DP Tier Lists?

[Mercenary Raven]

To start my activity here - as well as good discussion - I guess I should start with a Tier List Discussion. I do expect this "it's too soon! Competitor's not out yet!" shit to appear, but I don't give a fuck; this will be solely predictions based on statistics and movepools we have seen of the Pokemon, as well as abilities and typing. We know everything there is to know thus far about that kinda stuff, so I guess there can be a discussion.

Now, as far as deciding who goes where, someone brings up something and we discuss it. If I get three votes to place x Pokemon in x tier (from people that, from my point of view, seem experienced [not trying to sound elitist]), then they go on the list.

http://pkmn.net/forums/index.php?topic=60340.0
http://z11.invisionfree.com/Pokemonline/index.php?showtopic=1808

(Names: Roy Mustang, Lord Ike)

A bit of a discussion in those two places (edit it out if it's against the rules, and I apologize if it is; I'm not exactly sure of where the rules ARE, and whatever I read that seemed like rules didn't include anything about linking). And thus far, we've concluded the following...

Uber
Arceus
Darkrai
Deoxys (all forms)
Dialga
Giratina
Groudon
Ho-Oh
Kyogre
Lugia
Mew
Mewtwo
Palkia
Rayquaza

OU
Alakazam
Azelf
Blissey
Celebi
Cresselia
Dusknoir
Garchomp
Gengar
Gliscor
Gyarados
Heatran
Heracross
Infernape
Lucario
Machamp
Manaphy
Mesprit
Mismagius
Moltres
Raikou
Regice
Regigigas
Regirock
Rhyperior
Salamence
Skarmory
Staraptor
Tyranitar
Uxie
Weavile

BL
Articuno
Dodrio
Dusclops
Entei
Feraligatr
Flygon
Rampardos
Registeel
Rhydon
Shaymin

UU

NU
Bastiodon

 

[ShadyWolf]

Ugh...all the luridness begins. I'll never understand it. I don't see the reasoning in sorting Pokemon by how much use they'll see, then arbitrarily having an "uber" rank at the end. Wouldn't "uber" be a part of a stat total list, and not one that gauges the use of a given Pokemon? There are tiers, sure, but I wouldn't classify them as "uber, OU, BL, UU, NU, GX and ZY". But whatever...

 

[Mercenary Raven]

Wouldn't "uber" be a part of a stat total list, and not one that gauges the use of a given Pokemon?

So, by that logic, stuff like Slaking and Regigigas should be Uber, even though they're statistically disabled, with Traunt and Slow Start (respectively)?

Stats alone do not judge a Pokemon; it's a major part, I do agree, but you must also see use in their movepool, as well as their ability and many other things. Pokemon are stronger if they have more use, if you see my point. And remember, within that stat total includes some stats that are of no use for it, such as Alakazam with Physical Attack, Bastiodon with Special Attack, etc etc. I don't judge by stat totals, I judge the way it's spread. For example, Glaceon/Flareon got really screwed because their stats were spread out inadequately.

Sigh, I was hoping for a discussion concerning this upcoming metagame, but all I get is someone questioning it. Can someone please comment on this and start up discussion, cause that's what the point of this is, and the sole reason why I came here; I want all kinds of opinions throughout the fandom.

 

[Mukubird]

Is Milotic still OU? I didn't see it in the tiers.

 

[nYoo]

Animals in DP? What?

 

[Mercenary Raven]

Is Milotic still OU? I didn't see it in the tiers.

Obviously because some of us haven't discussed it yet XD

Milotic is still a Tank here, being that it still has Rest, as well as a wider movepool to abuse Sleep Talk with - however it should still stick to Ice Beam/Surf, being that it needs STAB (aka, a good attack - remember this gen is more offensively orientated) and Ice Beam (Garchomp is a real threat this generation as well, with Salamence as well) to cover everything. It still has ~144 Defense (Marvel Scale) and 125 SDef, with a massive 95 HP as well. Pure Tanking skills, mainly on the Physical side due to less weaknesses on that side and such.

My vote goes to Milotic = OU, so it's 1 vote so far. Two more votes for OU and Milotic goes on the list.

And... wtf at the above post?

 

[nYoo]

Isn't Tier a German loanword? (It means animal )
That kinda confused me.

 

[Luna Tiger]

Isn't Tier a German loanword? (It means animal )
That kinda confused me.

Nuh, the word 'tier' in English apparently originates from 'Old French', and I'm too lazy to get my other dictionary and check it. A tier is, "any order of rows arranged one above or below the other."

In this case, Tiers are used to describe...well, /usually/ a pokemon's base stats; I don't like it being used to cover for how spammed a pogey is. Tier 1 is the highest, and generally it goes to Tier 4.

 

[The Outrage]

I I remember correctly, Surgo explained what it is meant in Smogon. It is simply meant to show the usage of Pokemon. OU the most used, while UU the least used. Uber was a tier created to filter out Pokemon that would reak havoc in OU, and the BL Pokemon are simply Pokemon too good for UU, yet not used enough for OU. The usage is often tied to the Pokemon's power. In competitive play, people want to win, so obviously they would use a Pokemon who they think is strong, linking Overusage to power, while things like Magneton in the third gen was OU, it was no where near powerful, only used as a means to stop Skarmory.

Now onto predictions:
Charizard UU
Blaziken BL

 

[Mercenary Raven]

Charizard UU - not quite. That speed, with Belly Drum as well as a decent movepool (and Dragon Dance, if you don't like BD) shouldn't be UU. BL seems like a possible option for me.

Blaziken is going BL or UU, due to its poor Speed and being totally outclassed by Infernape and, for that matter, Charizard.

As far as BL's going, we're thinking that it'll be expanded to make a new tier, because there's so much that's going to be going in there.

 

[The Outrage]

Yeah I was rethinking my choice in putting Charizard into UU. After all, with the right support you can still set up bellyzard who would destroy UU pokes way too easily.

I'm pretty sure Blaziken's 120 Attack and 80 Spd will keep it out of UU.

As for Regigigas, do you really think he's OU material with it's Slow start ability? It would let Skarm set up a couple spikes on it and WW it before the 5 turns are up. Although I doubt he would be UU, especially if you manage to stall for 5 turns.

 

[Mercenary Raven]

110 in all Defenses and Psych Up. I do see why not, but I don't quite why it should go below BL. The thing is, you could BP up and kill whatever you suspect is a threat, and don't forget you have Substitute on Regigigas, and 210 still does ~70% to Blissey.

Also, Charizard can learn Flare Blitz. Heh.

I'm sure Hitmonlee had a better Speed stat and just as much attack, yet I didn't see him out of UU. What's your point?