Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

[karczx]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

Best Wishes, other than episode N, is the new Johto.

Since i liked Johto i can't really complain, Both sagas have wasted potential, that's true. But as far as interaction between character and fun aspect of episode goes for most part im more interested than disinterested in them.

Well, the only thing I disliked about Johto was the amount of boring filler episodes that it took to get to the Gyms in the early part of Johto, especially the route to Violet City and the first gym battle there. But then again, I enjoyed it when it first aired (especially given the hype about Johto and the G/S/C games) and didn't care much about it. It just seems to me that BW was such a radical departure from OS/AG/DP, I just can't comprehend it.

 

[Sweet Veil]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

We have an unpleaseable fanbase at this point. Our opinions are all so divided that, either way, the writers are going to be alienating someone. Sad, but true....

I'm almost positive this vocal minority of this area of the fanbase challenges the whole Sonic fandom in sheer numbers of unpleaseableness.


No it's not desperate, as I've said before. The writers have been doing this forever, May and Jasmine returned in DP and the Johto Pokemon for example. BW's lack of old things I'm guessing had more of an impact when they finally returned. People were going wild over seeing things like Shinx and Riolu among Unova Pokemon. I actually think it's some type of marketing strategy which I forget the name of, the anime only did it to emphasize the freshness of the games.

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

No.

I don't get it. If you think that's "nothing new" for the show and not a gimmicky stunt, why are you bringing that up in this thread?

The writers were doing fanservice when they were progressing the show forward. Which was every saga except Johto and Best Wishes.

That's not fanservice at all.

 

[FANG-TAN]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

Bringing back past characters all at once is never a bad thing - better late than never, in this case, it's also the reason why both fans of the anime and the Special manga want the World Tournament to be adapted so badly. It simply makes the studio look iffy doing such things only after their largest rating declines to date and a bunch of bullcrap writing. The anime dropped out of the Top 10 Japanese Animation rankings again after the shoddy league performance, and only got back into its usual spot (where it used to perpetually be in) a couple of episodes after they switched to the Episode N opening.

If they brought Butterfree back and properly acknowledged canon during the Battle Frontier, for instance, no one would be accusing ShoPro/OLM of such things (I don't think) because the ratings hardly took a big enough hit to drop them out of the Top 10 anime rankings in Japan and because previous episodes of AG didn't shy away from acknowledging past events from Kanto simply because it was fresh out of the OS, especially when the arc actually took place in Kanto. I know I wouldn't suspect them of anything "underhanded" if they regularly acknowledged past events as significant things to remember.

The writers have been doing this forever, May and Jasmine returned in DP and the Johto Pokemon for example.

Mikan appeared individually in the corresponding games though, so it's not like they were doing it for the hell of it. And while it's been somewhat of a tradition, the Hikari episodes easily have all the other "female companion return" episodes beat. Her return was as long as Episode N, long enough to be its own arc, and she was given a place in the opening. With Ibuki set to return, she pretty much is coming back for the hell of it and is plastered all over the opening. She sure as hell doesn't represent the World Tournament since we're not getting one. A proper comparison to Mikan's appearance in Diamond and Pearl would be Natsume appearing for one episode in Best Wishes, which isn't happening.

Again, the Jouto Pokemon returning for a league competition is different from Lizardon returning to Satoshi's roster. Lizardon, who is not a "boxed" Pokemon, is now integrated into the BW roster as a main member, rather than being "called upon" from its "in-training" status and leaving after two episodes. He probably isn't going away until the XY anime comes along. And with Butterfree, who is released, fans have been waiting for his return since 1997. You could compare it to the Lapras return episode back in Jouto, but back then we weren't being given an onslaught of fanservice at the same time and it was still during the OS (hint: the same series).

 

[Cybersai]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

Mikan appeared individually in the corresponding games though, so it's not like they were doing it for the hell of it. And while it's been somewhat of a tradition, the Hikari episodes easily have all the other "female companion return" episodes beat. Her return was as long as Episode N, long enough to be its own arc, and she was given a place in the opening.

But her return turned out to be nothing special. Her character was kept in the background and lost so early in a tournament it felt like she had no purpose. Also unlike the others, Dawn didn't grow or change at all since she last appeared, she didn't even get any new pokemon or clothes. It was underwhelming to say the least.

Again, the Jouto Pokemon returning for a league competition is different from Lizardon returning to Satoshi's roster. Lizardon, who is not a "boxed" Pokemon, is now integrated into the BW roster as a main member, rather than being "called upon" from its "in-training" status and leaving after two episodes. He probably isn't going away until the XY anime comes along. And with Butterfree, who is released, fans have been waiting for his return since 1997. You could compare it to the Lapras return episode back in Jouto, but back then we weren't being given an onslaught of fanservice at the same time and it was still during the OS (hint: the same series).

What about Jessiebel?

 

[Misty Calls Masquerain]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

Give me *desperation* over not using or showing old characters at all.

 

[Cybersai]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

I don't see why they're having Butterfree make a cameo now. Lapras appearing in late Johto made sense because it was the saga right after it left.

Butterfree should have had a cameo back in Orange Islands or early Johto or something.

 

[Almonds]

mmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

We don't need old characters making cameos or appearing in flashbacks.

What we really need is something new, fresh, and creative - like Episode N. As for Charizard, yes the nostalgia was immense but he turned out to be nothing more than one of Ash's sidekicks, only that he was strong. He wasn't even important during the Team Plasma crisis.

The writers should also stop the endless loop and try something new. It could be well-received like Episode N. What are they so afraid of?

 

[pokemon fan 132]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

Bringing older characters back is always good in my book since it provides more references and flashbacks to past strengthening continuity of pokemon series, adding new spice to anime in form of unpredictable,exciting twists which freshen up structure of anime and give something new, unexpected to follow by creating suspension and excitement over him/her being taken in new directions building on story.

Not to mention their presence imbues anime with more continuity bringing more coherent story, provides connections to past regions Ash traveled through and gives new viewers insight to better understand anime history.
As well pleases fandom creating boost in TV ratings.

There is nothing wrong in giving characters people grew to like(whether its Misty, May, Brock etc) more development, exploring more about their past and motives, break new grounds with their goals getting update etc. Since there indeed exist various ideas and unexplored directions which could bring new life to them growing forward.

If anything since older characters already have background and developed story to pick up and work upon allows that writers do sequel and give him more complex development ,. Which would be more fresh and exciting than same basic growth new characters always go through when starting out.

So yes i don't care if some find this as "desperate act or gimmick"because referencing and acknowledging past companions which left impact on show utilizing potential they have to offer more and grow further, events and sagas Ash went through keeping ties with history adds credibility and more substance to series story. Rather than just being treated like messed up abomination derived from alternate universe which erase history, ignores past like it never happened and treats main story like joke resulting in shallow development and little to no continuity having syndrome " anime with lost identity".

 

[Silktree]

Re: mmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

The writers should also stop the endless loop and try something new. It could be well-received like Episode N. What are they so afraid of?

Episode N wasn't well received by young viewers if the ratings are anything to go by. The only thing that was new about it was the condensed format.

 

[Nymphia]

Re: mmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

The writers should also stop the endless loop and try something new. It could be well-received like Episode N. What are they so afraid of?

Episode N wasn't well received by young viewers if the ratings are anything to go by. The only thing that was new about it was the condensed format.

If Episode N isn't well received, I can confirm that Decolora Adventure is a inhibitor for viewers. The ratings of the first 4 episodes are (Unknown), 3.1%(Afected by Golden Week), 4.2% and 3.4%.

I think that here we don't see many gimmick stunts right now. But I think that the big gimmick will come with Pokemon XY. In other words, the expression that I think should be used is said in my language as "grab it because curves are coming". In other words, prepare for expressing the problems of the Pokemon franchise in a short time. Smash doing XY information weekly is a sign of problems in the merchandise.

Note:I was going to put desesperation but I don't think that they are fully desesperate yet.

Edit: I think that the channel could be the cause of the bad ratings. Because any other anime like Naruto and Inazuma are getting 2s when they used to get 3s and 4s.

And what I said earlier, I think that the maximum effect that those low ratings could have is the return of a main character back into the show to create a "shock" (which means ratings). And there are hints (the menu) that Contest are returnings. And there are two coordinators in the pack of older characters and one of them (Dawn, honestly) are the first option to consider if a return happens.

Many people think that there will be 2 known main characters in XY. If you think so, you could be worng, be right or right but wrong in who character you expect.

And note: I ave the senseation that the writers are capable to not air the Beeheyem episode to short DA.

 

[Silktree]

Re: mmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

Smash doing XY information weekly is a sign of problems in the merchandise.

That's going too far. Why shouldn't Smash promote the games every week? We don't even know what the content will be.

 

[Nymphia]

Re: mmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

Smash doing XY information weekly is a sign of problems in the merchandise.

That's going too far. Why shouldn't Smash promote the games every week? We don't even know what the content will be.

The word every week is the key here. In BW, Sunday revealed the information every month and a few more times during the release. Between that and every week there's a notable difference. Specially when it's 20 weeks in advance.

 

[Silktree]

Re: mmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

The word every week is the key here. In BW, Sunday revealed the information every month and a few more times during the release. Between that and every week there's a notable difference. Specially when it's 20 weeks in advance.

And who says that Sunday's way of doing things made more sense? Covering the games just once a month is lazy.

 

[JohnnyCool708]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

I have to admit that the unfortunate earthquake disaster and subsequent episode skipping/hiatus in production severely hampered what seemed to be a very good plot in the early stages. Along with a desire to break onto the 3DS, I feel that the Pokemon Company really just wanted to turn their backs on Gen V, it really was unconventional (I use this word because of the product they had been producing pre-EQ and as such feel that these blunders are not all their fault). Various evidence stands out in this odd Generation: with no R/S remake, rushed and underdeveloped plotlines, the "Plasma Embargo", TR's apparent schizophrenia and desire to rehash the series (no foreign Pokemon originally in Isshu, Brock and Wobufett's absence, TR rebranding, lifting of the 6 Pokemon limit) are all big things. I feel that combined with all of the unavoidable setbacks or necessary rushing, the series just became more confusing when the writers realized everything made no sense and they tried pumping all the old back into the anime (and even the games).

 

[Cybersai]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

I just don't understand why they didn't turn the World Tournament into the filler arc instead of this ridiculous Da Islands arc.

They would be advertising the games and giving Ash tournaments to compete in. It was one of the major aspects of the games and the writers did nothing with it. I just can't understand it.

 

[Hidden Mew]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

I just don't understand why they didn't turn the World Tournament into the filler arc instead of this ridiculous Da Islands arc.

They would be advertising the games and giving Ash tournaments to compete in. It was one of the major aspects of the games and the writers did nothing with it. I just can't understand it.

I'm honestly kind of surprised with that too. I don't know if they could have turned that into an arc to last the rest of BW and I really don't want to see another poorly handled tournament arc like nearly all the ones in this series either, but I was kind of expecting something like that to happen anyway. The Pokemon World Tournament was one of the big selling points for B2/W2 and they just used it for the Junior Cup, which was really just another Club Battle tournament with a better prize in disguise anyway. It would have been kind of interesting to see Ash battle against a bunch of Gym Leaders from different regions in one tournament, but maybe they weren't sure how to incorporate the tournament into the series. It would have been a gimmicky stunt too, but it would kind of make sense at least given how much they hyped up the PWT during the pre-release for B2/W2.

 

[SammyW27]

Re: Do all these gimmicky stunts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to yo

I just don't understand why they didn't turn the World Tournament into the filler arc instead of this ridiculous Da Islands arc.

They would be advertising the games and giving Ash tournaments to compete in. It was one of the major aspects of the games and the writers did nothing with it. I just can't understand it.

Oh FM, surely you've realized by now that the producers AREN'T playing with a full deck (nor have they ever).

They care absolutely nothing about story and everything about providing silly entertainment for small children.

They're (far) more interesting in advertising the games instead of adapting them. The sad part is that they'd actually advertise them better if they adapted them better :-(

And just so I don't get in trouble with the admins, that's not bashing. That's the cold, harsh truth learned from years of seeing them screw up time & time again :dead:

 

[Almonds]

nts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

I just don't understand why they didn't turn the World Tournament into the filler arc instead of this ridiculous Da Islands arc.

They would be advertising the games and giving Ash tournaments to compete in. It was one of the major aspects of the games and the writers did nothing with it. I just can't understand it.

I'm honestly kind of surprised with that too. I don't know if they could have turned that into an arc to last the rest of BW and I really don't want to see another poorly handled tournament arc like nearly all the ones in this series either, but I was kind of expecting something like that to happen anyway. The Pokemon World Tournament was one of the big selling points for B2/W2 and they just used it for the Junior Cup, which was really just another Club Battle tournament with a better prize in disguise anyway. It would have been kind of interesting to see Ash battle against a bunch of Gym Leaders from different regions in one tournament, but maybe they weren't sure how to incorporate the tournament into the series. It would have been a gimmicky stunt too, but it would kind of make sense at least given how much they hyped up the PWT during the pre-release for B2/W2.

If the PWT was in the anime, personally, it could've been a good hype. A few popular gym leaders and previous rivals could've been selected as participants. This would've been the perfect chance to bring back Misty as a gym leader participant representing Kanto, maybe along with Brock who was a gym leader himself before. Johto would have Clair and whoever. Hoenn would bring Norman and a possible return of May and Max. Sinnoh would bring Maylene, Reggie, and Paul. The Unova region would have Drayden and Cilan. Instead of the champions (which would be too much trouble connecting), the Unova Elite4 could be there. Gary, Barry and Palmer could reappear as past rival participants and who knows, everyone's favorite Lance could come back. A whole, massive wave of cameos and nostslgia overload.

 

[SammyW27]

Re: nts that Best Wishes! keeps pulling seem desperate to you?

A whole, massive wave of cameos and nostslgia overload.

Uber Ironically enough, that's what they're going for now anyway! :dumb: