but I don't really want to have a falling out over it.
I've never added anything on to my original point. It has always been thus (which you can even check my blog post back in December to clarify):
2010: Pokémon Black and White (DS)
2012: Pokémon Black 2 and White 2 (DS) [Okay, my original blog post said Grey, but B2W2 was quite the curveball in terms of being 2 games - but that's it].
2013: Generation VI Primary Pair (3DS)
2014: Generation VI Third Version (3DS) [Or now, I guess Third Version/Second Primary Pair]
2015: Ruby/Sapphire Remakes (3DS)

In regards to my use of the word "games"; when discussing the main series and the future of the main series, I have only ever meant the "main series" games.
 

Keldeo94

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They would not be able to use a lot of the same programming - The Gameboy Advance and Nintendo 3DS are entirely different systems. They may reuse whatever engines they can (such as RNGs/IVs/EVs) etc, but the hard work of constructing each house in every city and each patch of grass in each route will have to be done all over again.

I meant things like text, teams, battles etc, I included houses and that as graphics which surely wouldn't take that long, people who hack ROMs seem to be able to do it all the time.

Also, they don't always do something to celebrate the 10th anniversary of a game - where was Red and Green's fanfare? The only thing that happened was a general 10th Anniversary for the franchise - not Red/Green itself.
What was Firered and Leafgreen then? EDIT: Not an argument, genuine question, I had assumed FRLG were to celebrate 10 years.

The reason Black 2 and White 2 are being released in June as opposed to September is blindingly obvious - so that they can also be released internationally in 2012 as well.

If they can release Skyward sword in the rest of the world at the same time as Japan why couldn't they just release BW2 in September with Japan and International release. I'm not certain, but I'd assume a Wii game would take longer to do than a DS game.

To put it simply: An ordinary DS game would not sell in 2013. They can get away with a DS game in 2012, but not 2013. This is supported by the confirmed Autumn 2012 release period for both America and Europe. Yes, localisation time is getting shorter, but for Pokémon, it's still fairly long - and if we look at the calender, an Autumn 2012 release date does not change the length of the period we've seen in Gen IV and V so far.

So DS games can be sold October to December, but come January there will be a bonfire of DS's?

I have dinner now so won't be able to post for a while.
 

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Oh I understand your point now. But Nintendo does seem to be getting faster at these things. Localization used to take years, now they can release localized games at the same time. Also, I'm sure the 1 year release gaps were there for sales, and to not throw everything in at once, hold some back, but if as you say the Generation is coming to an end in 2012, early 2013, then why wouldn't they rush it.

Also, developing a new game may take some time, but there's not really much to be worked out with remakes. They don't really have to think of much new stuff. Just update the graphics etc, they could probably use a lot of the same programming.

Also we already know they said they started working on Gen 5 quite a long time ago, BW2 could be almost complete already, they could already be working on RSemakes if planned for a november release. Also I fail to see no other reason why they decided to move BW2 up 3 months earlier in the calendar from their usual spot of releasing games in September unless they had something else they wanted to fit in at the end of the year.
HGSS, despite just being remakes, were a project that Game Freak spent a lot of time on. One reason for that is the fact that the DS' life span gave them a lot of flexibility, but another reason is that they wanted the remakes to stand out. Most of the new features were related to the graphics and music, but you can't say that Game Freak merely copied and pasted Gold and Silver's setting and story onto some pre-programmed template. Although they were working on Platinum and Black and White simultaneously, the fact that the HGSS project lasted three years should be telling. If you happen to understand Japanese, you can read about the staff's experience developing those games; it is clear that they weren't lazy about them at all. I say this as someone who thought they could have done a better job.

If this generation is supposed to end on the DS, which strongly seems to be the case, then Game Freak are most likely concentrating solely on the first 3DS games in order to make them as good as possible. Once again, it would make complete sense for those games to be a new generation.
 

Joshawott

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FireRed and LeafGreen were released in 2004; which was 8 years after Red and Green were released, not 10.

If they can release Skyward sword in the rest of the world at the same time as Japan why couldn't they just release BW2 in September with Japan and International release. I'm not certain, but I'd assume a Wii game would take longer to do than a DS game.
Who knows? I'd imagine that with Skyward Sword, while the story is certainly text heavy, the battles are not, so there is less to localise - especially as battles are a big part of Pokémon and the developers and translators need to make sure that the right messages appear at the right time.

So DS games can be sold October to December, but come January there will be a bonfire of DS's?
(Autumn is September-November, but close enough, doesn't really matter xD).
And yeah, pretty much. The Nintendo 3DS turns 2 years old in February 2013, so from then on it would have left its "infancy stage". As it stands, only 4 notable DS games are due out in Europe in 2012 - the Inazuma Eleven 2 pair and the Black 2/White 2 Pokémon pair. They've already started to phase out the Nintendo DS and it's only a handful of companies (like The Pokémon Company and GameFreak) who are clinging onto it.
 

Isaac Gravity

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Why all the arguing? Who cares what this "means"?! All that matters is Gen III love. Lots of it! Sure it has nothing to do elsewhere but Gen III getting much deserved props always brightens my day!!
 

El_

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Geez... people can't wait just one generation for RS remakes. They aren't coming this gen. This gen will end with BW2 which seems to be a swan song for the DS platform as a whole before finally moving to the 3DS.

They can't keep the DS forever, its quite obvious from the unusually early release that they want to end this quickly, while still supporting the platform like they said but eventually "moving on" which is what the fans themselves should do.

They aren't going to switch over to the 3DS with Hoenn remakes either. A switchover to a new platform begins with a new generation, not remakes. Only after the switchover should we expect remakes, though I'd rather have an HD Wii U console game first but thats just me...

Overall, everytime something happens people jump to Hoenn. I love that region honestly, but its Unova's time not Hoenn's. This distribution is simply to reference the basis of the region. (which the train company I agree is exploiting)

The timing for Generation 6 in 2013 on the 3DS is perfect, so perfect in fact that I will eat my computer if it doesn't happen. Generation 6 is mandatory, something that we all know will eventually come and must come unless Pokemon is discontinued. Remakes on the other hand... are not.
 

Fudgenuggets

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I still think you guys are looking to deep into this. Hoenn is based on Kyushu. That's all there is to it.

*waiting for someone to quote and disagree with me*
 

Mumzy

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Am I the only person that doesn't care about remakes?! It's not like graphics have improved. As long as I have PalPark I'm good.
 

ArginX

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Gen V takes place about 14 years after Gen I/III
I've never really seen how anything in BW shows this. I know it's based on BW being released that long after RBY, but if anything I would base it on either the time difference between it and FRLG or HGSS (if I had to use this method). Caitlin is 14 in PtHGSS - if 14 years have passed, she is now 28 in BW, and this does not appear to be the case. Likewise, if 14 years had passed Cynthia should look at least a little older, but she doesn't. However, the time gap is at least as large as the age of the ex-Team Rocket Grunt's child (who is probably about 5).
We can infer that Gen I is meant to take place during approximately the equivalent of 1996, the year it was released. This is because of the Cycling Road, which was modeled after the real-life cycling road that was nearly completed during 1996 in real-life Kanto. Gen II was originally planned to take place one year after Gen I (when it was scheduled for release in 1997) but, after being pushed back to the 1999 release, was retconned to take place three years after Gen I--again, being the equivalent of 1999 in the real world. Obviously, Gen III and IV, being equivalent to Gen I and II, respectively, retained this timeline. I am going to go with what Game Freak has done since Red/Green and assume that Gen V takes place during the equivalent of the year it was released--2010. Caitlin was in Gen IV, so she would actually be 25, not 28. Okay, I can accept that. Cynthia, I don't know. I have no idea how old (or young) she was in Gen IV. As for the Rocket Grunt, if I am correct, he had 11 years in between Gen II and V, and we shouldn't have to assume that he didn't wait six years before having a child. Lastly, the Giant Hole is modeled after Ground Zero, which would mean that Gen V takes place during the equivalent of the year 2001 at least; judging by the age of the Rocket Grunt's child, it's undoubtedly much later still.

And really, looking back, there's no reason we should've doubted the potential to fly to Houen from Isshu later in Gen V. After all, the only two real regions of Japan that haven't been made into Pokemon regions are the ones that link the real-world counterparts of already existing regions, so by the next generation we're almost certain to be able to travel back to Kanto/Jouto at the very least, as well as either Houen or Jouto. And there's no reason why once all of the regions are linked in-game, we shouldn't be able to fly to Isshu from the main continent (the one based off of Japan). Might as well let us fly back and forth sooner rather than later--in this generation. (hope I've explained all of this coherently)
Since Skyla even pointed out the difficulty associated with flying to Kanto, Johto, Hoenn, and Sinnoh even in a plane due to the distance, I really don't expect us to be flying there. Besides, Hoenn would be extremely tacked on if you could randomly fly there from Unova; there is no reason for it over any other region to be flown to from Unova.
In later Generations, Houen will connect with Jouto/Kanto via a future Pokemon equivalent of the Chugoku region. However, as of now, it's isolated. As you quote me saying, once all of the Japanese-based regions are connected, Isshu will still never be connected to any of them, so it's only natural that they'll instead allow you to travel to and from the region by boat or plane so as to eventually connect all of the regions. Since Masuda has fed into fan frenzy with his announcement in October, and since aside from the already existing reasons this enormous Houen promotion effectively makes Gen V RS remakes unmarketable by distributing the mascots and starters while simultaneously further feeding fan frenzy, I certainly am willing to bet that Houen will be accessible in BW2.
 
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SnorlaxMonster

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you said so much I can't really be bothered to attack each point and we're unlikely to persuade each other so I don't see the point, we'll have to wait for when you've got that cold hard game in your hands before we agree I guess.
I tend to reply to a lot at once infrequently rather than a individual posts frequently, so my replies tend to be long.

But just to point out, the fact they didn't use stuff, doesn't mean it wasn't a hint, it meant they were keeping there options and open, and were considering adding them to Johto. Like the White Rock and new formes etc. They new they were going to remake the games so they started laying down the foundations by saying things about the rock in Kanto and birds in Platinum etc. The fact they then said, nah actually we won't use them, doesn't mean they weren't going to use them.
Because they were never used, insisting now that they were hints at remakes doesn't make any sense. It is much more likely that they are unrelated to HGSS rather than them being planned for it but scrapped (since there is nothing that seems to fit into the "not scrapped" category). The trademark Pokémon WhiteGold seemed like a hint at the time, but now we know that it wasn't. Same goes for the white rock and legendary birds.

Also all the stuff about colours isn't ridiculous. If you start seeing Gold and Silver everywhere, I'd consider that a pretty big hint. Notice how in Black and White, suddenly we don't see Gold and Silver everywhere, (it may be somewhere, but not as prevalent) because their not lining up remakes for Gold and Silver anymore, so they're not putting in all the Gold and Silver stuff.
They don't want to be too obvious, they want to disguise their hints so that some will be able to work it out and it will still be a surprise for some. Some people are quite good at picking up hints, others are not.
Everywhere? The Park Ball is really yellow and white, not gold and silver; the "silver" part (the bottom) is the generic bottom-of-Poké Ball color, and is the same as balls like the Great Ball. Shadows of Almia was not made by Game Freak, so really it is irrelevant. The Poké Ball on the battle screen has its red section highlighted gold when you tap the touch screen as a replacement for the A button; the "silver" part is that way anyway. Even if any of these weren't obviously coincidental, why would anyone try and hint at a future game through such ridiculous means. Honestly, apart from "almost time to reveal" hints, the only "hints" are technical observations, not intentionally placed.

Also I don't see why on Earth a train company would contact a gaming franchise, and ask them to give out Pokemon to celebrate the trains anniversary. Equally I don't see Pokemon developing a sudden fascination with train companies in regions based on Hoenn.
Joshawott's already responded to this, but Pokémon is huge in Japan, and the fact that you even need to be on the train to get Pikachu really helps sell tickets, promote their anniversary, and promote their appearance to the general public as associated with Pokémon. The airline ANA has a strong association with Pokémon too: they have distributed event Pokémon, promotional TCG cards, and even have Pokémon planes (which you can buy toy versions of at the airport).

I suppose the next hint to RS will just be another coincidence, and the next, and the next, and the next, and the next, and the next, and the next etc. How many "coincidences do you need before you start to think ok maybe this isn't a coincidence anymore?"
Until there is actually a reason to suspect RSEmakes based on the "hint". The timing of the event makes it extremely obvious that it is not promoting RSEmakes.

Also while traditions have been ignored recently, I don't see why they'd make Gen 5 shorter than all the other regions, by giving us only 2 installments instead of the usual 3. Also as demonstrated by the 3rd version split/sequel thing, Nintendo are having rough times, Nintendo needs money, repackaging the same shit they did 10 years ago and selling it like its new, is easy money, and with the situation there in, they'd be foolish to pass up what is essentially free money.
As other users have pointed out, remakes do take a large amount of effort to make, as they need to actually reprogram the entire thing in the new engine. They are quicker to make than new primary pairs, but longer than third versions (we don't really know enough about B2W2 to assess it in here yet).

I can't see Gen 6 coming out next year, I'll eat my woolly hat if it does. I think 2013 will be the release of RS, but with them moving BW2 up early in the calendar, is it possible for RS to be released towards the very end of this year? If they were already working on it surely they could release it in November which is the 10 year anniversary.
I personally think, RSemakes could come out on DS this year, for their 10th anniversary. Or maybe in 2013 on DS, but also I don't discount the possibility of RS starting the 3DS off just as Pokemon Ranger started of the DS.
They are not going to release a game in the middle of the year then another at the end of the year. There are so many problems with that.

The timing for Generation 6 in 2013 on the 3DS is perfect, so perfect in fact that I will eat my computer if it doesn't happen.
As much as I agree that this is what will happen, I'm going to hold you to that.

Gen V takes place about 14 years after Gen I/III
I've never really seen how anything in BW shows this. I know it's based on BW being released that long after RBY, but if anything I would base it on either the time difference between it and FRLG or HGSS (if I had to use this method). Caitlin is 14 in PtHGSS - if 14 years have passed, she is now 28 in BW, and this does not appear to be the case. Likewise, if 14 years had passed Cynthia should look at least a little older, but she doesn't. However, the time gap is at least as large as the age of the ex-Team Rocket Grunt's child (who is probably about 5).
We can infer that Gen I is meant to take place during approximately the equivalent of 1996, the year it was released. This is because of the Cycling Road, which was modeled after the real-life cycling road that was nearly completed during 1996 in real-life Kanto. Gen II was originally planned to take place one year after Gen I (when it was scheduled for release in 1997) but, after being pushed back to the 1999 release, was retconned to take place three years after Gen I--again, being the equivalent of 1999 in the real world. Obviously, Gen III and IV, being equivalent to Gen I and II, respectively, retained this timeline. I am going to go with what Game Freak has done since Red/Green and assume that Gen V takes place during the equivalent of the year it was released--2010. Caitlin was in Gen IV, so she would actually be 25, not 28. Okay, I can accept that. Cynthia, I don't know. I have no idea how old (or young) she was in Gen IV. As for the Rocket Grunt, if I am correct, he had 11 years in between Gen II and V, and we shouldn't have to assume that he didn't wait six years before having a child. Lastly, the Giant Hole is modeled after Ground Zero, which would mean that Gen V takes place during the equivalent of the year 2001 at least; judging by the age of the Rocket Grunt's child, it's undoubtedly much later still.
Real world timeline is not the same as in-game timeline.

I'd be happy to place Gen V Caitlin anywhere between 16 and 25 really. Cynthia on the other hand hasn't visibly aged at all between Gen IV and V, meaning that the gap is certainly less than 10 years. As for the Rocket Grunt, I didn't mean to say that he had his son as soon as he got home, but was approximating the minimum time gap.

You said that Game Freak has always set games in the year they are released; since the current year isn't mentioned in any Pokémon game (and mentioning it would mess up time-based things anyway), RBY can be assumed to be a starting point, and we can simply consider the year to be 0 since we need a starting point. GSC is 3. That is all. A tradition that was followed twice and hasn't been seen since the isolated generations really isn't something we can base things on, and I would say BW is more likely to take place 6 years after FRLG (so 3 after HGSS), if we follow this method.

Also, Giant Chasm is not based on Ground Zero; Giant Chasm was created many years ago when a meteor struck, and it is not located anywhere near where Ground Zero is in the real world.

And really, looking back, there's no reason we should've doubted the potential to fly to Houen from Isshu later in Gen V. After all, the only two real regions of Japan that haven't been made into Pokemon regions are the ones that link the real-world counterparts of already existing regions, so by the next generation we're almost certain to be able to travel back to Kanto/Jouto at the very least, as well as either Houen or Jouto. And there's no reason why once all of the regions are linked in-game, we shouldn't be able to fly to Isshu from the main continent (the one based off of Japan). Might as well let us fly back and forth sooner rather than later--in this generation. (hope I've explained all of this coherently)
Since Skyla even pointed out the difficulty associated with flying to Kanto, Johto, Hoenn, and Sinnoh even in a plane due to the distance, I really don't expect us to be flying there. Besides, Hoenn would be extremely tacked on if you could randomly fly there from Unova; there is no reason for it over any other region to be flown to from Unova.
In later Generations, Houen will connect with Jouto/Kanto via a future Pokemon equivalent of the Chugoku region. However, as of now, it's isolated. As you quote me saying, once all of the Japanese-based regions are connected, Isshu will still never be connected to any of them, so it's only natural that they'll instead allow you to travel to and from the region by boat or plane so as to eventually connect all of the regions. Since Masuda has fed into fan frenzy with his announcement in October, and since aside from the already existing reasons this enormous Houen promotion effectively makes Gen V RS remakes unmarketable by distributing the mascots and starters while simultaneously further feeding fan frenzy, I certainly am willing to bet that Houen will be accessible in BW2.
I would think that more US-based regions would be made, which would connect to Unova. Once Japan is completely Pokémonified, I still don't see games where you can go to any of the regions freely, or even being able to visit more than two in one game (outside of perhaps an MMO). The game would just get too long, and they could make more money by selling multiple games rather than selling one with all the regions. In particular, if for no good reason Hoenn were chosen to be possible for the player to fly to in B2W2, how strong a relationship with Unova can Hoenn have when it is so far away? Besides, remaking Hoenn would take a lot of effort for just a random post-game area; if they bothered making Hoenn on DS, they mas as well just release remakes.
 

Mijzelffan

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Why would Hoenn pokémon being released point to RSE remakes? It seems to me that if anything, it would point to the opposite.

The biggest reason for new/young players to buy the remakes is getting pokémon they couldn't get otherwise. Distributing these pokémon over wi-fi first negates that need, meaning there is less reason for these people to buy the games if they were to come out.
 
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