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DP and what beyond?

Maxim Posthumus

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After many hours of analyzing several signs on the Earth and sky I decided to post what I know about possible future Generation IV Games.

After the release of Pokemon FireRed and LeafGreen versions people got pretty excited about Nintendo's plans for future. Many people hoped for GSC remake in close future. Since Generation III times are over people still hope that Nintendo will release GSC remake for DS someday.

Pokemon Diamond & Pearl versions have many Generation II references. Jasmine's cameo, Oak's cameo, Secret Medicine, NPCs mentioning Johto & Kanto places and characters. Game creators were apparently trying to keep old characters and things alive. It excited some people in hope for possible future GSC remake. But it's also possible that they are making all these references because there will be NO remake. It makes sense, too. Well, it makes more sense.

But there is also something hidden in game data - Johto location data. There are TWO Johto location entries in Game data (Gold & Silver?). That suggest that Pokemon (will) can be somewhat transferred from Johto to Sinnoh. It may be a sign of possible GS remake, or just dummy data. However, if you look at DP Items - all non-key Generation III items have their data in DP because they can be transferred along with Pokemon via Pal Park. So, if there was a G2 remake with G2 items, all things like Johto Balls or Apricorns could be transferred to Sinnoh. But there is no data about them in DP. However, if that data existed, it would be too obvious sign of GSC Remake. Nintendo doesn't want to be predictable, does it? If they want GSC remake, they could find a way to make these items untradeable.

And, finally, the strongest unsupporting point about the GSC remake - It is pointless. Pal Park makes it possible to get all old Pokemon without any new games. FR/LG and Emerald were neccessary to get all Pokemon in Generation III. GSC remake is not. But let me take us back to older generations. Yellow wasn't neccessary to get 150 Pokemon in Generation I and they made it. Nor was Crystal. And don't forget that there is (more like will be) 3rd Version of DP. It's also "pointless" because all Pokemon (except unobtainables) are catchable without it. And Despite that 3rd Version is "pointless", I'm pretty sure it WILL be out. So, the same situation may apply to GSC remake. I know, the chances for GSC remake are unlikely, but they aren't non-existant.

And don't forget that Generation IV is said to be last. If it will really be last Pokemon Generation, I'm sure that Nintendo will do anything to please fans and leave in glory. So, it may mean LOTS of games.

I wonder what else can be released. Sinnoh-based Generation IV puzzle game? Generation IV TCG? I hope for good spinoffs in this generation.

It was my research about future of Generation IV. Now, you can Discuss everything GSC Remake-related, 3rd Version of DP-related and Future Gen4 Game-related.
 

Habunake

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And don't forget that Generation IV is said to be last.
Yes, I know how they cancel game series when their new games sell like crazy.

That's an unbased rumour.
 

Jeff

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Mario games have been around for a while now... OH NO! They're going to cancel them too!

Seriously, there will be a Generation 5, we probably won't get it as soon as we got the previous generations, but it will come eventually.

As for the GS remakes, I'm getting sick of hearing people say "but you can already get all the pogeymanz". There are plenty of other reasons for GS remakes. I'm sure there are plenty of people who own Diamond or Pearl, but not a Gen3 game, the remakes will make it easier for these people to get old pokemon, without having to deal with the pokeradar, or waiting for the pokemon they want to show up in a swarm/the Trophy Garden/the Safari Zone. Plus, they'll be great to have just for nostalgia reasons, plenty of GSC carts have died, and there are probably people out there that are dying to play the games again. So just because all the pokemon are obtainable in Diamond and Pearl, that does not mean that everyone out there has no reason to buy a GS remake. If the games will sell, Nintendo will put them out.
 

Silktree

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But let me take us back to older generations. Yellow wasn't neccessary to get 150 Pokemon in Generation I and they made it. Nor was Crystal. And don't forget that there is (more like will be) 3rd Version of DP. It's also "pointless" because all Pokemon (except unobtainables) are catchable without it. And Despite that 3rd Version is "pointless", I'm pretty sure it WILL be out. So, the same situation may apply to GSC remake. I know, the chances for GSC remake are unlikely, but they aren't non-existant.
Why is a third game to Diamond and Pearl more likely to see the light of the day than the Gold and Silver remakes? I seem to recall that in early to mid 2004 the consensus seemed to have been that FireRed and LeafGreen had taken the place of a third game to Ruby and Sapphire. Emerald was released despite this impression, but to me that proved that there was no competition over the title of the generation's complementary release from which to begin.

If there were competition, then the vote would quite clearly have to be in favor of the remakes, which would be met with higher success if only for being two versions, all the while satisfying more fans and projecting a less repetitive image. After all, there are plenty of new fans who were too young when Gold and Silver were in their prime, and would therefore view the remakes as entirely new.

In terms of gameplay additions, there is absolutely no difference between remakes and third games. In terms of storyline additions to Diamond and Pearl, it goes without saying that such can only be accommodated by a third game. However, Game Freak obviously put very little thought into storyline additions to Red and Green by inserting none thereof in either Blue or Yellow. For FireRed and LeafGreen, the end result of the inserted additions was leaving a taste for more. As far as story development is concerned, Diamond and Pearl are in the same boat as FireRed and LeafGreen.

Having said that, I nonetheless foresee the forthcoming release of a third game after the remakes have become familiar territory in Japan.
 
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TTEchidna

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Let's not forget the only set of starters that are really hard to get. Sure, completing the Hoenn Dex or playing through Colosseum'd get you them, quite easily as well, but let's face it, the Johto starters are far less easy to get than those of Kanto, Hoenn, or Sinnoh.
 

Zeta

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Mario games have been around for a while now... OH NO! They're going to cancel them too!
There's a big difference. The Mario games are all self-contained, have no linked geography, very little shared continuity, and start entirely fresh almost every time.

The Pokemon games are all linked together, must have consistent geography, and essentially always have to include all the stuff from the previous games, plus new stuff - minus locations.

In other words, Mario provides a new experience every time - the only thing that ties them all together are Mario, Bowser, Peach, and "Jumping" somehow being involved. The Pokemon games are essentially "Expansion Packs" for an overall larger game, because they include all the old monsters, items, attacks, basic rules, mentions of previous locations - etc. etc. In fact, it's one of the few franchises that does this. Even monster raising ones. Monster Rancher, Telefang, and Digimon always get rid of a couple of monsters in each new game - neither series has ever had a game with all of the things from the previous games, or all of the franchise's characters in them.
 

bell02+

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There is over a 1000 Digimon though... :p (probably) and lots are clones. I don't think people care much if they miss black war growlmon.

I would like a full fledged linked Wii adventure game for pokemon, one that gets expanded after each generation with gameplay drastically different from the main series while keeping it's identity, but that probably won't happen.

I definately would buy a DS remake, and the amount of items missing from GS to DP is small enough to be in some kind of firmware update. So I think that part is ok.

On a third game though, it's hard. I agree with Unown Lord about the likely hood of there being GSC remake to that only because DP already features about everything the remakes have. I would like Volkner to be a champion though... but what else will they add? Simple battle animations? (Which would be cool, but would it be worth the Dev time)
 

Habunake

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About half of those 1000 Digimon are never expanded much, nor seen outside the card game...so, yeah, Pokemon manages it's monsters more fairly (to an extent...Dunsparce...)
 

The Outrage

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Yes, I know how they cancel game series when their new games sell like crazy.

That's an unbased rumour.
...Which comes around every new generation.....

The only reason to be making a GSC remake is for easier access to the Johto starters, the legendary beasts, and Ho oh and Lugia. Ofcourse, as time goes on, they will stop making third gen games, newer fans will be left with no way to get all the pokemon, except to possibly wait for swarms every single day, and a GSC remake will make their lives a whole lot easier.
 

Zeta

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Ofcourse, as time goes on, they will stop making third gen games, newer fans will be left with no way to get all the pokemon, except to possibly wait for swarms every single day, and a GSC remake will make their lives a whole lot easier.
GTS, Ditto, and the Breeding Center pretty much keeps this from ever happening.

Don't forget, Generation IV is said to be last by some.
Erm, yes - if by "some", you mean goofy speculators on internet forums, and no one who is affiliated with Nintendo in any way shape, or form.

By the way - there will be no more Zelda games from here on out. Please post this item in the news, crediting the mysterious "they" as the source.
 

The Outrage

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GTS, Ditto, and the Breeding Center pretty much keeps this from ever happening.
But let's not forget that you cant ask for a Pokemon on the GTS unless you've seen it and is in your Pokedex. If you have seen the Johto starters, the legendary dogs, Ho oh and Lugia, you most likely own them.

And as for the matter of Swarms being handled by GTS, again people most likely havent registered those Pokemon in their dex so they cannot ask for it on the GTS.

Let's not forget that the Magma booster and Electric engine is still tied to FR/LG, meaning that with them no longer in stock, Electivire and Magmortar will be out of the reach of many people. And also remember those Pokemon who only apear when you have the third-gen games plugged in.....
 

PDL

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But let's not forget that you cant ask for a Pokemon on the GTS unless you've seen it and is in your Pokedex. If you have seen the Johto starters, the legendary dogs, Ho oh and Lugia, you most likely own them.

And as for the matter of Swarms being handled by GTS, again people most likely havent registered those Pokemon in their dex so they cannot ask for it on the GTS.

Let's not forget that the Magma booster and Electric engine is still tied to FR/LG, meaning that with them no longer in stock, Electivire and Magmortar will be out of the reach of many people. And also remember those Pokemon who only apear when you have the third-gen games plugged in.....
Because you know... it's completely impossible to find someone over the internet who do have these pokémon, exchange friend codes, trade the pokémon and trade them back so you can look for them on GTS and other places.

Oh wai...

EDIT: I might as well add this:

I'm leaning towards the idea that Game Freak/Nintendo won't release a GS remake. One of the reasons why they made so many GBA games was that there was no connectivity between the advanced games and the original gameboy/colour games. They could have made 2 sets of games that had every single pokemon, including starters/legendaries/whatever, but they choose not to.

The game designers also wanted people to use the new pokémon rather then rely on old favourites all the time. This was a major problem back in GSC, it was far too easy to trade a lvl 100 from RBY and race through the rest the game, plus the Kanto nostalgia ment that many of the new pokémon were almost completely forgotten. (Delibird, Qwilfish and Dunsparce all come to mind.)

Not to repeat the same mistakes with Ruby and Sapphire, the game designers opted to not include most of the old favourites. This forced the players to start from scratch with all new pokémon, plus a few old standbys, some of these were even given a facelift which boosted their usefulness. (Wobbufett in particular)

Of course all the pokemon were programmed in the games, and were eventually made avialable via Colosseum and then FR/LG, Emerald and XD.

The problem with this arrangement is that people were forced to buy all these games in order to catch them all (thus they dropped the slogan a long time ago). With DP, it strikes a balance. You start off with a relatively clean slate. A slew of new pokémon plus old ones that were re-invented (Misdreavus, Ponyta and Roselia are good examples). However, once you beat the game, many options are opened up, the most promenent being Pal Park, where you can send all your pokemon from the advanced games to DP. Thus giving you an amazing selection of monsters for all your needs.

While Jotho is not likely to be explored any time soon, The game designers do acknowlegde it's existance (it is a fan favourite after all). Thus they've included little cameos here and there. But there's little chance they'll actually be expanding upon it.
 
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The Outrage

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Because you know... it's completely impossible to find someone over the internet who do have these pokémon, exchange friend codes, trade the pokémon and trade them back so you can look for them on GTS and other places.

Oh wai...
The only problem with that are internet thieves. This was a problem on SPPF with people asking for Legendaries for dex data, or other rare Pokemon claiming they only need them so they can search for them on the GTS. They promise they will trade back, but dont. Personally I blame those who just go "Okay, I'll lend you my Mew for dex data while you only give me a magicarp for safe keeping" They need to learn about colateral........
 

PDL

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The only problem with that are internet thieves. This was a problem on SPPF with people asking for Legendaries for dex data, or other rare Pokemon claiming they only need them so they can search for them on the GTS. They promise they will trade back, but dont. Personally I blame those who just go "Okay, I'll lend you my Mew for dex data while you only give me a magicarp for safe keeping" They need to learn about colateral........
Anyone who's dumb enough to fall for that deserves to get their rare pokemon ripped off. That's the risk you take with anything. There will always be crooks and always be morons take their bait.

The smart thing to do is to use common sense and find someone who you can actually trust.
 

Sand Man

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Personally, I think they should've made GSC remakes instead of FireRed and LeafGreen. It would've satisfied people who wanted to go back to Kanto and people who wanted to go to Johto. Remember, GSC had a somewhat double storyline: first you beat the GSC storyline, then you have to beat a somewhat lessened (but still pretty fun) RBY storyline.
 

PDL

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Personally, I think they should've made GSC remakes instead of FireRed and LeafGreen. It would've satisfied people who wanted to go back to Kanto and people who wanted to go to Johto. Remember, GSC had a somewhat double storyline: first you beat the GSC storyline, then you have to beat a somewhat lessened (but still pretty fun) RBY storyline.
It doesn't make sense to make a remake of a game that was only released 3 to 4 years ago, and it would actually make more problems by having Kanto Pokémon (starters, fossils and Legendaries in particular) nearly impossible to get.

I also honestly don't get why you'd want a GSC remake only to go back to goddam Kanto. It'd make alot more sense to have a game that actually takes place... I don't know... IN KANTO?

Face it, as "good" as the GSC games were, they were actually very badly designed. The new pokémon were barely given showcasing, and we had two majorly watered-down regions (There was seriously nothing to do in Kanto after you got your badges, which I might add, you never even see.) Rather then one whole complete region with tons of content.

While I doubt they'll make more mainstream games (apart from the special third version) for the DS generation, we can only hope that the 5th generation games would be kind to pokémon that were never really given a chance to shine in the games they were introduced in. (Kinda like how the 4th was good to Aipom and Misdreavus.)
 

Sand Man

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First of all PDL, I never said I wanted to go back to Kanto, but that people who wanted to could. Also, it's not like the remake couldn't include an underground area (I don't seem to remember the Sevii Islands in RBY, do you?) to include the fossils, like what they did with the desert underpass. You are right about the starters, although they could include them at the end of the game like they did in Emerald.
 

Geoffrey

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The Kanto in G/S/C was crap. Just plain crap. Biggest waste of time ever.
 

PDL

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First of all PDL, I never said I wanted to go back to Kanto, but that people who wanted to could. Also, it's not like the remake couldn't include an underground area (I don't seem to remember the Sevii Islands in RBY, do you?) to include the fossils, like what they did with the desert underpass. You are right about the starters, although they could include them at the end of the game like they did in Emerald.
I still find it completely baffling how GSC Kanto was actually enjoyable by some people. Even if they added all sorts of new content, I'd rather see it used on an entirely new place rather then a place we've already been to.
 
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