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Dynamax: Thoughts, Feelings, or Concerns

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First of all, the convo with @TechSkylander1518 was you saying that Pseudo legendaries (that are Pokemon with just high base stats) are somehow equivalent to Dynamax and now you being in held items? Why are you changing the topic on an unrelated post instead of actually addressing the point you brought up earlier?

Anyways, even this isn’t a fair argument since:
Tell me the name of an item which is remotely as powerful as giving a 50% HP boost and boosting the base power of Moves with beneficial effects for 3 turns while still having an additional held item.

You can hold items with Dynamax.

Again; name one ability on an extremely strong Pokemon with is remotely as powerful as a Dynamax form single handedly. Dynamax can be attached to any Pokemon on your team according to the situation; while you can’t pick or choose what Pokemon you put an ability on. You can’t use Wonder Guard on something with no weaknesses, while you can use Dynamax on a Mewtwo with +4Sp. Atk.

At this point I find it pretty dismissive of you to insult people who think Dynamax is overpowered by just saying they “can’t understand” while you yourself failed to give even a single, coherent and factually feasible or correct argument against any of the extremely well researched opinions provided by people on Smogon and on here.
-you can use semi-protected(invulnerable) moves that Max moves don't break. (1 turn from 3)
-Protects still reduce damage
-you can switch out and use immunities
-You self can Dynamax 1 pokemon during battle.
-You can still drain their hp and make their moves miss the target
-we have berries to block attacks
-we have items to revive pokemon and heal their hp during battle...

and like You said there are plenty of abilities that you can use agains Dynamax like Wonder Guard, Disquise, Sturdy, Ice Face that help in this kind of situations good.

Eiscue with Dive and Hail can handle physical Dynamax users very well.
If we get more Sturdy users added this game will change for Dynamax too.

Also we dont know maybe some of the new pokemon introduced in Crown Tundra and Isle of Armor will have abilities and moves that will reduce turns, that one turn is counted as 3 making Dynamax last one turn? or more moves that will react differently to Dynamax and with Dynamax?

We can hope they add Embargo back and make it work on Dynamax pokemon.
And that old moves that got cut come back with better effects.

Its a mechanic that boosts one pokemon from 6 in party in a full battle... Taking that Your team could have total type advantage, ability advantage and move advantage, item advantage, level advantage and boosted stats advantage there are people who worry about Dynamax only?
One pokemon getting immunities , 50% hp more and moves between 100 and 150 power for 3 turns isn't that more powerfull then megas and
Z-moves actually. Especially if You could get hit with 6 Garchomps, 6 Shedinja, 6 Mimikyus or a team mixed of them all...

Interesting Heal Block wasn't in te game, Embargo too....

If they would want to make a game change, they could make Heal Block come back in and lets say deactivate and block Dynamax or block the added 50% hp boost when used before... Or when used during Dynamax reduced it turn duration... we would need actually moves to reduce turns, making 3 or 2 turns count as one or by pass turns to make weather, perish count and other moves more usefull and strategical.


I have a weird feeling that our Wushu pokemon will clean the floor with Landorus... (Unseein fist, maybe priority punching moves???)
 
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-you can use semi-protected(invulnerable) moves that Max moves don't break. (1 turn from 3)
-Protects still reduce damage
-you can switch out and use immunities
-You self can Dynamax 1 pokemon during battle.
-You can still drain their hp and make their moves miss the target
-we have berries to block attacks
-we have items to revive pokemon and heal their hp during battle...

and like You said there are plenty of abilities that you can use agains Dynamax like Wonder Guard, Disquise, Sturdy, Ice Face that help in this kind of situations good.

Eiscue with Dive and Hail can handle physical Dynamax users very well.
If we get more Sturdy users added this game will change for Dynamax too.

Also we dont know maybe some of the new pokemon introduced in Crown Tundra and Isle of Armor will have abilities and moves that will reduce turns, that one turn is counted as 3 making Dynamax last one turn? or more moves that will react differently to Dynamax and with Dynamax?

We can hope they add Embargo back and make it work on Dynamax pokemon.
And that old moves that got cut come back with better effects.
If a specific mechanic requires a handful of highly specific and weird strategies to beat it, then it is broken. Not only that, several of the strategies you list wouldn’t work. You can’t make a Dynamax Pokémon miss their moves because Max Moves have perfect accuracy. Protect and berries only really work for one turn, and you still take damage and the opponent still gets their buffs. I don’t think Items are the major issue with Dynamax so Embargo returning wouldn’t do anything. Etc.

I have a weird feeling that our Wushu pokemon will clean the floor with Landorus... (Unseein fist, maybe priority punching moves???)
You think a Fighting type Pokémon will be the counter to... a bulky Flying type? Considering the nerf to priority in gen 7, I don’t think Unseen Fist will give priority to punch moves. Even if it did, people have reported that Dynamax Tyranitar has survived Fighting moves so that might mean Dynamax Landorus could survive Ice Punch, especially if it got Intimidate off.
 
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Adding to SpinyShell's points-

-we have berries to block attacks
No, we don't. There are berries that halve damage from one type of attack, but no berries that block attacks.

-we have items to revive pokemon and heal their hp during battle...
You can't use them in battles against other players.
and like You said there are plenty of abilities that you can use agains Dynamax like Wonder Guard, Disquise, Sturdy, Ice Face that help in this kind of situations good.
Disguise and Sturdy will last one turn, Wonder Guard will still be weak to five types, as well as taken out by any damage from Hail or Sandstorm if the foe has an Ice or Rock move, and Ice Face requires hail set up.

And even if these were perfect counters, expecting all players to have these specific abilities in their party- three of which are only on one species- is not balancing the game at all.
Eiscue with Dive and Hail can handle physical Dynamax users very well.
Again, this assumes that Eiscue isn't going up against a foe with any Fire, Water, or Rock moves. If it does, then Hail will be undone by the new weather.
Also we dont know maybe some of the new pokemon introduced in Crown Tundra and Isle of Armor will have abilities and moves that will reduce turns, that one turn is counted as 3 making Dynamax last one turn? or more moves that will react differently to Dynamax and with Dynamax?
Yeah, we don't know. So why should anyone change their opinion on how things are balanced now?
Taking that Your team could have total type advantage, ability advantage and move advantage, item advantage, level advantage and boosted stats advantage there are people who worry about Dynamax only?
Do you honestly think anyone is entering a fight with total advantages on all of these fronts? "Level advantage" doesn't even apply in PVP, where all Pokemon are set to level 50.
One pokemon getting immunities , 50% hp more and moves between 100 and 150 power for 3 turns isn't that more powerfull then megas and
Z-moves actually
Yes, it absolutely is. Z-Moves were only usable for one turn, Max Moves are usable for three- that's a direct comparison that shows it's more powerful.
. Especially if You could get hit with 6 Garchomps, 6 Shedinja, 6 Mimikyus or a team mixed of them all...
You keep acting like Shendinja is some god that can't be defeated. A party of six Shedinjas would be destroyed by Stealth Rock easily. It has one HP. Garchomp's double Ice weakness is easily exploitable, I have no clue what makes you think it would be a good counter to Dynamax. And Mimikyu will block one move with its ability. After that, you're in the same situation as before.

I don't see why you keep trying to make this case. If your solution to Dynamax is "bring a party of six Pokemon that are all the same species", that's not a balanced game.
 
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So I've been speculating on G Max moves for the starters and I'm expecting them to get upgraded effects of their signature moves. Rillaboom will have an Octolock effect where it lowers speed every other turn and traps, Cinderace guaranteed burn, and Inteleon ignores everything, moves, abilities, screens, weather, stat changes, he doesn't give a crap he has the high ground.
 
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Adding to SpinyShell's points-


No, we don't. There are berries that halve damage from one type of attack, but no berries that block attacks.


You can't use them in battles against other players.

Disguise and Sturdy will last one turn, Wonder Guard will still be weak to five types, as well as taken out by any damage from Hail or Sandstorm if the foe has an Ice or Rock move, and Ice Face requires hail set up.

And even if these were perfect counters, expecting all players to have these specific abilities in their party- three of which are only on one species- is not balancing the game at all.

Again, this assumes that Eiscue isn't going up against a foe with any Fire, Water, or Rock moves. If it does, then Hail will be undone by the new weather.

Yeah, we don't know. So why should anyone change their opinion on how things are balanced now?

Do you honestly think anyone is entering a fight with total advantages on all of these fronts? "Level advantage" doesn't even apply in PVP, where all Pokemon are set to level 50.

Yes, it absolutely is. Z-Moves were only usable for one turn, Max Moves are usable for three- that's a direct comparison that shows it's more powerful.

You keep acting like Shendinja is some god that can't be defeated. A party of six Shedinjas would be destroyed by Stealth Rock easily. It has one HP. Garchomp's double Ice weakness is easily exploitable, I have no clue what makes you think it would be a good counter to Dynamax. And Mimikyu will block one move with its ability. After that, you're in the same situation as before.

I don't see why you keep trying to make this case. If your solution to Dynamax is "bring a party of six Pokemon that are all the same species", that's not a balanced game.
You mean Shedinja is not a god? good, right, stealth rocks... one move to beat one pokemon is enough? Dynamax as a mechanic could also get a simple nerf with one move like using heal block...

Good I would love to see a battle vs a teamt that all 6 pokemon could Dynamax and what are the chances to win it...
That wuld be hard to beat and show real skills then... In my opinion weird that they didnt create in game high grade oponenst that could use 6 pokemon that mega evolve or 6 dynamax or more Z-moves, one pro pokemon... as Bosses, could be spirit trainers or Pokemon that battle under control of Pokemon that could take on a trainers form and do such a thing in game to see who is really the best trainer.
You would be limited. This would show if a mechanic is realy broken or not. Interesting how many trainers would beat this and how long would it take.
 
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I really like Dynamaxing, but Gigantamaxing was poorly implemented, ie not allowing us to upgrade regular Pokemon to make them Gigantamax-capable
 
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You mean Shedinja is not a god?
Yes, it's literally not. It's one-shotted by five common types and can be taken out with Hail, Sandstorm, Poisoning, Burn, or Stealth Rocks.

good, right, stealth rocks... one move to beat one pokemon is enough?
If your strategy is to just bring six Shedinjas, yes, Stealth Rocks is enough.
Dynamax as a mechanic could also get a simple nerf with one move like using heal block...
Healing Dynamaxed Pokemon is not the problem. Why on earth would you think it was?

You would be limited. This would show if a mechanic is realy broken or not. Interesting how many trainers would beat this and how long would it take.
Setting the player at a massive disadvantage like that would not show whether a mechanic is well balanced or not.
 
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The main reason why Dynamax is broken is that ANY pokemon can use it. It's nigh impossible to balance this because already strong pokemon just get even stronger with Dynamax.

I get that they allowed every pokemon to Dynamax so that the weaker pokemon can have more of a chance against the stronger pokemon, but the gap of power is still the same. The strong pokemon can also do it, meaning the power gap stays the same.
 
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The main reason why Dynamax is broken is that ANY pokemon can use it. It's nigh impossible to balance this because already strong pokemon just get even stronger with Dynamax.

I get that they allowed every pokemon to Dynamax so that the weaker pokemon can have more of a chance against the stronger pokemon, but the gap of power is still the same. The strong pokemon can also do it, meaning the power gap stays the same.
Not really. I've found way to take down or even avoid Dynmax pokemon on my own. Just because they have stronger moves, doesn't make them OP. Especially since the change doesn't last all game like megas
 
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Not really. I've found way to take down or even avoid Dynmax pokemon on my own. Just because they have stronger moves, doesn't make them OP. Especially since the change doesn't last all game like megas
Double health and moves can setup stats boosts and weather of all things. And it doesn't matter if it only lasts three turns, that's all you need to destroy the majority of the opponent's team. This mechanic is utterly broken and this comes after Gamefreak claimed they wanted a more balanced metagame.

This mechanic is so broken that Smogon banned it because they came to the conclusion that is one of the most unhealthy mechanics for competitive that Gamefreak has ever made. And this is the community that allows cover legendaries to have their own tier, unlike GF which just bans all of them, including the bad ones.
 
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Double health and moves can setup stats boosts and weather of all things. And it doesn't matter if it only lasts three turns, that's all you need to destroy the majority of the opponent's team. This mechanic is utterly broken and this comes after Gamefreak claimed they wanted a more balanced metagame.

This mechanic is so broken that Smogon banned it because they came to the conclusion that is one of the most unhealthy mechanics for competitive that Gamefreak has ever made.
Smogon literally bans anything that's strong. I have yet been though a battle where one dynamax pokemon determined the whole battle. So that's and overexagerration if I ever heard it
 
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Smogon literally bans anything that's strong.
Big difference between strong, and oppressive and unhealthy to the metagame.
I have yet been though a battle where one dynamax pokemon determined the whole battle. So that's and overexagerration if I ever heard it
You are gonna tell me which level of competitive you are, if you are even in one. Because this affects greatly high play.
 
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Big difference between strong, and oppressive and unhealthy to the metagame.

You are gonna tell me which level of competitive you are, if you are even in one. Because this affects greatly high play.
I play in competitions and ranked. So yeah
 
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I play in competitions and ranked. So yeah
So, mostly people that just go in for fun and don't think about which pokemon they bring in? Because most casuals play on cart instead of Showdown. Wifi is a really bad representation of competitive play and this is coming from someone that doesn't care much for competitive.
 
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So, mostly people that just go in for fun and don't think about which pokemon they bring in? Because most casuals play on cart instead of Showdown. Wifi is a really bad representation of competitive play and this is coming from someone that doesn't care much for competitive.
People don't ca-...You know what never mind. Playing on the computer is no different than playing on the actual game you're supposed to play pokemon. Showdown is only easier cause you don't have to constantly rebreed your sets. So honestly your idea of serious makes little sense.
 
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People don't ca-...You know what never mind. Playing on the computer is no different than playing on the actual game you're supposed to play pokemon. Showdown is only easier cause you don't have to constantly rebreed your sets. So honestly your idea of serious makes little sense.
You can play on whatever you want, but it doesn't change the fact that a lot people that want serious competition go for Showdown and other battle simulators. A lot of people that go on wifi on cart are just looking to have fun instead of serious competition. Sure, there are some that go in there for serious competition but it's much smaller compared to Showdown.

Claiming that you don't have an issue with Dynamax when you don't say which teams you fought or how high you are in ranked is honestly moot. Dynamax on the hands of an inexperienced player is not much of a threat. On the hands of an experienced player with a well built team and the cracks of how unbalanced Dynamax is start to show.
 
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You can play on whatever you want, but it doesn't change the fact that a lot people that want serious competition go for Showdown and other battle simulators. A lot of people that go on wifi on cart are just looking to have fun instead of serious competition. Sure, there are some that go in there for serious competition but it's much smaller compared to Showdown.

Claiming that you don't have an issue with Dynamax when you don't say which teams you fought or how high you are in ranked is honestly moot. Dynamax on the hands of an inexperienced player is not much of a threat. On the hands of an experienced player with a well built team and the cracks of how unbalanced Dynamax is start to show.
Then tell me why most ranked players I go against tend to use mons I see on Showdown? What you think every player uses a legend?
 
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Smogon literally bans anything that's strong.
There's literally pages and pages of discussion detailing why Dynamax is broken that amounts to a little more than "it's strong." If anything, Smogon tends to ban stuff that reduces the amount of skill needed to win, which was, to my understanding, one of the main reasons why Dynamax was banned.
Then tell me why most ranked players I go against tend to use mons I see on Showdown? What you think every player uses a legend?
Just because players use common Showdown sets doesn't mean that they're as skilled as actual Showdown players. That's not to say there's an actual skill disparity between Showndown and cart users, however, anyone can search for good sets. That doesn't mean they know how to use them or use them well.
 
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Dynamax also adds another layer of unpredictability. You have to worry about which pokemon the opponent is gonna use, which sets they have and so on, and now who's gonna Dynamax. With Megas you could almost instantly notice who was the mega and to a noticeable lesser extent which pokemon had a Z-move. Dynamax being universal makes this so much harder.

Then there's the fact that Dynamax can remove four moveslots syndrome from a lot of pokemon since a lot of moves also boost a stat on top of dealing high damage. Now you don't have to run Swords Dance, Dragon dance and so on, you can just Dynamax and go to town.
 
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There's literally pages and pages of discussion detailing why Dynamax is broken that amounts to a little more than "it's strong." If anything, Smogon tends to ban stuff that reduces the amount of skill needed to win, which was, to my understanding, one of the main reasons why Dynamax was banned.

Just because players use common Showdown sets doesn't mean that they're as skilled as actual Showdown players. That's not to say there's an actual skill disparity between Showndown and cart users, however, anyone can search for good sets. That doesn't mean they know how to use them or use them well.
So because people don't bother to think of ways to counter something it has to be banned?
 
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