Help with E4 Champion

It's Marill, bitch
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Hi guys. I need some help beating this woman for the first time. I trained my team by going through the Elite Four until the team faints about twice already (each time I got to the third/fourth guy's steel/psychic, can't remember it's name). I got to the champion the third time round, and yes I stupidly saved that time. I don't mind losing to her and just doing that all again, but I've gotten very close to beating her several times. It just seems a waste.

Anyway here's my team, and yes I realise I have two ground types in there. I didn't research too well b4 playing and was surprised to find that Gastrodon was water/ground. My other team mate was Ponyta which I stopped training to leave room for Lucario. Oh well:


STARAPTOR / Level 51
Moves: Fly, Defog, Close Combat, Aerial Ace
Item : Sky Plate
This I keep using on the ghost/dark, it does the most damage to it. However it's usually weak when I bring it out much later to fight Lucario or Roselia's evo. Plus it usually dies during the terrible battle against Garchomp

LUXRAY / Level 49
Moves: Thunder Fang, Strength, Shock Wave, Crunch
Item : Quick Claw
Because it's speed is quite low it takes off half damage to the Milotic, whose ice beam takes off 2/3's. If I'm lucky it gets parlyzed and you'd think I 'd be able to finish it off, but that time it takes it to red and it fully heals. You can imagine the reaction :/

LUCARIO / Level 49
Moves: Close Combat, Drain Punch, Rock Smash, Aura Sphere
Item : Fist Plate
Is second in line to fight Garchomp as Drain Punch does do it's duty, not much pp and as everything is faster than me it's futile to raise it's pp when I run out, if it even survives that long.

DRAPION / Level 49
Moves: Poison Fang, Crunch, Dark Pulse, Fire Fang
Item : Blackglasses
If I don't use Staraptor I use this against the ghost, doesn't do as well most of the time. If it's full health it's ok against a few others. It's usually dead by the time the last two come out, and that's always Lucario or Roserade.

GASTRODON / Level 50
Moves: Surf, Waterfall, Mud Bomb, Water Pulse
Item : Wise Glasses
Excellent special so it usually does ok against one of the enemy team, it's usually my last one out though. Again Milotic or the newly brought out Roserade kills all hope.

TORTERRA / Level 50
Moves: Earthquake, Synthesis, Mega Drain, Razor Leaf
Item : Shell Bell
Knocks her Gastrodon in one hit, if it doesnt then she wastes one/two items on it.. which I'm ok with. Is the best against Garchomp with Earthquake and Mega Drain. However most of the time I need to use Full Restores, and in the next move I'm back down to yellow. It's a very slow battle. Would be nice to use against Milotic if it wasn't for that rotten Ice Beam.


My this post is long. I have to get rid of some of the hm's I know that (defog for example), and Close Combat isn't too good. The furthest I've gotten against this girl is one left, and that was Roserade. Unfortunately Gastrodon was my last which knocked out Lucario, leaving it in the yellow. You can imagine what happened next. And yes I had used my many revies already. I've probably already answered my own question by explaining all that anyhow, but a second opinion would be nice. My second game team in Pearl was a bit more prepared for this moment than this, it always is.
 
It's Marill, bitch
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Wow quick reply :) thanks

I do have two ghost types I'd be willing to use:
Misdreavous/Mismagius which would require catching a new one and training it. I have one on Pearl, I only have one DS.

Spiritomb, caught it but not sure of it's level.

EDIT:
I just had another go, and my god I was so close. I got to the last one, Roserade and had my Staraptor out in yellow health. I counted on my Staraptor being fast but Roserade was faster, and a sludge bomb ended that. I wish had fully restored him. Still that garchomp is my main problem. I know a better way to get Milotic out of the way though, but it costs me my Drapion, strangely though Luxray survived which was a first.

EDIT2:
After dying, I had a look at what I have to replace.
Spiritomb 25, do some levelling up obviously
Ponyta 30 (would die to Garchomp, never mind)
Driftloon 22, again level up
My own Milotic, it was born with Hypnosis. I got traded the Feebas
Sneasel 32, has ice moves which would be nice.
Abra 7, needs a LOT of training but it's always been very helpful on FireRed/Leaf Green.

I don't want to have to resort to legendaries, but they are the types I want (psychic and dragon)
Dialga 47
Uxie/Azelf 50, really need psychic. move set isnt too great
 
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Addicted to Shinies
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Wow quick reply :) thanks

I do have two ghost types I'd be willing to use:
Misdreavous/Mismagius which would require catching a new one and training it. I have one on Pearl, I only have one DS.

Spiritomb, caught it but not sure of it's level.

EDIT:
I just had another go, and my god I was so close. I got to the last one, Roserade and had my Staraptor out in yellow health. I counted on my Staraptor being fast but Roserade was faster, and a sludge bomb ended that. I wish had fully restored him. Still that garchomp is my main problem. I know a better way to get Milotic out of the way though, but it costs me my Drapion, strangely though Luxray survived which was a first.

EDIT2:
After dying, I had a look at what I have to replace.
Spiritomb 25, do some levelling up obviously
Ponyta 30 (would die to Garchomp, never mind)
Driftloon 22, again level up
My own Milotic, it was born with Hypnosis. I got traded the Feebas
Sneasel 32, has ice moves which would be nice.
Abra 7, needs a LOT of training but it's always been very helpful on FireRed/Leaf Green.

I don't want to have to resort to legendaries, but they are the types I want (psychic and dragon)
Dialga 47
Uxie/Azelf 50, really need psychic. move set isnt too great
Do you have the national pokedex yet? If so, catch yourself a raticate/rattata, and breed a FEAR one. :p That can be used to take out the hardest ones at least... although those full restores are obnoxious. You'll have to estimate at least one full restore per Pokemon until she's used both of them...

Anyway, the FEAR Rattata is cheap, but it'll work. :p
 
It's Marill, bitch
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If I let myself lose after seeing every one of her team (which I have right now and just left.. just in case) then yes I do. All I needed I think was Garchomp

I hate to sound nooby tho, but what do you mean by FEAR? lol (must go search...)
 
DOES IT VIA COPY/PASTE
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Obviously, since you haven't yet beaten the E4, you wouldn't have the National Dex yet so don't worry about the FEAR Rattata.
FEAR stands for:
Focus Sash
Endeavor
Quick Attack
Rattata

Make your Level 1 Rattata use Endeavor. The other pokemon will most likely attack first, leaving your Rattata with 1 HP due to the Focus Sash. Your Rattata will then use Endeavor, bringing the opponents HP down to 1. Then, simply use Quick Attack to take out that last HP. Like Shuko said, it's cheap, but it works.
 
It's Marill, bitch
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Thanks for the help. I do have the Nationel Dex now so I've decided to use some different Pokemon that I was after b4 E4 anyway:
Eevee/Glaceon or Froslass
Gallade

I might get a dragon in from somewhere, probably not.. against another dragon of level 66 I think, not a good idea. Dunno who to replace though, I need to keep Staraptor and Torterra, possibly Luxray cos if I use it right it takes down Milotic without dying. Lucario may need a better moveset. I'm down to Gastrodon and Drapion. Probably both cos I wouldn't mind training a second guy (Gallade maybe) along with the ice type.
 
The freeze of ice!
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The way i would do it
STARAPTOR / Level 53
Moves: Fly, U-turn, Close Combat, Aerial Ace
Item : Sky Plate
This I keep using on the ghost/dark, it does the most damage to it. However it's usually weak when I bring it out much later to fight Lucario or Roselia's evo. Plus it usually dies during the terrible battle against Garchomp

LUXRAY / Level 54
Moves: Thunder Fang, Strength, Spark, Crunch
Item : Quick Claw
Because it's speed is quite low it takes off half damage to the Milotic, whose ice beam takes off 2/3's. If I'm lucky it gets parlyzed and you'd think I 'd be able to finish it off, but that time it takes it to red and it fully heals. You can imagine the reaction :/

LUCARIO / Level 54
Moves: Dragon pulse, extreme speed, flash cannon, Aura Sphere
Item : Fist Plate
Is second in line to fight Garchomp as Drain Punch does do it's duty, not much pp and as everything is faster than me it's futile to raise it's pp when I run out, if it even survives that long.

DRAPION / Level 53
Moves: Ice Fang, Crunch, Dark Pulse, Fire Fang
Item : Blackglasses
If I don't use Staraptor I use this against the ghost, doesn't do as well most of the time. If it's full health it's ok against a few others. It's usually dead by the time the last two come out, and that's always Lucario or Roserade.

GASTRODON / Level 50
Moves: Surf, Waterfall, Dig, Ice beam
Item : Wise Glasses
Excellent special so it usually does ok against one of the enemy team, it's usually my last one out though. Again Milotic or the newly brought out Roserade kills all hope.

TORTERRA / Level 57
Moves: Earthquake, Crunch, Giga Drain, Leaf Storm
Item : Shell Bell
Knocks her Gastrodon in one hit, if it doesnt then she wastes one/two items on it.. which I'm ok with. Is the best against Garchomp with Earthquake and Mega Drain. However most of the time I need to use Full Restores, and in the next move I'm back down to yellow. It's a very slow battle. Would be nice to use against Milotic if it wasn't for that rotten Ice Beam.
or use lv 56 dialga w/ blizzard, roar of time, dragon pulse, fire blast
or use lv 60 empoleon w/ ice beam hydro pump, brine, flash cannon
you should've picked piplup!
 
Religion is a club
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Put Charge onto Luxray. It will increase the power of your next Electric attack, and also raise your Special Defence (useful against Milotic's Ice Beam).

Staraptor needs Close Combat. It's fantastic against the right Pokemon.

Go to the Move Tutor (I assume you have a Heart Scale), and teach Torterra Wood Hammer. It's a move that uses it's attack stat (better than Special Attack) and has 100 base power compared to Razor Leaf's 55. Just watch out for the recoil.
 
It's Marill, bitch
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The problem with Luxray is that it is so damn slow against Milotic, she only gets a chance to attack once. Charge would be waisted I'm afraid. I have considered it.

I read somewhere about Wood Hammer so I've just taught it, the recoil doesnt seem too bad. He's level 51 now and has Giga Drain instead of Mega.

I did end up letting myself lose to get National Dex. I remember needing a fire type a lot during the E4 itself.

Thanks to the National Dex I've sent over one Eevee, got one from Hearthome and got Glaceon and Flareon. I figured I'd need a good fire type, not against the dragon obviously. I've got two fire types now and not sure which would be best: Flareon and Typhlosion. I als tried to catch a male Ralts so I could get Gallade (to replace Lucario), typical of my luck I ended up with a female. Gardevoir is usually pretty good so I'm training that. I don't want to get rid of too much of my team, as per usual I have too many team members than I can take lol. Any suggestions?? :p

Thanks all for the replies :)
 
Cheers to the Freeze
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If you're going to make use of W.Hammer/Giga Drain, give Torterra Big Root. Helps with the healing of recoil. Also, try Endeavor on Staraptor. Also, for those that hit you with the Physical moves, spamming a Staraptor/Luxray switch to shut down their Att could help you, but that only works if your Luxray has Intimidate and you have the right sort of restoratives.

If you have the Nat'dex, o_O it might be time to start migrating HMs off your high-level party members.
 
It's Marill, bitch
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Yeah I read about the Wood Hammer so that's done :) He used to have Big Root, I only swapped it for Shell Bell to help heal it but it's not too great. He's at 51 (almost everyone got levelled up) so it has Giga Drain now.

Good idea for Staraptor. HM's are mostly off, Staraptor and Luxray have an empty slot. I know Luxray's got another move to learn in it's late 50's.

Right now I've got 9, count 'em 9 team members to choose from, 3 new ones in training. I've ordered them on who's going to be the most useful during the fourth run through the E4, and Gardevoir ends up last, but it may prove useful against the Champ while some of the ones who are most useful b4 hand aren't.

TORTERRA: Giga Drain, Synthesis, Wood Hammer, Earthquake (51)
GASTRODON: Surf, Waterfall, Mud Bomb, Water Pulse (50)
DRAPION: Poison Fang, Crunch, Dark Pulse, Fire Fang (50)
STARAPTOR: Fly, Close Combat, Aerial Ace, (empty) (52)
GLACEON: Avalance, Icy Wind, Sand Attack, Quick Attack/Tackle (currenly only 21)
QUILAVA: Flame Wheel, Ember, Dig, Tackle/Quick Attack (currently 21)
LUXRAY: Thunder Fang, Shock Wave, Crunch, (empty) (50)
LUCARIO: Close Combat, Drain Punch, Aura Sphere, Dragon Pulse (50)
KIRLIA: Confusion, Magical Leaf, Lucky Chant .. and can't remember the last one (21 as well)

It obviously needs cutting down. This always happens to me, I can't settle for just six. Obviously I wont send the 21's into the E4, I'll train them as well as level up the others. The ones I was going to evict was Drapion and Gardevoir, still not overly sure. Ack >_<

Still appreciating all the replies and stuff, I still need to work on the movesets, there's some good suggestions. I've got loads of TM's I haven't used, sigh.
 
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... although those full restores are obnoxious.

Yes... yes, they are. It's ironic that you're better off knocking down only slightly more than half of an opponent Poke's HP than almost all of it. If you knock off a bit more than half, they won't use a Full Restore, and you can faint the Poke next turn.

If you take off almost all of the HP, they'll use a Full Restore, which basically wastes an extra PP for you since it ends up taking three hits to kill the foe. (Thank goodness they never seem to use two or three in a row).

I really, REALLY hate that sound in Elite Four battles: Beedle-oop-wooooooooo-OOOOOOP! then, "<Name> used a Full Restore!"
 
It's Marill, bitch
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Yeah I know, it's what annoys me the most during this match. That Milotic and Garchomp are such hackers: EVERY time my Luxray used Thunder Fang first time it would take half off, then the second time if she survived, it would just take half off what was left or get to red.. and yep, Full Restore. Luxray dies on the next Ice Beam and that's the end of that.

Garchomp.. the last time I battled that I had a good strategy for once that would of worked if it's HP didn't keep changing like Milotic's. I'm sure it was on yellow when it decided to use Full Restore, my next move would of killed it. It wiped out all but two before dying, the one who won was in the red.

It's not the noise it makes that gets me, it's the dreaded wait it does after u select a move it does before the noise. You know what's coming. Oh and why must this woman have Sitrus berries attached to each one, grates on me.. it really does.
 
It's Marill, bitch
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Double post. Sorry.

Update: I still have nine team members I'm not sure who to keep or not. Need some advice (I even have a topic on Serebii as well :p )

Torterra @Big Root (51) (m)
- Earthquake
- Giga Drain
- Synthesis
- Wood Hammer

Gastrodon @Wise Glasses (50) (f)
- Surf
- Mud Bomb
- Waterfall / might replace it for a special move
- Muddy Water

Drapion @Black Glasses (49) (f)
- Poison Fang
- Crunch
- Dark Pulse
- Fire Fang

Staraptor @Sky Plate (52) (m)
- Fly
- Aerial Ace
- Endeavor
- Brave Bird

Luxray @Quick Claw (50) (f)
- Thunder Fang
- Shock Wave
- Crunch
- (empty due to forgetting Strength)

Lucario @Fist Plate (50) (m)
- Dragon Pulse
- Close Combat
- Aura Sphere
- Drain Punch

~new
Glaceon @Icicle Spear (25) (m)
- Avalanche
- Icy Wind
- Quick Attack
- Hail

Kirlia @Odd Incense (25) (f/ was after a male for Gallade)
- Confusion
- Magical Leaf
- Calm Mind
- Lucky Chant

Quilava @Heat Rock (25) (m)
- Flame Wheel
- Ember
- Dig (egg move)
- Sunny Day

I'm torn between keeping: Kirlia, Gastrodon, and Lucario. I think Drapion is out though. Ack :S

Quick question though, when can you get to the routes on the right of the cave b4 the E4 (cant remember the name, omg brain has died). I thought it was after you got the National Dex, he's still blocking it so I assume it's when you beat the E4.
 
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