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Has Paul ever gotten in trouble for his abuse of Pokemon?

owenpeterson

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Pardon me if I haven't seen the D&P series yet, but I have heard and read about Paul and his behavior towards Ash as well as his own Pokemon.

It has been established that Paul from Sinnoh has been nothing short of a complete asshole. One thing that truly establishes his jerkass persona is of course the way he treats his Pokemon. The biggest crime in that department was the way he treated Chimchar. I won't get into too much detail there because you know what happened.

But one thing that confuses me is what Pokemon authority figures such as Nurse Joy, Officer Jenny, Professor's Oak, Elm, Birch, Rowan, etc could have done about him. Is it possible that they knew about his abuse of his Pokemon? Couldn't they suspend his Pokemon licence? What do they personally think of his rotten attitude?

Maybe it has happened before. Maybe not. I can imagine that in the real world, someone like Paul would have become a juvenile delinquent, get thrown into detention centers, jail cells, etc.

Has Paul ever been disciplined for his behavior in the show? Do you think he should have been?
 

sc190191

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Paul was always very respectful of authority figures in the Anime so they had no reason to reprimand him. Also, although he trained his Pokemon very hard, it was established later in the Sinnoh series that his style just differed from Ash, and even at multiple points there were parallels between Ash and Paul's training styles. He was hard on his Pokemon, and certainly his actions towards Chimchar seemed abusive, but it should be noted that all of his Pokemon liked him except for Chimchar. His brother, Reggie, was a well respected trainer and breeder and did not have any issues with how Paul trained his Pokemon. Also I think many people forget that Ash and Paul left each other on respectful terms as if they finally understood each other. Many of his training methods were fairly dramatized in order to increase the divide between Ash early in the series, but it was clear he still cared for those of his Pokemon that were hard working. His training style is really not much different than how many coaches treat their players in sports such as basketball and football and although not all players respond to this type of training, many of them respect and love their coaches for it as they also have a strong desire to improve. It is just a different style that works for some and not for others, which is why Paul was willing to release Pokemon if they would not thrive under his care. The beginning of the series painted Paul as more of a villain (mostly because he was still shrouded in mystery), but if you watch the entire series you will see that he is just another trainer who wants to succeed, with Pokemon that also really want to succeed, he just has a different style than we are used to.
 

ii kanji

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Maybe not. I can imagine that in the real world, someone like Paul would have become a juvenile delinquent, get thrown into detention centers, jail cells, etc.
Omg LOL how funny! You need to just watch DP.
 

Hidden Mew

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Maybe it has happened before. Maybe not. I can imagine that in the real world, someone like Paul would have become a juvenile delinquent, get thrown into detention centers, jail cells, etc.

Considering that you haven't watched DP yet, that's a pretty strange conclusion to jump to. While Paul was abusive to at least Chimchar, I don't think that meant he would have become a juvenile delinquent. For starters, he was usually pretty respectful to authority figures like Professors and most of the Gym Leaders he faced. Juvenile delinquents usually aren't known for that kind of behavior.

I'm not sure if any of the Professors could have suspended his Pokemon license. They don't seem to have that kind of authority. Officer Jenny might have been able to do something if she had seen his behavior, but that's probably about it. I do remember Nurse Joy calling Paul out on how he was impatient more than anything else when he was pushing Chimchar too hard, but I think that's all that she could have done. The show definitely emphasized that Paul's behavior towards his Pokemon was pretty bad, especially with Chimchar. There definitely were similarities to Ash and Paul's training styles, but the differences were there too. Paul was physically and emotionally abusive towards Chimchar. He was willing to push it beyond its limits and risk injuring it just so that Chimchar could unlock its Blaze ability. Even though his other Pokemon seemed to like Paul and that training method worked for them, that doesn't make Chimchar's abuse suddenly okay.

Ash and Paul did end their rivalry being on more respectful terms and we didn't hear or see Paul releasing Pokemon as often as before later on in the series, although I don't know if that meant that he stopped doing that. I don't think that Paul would have been thrown in jail in the real world, but I do think that the show never really made all of his behavior and training methods look okay. We weren't used to this kind of harsh training method, but I don't think that were were to agree with it, or at least not all of it, in the context of the anime.
 

owenpeterson

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Considering that you haven't watched DP yet, that's a pretty strange conclusion to jump to. While Paul was abusive to at least Chimchar, I don't think that meant he would have become a juvenile delinquent. For starters, he was usually pretty respectful to authority figures like Professors and most of the Gym Leaders he faced. Juvenile delinquents usually aren't known for that kind of behavior.

Okay so I admit that the juvenile delinquent stuff was a bit strong and more appropriate to describe Team Rocket members and other members of crime syndicates. But I did also read somewhere that Paul did in fact disrespect the gym leader of his hometown Veilstone City, Maylene, when he insulted her after defeating her. And it was Ash who had to help her regain her confidence. That seems pretty low for Paul in my opinion.
 

Arceus the Dragon

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I don't believe that Paul has ever got in trouble in the series.
 

Hidden Mew

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Okay so I admit that the juvenile delinquent stuff was a bit strong and more appropriate to describe Team Rocket members and other members of crime syndicates. But I did also read somewhere that Paul did in fact disrespect the gym leader of his hometown Veilstone City, Maylene, when he insulted her after defeating her. And it was Ash who had to help her regain her confidence. That seems pretty low for Paul in my opinion.

I agree that was low of Paul, but he only acted that way to that Gym Leader because it was easy to defeat her. Aside from that, he generally seemed respectful enough to Gym Leaders. It still would be better to actually watch the series before passing judgements or making various claims about a character though.
 

sc190191

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Paul is a reflection of competitive trainers irl.
This is very true, but I think if Pokemon training was real life that a significant amount less people would train in this fashion.

The anime isn't really consistent though when portraying actions similar to Paul's. Ash has many times trained his Pokemon very hard. Usually they want to get better also, and certainly even Chimchar had a great desire to improve. Is Brock a bad trainer because he commanded his Forretress to use explosion?

Another random question, why is someone who hasn't seen DP creating this thread/arguing about hearsay?
 

owenpeterson

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Another random question, why is someone who hasn't seen DP creating this thread/arguing about hearsay?
I've read about his character traits from Bulbapedia, fanfictions and from other comments on this board, if it helps any. But you're right I do need to take a peek at Diamond and Pearl if you insist.

Back on topic however. There have been other instances where Paul's training methods were used in a similar fashion. Such as AJ from early on in Kanto, though that was more of a tough love sort of thing, so I can't hold anything against him. But Damien was truly abusive towards Charmander to the point where he almost killed it. One has to wonder if THAT would have gotten his (Damien's) Pokemon licence revoked.
 

Hidden Mew

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This is very true, but I think if Pokemon training was real life that a significant amount less people would train in this fashion.

The anime isn't really consistent though when portraying actions similar to Paul's. Ash has many times trained his Pokemon very hard. Usually they want to get better also, and certainly even Chimchar had a great desire to improve. Is Brock a bad trainer because he commanded his Forretress to use explosion?

I think that there's a big difference between Ash training his Pokemon hard and what Paul did to Chimchar. Yes, Ash trains his Pokemon hard and Chimchard wanted to get stronger as well, but the key difference is that Ash never pushed his Pokemon to the point where their health was in danger. That's what Paul did during the Tag Battle arc. He was willing to hurt Chimchar as much as he could to get it to use Blaze, pushed it to the brink of exhaustion, wanted to use Thunder to wake it up, used it in a battle despite being told to give Chimchar some rest and abandoned during the match simply because of its emotional scars. Ash would never do anything like that and comparing to Brock telling Forretress to use Explosion doesn't work either. Explosion isn't on the level of physical and emotional abuse, especially when Brock would call it back afterwards and get it healed. If Ash saw that one of his Pokemon was too hurt or tired to keep training, he'd stop and take them to a Pokemon Center. Paul wouldn't do that with Chimchar and Ash had to step in to give it the medical treatment it needed.

Paul isn't an abusive trainer because he pushes his Pokemon hard. He's an abusive trainer because he pushes his Pokemon, or at least Chimchar, to where their health is in danger and his treatment towards Chimchar left clear and deep emotional scars.

I've read about his character traits from Bulbapedia, fanfictions and from other comments on this board, if it helps any. But you're right I do need to take a peek at Diamond and Pearl if you insist.

Using second hand information and especially fan fictions to judge a character seems like a really bad idea to me.

owenpeterson said:
Back on topic however. There have been other instances where Paul's training methods were used in a similar fashion. Such as AJ from early on in Kanto, though that was more of a tough love sort of thing, so I can't hold anything against him. But Damien was truly abusive towards Charmander to the point where he almost killed it. One has to wonder if THAT would have gotten his (Damien's) Pokemon licence revoked.

AJ was hard on his Pokemon, but it was more along the lines of tough love since he actually did care for his Pokemon. Damien nearly killing Charmander would have resulted in some serious consequences if the police knew about it. Although, I don't know if a trainer having their Pokemon license revoked is something that can happen in the anime.
 

sc190191

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I have one last thing to say about this Paul nonsense before I move on. In my opinion the rivalry with Paul was one of the best written portions of the anime. Their relationship wasn't a simplified good/evil relationship or a friend/friend relationship like many relationships in the show. Paul started off portrayed very negatively, which certainly drove up passion against him, but eventually the realization was not that Paul was evil, but that all people have different ways of thinking and different backgrounds that lead them to the actions in every day life. I do think a lot of Paul's training styles were meant as a way for people who play the games to think about the way they train (because it is very much like how many train/battle in the game i.e. toxic orb/guts combo, etc.) and consider if this is how they would want to be if they were actually a trainer. Paul certainly was portrayed more negatively in the beginning, but just as Ash learned and grew from having Paul as a rival, Paul learned and grew from having Ash as a rival. I do think that the way Paul treated Chimchar was certainly going too far, but otherwise his training style was not wrong, just different. This is part of the lesson that was portrayed, that it is okay to be different and to train in the way that suits you and your team best, while always trying to learn and improve. Anyway, I am very glad that Paul was a part of the anime. I wouldn't call him one of my favorite characters by any stretch, but I also think the DP series wouldn't have been nearly as good without him. I really appreciate the less simplified relationships during the DP series, and this one was the best of them. No one is perfect and I feel as though Paul learned from the Chimchar incident and was a better trainer for it, and that the respect shown between Ash and Paul at the end of the series was an important part of the series development.
 

Johtohfiller

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He should have lost his license for what he did to Chimchar. No one saw him do it though.
 

A Wild Luxray

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Paul was a very unlikeable character, but the DP series wouldn't have been the same without him. He was rude, disrespectful, and awful to his Pokemon. It made me so happy when Zoey took a stand to that asshole and I wish she got all up in his face more. He was a good rival though, because he was a foil to Ash and pushed Ash to his limits.
 

Gengarzilla

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Nurse Joy got on his case once, but I think that's about it.
 

A Wild Luxray

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I think Cynthia did also after she completely wrecked his team. I know through the battle that she showed obvious signs that she wasn't to pleased with his behavior. When Paul criticized Chimchar, she did seem shocked and appalled by what he said. I think she only really demanded that he visited the Pokemon Center after the battle in a very stern way. It wasn't like a please go, it was more like a GET YOUR ASS THERE RIGHT NOW! ITS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY SO GO!
 
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