Review "ExtremeSpeed Genesect: Mewtwo Awakens" & "Pikachu and Eevee Friends"

[Life]

I still want to know how different scientists got the same results as Dr. Fuji....

 

[WatcherMark]

Seems like the previous Mewtwo was retconned out of existence then, which is dreadful if true.

I don't think it's so much the previous Mewtwo being retconned out of existence, but Mewtwo Returns (and by extension, the Mastermind special) being deemed non-canon.

I'm also starting to think that Yamirami may have a Generation VI evolution. Seems like the writers were pulling their trick of seeing how well a Pokemon fits in with the group by pairing up said Pokemon with a main character in the movie.

 

[Silktree]

I don't think it's so much the previous Mewtwo being retconned out of existence, but Mewtwo Returns (and by extension, the Mastermind special) being deemed non-canon.

The special is an integral part of the Mewtwo saga and aired as a regular (albeit significantly lengthened) episode in Japan. It is definitely part of the Original Series canon.

 

[dracoflare]

The summaries note that Mewtwo learns to respect Ash through this movie, something Oldtwo had did in Movie 1 already. The movie also features a bit of flashbacks from Mewtwo's side. The prologue was pointless afterall.

 

[Satoshi_Pikachu]

Huh, so either this renders the first movie non-canonical or this movie is non-canonical. Or maybe neither are canonical. I can't say that I care, the last time I thought the Mewtwo movie was good was when I was 8 or something (imo, it's not bad, just not good, even by Pokémon standards).

But from the summary, it sounds like the movie itself sucks. Unless the summaries made it sound lamer than it actually is, the development of Mewtwo and the Red Genosect were handled pretty badly. I reeeaaaally hope that's not the case.

 

[FANG-TAN]

Or maybe neither are canonical.

The original Mewtwo actually *appeared* in the show unlike this one. Take that as you will.

 

[Silktree]

Saying that this movie retroactively renders the Mewtwo saga (or any part of it) non-canon is a nonsensical claim since Takeshi Shudo, who was the head writer, clearly viewed that saga as being canon. No one can change that fact after Shudo's death.

On the other hand, this movie doesn't even incorporate any of the scenes from Episode N or the prologue (they're similar but definitely different), going as far as to contradict two plot points in the latter. They merely tried to make it look canon as part of the rehashing of Movie 1.

 

[sunyshore]

my goodness...so much negativity and anger from a bunch of people who did not even see it? why are you all so disappointed? it reads to me that it is because this is a new mewtwo, and that means the writers are trying to do something crazy...

this movie was very heartwarming, touching, and quite moving. it was about GENESECT's story more than mewtwo, and their quest to find their home, after waking up to find all they know and love gone and their bodies grossly altered to be machines of battle. as for the mewtwo being different, can anyone explain to me why this is so horrible???. so another group of scientists made another mewtwo. that's impossible now? cloning the same thing twice is something we can do even in our real world, but possible science seems to anger so many of you guys in a movie about flying bug monsters and supersonic cat psychics.

and there is no such thing as "ash has never seen a mewtwo before", and i do not know why pokebeach has to put stuff like that, which is entirely intuition. ash simply says, who are you?. what's to say he just simply knew it was not the mewtwo he had known?

besides, i think XY will explain why and how there were two mewtwos. so please calm down. and remember, at the end of the day, the writers of the anime and movies simply DO NOT CARE as much as the fans seem to care. if they make a huge canonical error, it's because they don't care, not because they are evil. if you've watched this series for fifteen years it's pretty obvious not that much effort goes into it much of the time.

just stop hating on this movie you've not seen yet because pokebeach, who makes sure everyone knows he hates most pokemon movies, said he didn't like it. i personally loved it. i loved the new mewtwo, she was amazing, she loved her friends, smiled and played games, and cared about everyone's welfare, and was never selfish or cruel. the worst she did was act coldly to ash and friends because she dislikes humans, probably since the last time she saw them they were cruelly torturing and experimenting on her. lynch me if you like, but she was far more interesting and heartbreaking than the other mewtwo who i am sure still exists in the world.

i am disappointed in this really nice story being cast aside so quickly

 

[Dogasu]

I haven't gotten a chance to see the movie, buuuuuut...

Seems like the previous Mewtwo was retconned out of existence then

No. Satoshi not bringing up the previous Myuutwo and "retconning the previous Myuutwo out of existence" are two very different things.

I mean, this is Satoshi we're talking about. The kid who has to look up pokemon like Hitokage and Caterpie in his Pokemon Zukan all the time.

Oh, and the blatant 9/11 reference also sounds kind of unnecessary

I don't know the scene they're talking about, but I would hesitate to call anything a "9/11 reference" unless we see two twin towers burning or unless we see a flying object crash into a building and cause it to fall down in a very specific way. They should be allowed to show a city being destroyed without everyone screaming about it being a reference to 9/11.

It probably won't get edited out because I imagine WPM and co. are exaggerating it.

This times 1,000,000.

 

[sunyshore]

No. Satoshi not bringing up the previous Myuutwo and "retconning the previous Myuutwo out of existence" are two very different things.
I mean, this is Satoshi we're talking about. The kid who has to look up pokemon like Hitokage and Caterpie in his Pokemon Zukan all the time.

thank you, thank you. the old mewtwo has not been wiped out because other scientists also cloned mew. it is never said "ash has never seen a mewtwo before". i am not sure why pokebeach wrote that at all.

I don't know the scene they're talking about, but I would hesitate to call anything a "9/11 reference" unless we see two twin towers burning or unless we see a flying object crash into a building and cause it to fall down in a very specific way. They should be allowed to show a city being destroyed without everyone screaming about it being a reference to 9/11.

there is no references to 911 at all. it is not a deliberate reference to 911 and anyone who says that is wrong.

It probably won't get edited out because I imagine WPM and co. are exaggerating it.

This times 1,000,000.

i am not sure if i am "and company", but this is a little bit rude....pokebeach exaggerates, of course, but i am not exaggerating anything. i don't see 911 in every building being wrecked in a movie, but my entire group of 12 people who saw it had to agree there was one scene that gave us some chills because it was just similar imagery (not on purpose at all, i am sure). whether you find it uncomfortable or not is up to you, but do not just assume everyone is a crazy exaggerator. for the record, this is my summary of the scene in question.

"They fly around the city, hitting buildings occasionally and knocking debris down, causing a resident to look up in surprise to see smoke coming from a damaged skyscraper. "

and i am not exaggerating. so take from it what you will i guess.

 

[KingMan]

I don't think Returns is being retconned. Here's something I found when browsing the Gamefaqs message board for Pokémon X:

It's a second Mewtwo.

They haven't retconned or removed anything. A new scientist team decided to have a go at making Mewtwo. Simple as that.

The issue in question is a problem of context. When Mewtwo appears, Ash says "omae wa..." which can translate to both "who are you?" and "I know you". It's all about the tone and context. In the manga version of the movie, it's stated with the ... indicating there is knowledge. It's all about tone.

So the original Mewtwo hasn't been retconned out of existence. That hopefully should solve that issue.

...

just stop hating on this movie you've not seen yet because pokebeach, who makes sure everyone knows he hates most pokemon movies, said he didn't like it. i personally loved it. i loved the new mewtwo, she was amazing, she loved her friends, smiled and played games, and cared about everyone's welfare, and was never selfish or cruel. the worst she did was act coldly to ash and friends because she dislikes humans, probably since the last time she saw them they were cruelly torturing and experimenting on her. lynch me if you like, but she was far more interesting and heartbreaking than the other mewtwo who i am sure still exists in the world.

i am disappointed in this really nice story being cast aside so quickly

This Mewtwo really did smile and play games? Wow. That would be fun to see.

I guess this is starting to become a bit overblown. I've heard some clips of Reiko Takashima's Mewtwo and she sounds alright. I kind of feel sorry for her right now. If Masachika Ichimura was the Sean Connery of Mewtwo VAs, Phillip Bartlett its Roger Moore and Dan Green its Pierce Brosnan, then Takashima is its Daniel Craig.

 

[Satoshi_Pikachu]

Or maybe neither are canonical.

The original Mewtwo actually *appeared* in the show unlike this one. Take that as you will.

The Mewtwo appeared, but for all we know the actual events of the movie didn't happen. Or wait, did it appear other than when he was beating the crap out of Shigeru? But I honestly wouldn't be very surprised if they don't consider it canon. It probably is canon, but eh, the writers have fucked up so badly before I just can't react to anything they do anymore.

EDIT: If what Satoshi said was "omae wa", then it's likely they left it ambiguous on purpose and both movies can still be canon.

 

[Dr. Buni]

I still want to know how different scientists got the same results as Dr. Fuji....

It is not really the same results, since this new Mewtwo is able to change forms, unlike M01 Mewtwo.

 

[sunyshore]

I still want to know how different scientists got the same results as Dr. Fuji....

It is not really the same results, since this new Mewtwo is able to change forms, unlike M01 Mewtwo.

they didn't get the same results. this mewtwo acted completely different and had a completely different personality and set of values. she cherished and loved her pokemon friends from the start, and never cloned or mentally tormented them or did any of the cruel things the old mewtwo did.

If what Satoshi said was "omae wa", then it's likely they left it ambiguous on purpose and both movies can still be canon.

.
that is what he asks.

 

[WatcherMark]

I don't think Returns is being retconned. Here's something I found when browsing the Gamefaqs message board for Pokémon X:

So the original Mewtwo hasn't been retconned out of existence. That hopefully should solve that issue.

But the issue isn't the fact that new scientists created Mewtwo as it was Satoshi not recognising it. I still stand by the idea that Returns is non-canon, since the original Mewtwo appeared in episodes of the anime and played a major role in Satoshi's final Kanto Gym Battle episode.

 

[Joshawott]

I want to begin with this by saying, like the majority of people posting in this thread, I have not seen this movie. However, I think this Mewtwo talk is silliness. If you read Dogasu's translations of interviews with key staff, it becomes clear why the decision was made to go with a different Mewtwo:

When you think about the Myuutwo from the first movie, Myuutwo Strikes Back, you think about lines like "Who am I?" and how there was this running theme of Myuutwo wondering about itself and how it relates to the world around it.

The Myuutwo in this film has actually gone out into the world and has expanded its worldview. And it's started to be concerned about this world and those in it, and when you compare it to the previous Myuutwo, you'll definitely feel like it's gotten past one of its limitations.

This Myuutwo is not the same Myuutwo from the first movie. What part will this Myuutwo, who's actually gone out into the world, play in this movie?

About the appearance of Myuutwo since the first movie

Yuyama: The entire staff, myself included, see Myuutwo as this incredibly unforgettable pokemon because of the first movie. And there's this idea that Myuutwo just sort of looks down on all other pokemon from atop this high perch, y'know? We went into the production of this film thinking we wanted to create a brand new image for the pokemon.

So everyone: the reason why this Mewtwo is not the same Mewtwo as in the first movie is because the director and the team behind this movie wanted to approach the species from a different angle. The different voice was clearly done to make it instantly noticeable that the two are not the same.

In regards to disrespecting Shudo's work - if anything, this is honouring it. It has been said many times that the director was close to Shudo, so imagine how stressful it would have been to have to go back to Shudo's characters and themes and have to build on them?

Think of it like this: A reboot of the Batman film franchise is inevitable, especially with DC's plans for a Justice League movie and Nolan stating that his films will not be connecting to it. This is the same as all of you moaning that the next Batman film franchise will be disrespectful to Nolan's films, because they offer different interpretations to the same character and mythos.

 

[Darth Darkrai]

I really agree with several Statements before especially with the one above and I have nothing against the New Mewtwo and I think it is better with a new one probably and now that I have read the Synopsis several times the Plot looks good and is Ok and I have not seen it and won't for several DREADFUL MONTHS and I really want to see how it goes whenI see it.

And Now, No one has even said anything about the Eevee Special at all and what happened was it good or not at all because I thought this was also going to be good and I want to know what happened and was good.

Also one more thing, How well did Sableye do in this Movie and want to know if He was Memorable or not and what Moves did it use Mewtwo used.

 

[Adamant]

The scene where Satoshi and Mewtwo meet was shown on Pokemon Smash today. It's identical to the exchange in the manga.

In the manga, the line is おまえは…。, rather than おまえは…？. It could still be intended as a question ("Who are you?") as opposed to a recognition ("You're..."), but the lack of a question mark makes it come more across as the latter.

In the movie... well, to me, who listened to it once as it played on live TV, the line did not sound like it had the intonation of an outright question. To me.
Take it for what it's worth.

(also, So Takei is fucking hilarious and I love him)

 

[Life]

It is not really the same results, since this new Mewtwo is able to change forms, unlike M01 Mewtwo.

they didn't get the same results. this mewtwo acted completely different and had a completely different personality and set of values. she cherished and loved her pokemon friends from the start, and never cloned or mentally tormented them or did any of the cruel things the old mewtwo did.

I know they didn't get the exact same results, but they got pretty dang close. /:

 

[Garren]

How was Genesect?

I'm still kind of miffed it (I was so looking forward to seeing an "Ancient Form") was sort of pushed to the side in favor of Mewtwo, but it sounds like Douse Genesect was adorable, so I'm happy.