Gen VI Pokemon File format discovered

[Stratelier]

But I don't think anyone has to worry about "hacked" Pokemon being transported over since Nintendo plans on programming in certain checks to make sure the Pokemon's data comes up valid.

There are also the matter of things like IV and shiny hacks which can't be detected because there's nothing technically illegal about the data, it's just something that under normal circumstances is really very improbable and difficult to actually get. (Now with the Friend Safari having Pokemon with one or two maxed IV's this is not as unlikely as before, but still. A Pokemon with flawless IV's and shiny is very probable to have been hacked to be that way)

I really hope they dont crack the code.

From what I saw in the links posted early (and atm not entirely culled btw) they've already got 'cleartext' versions of the PKX file data (yes it's still binary values but whatever shuffling/obfuscation the game uses prior to transmitting the file has already been broken). There was even an in-game screenshot of an allegedly tweaked .PKX file (i.e. hacked Pokemon) successfully imported/traded back to XY. So unfortunately they are pretty much there already -- the biggest obstacle to all hacks is simply unlocking the front door; if you can do that, everything behind it is easy picking. The only way to really prevent this is for the file to contain some method of secure checksum/hashtag to authenticate whether the rest of the data is legit. Because the exact method for generating that checksum is something known only to the developers, if you can't generate a matching checksum, then it doesn't matter whether you know the rest of the format or can tweak values because you just can't get the game to accept it back.

 

[bluestarfish]

To add onto the whole talk on corrupting games, the 4th gen ones at least have backups, one time I accidentally popped the cartridge out of my ds while playing which corrupted the save file. The game informed me of the corruption and restored it from an older save. I'm not sure if the newer games also do this, but it is worth knowing about.


I don't know if I have any hacked pokemon off the gts, but I've never had any problems with my games acting up, and I don't especially care if they look legitimate enough to nintendo that they can make it through the gts after they put the hack sniffers on it.

 

[Cute Charm]

If they were doing this in the name of finding out unreleased info, pictures, and the dummied out stuff. YAY! Good for them! Bring on the leftovers and new info!

But everything is just pointing to doing this just so they can continue hacking pokemon. Which just brings up the thought that Wonder Trade was fun while it lasted.

 

[JarieSuicune]

Those poor unlucky us who only get Route 2/3 Pokemon from Wonder Trade envy you others... not even bred starters... (Not that I dislike the system, I love it! Just... WAY too much no-need Pokemon being dumped in. It should have been a locked feature until several routes later in the game, at least...)

Yeah, I've enjoyed making perfect teams via PokeGen, but I'd be more than happy to see it stopped down completely for creating into Gen VI. Same goes for failing to get into the main of the games. Seriously, this is the FIRST time since Red/Green that there has been ANY form of real mystery for more than... one day or so after release (which is saying something, since a number of retailers sold these games well before release... jerks).

Would it really kill those people to just enjoy the games, if only for a couple months? It's also rather nice to NOT have perfect teams, since those imperfections help balance things by sheer unknowns (don't you dare tell me that you've never gotten a thrill from outspeeding/overpowering a Pokemon with something that has no business otherwise doing so at equal levels!). You don't know for certain that your opponent's Mega Gardevoir has totally maxed out Speed and Sp.Attack, so you can actually consider using something that could otherwise be a touch slower/frailer.

Once people all over have had a chance to fully enjoy all the awesomeness there is here, then I'd not mind things opening up, since then it wouldn't really make much difference. (As numerous people have pointed out, getting the perfect team is already not very difficult if you just work at it; even having them all Shiny isn't as much of a sign of being over-obsessed any more.)
The only real benefit I see to be gained is extra copies of limited items/Event-exclusive Pokemon.

In short: I'd rather just a Cloning method be found and leave it at that. No more is needed in the end.

 

[randomspot555]

I more have a problem with people trading hacks to those that do not know they are hacked, but that was just my paranoia over the circumstance, no Idea if the Pokemon was really hacked but its long gone. Im very careful with my games and systems as well. I did not drop the system or anything. Hacks still should not be put on the GTS or Wonder Trade.

I 100% agree that people who trade hacks to unknowing trainers is a completely crappy thing to do. However, hacks do not "occasionally" or otherwise harm the game or save file unless you are the person actually inserting the malicious Pokemon or badly made AR code yourself and there's a 0% chance of trading that harmful Pokemon away because, again, the effects of a bad hack are immediate. And again, the cause of a save file stopping due to a bad hack isn't the actual hacked Pokemon but rather the loading of a badly made or too many AR codes at once.

 

[Heredity]

If they were doing this in the name of finding out unreleased info, pictures, and the dummied out stuff. YAY! Good for them! Bring on the leftovers and new info!

But everything is just pointing to doing this just so they can continue hacking pokemon. Which just brings up the thought that Wonder Trade was fun while it lasted.

I've seen the image Stratelier has mentioned, where this group has modified a file and then sent it to X/Y via WonderTrade, and nothing about discovering new information. So, take that as whatever you wish to.

I'm more so bummed out about this because I think that these modified Pokémon make competitive battling that much harder. Not just online either, at the last official Nintendo hosted tournament I went to, I heard a lot of folk laughing about whether they should 'go legit for this one.'

 

[BigBadBatter]

Best part of the game? Wonder Trading without any fear you might get something hacked in return. It'll be a damn shame when that's no longer possible. I don't compete in tournaments or anything, but even the thought something in my game may be hacked is enough to irritate and bother me. :/

Yes this bothers me as well because there was an incident I experienced in an older game where I got what I thought was a normal Pokemon off the GTS holding a Master Ball and a short time after the game froze for a bit of time and I had to restart the game. I was paranoid that this Pokemon I got froze the game. I released it automatically. Hacks can occasionally harm your game, so I have a problem with them for that reason. I have a problem with hacks being unknowingly distributed to others but people do give hacks out knowing full well they are hacked. I wish this risk to not exist in Gen 6. I really hope they dont crack the code.

Hacks can harm the game in that they can cause it to stop (in which case, power off, power on, and just re-start the game from the save on the main menu) but they can't cause save files to be deleted or anything like that. That being said, due to the way those types of hacks are produced (often times, by a botched, poorly made AR code), they'll automatically become a problem and there isn't even a chance of trading them because once the code is started it'll automatically freeze the game. Usually these AR codes aren't even for a single Pokemon, but something like 6+Pokemon generated at once, or the casue of multiple AR codes being used simultaneously. Basically these harmful hacks are completely self-inflicted and automatic and since they're automatic, there is an absolute 0% chance of them being traded. AND the harm isn't the Pokemon itself but in the action the AR is trying to make the game do, thus overloading it and causing the game to pause.

Games can freeze in completely normal circumstances. Closing the DS into sleep mode all of a sudden sometimes causes that to happen, if the system is dropped while the game is playing, if a disconnection happens at the wrong time during wireless activities, etc... It is highly unlikely that that specific Pokemon, or any individual hacked Pokemon, that is able to be traded causes any actual harm to a save file.

I more have a problem with people trading hacks to those that do not know they are hacked, but that was just my paranoia over the circumstance, no Idea if the Pokemon was really hacked but its long gone. Im very careful with my games and systems as well. I did not drop the system or anything. Hacks still should not be put on the GTS or Wonder Trade.

There are some things that are easy to notice in hacks, ie starters in masterballs, incorrect met at level, egg move mons not in pokeballs (not gen 6), the list goes on.

 

[The Outrage]

I more have a problem with people trading hacks to those that do not know they are hacked, but that was just my paranoia over the circumstance, no Idea if the Pokemon was really hacked but its long gone. Im very careful with my games and systems as well. I did not drop the system or anything. Hacks still should not be put on the GTS or Wonder Trade.

There are some things that are easy to notice in hacks, ie starters in masterballs, incorrect met at level, egg move mons not in pokeballs (not gen 6), the list goes on.[/QUOTE]

You can catch starters in Friend Safari, and the type of ball a Pokemon has from breeding is dependent on the mother. Hidden Abilities can now be passed by males, moves by females, which means there's no longer any illegal egg combination just because you can't get a father with all the moves.

 

[bluestarfish]

I'm more so bummed out about this because I think that these modified Pokémon make competitive battling that much harder. Not just online either, at the last official Nintendo hosted tournament I went to, I heard a lot of folk laughing about whether they should 'go legit for this one.'

Even ignoring people that hack their mons, lots of people that are competitive in the official tournaments RNG their monsters (particularly the legendaries that are allowed), so it really doesn't matter if they are hackable or not, people will always find a way. (not especially relevant to the overall conversation, other than that hacking or not as far as the official competitions go there will be people that abuse things to get the edge).


Apparently quite a few people get caught and disqualified from those comps before even getting to enter because hacked mons were detected on their cart, whether those were mons that looked legitimate but somehow didn't pass or what I don't know, but hacking isn't as easy to get away with as one would think.

 

[Heredity]

I'm more so bummed out about this because I think that these modified Pokémon make competitive battling that much harder. Not just online either, at the last official Nintendo hosted tournament I went to, I heard a lot of folk laughing about whether they should 'go legit for this one.'

Even ignoring people that hack their mons, lots of people that are competitive in the official tournaments RNG their monsters (particularly the legendaries that are allowed), so it really doesn't matter if they are hackable or not, people will always find a way. (not especially relevant to the overall conversation, other than that hacking or not as far as the official competitions go there will be people that abuse things to get the edge).


Apparently quite a few people get caught and disqualified from those comps before even getting to enter because hacked mons were detected on their cart, whether those were mons that looked legitimate but somehow didn't pass or what I don't know, but hacking isn't as easy to get away with as one would think.

The way Nintendo holds the tournaments here, you're probably only going to be detected of doing so if you are required to insert your game card into their special unit that's connected to a TV. Otherwise, you have a 50% chance in the finals of just getting through with your regular old 3DS/DS.

Modifying your 'mons has always felt unfair to me, especially after I did it in Gen III with a Gameshark and transferred the Pokemon I gained to Gen IV - subsequently flooring anyone I took on; Gen VI has been fun so far, I can verse randoms wirelessly and actually win with strategy and an EV'd team. I guess that fun's not going to last for long though, thanks to PP.

 

[Pikafanboy]

But everything is just pointing to doing this just so they can continue hacking pokemon. Which just brings up the thought that Wonder Trade was fun while it lasted.

Indeed. I've really enjoyed it thus far, but if the hacking has begun already I'm done with Wonder Trade. There's never going to be a grace period again on top of that, since Pokemon Bank was described as being for all generations to come, meaning the hacks will always work their way up even if Nintendo's next system isn't itself hacked right away. "Legit" Pokemon like a shiny legendary with perfect IVs will make it through since it is technically possible.

 

[Cute Charm]

I've seen the image Stratelier has mentioned, where this group has modified a file and then sent it to X/Y via WonderTrade, and nothing about discovering new information. So, take that as whatever you wish to.

I'm more so bummed out about this because I think that these modified Pokémon make competitive battling that much harder. Not just online either, at the last official Nintendo hosted tournament I went to, I heard a lot of folk laughing about whether they should 'go legit for this one.'

That's what I meant, actually. If they were focused on the new and leftover stuff then they wouldn't be doing things like that and would just be off in some corner trying to crack the code and not attempting to dupe anything.

Nintendo really wants to put a stop to hacking regardless of the true issues the hacked pokemon cause. We can only hope that somewhere deep in the ignored coding GF or Nintendo have figured out how to put in a fail safe that hide hacked pokemon. Like having them not show up in the GTS or be able to be traded over Wonder Trade. Or maybe in the case of attempting to battle with a hacked pokemon they automatically replace it with a level 1 magikarp with crappy stats.

Indeed. I've really enjoyed it thus far, but if the hacking has begun already I'm done with Wonder Trade. There's never going to be a grace period again on top of that, since Pokemon Bank was described as being for all generations to come, meaning the hacks will always work their way up even if Nintendo's next system isn't itself hacked right away. "Legit" Pokemon like a shiny legendary with perfect IVs will make it through since it is technically possible.

From my understanding perhaps Pokemon Bank could tell the difference between legit shiny legendaries and hacked ones. Since the official ones are usually put out by PCI, maybe they have a long list of Trainer IDs and that's how they can differentiate the real from the fake ones.

Then again, people out there are greedy and crafty enough to probably even hack the Trainer ID numbers to make it look legit...in which case, like I said, there has to be (or at least should be IMO) a fail safe somewhere because Nintendo and PCI detest hacking with a passion.

 

[Heredity]

Seems Wonder Trade spoofing is closer to being possible.

I wish I'd just kept scrolling past that link, like I'd done before. But no, curiosity got the better of me and the OP shows

Spoiler

Diancie, Hoopa, and Volcanion.

Thanks GBATemp, thanks.

 

[Kalavinka]

Does that mean we can prepare a page for them on the wiki now? (even if it's just some draft in user subspace)

TBH I'm more interested in finding out base stats and the like. Datamine fun, although I'm still not sure whether this paves the way for actually mining the game or just the Pokémon data.

 

[The Outrage]

Well, it was fun trading while it lasted :/

 

[Regiruler]

I'm more so bummed out about this because I think that these modified Pokémon make competitive battling that much harder. Not just online either, at the last official Nintendo hosted tournament I went to, I heard a lot of folk laughing about whether they should 'go legit for this one.'

Even ignoring people that hack their mons, lots of people that are competitive in the official tournaments RNG their monsters (particularly the legendaries that are allowed), so it really doesn't matter if they are hackable or not, people will always find a way. (not especially relevant to the overall conversation, other than that hacking or not as far as the official competitions go there will be people that abuse things to get the edge).

The RNG process hasn't been discovered for X/Y yet IIRC and you get 3 perfect IVs anyway. Combine that with the synchronize of choice and it shouldn't be hard to get a perfect legendary.
This is somewhat pointless for now though as the only tournament-legal legendaries we have access to are the legendary birds.

EDIT: Built in acronym dictionary? neat

 

[bluestarfish]

Yeah, "for now" and once pokemon bank opens up, they're going to be trading up all their RNG'd mons from 4/5th gen. Whether people are hacking cleverly enough to get past detection or simply RNGing as far as the competitive scene goes, Nintendo they tweaks the rules it's going to be hard to be competitive in official tournaments unless you are willing to game the system one way or another. (and for whoever brought up the physical things, I'm only thinking about nintendos in person competitions to begin with where they catch and toss people with hacked mons)

As far as the whole hacking thing, I think it's best to wait and see what sorts of things happen. There's no denying that it's rather cheap particularly if you want to be competitive. And if one doesn't want to be spoiled on whatever ends up getting dumped, just avoid it. It isn't especially hard to do that.

I am pretty curious to see what hidden bits and pieces are in the game now, particularly in terms of things like data and game mechanics. I've already played through the game now, and it's pretty fun to get to see into the guts of how stuff works.

 

[Stratelier]

There are some things that are easy to notice in hacks, ie starters in masterballs, incorrect met at level, egg move mons not in pokeballs (not gen 6), the list goes on.

And some of them won't apply anymore, like how you can catch wild starters (and with hidden abilities) in the Friend Safari.

TBH I'm more interested in finding out base stats and the like. Datamine fun, although I'm still not sure whether this paves the way for actually mining the game or just the Pokémon data.

Not the game ROM itself, but if they can spoof Pokemon trades they can spoof and evaluate pretty much any and everything that can be sent in the trade. E.g. hack up a Lv.50 Pokemon with neutral Nature and zero total IV's and that basically tells you outright what their species' base stat values are.

 

[Tensho]

Good about hack: revealing of legendary, moveset, verify base stats, hidden items, mega, etc.
Bad: the wonder trade hazard.

 

[bluestarfish]

So since all this hacking and stuff has been being talked about, has anyone heard about the mystery egg things coming off wonder trade? I've been seeing bits and pieces of people talking about this in response to the fact that the games are slowly being cracked and was wondering if there is any credence to it?

Because if it is, I'm taking back my previous stance on hacked things, cause if these are getting through and corrupting pc boxes and things I don't want to have any part of that mess. If it is true I hope nintendo works out a way to at least give people a way to get rid of the bad eggs.