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Do you think the writers are doing enough with Iris?

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Musashi

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After years of having the female character take more of an equal role with Satoshi, Iris' role in Best Wishes! is much more of a sidekick character. Do you think the writers are doing enough with Iris? Should she have a bigger role in the show? Please explain why or why not.
 
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Mucrush

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I think she are fine... what else should they do? This series isn't abour Iris, so let her just be the girl on the side of the road and let her have a little story for herself :D
 

Gracidea

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Iris has the biggest role in the Anime yet as a female protagonist and we will only learn more, She is much more interesting than previous protagonist in my opinion, The writers are doing great.
 

Necrozma

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Indeed, the more we learn about Iris the more interesting she gets. For example, what's the connection between Drayden and that old lady?
 

Lilac

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Indeed, the more we learn about Iris the more interesting she gets. For example, what's the connection between Drayden and that old lady?

2.About The Old Lady It's The Town Elder who gave her Axew
 

Necrozma

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I do know that, but what's the deal between her and Drayden?
 

Iteru

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I think they should do more with Iris. The best example for why I hold this opinion is Doryuzu. We saw him only around two or three times before BW36, and it all seemed to happen in a flash. There wasn't a great amount of focus there, and one of her best storylines was wrapped up too quickly in my opinion. Personally I'd love it if we were shown more steps of her overcomming her obstacles, which I hope we see for Emonga.
 

Aestivate

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I think they're doing enough for Iris so much that it wouldn't detract from Satoshi's storyline. I definitely want to know 'more' because the 'mystery' shrouding her character is a very good angle to develop it - I also like the babysteps that are being taken in order to do so. Admittedly I think the issue with Doryuuzu was resolved in a bit of an asspull, but then again I'm not going to be like "wow how DEM" because Doryuuzu's inability to listen to Iris had a lot to do with Doryuuzu BSOD'ing and Iris not understanding his emotions, as opposed to blatant disrespect from Pokemon to trainer (as was the case with Lizardon and arguably Manmoo). I am really enjoying Iris so far, and she's far more interesting to me than Hikari ever was.
 

Insanish Danish

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I do, totally. I like how she's not entirely shoved in the background, but at the same time she doesn't hog the spotlight either. She has a great personality and interactions with the other characters, and to me that's all I need for a character to be lovable. She doesn't need a huge sidequest that even rivals Ash's quest in order for me to like her. I think she's great the way she is and the writers are doing a good job with her.
 

Lilac

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there should be an arc where you learn more about iris
like EP4 of DP:Sinnoh Leauge Victors
 

Shinneth

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This is a bit tricky to answer. Naturally, I don't think the writers are doing enough with Iris, but not in a "she needs more screentime" way. The amount of time she's given is just fine for what she is -that being a sidekick as opposed to a co-star like Dawn - but the way her time is used in several episodes is what I have a problem with. With the most recent development of her character having come and gone, I still feel like the writers aren't pulling off Iris' story in a way that makes her an appealing character that we should be rooting for. I've seen a lot of praise for how the Excadrill problem was resolved solely because it was different from similar subplots in the past (Ash/Charizard and Dawn/Mamoswine, obviously) without any regard to how well-written and sensible the resolution was.

It being different isn't what I have a problem with; it's the fact that it was very poorly-written and the story overall didn't have much going in when it was mentioned all of maybe two times in the decent-sized gap of episodes that transpired since the subplot was established. Since they were gearing for this to be a very emotional episode to where you're supposed to feel for her in her situation, the least they could've done was have Iris acknowledge some of her flaws (outside of not having any Dragon-types besides Axew... because that can be resolved by just going out and catching more), learn her lesson, and become a better trainer for it. Pretty much every main character on this show goes through this kind of thing; all of them get called out on a critical flaw of theirs and they owe up to it, learn from their past mistakes, and become better trainers for it. Iris seems to have evaded all of this and all of the blame is instead placed on her Pokemon. Now Iris is supposedly magically on par with Ash in terms of power with an Excadrill that she earned through plot convenience alone and there's no heat on her whatsoever, which makes her even harder to relate to.

So... the matter of the writers doing "enough" with Iris? They've got enough going on with her, sure (though it wouldn't have killed them to have Iris being more proactive in the background with her Pokemon for some episodes), but I really don't think they're doing it right. There's nothing wrong with the writers trying out different ways of developing characters, but doing things differently just for the sake of being different (which I feel is the motivation behind the majority of Iris' subplots) isn't something that should be glorified. Iris still feels largely unjustified, not relatable, unsympathetic, and her personality just does not shine to me at all. After all this, the writers still haven't convinced me that Iris truly belongs in the group. Now it seems the more they try to "justify" her, the more it backfires because of some irrational need to make Iris betray the protagonist mold so she can be... different.

I'll appreciate it if no one labels me insatiable or anything along those lines.
 

Hellion

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I agree a lot with was Shinneth has said. To me, it's never been about how much time a character gets, it's about what the writers do with that character, and so far, they really haven't shown anything that really makes me care about Iris. Most of her storylines have been not focused enough and resolved too quickly, but more than anything, I've yet to see anything that really makes me root for Iris, makes me care about her dreams; anything that really makes me want to see more of Iris.

Also, none of her flaws are really treated as such. Ash doesn't really react to any of her taunts, and when she doesn't pay attention to Doryuuzu's being psyched out by Shaga's pokémon, Shaga and the village elder seem intrigued rather than being judgemental or disappointed. In last week's episode, she showed blatant disregard for her pokémon's safety in baiting her opponent into hitting Doryuuzu Every time she messes up, it's never being called out by other people, and never really shown to be her fault either. She doesn't notice Doryuuzu's problem rather than be the cause of Doryuuzu's porblem. Also, her portrayal in BW036 bothered me. She was shown to be super powerful very early on in life with her Doryuuzu having 99 OHKO wins before evolving, with Iris winning a tournament years before Ash even got his first pokémon. All of those contribute to this feeling I have that Iris isn't relatable, vulnerable; I'm not feeling connected or engaged in her character or her storylines.

Finally the CotD and possible rivals associated with Iris have so far been lackluster. Emmy was one of the blandest CotD in recent history and there was nothing about Langley that really made me interested in her, most definitely because she wasn't introduced as a human character, but straight away introduced as a battler, so we didn't know anything about her except, she's an unlikable bitch. So, in BW036, instead of rooting for both the main character and the rival, I found myself rooting for no one and feeling apathetic towards the battle. I also found her interactions with other recurring characters and Gym Leaders to be rather dull.

tl;dr: Iris doesn't need more screen time, the writers just need to do more with the screen time they have now, and that means making Iris more relatable, compelling and interesting.
 

Masurao

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Her Drilburr mainly being the cause of the issue. Are we to believe that she had trained that Pokemon any longer Paul for instance trained some of his Pokemon? There was absolutely no reason, for them to have it that strong. Giving it 99 OHKO victories doesn't make me feel attached to her Excadrill, as a character since there was no struggle shown for it to get that powerful. There's also the fact that her whole mention of "training at her own pace", was contradicted thanks to the flashback.

Let's take Ash's other Pokemon for example, there has never been one time where they where shown to be some unstoppable OHKOing battling machines. They have been shown to struggle to acquire the strength they did. They lost many battles, and won many battles. Where was that with Drilburr? Nowhere. Instead it just seem to coast along defeating everything in it's path like child's play, never once being seen to struggle to acquire the power it has now.
 
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Yankees4life

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Yes, shes not a co-star or anything since she splits screentime with her fellow sidekick, Cilan. And also, shes an improvement over her predecedor, who pretty much stopped me from watching up to season 14. I think the writers treat her as a sidekick should be treated as, a sidekick
 

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I think Iris is a character full of potential and her screentime is okay enough to let her develop interesting stuff in the show - other characters could accomplish that with shorter screentime after all (YMMV); however, I wish writers could write her in a way that her talents and flaws were better... Justified?

Personally I like the idea that if a hero is strong, his enemies/challanges should be even greater. So I am not saying I dislike Iris or that I find her a Mary Sue (far from that) but... Sometimes she sounds like a OC coming from a "new Ash's journey" fic, too many powers but too few mistakes or problems taken seriously lol xD

Times when she interacts with Cilan (showing how Ash's new friends are different/actually interacting with Cilian and not just Ash) are interesting, the fact she wants to be a Dragon Master (somehow like Misty's dream but executed in other way) and how she's really linked to Shaga (link to BW games) are also nice touches... You know, Iris can be an interesting girl, but when writers decide to go sloppy with her abilities/characteristics... That's a big downer to many people. For example, am I alone or did more people think her "99 wins as a kid" thing was too much? :/

Well, time might change and improve her development- after all we're just at episode 30-40ish... I only hope someone decides to do something before they arrive at the 8th gym lol
 
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pokemon fan 132

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What to say about Iris?
From start it was obvious that she is not going to receive nowhere near as much like May or Dawn did which doesnt matter to me because for good development you dont need a lot.

She is good character contributing to balanced and interesting group dynamic with writers attempt of keeping her past and story like goal,problems surrounding her pokemon etc in mystery until now being nice twist trying to keep audience in intense mood.How successful they were at it though is different pair of sleeves.
Currently she is getting pretty good treatment for a supporting character screen time wise(especially lately)giving us insight in her back story and past life,what motivated her wanting to become dragon master,as well problems about her pokemon like Axew,Emolga and Excadrill until lately being addressed.Possible inclusion of rival like Langley is welcomed thing too which could serve as push/motivation in her future development.
Insight in past and defeat she experienced from Drayden pretty much sets up that culmination of Iris development is going to happen around 8th gym getting rematch with Excadrill with Axew being petty much a given being main center of Iris story with her mission being to raise and evolve it in powerful Haxorous.

I also like the fact that we get for a change experienced trainer who isnt complete rookie which didnt happened since Misty with Iris showing impressive skill with her result of 99 wins winning tournament under age of 10.Thats not to say how other girls like May,Misty or Dawn didnt win competitions too having powerful pokemon with Iris not being strongest battler in group but so far she seem to have strongest pokemon in main cast being Excadrill who showed to be a real problem to deal with.
I dont know about others but i find relationship between Iris and drill pokemon touching and intriguing too.When he was still Drillbur everything didnt started out well between them with time becoming close friends participating in many battles with whole reason behind his disobedience being caused by lose of confidence in his trainer after being pushed to try harder in battle despite being injured.Thanks to another lost against Langley and Beartic Iris managed to break through him gaining his thrust back working again as team in battle.

Some may say how there arent any particular flaws going for Iris character to have her change but you dont always need to have character experiencing emotional struggle to develop him.Point of Iris development isnt to have her get over some childhood trauma or having breakdown needing to return her confidence or some other character aspect back but in having her leaning how to become better dragon trainer,exploring new strategies learning on defeats and how to overcome problems surrounding her pokemon from insecure Axew,unwilling to battle Emolga and until recently disobedient Excadrill.
This is way through which her character is probably planned to grow in strong dragon trainer on pair with Drayden expanding her horizons along with leaning how to deal with pokemon problems and obstacles which are put in front of her gaining more experience and confidence out of it.That and strengthening her relationship with pokemon becoming closer to the gaining their thrust like Excadrill case showed and to some extent Axew .

However i have to say that my main objection is rapidness through which Iris issues are being resolved with whole resolution of Excadrill problem being rushed happening too fast.This kind of approach sometimes while desired can on other hand feel forced making character resolution of problem unrealistic.

However generally speaking im content with focus Iris receives so far having more positive than negative things in treatment so far in my opinion.
 

Masurao

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For example, am I alone or did more people think her "99 wins as a kid" thing was too much? :l

No, you're not. Many people have expressed dislike for such a fact. Why they felt they needed to overly hype her in the flashback was beyond me, and alot of other people. How exactly does that make her relatable?

She didn't show any struggle. People say that she bonded with Excadrill after training with him, but that's no different from anyone else in this show as far as main characters go.

What does giving Iris such a powerful Pokemon this early into the series do for her character?
 
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pokemon fan 132

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She didn't show any struggle. People say that she bonded with Excadrill after training with him, but that's no different from anyone else in this show as far as main characters go.

I actually agree how whole resolution of Excadrill issue was rushed happening too quickly but to be fair it had its positive sides.Through flashback(rather long one)we get to see whole reason why this problem appeared in first place with harsh defeat from Beartic and Iris opening herself helping him how to perfect Focus blast making him start to realize how she truly cares for him wanting him best.Iris and Excadrill in reality as past showed already had strong bond which was staggered a bit with one tragic incident,being only needed to get it back on right track.

It wasnt like with Ash Charizard or Dawn Mamoswine with pokemon being disobedient from start with this type of problem when you think about it not requiring so much set up.
Though point stands it needed more time to make it feel more realistic.

What does giving Iris such a powerful Pokemon this early into the series do for her character?

Well she already had it that strong while she was kid years before turning 10 and beside its not totally unrealistic for young trainer to have powerful pokemon.Excadrill showed to be quite tough as pokemon already as Drillbur while being in wild and i guess revealing Iris already having strong pokemon serves purpose of portraying her in light as competent trainer who has talent to come very far in training dragon types with elder of village having trust in her abilities when giving her task to evolve Axew.
 
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Hellion

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Since the other thread got closed.

She did nothing about Doryuuzu's problem, FOR YEARS! If that's not a flaw, I don't know what is...

In the BW036 flashback, she is shown trying, and she later states in present times that she tried to encourage Doryuuzu many times over the years. The writers went out of their way to disprove your statement.

"Could it be ... that you already knew after the first hit we couldn't win against the opponent? And yet I ... I...Doryuuzu... I'm sorry. I didn't even try to understand your feelings. All I ever did was telling you to do your best."

First moment in Best Wishes in which Iris is forced to admit how it was her fault all along

Except it wasn't her fault. Doryuuzu misunderstood her, that's why it retreated back in its shell. Iris is apologizing because she hadn't figure out that... Doryuuzu misunderstood her caring and encouraging for carelessness. But, in the end, was she portrayed as being wrong? No and that's the problem. Once, she apologizes for doing absolutely nothing wrong, Doryuuzu then realizes she cared all along and... gets back to training as she told him to do before, proving her right in the end.

Doryuuzu developed, as he realizes that Iris had cared all along and that it should trust its trainer in fighting stronger opponents, but nothing about Iris's methods or core characteristics are shaken in that episode.
 

Necrozma

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Except it was her fault. Had she understood him all of that would have never happened.
 
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