Dogasu's Backpack Discussion

[Nicolas721]

I agree with the posts above. Maybe the dub uses unfortunate adverbs and expressions, but it's not like the Japanese version is not to blame too.

It was nice to see a comparison so soon after your trip though.

 

[Duke Spubber]

Is it really so bad that people have the English dub ingrained in their consciousness? You say you don't care what version people watch. You say you condescend to the dub itself but not its fans. Yet you say this, which contradicts those charitable things you said about the dub fandom. It really does seem like you require people to like it in Japanese only.

It's because people will endlessly prop up the dub as proof of some kind of hard fact, like when Butterfree dies when it mates or that Meowth's first word was "Rocket" or that the gang actually went to Seafoam Islands in late Kanto.

 

[Zakichio]

It's because people will endlessly prop up the dub as proof of some kind of hard fact, like when Butterfree dies when it mates or that Meowth's first word was "Rocket" or that the gang actually went to Seafoam Islands in late Kanto.

And that's...bad to do?

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

"For a while" is basically saying that Pidgeotto's job to protect its kin is a temporary thing, which is a thing Japanese version did not. "We'll back as soon as we finish our errand" is saying nothing about taking back Pidgeotto, its job is to protect its kin, it doesn't really matter whether they came back or not, Pidgeotto is no longer part of the team. Though, it's still a mistake to not show Satoshi's return and his temporary reunion with his first bird pokemon ever.

 

[Dogasu]

A few clarifications:

- As stated above, the "for a while" added by the dub changes the scene to make it seem like the job Satoshi's given his bird is only a temporary one. That's same implication is not in the Japanese version.

- I recognize that "We'll be back as soon as we finish our errand" could be interpreted as Satoshi making The Promise, sure, but I will also point out that "we'll be back" and "we'll be back for you" is not necessarily the same thing. I'm sure there are people who will find that distinction overly pedantic, and that's fine. But if this is the only argument that can be produced for saying that Satoshi made the same promise in the Japanese versiont that Ash does in the English verison then I'd say it's a pretty weak one.

- The Japanese version's "Pigeot! Good luck!" vs. 4Kids' "See you soon, Pidgeot!" is undeniably a change. Like, the two aren't even similar.

Though, it's still a mistake to not show Satoshu's return and his temporary reunion with his first bird pokemon ever.

I don't disagree with this.

 

[Zakichio]

I'm sure there are people who will find that distinction overly pedantic, and that's fine. But if this is the only argument that can be produced for saying that Satoshi made the same promise in the Japanese versiont that Ash does in the English verison then I'd say it's a pretty weak one.

Because only arguments defending the Japanese version are strong? What's weak about a dub defense?

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

Because only arguments defending the Japanese version are strong? What's weak about a dub defense?

But you didn't forward any arguement?

 

[Daenerys]

Personally, I don't understand why Ash told Pidgeot that he'd be back [in the Japanese version] if he wasn't planning on returning to the Viridian Forest to reunite with Pidgeot, but I digress. I've never cared for Pidgeot's fate one way or the other.

 

[Galactic_V]

Maybe the line "I'll be back as soon as I finish my errands" meant the writers intended to feature another Pidgeot episode down the road? Similar to the Lapras one in Jouto.

About the implication, I always wondered if Satoshi didn't meet him off-screen. Course it'd be great to have seen him again, but the absence doesn't discard the possibility they never met again (seeing Pidgeot's only reference was in Hayato's gym episode, with Satoshi mentioning how he misses him and wondering how he's doing).

 

[technickal]

I like this Translation Tuesdays idea. It's an improvement from Kanto 2017 IMO because it means more variety and less schedule slips. Plus, there's so much untranslated Japanese material from the franchise, episodes are hardly the half of it.

Though I'm going to have to say that the dub dialogue in the Pidgeot episode only seems as bad as it does because hindsight is 20/20. The rewording definitely gives more false hope, but I can see someone who watched the Japanese version of that episode first getting at least some of that too. And it's interesting you bring up the fact that that version was a year ahead at that point and Galactic mentions Ash talking about Pidgeot in an early Johto episode in both versions, because I just checked and the original version of that episode was released after the dub of this one. Which means they were still thinking about it at that point, and I wonder if Ash indeed was going to visit him at one point and it was dropped around the same time the GS Ball plot was. Of course 4Kids had no way of knowing this – probably – but if it did happen I don't think you'd be ragging so hard on their...interpretation.

It's because people will endlessly prop up the dub as proof of some kind of hard fact, like when Butterfree dies when it mates or that Meowth's first word was "Rocket" or that the gang actually went to Seafoam Islands in late Kanto.

But the whole point was it wasn't said in either version...? I mean, I'm not denying the dub rewrites a lot, but that wasn't one of them.

 

[Duke Spubber]

And that's...bad to do?

Yes, because it's not the intent of the original writers.

Let's turn it the other way. Let's say that, in the Japanese dub of the first Thor movie, they added dialog which said that Loki and Thor were actual brothers (instead of Loki being adopted) and that the Warriors Three were Thor's cousins. Would you take that as incontrovertible proof they were all blood related despite that not being the intent of the original writers? That's essentially what you're asking when you want dub rewrites to be considered canon to the Japanese version.

 

[MizuTaipu]

Nice that Tomioka played the games before writing the Yuji/Drake battle. He's the best writer on the show next to Yonemura. It's weird how they never made any indication on how long they take to write each script from the first draft to the last. In that "making of" comic you did they said production process or each episode is roughly five months so I'm guessing like two weeks?

 

[Daenerys]

In every episode I write, having the main pokemon use a special attack that hadn't appeared in the TV series before is a Tomioka Promise. This time, we get "Dragon Rage."

Yet we'd seen Dragon Rage used on two occasions prior to that episode.

 

[SinnohEevee]

Even though Satoshi doesn't clearly say he will meet Pidgeot again, one can be led to believe he wants to see it again when he says "we will be back as soon as we finish this errand". I am not saying he wants it to re-join his party, but to see it. But it seems the writers forgot about Pidgeot in Johto and we haven't seen Ash meet it again even though it's on Route 1, near Pallet Town.

 

[ii kanji]

Nyarth should be living a happy life after being mistaken for a God but he doesn't want to leave the Rocket-Dan or Musashi and Kojirou behind. The highlight of this one is the trio's friendship.

I miss you Mr Takegami!!

Thanks Dogasu, another life-affirming read!

 

[kantoskies]

Okay, this isn't technically content from your website, but it was on Twitter and I really wanted to bring it up:


View: https://twitter.com/DogasusBackpack/status/991698132651069440?s=19


GOROCHU !!!!!!!

I love pre-release stuff from when a long running series like this is finding its way. Its why I find concept art and beta elements from the original Gen I games so much more interesting than that from the new games.

And I really really really want to see that original Pikachu design now!

 

[Charmander4]

It sure sounds like he said he was coming for Pidgeot in the Japanese. Don’t see what the dub did wrong.

 

[Silktree]

And I really really really want to see that original Pikachu design now!

Spoiler: Big pic

 

[Antiyonder]

Some minor comments that came to mind regarding some past comparisons:

Japanese Episode 026

Later, we get a line uttered during the fire scene that's just cheesy beyond belief:

Girl Scout: "We've gotta catch em' all!"

Haaaa....get it? That's what they say...in.....the........show. Ha.

No kidding. Should have really been "We've gotta save em' all!".

Japanese Episode 065

Shigeru: "Look at that, getting all worked up so easily. You really are a kid, huh?"

Shigeru's basically an Iris light here.

I don't know. Even at his worst in battling, he still has the skill to back that snark up.

Japanese Episode 035

People claim that this episode being banned doesn't make any sense because we have seen guns in this series before. Ash got threatened by a bunch of guns in "Here Comes The Squirtle Squad," even going so far as to identify them as "guns." Officer Jenny pointed a gun at our heroes just one episode prior, in "The Kangaskhan Kid." We'll see a burglar with a gun in "The Case of the K-9 Caper," and Ash will imagine his friends getting shot by an unknown sniper at the beginning of "Pokémon Paparazzi!"

But you have to remember two things. The first is that the censors absolutely make distinctions between things that you and I wouldn't think twice about. There's a difference between actually firing a gun and simply pointing it at someone. A gun being held up close to someone and a gun being pointed at someone from far away are two different things, in the eyes of the censors. A gun being on-screen for ten seconds might be OK, but fifteen seconds of screentime is taboo. It's not uncommon to see rifles and bazookas allowed, but not handguns.

The difference between the guns in this episode and the guns in other episodes is that in this episode, the guns were actually fired. In this episode, the guns were held right up to people's heads. In this episode, the guns were onscreen longer than all those other instances combined. In this episode, there were no other adults around to stop the would-be shooter(s). In this episode, the guns in question were the same type of handguns a kid can find in his dad's sock drawer.

It probably doesn't help that Kaiser was threatening to shoot the trio just cause those damn kids were singing on his lawn, whereas previous examples have people doing so in possible defense, enforcing actual laws or training exercise.

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

Spoiler: Big pic

That's just Pikachu in its G1 design. They're talking about something different.

I don't know. Even at his worst in battling, he still has the skill to back that snark up.

We didn't see much of his skills in Kanto, so, no.