Dogasu's Backpack Discussion

[Johtoo]

He made a similar parody of the Pokemon theme song that featured him walking around in a hazmat suit "collecting" all of the COVID variants (gotta catch 'em all), with lyrics suggesting that the pandemic was a conspiracy orchestrated by big tech and pharma to cull the population and all of that.

He's also a member of the Church of Satan, which I can't imagine TPCI would want to associate with either. That being said, that was on his Wikipedia page before and I see that it's not currently, so maybe that was just an untrue rumor.

I'm sorry, but what? The video he made relating to covid was simply a parody and an attempt to bring laughter out of a terrible situation. Please, by all mean, go through his twitter feed and bring something more substantial, because attacking a person's character based off assumptions is never the right thing to do. The second point is useless as well. I'm not entirely sure what that religion entails, but last i heard, being religious in America isn't a crime. Not to mention you don't even know if that's true at all considering your source is wikipedia. I try and stay out of these personal arguments, but come on. You can't just paint someone as a bad person like that. And trust me, TCPI have been avoiding Jason Paige long before all of this. And their reason for not bringing him back isn't because of his beliefs. It's because a) TPCI are cheap, B) TCPI are out of touch with the fanbase and C) Their goal is to destroy the dub, not bring back an iconic voice who actually may bring interest back into it.

 

[Yash]

I'm sorry, but what? The video he made relating to covid was simply a parody and an attempt to bring laughter out of a terrible situation. Please, by all mean, go through his twitter feed and bring something more substantial, because attacking a person's character based off assumptions is never the right thing to do. The second point is useless as well. I'm not entirely sure what that religion entails, but last i heard, being religious in America isn't a crime. Not to mention you don't even know if that's true at all considering your source is wikipedia. I try and stay out of these personal arguments, but come on. You can't just paint someone as a bad person like that. And trust me, TCPI have been avoiding Jason Paige long before all of this. And their reason for not bringing him back isn't because of his beliefs. It's because a) TPCI are cheap, B) TCPI are out of touch with the fanbase and C) Their goal is to destroy the dub, not bring back an iconic voice who actually may bring interest back into it.

Hey, someone asked, I answered.

I'll give Jason the benefit of the doubt on the Church of Satan thing only because that factoid no longer seems to be printed anywhere, but he did release a song back in 2010 entitled "Thank You, Satan." Maybe that's what I was thinking of. Either way, should point out that while being religious in America isn't a crime, Satan generally isn't a religious figure that's thought of too highly.

Should also point out I'm not saying any of this to make a value judgment on Jason myself, just why I think TPCI wouldn't be interested in working with him anymore.

Funny thing is Jason Paige actually has worked with Nintendo as recently as 2006 (he was hired on as a singer for Elite Beat Agents), which is around the time TPCI started producing the Pokemon dub in-house, so I doubt TPCI would be averse to working with him again. But judging by your last point (lol, the company that's been producing the Pokemon dub for the last 17 years wants to destroy it?), I'm guessing you'd disagree.

 

[Poke Trey]

Hey, someone asked, I answered.

I'll give Jason the benefit of the doubt on the Church of Satan thing only because that factoid no longer seems to be printed anywhere, but he did release a song back in 2010 entitled "Thank You, Satan." Maybe that's what I was thinking of. Either way, should point out that while being religious in America isn't a crime, Satan generally isn't a religious figure that's thought of too highly.

Should also point out I'm not saying any of this to make a value judgment on Jason myself, just why I think TPCI wouldn't be interested in working with him anymore.

Funny thing is Jason Paige actually has worked with Nintendo as recently as 2006 (he was hired on as a singer for Elite Beat Agents), which is around the time TPCI started producing the Pokemon dub in-house, so I doubt TPCI would be averse to working with him again. But judging by your last point (lol, the company that's been producing the Pokemon dub for the last 17 years wants to destroy it?), I'm guessing you'd disagree.

Why would a dub that's been going on for nearly 20 years want to kill itself? Sure they make questionable decisions but, they still care to dub and not have anyone else touch it. Their marketing for the upcoming Horizons series can attest to this.

 

[PaperSplash]

Hey, someone asked, I answered.

I'll give Jason the benefit of the doubt on the Church of Satan thing only because that factoid no longer seems to be printed anywhere, but he did release a song back in 2010 entitled "Thank You, Satan." Maybe that's what I was thinking of. Either way, should point out that while being religious in America isn't a crime, Satan generally isn't a religious figure that's thought of too highly.

Should also point out I'm not saying any of this to make a value judgment on Jason myself, just why I think TPCI wouldn't be interested in working with him anymore.

Funny thing is Jason Paige actually has worked with Nintendo as recently as 2006 (he was hired on as a singer for Elite Beat Agents), which is around the time TPCI started producing the Pokemon dub in-house, so I doubt TPCI would be averse to working with him again. But judging by your last point (lol, the company that's been producing the Pokemon dub for the last 17 years wants to destroy it?), I'm guessing you'd disagree.

I also would like to add that while parodies are all well and good, using something you don't own but previously were involved with to comment on a sensitive subject can give the false impression that you're speaking for the brand (and yes, that can be easily debunked but think of all the misleading headlines that can spawn that the uninformed will take at face value). If you're not careful that can very quickly turn into a full-on conflict of interest.

And the Satan stuff in particular is something Pokémon in particular would definitely want to stay far away from, given their multiple run-ins with allegations of Satanism in the past. One of them directly relates to the phrase "Gotta catch 'em all!"... so yeah, they certainly don't want to even remotely validate any of that nonsense.

 

[Yash]

I also would like to add that while parodies are all well and good, using something you don't own but previously were involved with to comment on a sensitive subject can give the false impression that you're speaking for the brand (and yes, that can be easily debunked but think of all the misleading headlines that can spawn that the uninformed will take at face value). If you're not careful that can very quickly turn into a full-on conflict of interest.

And the Satan stuff in particular is something Pokémon in particular would definitely want to stay far away from, given their multiple run-ins with allegations of Satanism in the past. One of them directly relates to the phrase "Gotta catch 'em all!"... so yeah, they certainly don't want to even remotely validate any of that nonsense.

Yeah, that didn't even occur to me, lol. I could see the fact that he probably gets more attention for having sung the Pokemon theme than anything else in his career whenever he drops a new version or parody of it ruffling some feathers.

It's not like 4Kids ever made the effort to work with him again after the original theme song (and a few tracks on the 2BA Master album), either. IIRC he only got paid like, $100 for singing the Pokemon theme in the first place, which is outrageous knowing what a phenomenon it became, but that's the music industry for you. The guy who wrote the One Piece rap theme for them (Shawn Conrad) said he similarly got stiffed by the suits when he asked for proper payment and credit, because according to them, they were the ones who had the idea to do a rap song for the opening, so it was really their idea (despite him doing the actual work of, you know, writing the song).

 

[snowmint]

I wish we could get more interviews witht he song writers for 4kids shows.

 

[Yash]

I wish we could get more interviews witht he song writers for 4kids shows.

I felt bad for Shawn because he apparently had no idea the song was so negatively received in the fandom before he made a video talking about it. He made a follow-up video where he basically apologized for writing it, and it's like, I hated that song as much as anyone else, but lay off. The 4Kids execs were the ones who made the decision to replace We Are! with a rap song, he was just the dude they hired to make it. (also, it's a cartoon, no one needs to be mad about it)

 

[darksteel6]

I felt bad for Shawn because he apparently had no idea the song was so negatively received in the fandom before he made a video talking about it. He made a follow-up video where he basically apologized for writing it, and it's like, I hated that song as much as anyone else, but lay off. The 4Kids execs were the ones who made the decision to replace We Are! with a rap song, he was just the dude they hired to make it. (also, it's a cartoon, no one needs to be mad about it)

Actually 4Kids originally did an English version of "We Are" that was shown off at conventions, but Toei wanted them to do an original song so 4Kids came up with the rap.

Did not know about Jason spouting conspiracy theories about COVID, ugh lost respect for so many musicians who showed their ass over COVID(Meat Loaf, Van Morrison, Eric Clapton, M.I.A., Shinedown etc)

 

[snowmint]

There's a reason why 4kids or TPCi never brought him.

 

[PaperSplash]

It's not like 4Kids ever made the effort to work with him again after the original theme song (and a few tracks on the 2BA Master album), either. IIRC he only got paid like, $100 for singing the Pokemon theme in the first place, which is outrageous knowing what a phenomenon it became, but that's the music industry for you. The guy who wrote the One Piece rap theme for them (Shawn Conrad) said he similarly got stiffed by the suits when he asked for proper payment and credit, because according to them, they were the ones who had the idea to do a rap song for the opening, so it was really their idea (despite him doing the actual work of, you know, writing the song).

$100?! Ouch. I can definitely sympathize with him for that, at least. And yeah, I noticed 4Kids tends to be outright terrible with song credits, just like with their writers and voice actors. When it comes to actual on-screen listings you usually just get a vague "Theme Song by" heading, which doesn't differentiate between the composer(s), arranger(s), lyricist(s), etc. when they aren't all the same person (and they often aren't). And the artists? Provided you're not also the composer and/or lyricist, you usually just get left out entirely. This was the case with Jason Paige and Pokémon Theme, believe it or not: only John Loeffler and John Siegler are credited for it in the actual episodes. Pokémon is lucky that it got full albums like 2.B.A. Master with comparatively detailed liner notes; most of other 4Kids' other licenses didn't get the same treatment. Because of all that, we still don't know who sung their Kirby or Shaman King themes, for instance. It's a real shame, especially given how well done I thought those were.

 

[snowmint]

And low and behold, the Jason Paige material wasn't used in the latest dub episode in Canada.

 

[jungle_penguins]

$100?! Ouch. I can definitely sympathize with him for that, at least. And yeah, I noticed 4Kids tends to be outright terrible with song credits, just like with their writers and voice actors. When it comes to actual on-screen listings you usually just get a vague "Theme Song by" heading, which doesn't differentiate between the composer(s), arranger(s), lyricist(s), etc. when they aren't all the same person (and they often aren't). And the artists? Provided you're not also the composer and/or lyricist, you usually just get left out entirely. This was the case with Jason Paige and Pokémon Theme, believe it or not: only John Loeffler and John Siegler are credited for it in the actual episodes. Pokémon is lucky that it got full albums like 2.B.A. Master with comparatively detailed liner notes; most of other 4Kids' other licenses didn't get the same treatment. Because of all that, we still don't know who sung their Kirby or Shaman King themes, for instance. It's a real shame, especially given how well done I thought those were.

I haven't checked for the other franchises but you may (unlikely though) be able to some glean information from an ASCAP database or similar if you have song writer credits. I barely know how it works but found it amusing the publishers are named Mewtwo Music and Vaporeon Music.

 

[PaperSplash]

I haven't checked for the other franchises but you may (unlikely though) be able to some glean information from an ASCAP database or similar if you have song writer credits. I barely know how it works but found it amusing the publishers are named Mewtwo Music and Vaporeon Music.

Unfortunately, I have checked. The songwriter credits there barely tell you anything 4Kids' own credits didn't; it's just one extra name at most which is typically just a former exec from the company. And of course the performers are still not listed.

 

[Johtoo]

I actually think it's kinda shitty of the Pokemon Company to ignore Paige like this. If the $100 figure is true (which was obviously 4kids fault), shouldn't TCPI make an effort to hire him again or at least compensate him better for the song he created? While he didn't write the song, his voice is associated with one of the most iconic songs of our childhood. And the thing is: he doesn't hold any negativity towards Pokemon about how that was handled.

 

[PaperSplash]

I actually think it's kinda shitty of the Pokemon Company to ignore Paige like this. If the $100 figure is true (which was obviously 4kids fault), shouldn't TCPI make an effort to hire him again or at least compensate him better for the song he created? While he didn't write the song, his voice is associated with one of the most iconic songs of our childhood. And the thing is: he doesn't hold any negativity towards Pokemon about how that was handled.

4Kids definitely deserves some blame, but artists of all stripes not being properly compensated for their work is a common issue across many different creative industries. (Hollywood at least has enough unions, guilds and associations around to enforce the bare minimum treatment, but from what I've heard similar regulation in other industries is barely existent, and the main reason why more people don't speak out about it is the fear of getting blacklisted.)

And no, I'm not trying to normalize practices like this or say they suck any less as a result. They certainly don't. But sadly TPCi as a corporation has little reason to listen to Paige's wishes. It's unfortunate, but I honestly think a lot more people remember the song itself than who originally sung it. Yes, that's probably by 4Kids' design like I previously mentioned. It's a shitty situation all around.

 

[snowmint]

Interesting to see the singer for the MMPR theme song return for the Netflix special that just came back while Jason Paige hasn't returned to pokemon in any way shape or form at all.

 

[LDEJRuff]

I think the timeline page for the unaired "Team Rocket vs.Team Plasma" two-parter should be updated, given due to the episodes' scripts being leaked and translated.

 

[Charmander4]

I think it’s pretty clear in the Japanese version when Ash released Pidgeot in Pallet Party Panic that saying “we’ll be back as soon as we finish our errand” implies he would be back for Pidgeot. The writers at least thought so too, as recent events have indicated. I know this episode in Japan had caused issues with fans there too.

4Kids translated it correctly. But why do you have the above line and then say “there’s no promise” in Japanese?

 

[PaperSplash]

I think it’s pretty clear in the Japanese version when Ash released Pidgeot in Pallet Party Panic that saying “we’ll be back as soon as we finish our errand” implies he would be back for Pidgeot. The writers at least thought so too, as recent events have indicated. I know this episode in Japan had caused issues with fans there too.

4Kids translated it correctly. But why do you have the above line and then say “there’s no promise” in Japanese?

Well, they made it more explicit what the "errand" was (which in hindsight was an especially bad move considering the fate of the GS Ball subplot) and changed a vague "Good luck!"/"Do your best!"/"Hang in there!" to a more personal "See you soon!".

"Why didn't he come back for Pidgeot?" is definitely not a sentiment exclusive to dub fans but 4Kids didn't help matters either.

 

[Poke Trey]

4Kids didn't help things period, but at least something came of this sooooo.