Mafia Fire in the Garden: Kanto Starters Mafia: Endgame, Bulbasaur Victory

[Zexy]

how about LICH KING, can you refresh my memory on your read on them?

Scum lean, mostly because of the dawn dusk kill and now also because he is conveniently ganging up on me with an OMGUS to make the votes 3-2 and hopefully save Piko.

If Piko flips scum, chances he is scum increase by a lot too, probably even more than Mido whose points might have just been used/parotted by Piko.

Would not really push their case more yet, Piko is more urgent and unfortunately, as things are, me and Piko are the wagons that maximize info given on flip.

 

[ExLight]

gentlefeather seems pretty townie to me, I don't think scum tries to guarantee a mislynch last second like that? Even if their scumbud was among the other wagons?

Dawning, can you ping @gentlefeather outside of the thread?

 

[Zexy]

gentlefeather seems pretty townie to me, I don't think scum tries to guarantee a mislynch last second like that? Even if their scumbud was among the other wagons?

Dawning, can you ping @gentlefeather outside of the thread?

Very WIFOMy argument, scum has nothing to lose by doing it if they believe they will be townleaned for that

Jamie and gentle votes did not really decide the ourcome of the mislynch. Raven, Piko, Caps and I did.

 

[ExLight]

gentlefeather seems pretty townie to me, I don't think scum tries to guarantee a mislynch last second like that? Even if their scumbud was among the other wagons?

Although it could be theatrics, but it doesn't seem something I'd expect someone with not so much mafia experience to do, considering it can draw attention to them?

Man you contradict yourself, why do you want to vote Snowy when you think he is a Townie?
Or did he become a Townie just because he subbed out?

Pretty good point, lol.
I also don't like the "lynch snowy, and if he flips mafia feel free to lynch me". If he flips town are we supposed to townread???? You (Zexy) were constantly suggesting to lynch him instead despite being defending that slot.

I'm pretty torn between Zexy and Piko for today's lynch
I also think that if Zexy is scum there's a decently high chance wissen is also scum, considering there seems to be some pretty desperate attempt to defend that slot that is barely active?

 

[ExLight]

Very WIFOMy argument, scum has nothing to lose by doing it if they believe they will be townleaned for that

Yes they do, it's likely to backfire and get their asses lynched instead.
Scum doesn't like to stay on the final votals because it's a common and intuitive way to analyze where scum might be.

Again, the getting late part to vote might be theatrics, but I am skeptical of gentlefeather purposely drawing attention to themselves over something that changes nothing in that day's lynch.

 

[Zexy]

I did not try to defend wissen slot, all I said was not vote for it until Elie gets a chance to post, in fact I even said I slightly scum lean it after making the final case on Piko

ExLight, please let me ask you something. If Piko flips and is scum, do you really think that makes Elie more likely town? Why? If I flip town?

 

[Zexy]

I just think your mentality on the Elie/wissen slot is a bit "damned if you do, damned if you don't"

You think I flip scum, Elie could be my buddy
You think I flip town, you all consider my case on Piko next, he flips scum, Elie/wissen could be his buddy that he protected early d1
Piko flips town, you think I will flip scum, Elie could again be my buddy

Like who has to flip what for Elie/wissen slot to not be considered scummy from you?

 

[ExLight]

I don't see a strong connection between Piko and Wissen, honestly.

You or wissen flipping scum makes me see the other as scumbud, and Piko as townier.
Piko flipping scum makes me see you as townier, doesn't affect my read on wissen.

 

[Minish]

I confirm that I have received my role.

Anyone wanna give me a quick rundown? I won't be able to fully catch up til later.

 

[ExLight]

I confirm that I have received my role.

Anyone wanna give me a quick rundown? I won't be able to fully catch up til later.

wissen affirmed jaison was mafia D1
Zexy and Caps then lynched jaison D1 and they were town

duskdawn died N1 and was indept
gentlefeather and JamieIsBored are fairly inactive rn
Raven's activity dropped significantly

Zexy claims they were targeted N1 by a role that made so he was aware of people visiting him

some friction between Midorikawa (Mint) and Zexy
Pikochu, Caps, Mido, and me seem to be the mainly active people atm
LICH has been popping up sporadically but not adding too much to the convo

Zexy has some interactions with Snowy, Caps has some with Pikochu

 

[ExLight]

wissen affirmed jaison was mafia D1
Zexy and Caps then lynched jaison D1 and they were town

duskdawn died N1 and was indept
gentlefeather and JamieIsBored are fairly inactive rn
Raven's activity dropped significantly

Zexy claims they were targeted N1 by a role that made so he was aware of people visiting him

some friction between Midorikawa (Mint) and Zexy
Pikochu, Caps, Mido, and me seem to be the mainly active people atm
LICH has been popping up sporadically but not adding too much to the convo

Zexy has some interactions with Snowy, Caps has some with Pikochu

oh yea, wissen was subbed out for breaking rules (we don't know which one) and is being replaced with Ellieson
and u should prolly vote for phase extension cuz we could definitely use some time to rediscuss the day now that we have active people subbing in

 

[Mint Elv]

The issue I have with that though is I highly doubt that scum wants to do a theater in such a way that would lead to bussing on Day 1, especially that early on Day 1.

Why not? Would clear their scumbud for like the whole game.

The way you posted, it seems that you were trying to seek certainty over just grabbing information and doing analysis and doing such analysis analysis. Or at the very least, post impressions and guts.

……what? Why wouldn’t anyone see certainty? Certainty > impression and guts. The day one mislynch was due to ridiculous conjecture that didn’t make sense.

didn't find your explanation to be groundbreaking to be honest. As I previously stated, I feel that your posts tend to be distracting from scumhunting by bringing up mechanics and discussions that should be have in the later phases.

Why? Why can’t we have them now?

And yet, there has been some discussions about evolution and roles and about visitors from Zexy's claim. My thought process is that the person who visited Zexy should be looked at it more wherever the hell that leads to. It's as if most players weren't paying attention to that part!

We didn’t dwell on it because there’s not a point. It’s just something Zexy claims happened and unless someone comes out that is what it will stay as.

Also how is concentrating on Zexys claim different from Light taking about mechanics. Both are mechanics.

Mint's posts are based more on what happened and with attempts at logic while your posts looked more speculative to me.

Attempts? Read. There’s no attempts, there is logic. Logic I proved right day one, and logic I consistently back up with posts quotes in the same posts as my votes. Where’s your logic because I fail to see much in what caps is having me look at.

Tell me how this is basically not parroting? That's where I thought this was basically essentially a parrot on Snowy's part.

Because snowy did that on his own and no one else said anything about it. That’s all snowy.

said under normal circumstances it would be suspicious. And I felt that gentle should have saw the other vote that broke the tie.

We’re the posts far apart?

want something more substantial from LICH. LICH at the time was just pointing fingers and did a bunch of "what ifs" without even just a surface level analysis of such what ifs. To me, he was just spamming WIFOM that distracts from the game.

LICH has been direct. There ain’t not what ifs there.

 

[RavenRaziel98]

Unvote
I'm not achieving anything with this atm.

VOTE: Phase Extension

Will reread from the start of D2 soon, have been following rather loosely for the last ~30h so I rather wanna look at things more closely, might not be able to make it tonight anymore though. I'll try to, but I won't make any promises.

 

[Mint Elv]

Although it could be theatrics, but it doesn't seem something I'd expect someone with not so much mafia experience to do, considering it can draw attention to them?


Pretty good point, lol.
I also don't like the "lynch snowy, and if he flips mafia feel free to lynch me". If he flips town are we supposed to townread???? You (Zexy) were constantly suggesting to lynch him instead despite being defending that slot.

I'm pretty torn between Zexy and Piko for today's lynch
I also think that if Zexy is scum there's a decently high chance wissen is also scum, considering there seems to be some pretty desperate attempt to defend that slot that is barely active?

Zexy suggested the idea of Wissen being mafia that outed his buddy. It was his whole reason behind the Jaison lynch. How does that play into your theory?

I confirm that I have received my role.

Anyone wanna give me a quick rundown? I won't be able to fully catch up til later.

I wouldn’t trust run downs. They’ll be bias as heck right now. Just take your time and read the thread and form your own thoughts.

wissen affirmed jaison was mafia D1
Zexy and Caps then lynched jaison D1 and they were town

duskdawn died N1 and was indept
gentlefeather and JamieIsBored are fairly inactive rn
Raven's activity dropped significantly

Zexy claims they were targeted N1 by a role that made so he was aware of people visiting him

some friction between Midorikawa (Mint) and Zexy
Pikochu, Caps, Mido, and me seem to be the mainly active people atm
LICH has been popping up sporadically but not adding too much to the convo

Zexy has some interactions with Snowy, Caps has some with Pikochu

This is a horrible run down.

 

[DawningWinds]

Day Two is officially being extended to 4:00 PM CDT on June 10th.

 

[ExLight]

Zexy suggested the idea of Wissen being mafia that outed his buddy. It was his whole reason behind the Jaison lynch. How does that play into your theory?

I already explained it like twice or thrice that I do not like how people went for jaison, because if the logic was that "wissen might've outed his buddy" people should've gone for wissen, not jaison. If wissen was telling the truth we'd still get scum lynched; but if wissen was lying (which turned out to be the case) we'd still have a chance of hitting scum at best, and get rid of a townie town who doesn't care about hurting town at worst.

From my brief reread of D1 Zexy was vehemently defending wissen and pushing for jaison, which is extremely odd to me. Them defending that we should stall wissen's lynch to allow the slot to be replaced and justify their actions (spoiler alert there's no justification, everyone was vanilla, either wissen was a toxic player or mafia pulling the shitiest gambit) also irked me quite a bit, which makes me think Zexy might be scumbuds buying time for that slot.

This is a horrible run down.

meanie :(

the best i could do without being biased as fuck + considering I have been putting a limited amount of time into the game lol
feel free to add more details

 

[Mint Elv]

wouldn't say that ExLight's applied philosophy is incompatible for this game. What I was trying to say is that the current philosophy just doesn't apply at this stage of the game and that such a philsophy

Why not? You’ve given no reason why it isn’t compatible.

I think we all are, though I do want to say that the more active players are trying to make themselves look more active than they really are. I know they are talking about pushing the inactives and I think the votes on the other inactives are reasonable enough to see.

I don’t think anyone is trying to look more active than they are. I think everyone is being genuinely active as possible.

I think we all are, though I do want to say that the more active players are trying to make themselves look more active than they really are. I know they are talking about pushing the inactives and I think the votes on the other inactives are reasonable enough to see.

Didn’t mean to quote twice

Part of the reason why I voted for Snowy is to encourage talking as there wasn't much from him at the time. I personally didn't go after LICH or Jaime because I didn't know what their play style like at all. I kinda have an idea, albeit a very outdated idea. And yes, I know this starts getting into meta which is something not worth going into. Suffice to say, I just gave LICH and Jaime more of the benefit of the doubt than I did with Snowy.

This sounds like you wanted to go after someone you knew you could pressure.

I'm really not liking that you are non-commiting to a wagon and I'm suspecting you're trying to either pin this mainly on me and/or Caps. You have been pushing pretty hard for a wagon on A/B, and then when you are being prodded you withdraw. Then you decided to ask Caps about Caps/Piko That reeks you and Caps being potential scum buddies trying to score a mislynch on me.

As for giving maximum info in the game, I feel pushing the more actives into the wagon would productive as I feel they are causing the most of the confusion currently in this game.

So there are points I agree and disagree with. I don’t think anything reeks of anyone being scum buddies in general in this game.

I wouldn’t say Zexy is backing off but he has been pushing but not taking the step forward, evidenced by the way he tries to tell me I’m making mistakes and uses appeal to emotion.

And I do agree the actives are the confusion but that’s why we need cases like caps and me actually discussing and showing stuff instead of spouting stuff.

This probably gonna look like an OMGUS; these posts raised serious red flags that I'm willing raise a Zexy/Caps wagon. I'm not just not seeing how Zexy is putting Caps as a lower priority target. I'm also not seeing much alternative wagons not involving I think these two are having the game focus too much on WIFOM on finding scum. Kinda makes me think that Zexy and Caps are potential scumbuddies trying to focus solely finding mafia and not figuring out who may be town also.

Still don’t see it as OMGUS. That’s only for cases where someone votes someone just for voting them first. If you build an actual case then it’s an actual case.

The latter half is still problematic. There is too much belief of people being buddies and everyone should be looked at alone. While I think it’s okay to point at small things that seem like they are too coincidental like I did with snowy and Zexy, I don’t think cases should be based around dependent on tw people being partners.

And it’s not jsut you doing this. It’s too rampant right now and it harms the thread.

Actually, there hasn't been too much analysis as a group of potential town players. I kinda feel that mafia has been focusing too much on accusations who might be them that we lost who may not be them too.

Because too many are just “if x is mafia then x is also mafia” and stuff. It’s mostly people responding to others instead of just building cases.

 

[Mint Elv]

I already explained it like twice or thrice that I do not like how people went for jaison, because if the logic was that "wissen might've outed his buddy" people should've gone for wissen, not jaison. If wissen was telling the truth we'd still get scum lynched; but if wissen was lying (which turned out to be the case) we'd still have a chance of hitting scum at best, and get rid of a townie town who doesn't care about hurting town at worst.

From my brief reread of D1 Zexy was vehemently defending wissen and pushing for jaison, which is extremely odd to me. Them defending that we should stall wissen's lynch to allow the slot to be replaced and justify their actions (spoiler alert there's no justification, everyone was vanilla, either wissen was a toxic player or mafia pulling the shitiest gambit) also irked me quite a bit, which makes me think Zexy might be scumbuds buying time for that slot.


meanie :(

the best i could do without being biased as fuck + considering I have been putting a limited amount of time into the game lol
feel free to add more details

So show quotes of his defense. You’re saying it exists, so show it. For the record LICH has stated te same flaw and I might have too. So I agree the jaison choice never made sense but I can’t recall a Wissen defense until the sub in. So quote it for everyone to prove your point.

 

[Zexy]

I am planning to do a kind of big post replying to Mido and clarifying a few points against Piko, ISO style, but rather than spamming an insane amount of quotes I will probably just mention post numbers. This is a kinda big project though and it will take several hours yet.

I am reading up on all Mido Caps Piko have said, but until that is ready, I am only gonna reply to people like ExLight and other lower activity ones that I hope show up. Not that it is going to change my mind that Piko is the best lynch today (unless we get some super weird claim), but we need things to work D3 onward.

 

[gentlefeather]

hello hello

i notice i was called out for the last minute attempt at a vote and that's valid, I'd find it scummy too considering the result

all i can say is I didn't realize how close the deadline was and I'm used to ties = no lynch. wasnt sure if that's the process here or not but at that point it was a while since we had a tally, i didn't know how many people voted
and in case jaison was scum i wanted to prevent a situation where scum possibly voted last second to tie or flip