• Bubapedia Error 503 Backend fetch failed

    Our technical staff are continuing to monitor the wiki to try and resolve these ongoing issues that are impacting page and image loading. We apologize for the inconvenience. We'll update as soon as we've got more information on this for you.

  • Excited about the recently announced new Pokémon games? Join us here for discussion and speculation.
  • Visit your account preferences to list your favourite Gen 9 Starter, and you'll get the appropriate badge added to your profile!
  • All members are allowed to express their opinions, no matter how unpopular, so long as they respect others and do not claim their opinion is the only valid opinion. While we understand that there is debate regarding Goh, someone posting an opinion you disagree with does not give you the right to attack them or report the content for trolling/baiting. This notice will serve as a 0-point warning and as such, Anime & Manga staff reserve the right to jump immediately to point warnings. For more information regarding our stance on arguments and debates, see this PSA.
  • If you are finding yourself unable to log in, you should be able to fix the issue by following the following process.
    1. Close all browser tabs with any part of Bulbagarden open.
    2. Delete all Bulbagarden.net cookies (and if possible, any cached site data for Bulbagarden) from your browser.
    3. Close and reopen your browser, open a new tab, and log into the forums on the new tab.
    If you've followed this process and are still having issues, please contact us via the "Contact us" link at the bottom of the forum.

Dogasu's Backpack Discussion

Yash

CHOCOLATE
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
647
Reaction score
193
BTW speaking of One Piece, 4Kids never actually wanted to dub that show in the first place, Toei forced them to do it as they refused to license out two of their other anime that 4Kids wanted to dub(Ultimate Muscle and Magical DoReMei)unless they also agreed to do One Piece. The reason Toei did that is because they desperately wanted One Piece to have the same success in America as DBZ did(though funnily enough the at the time shaky reputation of Funimation's in-house dub of DBZ led to them actually turning down Funimation to do the dub of One Piece back in 2003) and they figured it would get even bigger ratings from airing on public TV, so they were willing to do whatever it took for the show to get aired on network TV, approving every single edit 4Kids made to the show(they even were even the ones that asked 4Kids to do an original theme song despite them already having recorded an English version of 'We Are!" which had been shown off at conventions)and not caring about how badly butchered the show wound up in the process.
Just going to point out that I've read this explanation before, it came a community rep who didn't even work at 4Kids during the entire time in which they had One Piece, and it's always read as complete passing-the-buck BS to me. One Piece was one of Japan's hottest series (and it still is!), a ton of companies were gunning for it to the point where Funi's reps dug up three separate pilot dubs (one was produced by Funimation, two by completely separate studios), the idea that Toei had to offload it on 4Kids as part of a package deal is absurd.

The timeline doesn't even make sense, 4Kids announced they'd licensed Kinnikuman as early as January 2002, and in 2003 Funimation confirmed they were still actively negotiating for the rights to One Piece. 4Kids also confirmed they were in active negotiation for the rights to Doremi in October 2003, and only announced they'd licensed the show in November 2004. It makes zero sense to assume the three shows were bundled together as part of a package, otherwise 4Kids could have just announced they had all three in 2002, especially since they were going on a licensing spree trying to fill out their Fox Box lineup at the time and OP would have been a much bigger headliner than anything else they had at the time (compared to what, Fighting Foodons?).

I've also never heard the explanation that Toei was put off of Funimation because of their poor DBZ dub, but why would they be? Funimation's DBZ dub was massively successful, and Toei was clearly not concerned about their properties being heavily localized in America (Digimon and Sailor Moon say hi, and also, why would you be upset about how DBZ was handled and then pass off your next biggest series to 4Kids and demand the same overzealous treatment?), they were in it for the money. They saw 4Kids as the company that made Pokemon and Yugioh big in America, and went with them, simple as that. 4Kids might also have been able to offer a better deal than Funimation could.

Not to be uptight about this, I ran One Piece Uncensored back in the day (which I quickly gave up on about 40 episodes in after 4Kids started going slice-and-dice-heavy on the episodes, Dogasu even wrote up a comparison for me once which I never got around to posting, apologies for that) and followed the licensing drama closely. It just always struck me as insanely convenient that right around the time 4Kids was starting to get more involved with the online fandom and rehabilitating their image (this was around the time they started putting up subbed episodes of Yugioh and Sonic X, the only series they had by that point that still had active followings) they had a handy explanation for why they weren't really the bad guys for how they handled One Piece, it was all Toei's fault. And the thing is, One Piece was always a terrible match for their editing/localization policies, but I'm going to blame that on the executives first and foremost who thought they could handle it, these were the same suits who were gunning for InuYasha, Bleach and Naruto at various points, they clearly never stopped to think if they could, they just wanted to cash in on the anime fad as quickly as they could.

Edit: Update after doing more digging. 4Kids actually licensed Kinnikuman in January 2001, or at least announced it. Apparently this was for the original series however ("Ultimate Muscle" is a dub of the second series, Kinnikuman Nisei, which 4Kids seemed to have licensed later). Still doesn't explain the timeline discrepancies and the "OP was bundled with Kinnikuman/Doremi licenses" explanation doesn't pass the smell test for me.
 
Last edited:

darksteel6

Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2021
Messages
88
Reaction score
32
Just going to point out that I've read this explanation before, it came a community rep who didn't even work at 4Kids during the entire time in which they had One Piece, and it's always read as complete passing-the-buck BS to me. One Piece was one of Japan's hottest series (and it still is!), a ton of companies were gunning for it to the point where Funi's reps dug up three separate pilot dubs (one was produced by Funimation, two by completely separate studios), the idea that Toei had to offload it on 4Kids as part of a package deal is absurd.

The timeline doesn't even make sense, 4Kids announced they'd licensed Kinnikuman as early as January 2002, and in 2003 Funimation confirmed they were still actively negotiating for the rights to One Piece. 4Kids also confirmed they were in active negotiation for the rights to Doremi in October 2003, and only announced they'd licensed the show in November 2004. It makes zero sense to assume the three shows were bundled together as part of a package, otherwise 4Kids could have just announced they had all three in 2002, especially since they were going on a licensing spree trying to fill out their Fox Box lineup at the time and OP would have been a much bigger headliner than anything else they had at the time (compared to what, Fighting Foodons?).

I've also never heard the explanation that Toei was put off of Funimation because of their poor DBZ dub, but why would they be? Funimation's DBZ dub was massively successful, and Toei was clearly not concerned about their properties being heavily localized in America (Digimon and Sailor Moon say hi, and also, why would you be upset about how DBZ was handled and then pass off your next biggest series to 4Kids and demand the same overzealous treatment?), they were in it for the money. They saw 4Kids as the company that made Pokemon and Yugioh big in America, and went with them, simple as that. 4Kids might also have been able to offer a better deal than Funimation could.

Not to be uptight about this, I ran One Piece Uncensored back in the day (which I quickly gave up on about 40 episodes in after 4Kids started going slice-and-dice-heavy on the episodes, Dogasu even wrote up a comparison for me once which I never got around to posting, apologies for that) and followed the licensing drama closely. It just always struck me as insanely convenient that right around the time 4Kids was starting to get more involved with the online fandom and rehabilitating their image (this was around the time they started putting up subbed episodes of Yugioh and Sonic X, the only series they had by that point that still had active followings) they had a handy explanation for why they weren't really the bad guys for how they handled One Piece, it was all Toei's fault. And the thing is, One Piece was always a terrible match for their editing/localization policies, but I'm going to blame that on the executives first and foremost who thought they could handle it, these were the same suits who were gunning for InuYasha, Bleach and Naruto at various points, they clearly never stopped to think if they could, they just wanted to cash in on the anime fad as quickly as they could.

Edit: Update after doing more digging. 4Kids actually licensed Kinnikuman in January 2001, or at least announced it. Apparently this was for the original series however ("Ultimate Muscle" is a dub of the second series, Kinnikuman Nisei, which 4Kids seemed to have licensed later). Still doesn't explain the timeline discrepancies and the "OP was bundled with Kinnikuman/Doremi licenses" explanation doesn't pass the smell test for me.
It's not "absurd" at all considering how little respect Toei have for their own franchises, so I can absolutely believe they wouldn't have a problem letting it get butchered for network TV out of desperation to have another US hit like DBZ.

Also that explanation didn't come from 4Kids themselves, rather it came from other people online who had heard things through the grapevine, 4Kids never did a PR press release saying any of this, I heard it secondhand.

People just have such an insane hatred for 4Kids that they want to believe every single bad thing they hear about them no matter how little sense it makes.

I heard about Toei being put off Funimation and choosing 4Kids instead from DBZ Uncensored 2: https://web.archive.org/web/2008112...on.com/dbzuncensored2/editorial/onepiece.html
 

snowmint

Henshin A Go Go Baby!
Joined
Feb 23, 2007
Messages
132
Reaction score
61
It's not "absurd" at all considering how little respect Toei have for their own franchises, so I can absolutely believe they wouldn't have a problem letting it get butchered for network TV out of desperation to have another US hit like DBZ.

Also that explanation didn't come from 4Kids themselves, rather it came from other people online who had heard things through the grapevine, 4Kids never did a PR press release saying any of this, I heard it secondhand.

People just have such an insane hatred for 4Kids that they want to believe every single bad thing they hear about them no matter how little sense it makes.

I heard about Toei being put off Funimation and choosing 4Kids instead from DBZ Uncensored 2: https://web.archive.org/web/2008112...on.com/dbzuncensored2/editorial/onepiece.html
I still think Toei went with 4kids cause of their guarantee to get it on TV and they made blockbuster hits with Pokemon and yugioh.
 

PockyAddict

Active Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2008
Messages
1,088
Reaction score
33
Pronouns
she/her
That's too bad, I remember watching Johto as a kid and thinking it was weird how we never saw The Ice Cave and then I go on TV Tome(ah the memories!) and look at an episode guide and find out the Ice Cave episode got banned cause of Jynx, that really annoyed me back then and still annoys me now.

TCPI are way too kneejerk, i'm not even sure why they randomly banned those two Jynx episodes many years later, if that happened in the wake of say the Dylan Roof murders that would've actually made sense, but those episodes were pulled years before that tragedy happened so I can't understand what possible logical reason there was to ban them like that.

BTW you wouldn't happen to have a tape of the first Kids WB airing of "Mandarin Island Mis-Match" would you?

You brought back so many memories with that site, I also used it along with dogasu and serebii to check for pokemon episodes.

I still remember the SARs rumor (which had been debunked) that some pokefans said at the time and thought that was the reason until i learned a few months later in 2003 the real reason.
 

darksteel6

Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2021
Messages
88
Reaction score
32
You brought back so many memories with that site, I also used it along with dogasu and serebii to check for pokemon episodes.

I still remember the SARs rumor (which had been debunked) that some pokefans said at the time and thought that was the reason until i learned a few months later in 2003 the real reason.
I remember the SARS rumor too LOL.
 

MizuTaipu

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2009
Messages
1,622
Reaction score
389
I had a lot of fun memories listening to that Radio Show every week back in 2012 (even if I couldn't understand much) so I'm really grateful that you're continuing these write-ups. It's pretty valuable since a lot of the non-regular voice actors never really got interviewed about solely their work on Pokemon; I'm excited to learn more behind-the-scenes details! And of course for more Rocket content since Hayashibara, Miki, and Inuyama are just amazing people. :)

Though it is pretty awkward seeing you write about old ad campaigns that ended a decade ago.
 

ii kanji

Eternally misleading
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
9,637
Reaction score
10,370
Pronouns
She/her
Kojirou asks until what age he wants to keep raising Pokémon. And does he even want to continue? Mr. Ishizuka replies that he wants to keep doing this until he dies. So you're a lifer then, Kojirou asks. "I'm a lifer" Mr. Ishizuka replies. "I'll keep raising Pokémon until my voice gives out."
:cry:

Thank you Dogasu, best project for the new year! Looking forward to the rest.
 

PaperSplash

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 30, 2021
Messages
505
Reaction score
1,093
Pronouns
He/him
Kojirou asks until what age he wants to keep raising Pokémon. And does he even want to continue? Mr. Ishizuka replies that he wants to keep doing this until he dies. So you're a lifer then, Kojirou asks. "I'm a lifer" Mr. Ishizuka replies. "I'll keep raising Pokémon until my voice gives out."
Man, that hits really hard now. Talk about poignant.
 

darksteel6

Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2021
Messages
88
Reaction score
32
Just found out there was some censorship done to "School of Hard Knocks" on both Kids WB and the Netflix version, in this case it was Brock's line after seeing Giselle's picture- "She can violate my rights anytime!" that line was completely cut on Kids WB and partially cut on Netflix(but its intact on Amazon Prime and on DVD)
 

PaperSplash

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 30, 2021
Messages
505
Reaction score
1,093
Pronouns
He/him
Just found out there was some censorship done to "School of Hard Knocks" on both Kids WB and the Netflix version, in this case it was Brock's line after seeing Giselle's picture- "She can violate my rights anytime!" that line was completely cut on Kids WB and partially cut on Netflix(but its intact on Amazon Prime and on DVD)
I'm not sure if that's completely true. I remember the line always being "She can violate my rights if..." before Misty cuts him off. I wouldn't be surprised if Kids WB cut it regardless though.

Anyway, his line in the Japanese version is even worse... "I'm looking forward to eight years from now." :sick:
 

darksteel6

Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2021
Messages
88
Reaction score
32
I'm not sure if that's completely true. I remember the line always being "She can violate my rights if..." before Misty cuts him off. I wouldn't be surprised if Kids WB cut it regardless though.

Anyway, his line in the Japanese version is even worse... "I'm looking forward to eight years from now." :sick:
Yeah I checked it last night and it's cut like that on Amazon as well, guess i'll have to check the VHS and DVD and see if it's intact on there.
 

darksteel6

Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2021
Messages
88
Reaction score
32
Yeah, I have the episode on DVD and Brock definitely says "if" and not "anytime."
Which DVD? The Indigo League Volume 1 set or the Pioneer "Sisters of Cerulean City" release? Cause the latter is the one I got on Ebay, once it arrives i'll check it out and let you know if the line is fully intact or not.
 

Insanish Danish

oh wow, sports
Joined
Feb 19, 2009
Messages
10,272
Reaction score
1,315
Pronouns
She/Her
Which DVD? The Indigo League Volume 1 set or the Pioneer "Sisters of Cerulean City" release? Cause the latter is the one I got on Ebay, once it arrives i'll check it out and let you know if the line is fully intact or not.
Indigo League Volume 1, the 2006 release.
 

PaperSplash

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 30, 2021
Messages
505
Reaction score
1,093
Pronouns
He/him
Dogasu, I'm curious what you would think of Megan Hollingshead's newer takes on Nurse Joy in Pokémon Journeys. It's still distinctly the same voice, but I noticed that the performance came off a lot softer and more subdued overall – in a good way; she doesn't over-inflect anywhere near as many lines as she did back in the 4Kids days. I'm not sure if it's exactly what you're looking for but it might be worth checking out.
 

snowmint

Henshin A Go Go Baby!
Joined
Feb 23, 2007
Messages
132
Reaction score
61
Dogasu, I'm curious what you would think of Megan Hollingshead's newer takes on Nurse Joy in Pokémon Journeys. It's still distinctly the same voice, but I noticed that the performance came off a lot softer and more subdued overall – in a good way; she doesn't over-inflect anywhere near as many lines as she did back in the 4Kids days. I'm not sure if it's exactly what you're looking for but it might be worth checking out.
Megan even says that she's not so "over the top" in her recent portrayal of Joy in interviews.
 

darksteel6

Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2021
Messages
88
Reaction score
32
Ok just got the DVD and checked it and that version is also has the "if" line, i'm starting to wonder if that's just how the line was recorded, but it's cut off so abruptly in the dub that I figure there has to be more to it. So i'm filing this one in the "unsolved mysteries" category for now(unless the tape is different).
 
Top