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Future Villains: Organization or Individual?

Future Villains?

  • Team Villains!

    Votes: 15 48.4%
  • The One, The Only, Big Boss

    Votes: 8 25.8%
  • Other

    Votes: 8 25.8%

  • Total voters
    31

Ereshkigal

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hmmm what would you say a villian team wants to win the pokemon league and take it over?
something like terrorist that want to remade gyms and league but want to win it first.
Huh. This would be a nice take on Team Skull. Or another, unique villainous team.

Also would be cool to have more villians with goals not related to stealing pokemon but rather lets say other things or destroying things to make something happen like to see what legendary wins or more interesting stuff...
This described Teams Magma, Aqua, Galactic (at least half of Galactic, anyway), Plasma, and Flare. Stealing pokemon as a primary goal has been pretty much limited to the mafia/yakuza (Team Rocket) and street gangs (Team Skull) within the main series. While some of them did steal pokemon, the theft of pokemon was not their primary goal and oftentimes not even necessary for that primary goal; Team Plasma did occasionally steal pokemon but was really trying to get people to no longer have pokemon so they could take over Unova and were just as happy with people willingly releasing pokemon into the wild.

Note that of the teams, two were organized crime (Rocket and Skull), two wanted world domination (Plasma and Flare), two wanted to commit genocide (Galactic and Flare), and three were animal rights groups (Magma, Aqua, and around half of Plasma).

How lacking in world-shaking seriousness having a goal of just stealing pokemon is compared to things like genocide and world domination is why it is I think Rocket was treated so seriously by the games, since they were the first team, while Skull was more comedic relief.
 

Rocket Zigzagoon

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If I ever want to have darker storyline in Gen 8, I would want to see police brutality as a main theme with International Police being true villains. However, things should get complicated as Looker should be anti-villain who wants to reveal the truth behind police brutality issues. Even if that could scare young players away, things can get interesting and can lead to some restructuring.

Huh. This would be a nice take on Team Skull. Or another, unique villainous team.



This described Teams Magma, Aqua, Galactic (at least half of Galactic, anyway), Plasma, and Flare. Stealing pokemon as a primary goal has been pretty much limited to the mafia/yakuza (Team Rocket) and street gangs (Team Skull) within the main series. While some of them did steal pokemon, the theft of pokemon was not their primary goal and oftentimes not even necessary for that primary goal; Team Plasma did occasionally steal pokemon but was really trying to get people to no longer have pokemon so they could take over Unova and were just as happy with people willingly releasing pokemon into the wild.

Note that of the teams, two were organized crime (Rocket and Skull), two wanted world domination (Plasma and Flare), two wanted to commit genocide (Galactic and Flare), and three were animal rights groups (Magma, Aqua, and around half of Plasma).

How lacking in world-shaking seriousness having a goal of just stealing pokemon is compared to things like genocide and world domination is why it is I think Rocket was treated so seriously by the games, since they were the first team, while Skull was more comedic relief.
From what I see, the Ghetsis-led Team Plasma in B2W2 subjected every Plasma grunt into forced labor of "liberating Pokémon" and quarreling with former members, and as such, this "forced labor" imposed by Ghetsis, among other things, led to him being berated by everyone even more and fallen into coma, and these paved the road for Team Plasma's complete disbandment.
 

Matleo

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Huh. This would be a nice take on Team Skull. Or another, unique villainous team.



This described Teams Magma, Aqua, Galactic (at least half of Galactic, anyway), Plasma, and Flare. Stealing pokemon as a primary goal has been pretty much limited to the mafia/yakuza (Team Rocket) and street gangs (Team Skull) within the main series. While some of them did steal pokemon, the theft of pokemon was not their primary goal and oftentimes not even necessary for that primary goal; Team Plasma did occasionally steal pokemon but was really trying to get people to no longer have pokemon so they could take over Unova and were just as happy with people willingly releasing pokemon into the wild.

Note that of the teams, two were organized crime (Rocket and Skull), two wanted world domination (Plasma and Flare), two wanted to commit genocide (Galactic and Flare), and three were animal rights groups (Magma, Aqua, and around half of Plasma).

How lacking in world-shaking seriousness having a goal of just stealing pokemon is compared to things like genocide and world domination is why it is I think Rocket was treated so seriously by the games, since they were the first team, while Skull was more comedic relief.
rather though about stealing technology, it's really hard for them to go outside the box with time and so many villians used in movies and series... personally the Hunter could come back and work with team rocket for me. We would need villians that really can fight and that maybe could have goals related to evolving their pokemon and making a army?

Corruption in the police Rocket Zigzagoon would be a great idea, hidden in plain sight.
The same would be good for a evil pokemon nurse.
 

Rocket Zigzagoon

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rather though about stealing technology, it's really hard for them to go outside the box with time and so many villians used in movies and series... personally the Hunter could come back and work with team rocket for me. We would need villians that really can fight and that maybe could have goals related to evolving their pokemon and making a army?

Corruption in the police Rocket Zigzagoon would be a great idea, hidden in plain sight.
The same would be good for a evil pokemon nurse.
I can see that though. But for nurses, this could be too much tho.

Maybe morality issues led to the split would work too.
 

Matleo

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I can see that though. But for nurses, this could be too much tho.

Maybe morality issues led to the split would work too.
or some other goals that forced a morality split? you know lost of relatives and those who you loved?
 

Ereshkigal

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rather though about stealing technology, it's really hard for them to go outside the box with time and so many villians used in movies and series... personally the Hunter could come back and work with team rocket for me. We would need villians that really can fight and that maybe could have goals related to evolving their pokemon and making a army?
I think the problem with villains that can put up a fight is they would curbstomp an eleven-year-old. If we're going to keep having child protagonists, the children need at least a chance to win rather than being used a mop every time they meet the enemy. And countering an army would definitely be beyond anything a child could handle.
 

prog rocker

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I think another reason we have teams instead of singular villains is from a gaming perspective: They need people that fulfill the role of mobs or generic enemies, kind of like the goombas or koopas from Mario.
 

Matleo

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I think the problem with villains that can put up a fight is they would curbstomp an eleven-year-old. If we're going to keep having child protagonists, the children need at least a chance to win rather than being used a mop every time they meet the enemy. And countering an army would definitely be beyond anything a child could handle.
what about oponents related to spirits and paranormal?
let's say spirits of evil trainers that hold their pokemon still captured?
Or maybe our rival is possesed by one and want's to win the league only to gain a object or something to controll all pokemon in the world? Always felt that evil king motive from Battle
Piramid not used enough and not good enough really.
This kind also could have followers.

We didn't had in pokemon cults, worshippers, followers that would "worship pokemon" too much and lets say want to destroy humanity, lets say be dangerous in ways of protecting them or wanting Pokemon to control the world? We always had humans that wanted power over pokemon... would be interesting to have a pokemon that could reverse that.

Also we didn't had villians that lets say more use technology. Alchemy
With and against pokemon... that would lets say use electric, psychic, poison and steel types more...

Spiritualists that would use psychic, fairy, ghost, dark and dragons.

Nature obsesed that use ground, water, fire, grass,electric, flying, fairy.

A cult of fighters that use Ninja and warrior motive oriented pokemon.
 
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prog rocker

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what about oponents related to spirits and paranormal?
let's say spirits of evil trainers that hold their pokemon still captured?
Or maybe our rival is possesed by one and want's to win the league only to gain a object or something to controll all pokemon in the world? Always felt that evil king motive from Battle
Piramid not used enough and not good enough really.
This kind also could have followers.

We didn't had in pokemon cults, worshippers, followers that would "worship pokemon" too much and lets say want to destroy humanity, lets say be dangerous in ways of protecting them or wanting Pokemon to control the world? We always had humans that wanted power over pokemon... would be interesting to have a pokemon that could reverse that.

Also we didn't had villians that lets say more use technology. Alchemy
With and against pokemon... that would lets say use electric, psychic, poison and steel types more...

Spiritualists that would use psychic, fairy, ghost, dark and dragons.

Nature obsesed that use ground, water, fire, grass,electric, flying, fairy.

A cult of fighters that use Ninja and warrior motive oriented pokemon.
I don't know if it only applied to Yu-Gi-Oh! or not, but I don't Japan would include anything cult-related in Pokémon after a certain incident with a sex cult (I'm not kidding). Or the whole Aum Shinrikyo thing, where otakus got mis-blamed (again).

Also, "religion of evil" stories are even more cliché than what Pokémon deals with.
 

Ereshkigal

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what about oponents related to spirits and paranormal?
let's say spirits of evil trainers that hold their pokemon still captured?
Or maybe our rival is possesed by one and want's to win the league only to gain a object or something to controll all pokemon in the world? Always felt that evil king motive from Battle
Piramid not used enough and not good enough really.
This kind also could have followers.

We didn't had in pokemon cults, worshippers, followers that would "worship pokemon" too much and lets say want to destroy humanity, lets say be dangerous in ways of protecting them or wanting Pokemon to control the world? We always had humans that wanted power over pokemon... would be interesting to have a pokemon that could reverse that.
We already had four teams that wanted to destroy humanity to come capacity: Teams Aqua and Magma in their remake (which I found annoying; the original version was better), Team Galactic, and Team Flare. And religion of evil kinda sounds off for Pokemon, given how that world treats their gods. Even how they treat their spirits comes to mind; a lot less evil, even on the malevolent ones, and a lot more just predatory animals.

To be honest, this entire idea seems like a Western approach to spiritualism and religion, whereas Pokemon is founded heavily in an Eastern approach. I don't see that changing any time soon.

Also we didn't had villians that lets say more use technology. Alchemy
With and against pokemon... that would lets say use electric, psychic, poison and steel types more...
Team Flare was all about technology, including their use of the Ultimate Weapon.

I think it helps to keep culture in mind with these games. While Japan is perfectly capable of understanding a Western approach to spiritualism and magic, they also have their own approach and Pokemon is very much rooted at its core in the Japanese approach. That's part of why the "pokemon are demons" idea that went around years ago wouldn't have made as much sense to Japanese people; Pokemon effectively are demons, but the demons of Japan that range as much in personality and intent as humanity does and are often manifestations of human nature rather than the evil tempters the people spreading the idea were thinking of.
 

Matleo

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I don't know if it only applied to Yu-Gi-Oh! or not, but I don't Japan would include anything cult-related in Pokémon after a certain incident with a sex cult (I'm not kidding). Or the whole Aum Shinrikyo thing, where otakus got mis-blamed (again).

Also, "religion of evil" stories are even more cliché than what Pokémon deals with.
"not evil" but maybe obsessed with power, knowledge and other things... everything needs to do with sex?
You have watched Captain America Civil War... two sides both think they are good and fight each other?
I think Japanese take things too personal sometimes.
Though about Chaos and Order how would be if two organizations would try to make them happen.

Not destroy humanity and pokemon but control... what if one team wants Order and the Other wants chaos? Imagine a legendary pokemon and a small group of pokemon that could evolve into two different directions Order- more human or object like , Chaos- more beast like.
 

prog rocker

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"not evil" but maybe obsessed with power, knowledge and other things... everything needs to do with sex?
You have watched Captain America Civil War... two sides both think they are good and fight each other?
I think Japanese take things too personal sometimes.
Though about Chaos and Order how would be if two organizations would try to make them happen.

Not destroy humanity and pokemon but control... what if one team wants Order and the Other wants chaos? Imagine a legendary pokemon and a small group of pokemon that could evolve into two different directions Order- more human or object like , Chaos- more beast like.
Dude, that's no what I'm talking about. I said that cults got banned after an incident with a sex cult, not that the cult had to do with sex. Also, you completely ignored the whole Aum Shinrikyo part: It was the cult that made the 90's sarin gas attacks in Japanese trains, where they blamed otakus because the AS leader based their philosophy on anime. That's the reason why Japan is (was?) a little bit touchy about cults.

EDIT: An example of the ban was with Yu-Gi-Oh! 5D's, where they had to scrap the original second part of the anime after that cult scandal and the fact one of seiyuus was involved in it.
 

Matleo

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Dude, that's no what I'm talking about. I said that cults got banned after an incident with a sex cult, not that the cult had to do with sex. Also, you completely ignored the whole Aum Shinrikyo part: It was the cult that made the 90's sarin gas attacks in Japanese trains, where they blamed otakus because the AS leader based their philosophy on anime. That's the reason why Japan is (was?) a little bit touchy about cults.

EDIT: An example of the ban was with Yu-Gi-Oh! 5D's, where they had to scrap the original second part of the anime after that cult scandal and the fact one of seiyuus was involved in it.
they think that culture is responsible... how arrogant way of thinking.
Then Priests and high Orders... good that they don't ban temples and everything... censorship...
 

prog rocker

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they think that culture is responsible... how arrogant way of thinking.
Then Priests and high Orders... good that they don't ban temples and everything... censorship...
Not so much censorship as it's a sour spot. Putting something like that would be like mentioning the Boston Marathon Bombing in a kids videogame.

EDIT: Also, it's not about religion, it was about cults specifically. Also, you are acting as if your country, whatever it is, didn't blame anything on anyone.
 
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Kyriaki

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I'd like to see a rich Big Boss hiring an entire lab. The scientists would split two sides. One side joins the Boss for different reasons (i.e., money, agreeing with the Boss's ideals, etc). Another side is secretly planning to overthrow the Boss. We could get different sprites or models for the scientists depending on their alignment.

And when the protagonist helps liberate the lab, half the antagonizing scientists escape and join the Big Boss.

*gasp* We could actually witness the growth of an organization throughout the game.
 

prog rocker

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I'd like to see a rich Big Boss hiring an entire lab. The scientists would split two sides. One side joins the Boss for different reasons (i.e., money, agreeing with the Boss's ideals, etc). Another side is secretly planning to overthrow the Boss. We could get different sprites or models for the scientists depending on their alignment.

And when the protagonist helps liberate the lab, half the antagonizing scientists escape and join the Big Boss.

*gasp* We could actually witness the growth of an organization throughout the game.
It could work, seeing how it would still have those mobs that are actually needed in the game. Just don't make the Big Boss a cliché.
 

Ereshkigal

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I'd like to see a rich Big Boss hiring an entire lab. The scientists would split two sides. One side joins the Boss for different reasons (i.e., money, agreeing with the Boss's ideals, etc). Another side is secretly planning to overthrow the Boss. We could get different sprites or models for the scientists depending on their alignment.

And when the protagonist helps liberate the lab, half the antagonizing scientists escape and join the Big Boss.

*gasp* We could actually witness the growth of an organization throughout the game.
Make the Big Boss be the Pokemon Professor who gives you your first Pokemon and generally acts kind and supporting to you. Give you reason to feel conflicted.
 

Matleo

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Not so much censorship as it's a sour spot. Putting something like that would be like mentioning the Boston Marathon Bombing in a kids videogame.

EDIT: Also, it's not about religion, it was about cults specifically. Also, you are acting as if your country, whatever it is, didn't blame anything on anyone.
the use other names then cult but that won't eliminate the phenomenom of priests and similar stuff.
 

prog rocker

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the use other names then cult but that won't eliminate the phenomenom of priests and similar stuff.
Then that would fall into the "religion of evil" that is plaguing 90% of JRPGs. Seriously, I disconnect my brain every time that plot comes.

EDIT: I blame Final Fantasy Tactics for this one cliché. I know older games did that, too, but FFT is still the most popular example.
 
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