How did the original Ash's story end?

[Silktree]

@GalacticRonpa, I don't think you're on the same page as the rest of us. This discussion is not about the Movie 1 trailer, but rather about the original Ash not being carried over to the SM anime. You're free to use that trailer for your epilogue speculation, though.

@Kallyle, the SM games don't actually hint at the UBs destroying any world. All we know is that some people ended up leaving their world(s) without remembering why.

@FANG-TAN @Crystal Could you guys shed light on the parts of Shudo's blog entry that weren't translated on Reddit? Not the entire thing since it's very long, but just whatever seems interesting.

 

[kantoskies]

I think you guys might be.....taking this a bit too literally.

 

[Silktree]

And I think you're wrong, but the movie thread is already a place for that debate.

 

[Team Gaara]

Honestly, who's to say the "Original Ash" won't come back later after all this? And this is only for the movie and the SuMo Anime? It's a bit too soon to say that we're completely done with the Ash we've known up till now~

 

[Silktree]

Why would they bother jumping between continuities like that? To alienate not only the veteran fans, but also the kids growing up with SM? For heaven's sake: The 20th anniversary is not the right time for arbitrary decisions.

The most likely reason for this change is that they wanted to streamline the show and no longer be beholden to its history, considering how close Ash came to winning a league.

 

[Elementar]

I don't want to believe that it's another Ash, but if I had to ask what happened to the XY&Z one, I'd say he trained and eventually beat his father, who turned about to be Red, at the World Championships. They then go through the cheesy friend reunions, and he decides to take the mantle of the World Pokemon Champion, allowing him to travel the world and visit every region whenever he wants. I'd like that.

 

[Peppermint Phoenix]

@kantoskies link to actual quote?

Anyways this makes me pissed can now people can go "Welp the Ash we knew never won a league and never did lol at you the Ashnime sux where's my pokemon MANime?" I know I mixing memes but whatever they made Ash lose and release his Greninja just for the illusion that XY&Z and SM are the same continuity or because they prioritized team flare over the league and potential E4 battles that much?!

Whatever time to get my foolish fanfic wishes on: It's long though

Spoiler

After returning home Ash decides to train on Mount Silver for a year

During that time three things happen in addition to evolution:

Ash's Greninja surfs from Kalos and finds Ash

Ash befriends the Tyranitar tribe and evolves the Larvitar he befriended

Ash meets the trainer who started with Bulbasaur who also captured Ash's Pidgeot. They have an ante battle where if he wins Ash will help him catch his own Tyranitar and look for mega stones. Ash wins however thus he gets his old Pidgeot friend back as well as well as a mega necklace and Pidgeotite.

After the year Ash is 17 instead of eleven and other characters ages collapse into what they "should be" Team Rocket are the only ones who notice and no one pays attention when they bring it up. Jessie James and Meowth are trying to revive team rocket after it got destroy by Leaf who only did so because they somehow were indirectly obstructing her journey.

Ash after reintroducing himself to friends and family around Kanto meets Agent P the Pokemon League Inspector. He points out that the Pokemon League inspection agency was inept citing Skylas air battles and Volkner giving away badges as examples and hypothesizes that the inspectors mostly being Joys limited their staffs. He then reveals that he interviewed every gym leader who gave Ash a badge and that people who have illegitimate badges (including ones given by the now changed draw rule) are banned until they legitimize every single one of them by winning a 1v1 battle with the inspector assigned to them who are using Volkner level Pokemon of the type that the badge corresponds to. Ash wins every one of them but asks why he didn't battle a water Pokemon. P responds that Misty wanted to fight him instead and says Ash proved his worth so he's allowed to be on the honor system.

Ash wins a full battle with Misty.

The tourney begins and many former rivals and friends of Ash who already have Kanto league badges compete. After the screening the tournament has 256 participants including Gary who returned to battling after learning he was treated better do to his grandfather's position. As well there is the random Heatran guy in the background he makes friends with Cameron but later beats him the first round.

Spoiler

Ash beats AJ in the first round

Ash beats Samurai in the top 128

Unknown chamander Trainer beats Alain in the Top 128

Barry beats Virgil in the Top 64

Brock under the name Masked ladies' man beats Damien in the Top 64

Leaf beats Gisselle in the Top 64

Ash beats unknown Charmander Trainer in the Top 64

Unknown Bulbasaur beats Stephan

Ash beats Harrison in the Top 32

Heatran guy beats Conway in the Top 32

Masked Ladies Man beats Trip the Top 32

Leaf beats Nando in the Top 16

Tyson defeats Pete Pebbleman in the Top 16

Ash defeats Unmasked Brock in the Top 16

Barry beats random Heatran guy in the Top 16

Morrison beats unknown Bulbasaur Trainer in Top 16

Sawyer beats Katie in the Top 16

Gary beats Astrid in the Top 16

Paul beats Assunta in the top 16

Paul defeats Morrison in the the Top 8

Tyson defeats Sawyer in the Top 8

Ash defeats Gary in the Top 8

Ash points out to Gary

Leaf defeats Barry in the Top 8

Ash defeats Leaf in the Semifinal

Paul defeats Tyson in the Semifinal

Ash wins the final against Paul

After defeating Kanto Champion Ritchie. Tobias reveals he's Ash's dad and takes him on a trip to teach him how to catch Legends

One year later he returns with Ho-oh and Paul, Tyson, Ritchie and Ash each representing Sinnoh, Hoenn, Johto and Kanto respectively declare who ever wins their Tournament of champions will be a Pokemon master

 

[Silktree]

@Harmful Heron, here is the link to the sound director's quote.

 

[SinnohEevee]

Honestly, who's to say the "Original Ash" won't come back later after all this? And this is only for the movie and the SuMo Anime? It's a bit too soon to say that we're completely done with the Ash we've known up till now~

Because they don't care about older fans.

 

[Peppermint Phoenix]

@Silktree

So they were willing to same "Ey this is a different continuity" now but they chose not to do that when my best wishes hate faction was ragging on Ash's performance in Unova... and they made Ash lose the Kalos league even though they they didn't have soft reboot because they were hard rebooting anyways...


and there one little thing too: I've asserted that even though the from that the writers don't want him to win eventually the would feel forced to because each league par Unova he improved. By getting a close match with Alain, Ash got the closest he can get to winning without actually winning. He can't get any closer. So by declaring it a loophole they got around the assertion that gave me hope of seeing Ash win a league and it's very well possible that I will never see him win.

And for what to trick kids who started XY or BW into thinking it isn't a reboot? That's the reason why the canon ending is a kiss and Greninja being released. A twenty years one story no real ending just to fool children...

I'm sadder and madder than a grown man should be. I guess I can take solace in the fact that my wall of bullshit is just as canon as any other possibility.

 

[Silktree]

Yeah. A reboot means that Ash doesn't need to surpass his accomplishment in Kalos, because that Ash doesn't exist anymore.

I've just remembered that in one of the last few XYZ episodes, Ash said that he would go back to Kanto and start from scratch. He didn't say anything about going to another region, though. So could the writers have intended for him to go through Kanto again with new Pokemon? I'd like to think that he would train his unevolved Pokemon instead, just as he did with Phanpy the last time he was in Kanto. Let's see how many there are:

Totodile, Corphish, Gible, Buizel, Oshawott, Snivy, Scraggy

That's a lot of Water-type Pokemon. I didn't count Bulbasaur due to its wish to remain unevolved, and likewise, Squirtle has a job to do. Corphish and Buizel are arguably strong enough already, too. If we remove them and add Pikachu (obviously), that's a full team.

 

[Peppermint Phoenix]

@Silktree so he wins Kanto league and lives happily ever after yay would have been nice to see it though

 

[Silktree]

He should win the Kanto badges that he didn't get fair and square. Namely, all of them but Lt. Surge and Blaine's... He could get two additional badges, be they anime-exclusive or from hypothetical Kanto sequels.

 

[Peppermint Phoenix]

He should win the Kanto badges that he didn't get fair and square. Namely, all of them but Lt. Surge and Blaine's... He could get two additional badges, be they anime-exclusive or from hypothetical Kanto sequels.

What about Koga? Also in my wall of text I thought of a solution other than walking up to Erika after all that time and saying "Hey I didn't earn this let me fight you" which I don't think Erika would take to kindly to.

 

[Team Gaara]

Because they don't care about older fans.

Still a bit early to conclude ATM, IMO~

@Silktree, well I can't say for sure why they would. Maybe just something they're experimenting with. I just can't say I think 100% that as of now, the Ash we've all known up till now is fully done and completed with his journey on such an unfinished note.

I know we all think they don't care about us as fans, but truly, surely they'll give Ash SOME sort of actual conclusion other than just doing the same thing in 6 different regions and then ending up at home. Even if it's some 30 min special somewhere. To end it off like this doesn't seem right.

 

[Silktree]

What about Koga?

He is one of the six I meant by "other than Lt. Surge and Blaine". But his gym should belong to Janine by now.

Also in my wall of text I thought of a solution other than walking up to Erika after all that time and saying "Hey I didn't earn this let me fight you" which I don't think Erika would take to kindly to.

Sorry, but that sounds a bit contrived. What's wrong with Ash asking those gym leaders for a rematch? He has the badges, yes, but he always loves battling people. Hell, he asked Wattson for a rematch because he hadn't earned the badge fairly.

To end it off like this doesn't seem right.

It sure doesn't, but if that's their idea for the 20th anniversary, I doubt it will ever change.

 

[Peppermint Phoenix]

@Silktree I meant how was the Koga badge unfair?

On the inspector P thing. I mean yeah maybe it's a bit contrived but an overhaul of that magnitude is certainly in order. Volkner by himself represented a huge issue. I mean the difference between 7 and 8 badges is minute but it's a real hassle to look at the Bolt badge and say "this has a 20% chance of being bullshit". Yeah I'll concede that asking a for rematches isn't a problem he doesn't seem like he would feel an obligation like that but I could see him doing it cause he feels like battling.

 

[Silktree]

@Silktree I meant how was the Koga badge unfair?

My bad. I remembered Team Rocket interrupting it, but the battle was continued.

Anyway, Shudo's planned ending obviously has to do with the Fantasy in My Pocket song and the first Movie 1 trailer. Note how the little girl only meets Pikachu in a dream-like state...

I can only imagine that Shudo's vision wasn't shared by the rest of the staff, but I have to admire him because he actually had an ending in mind that says something about us, the viewers. So with that in mind... What happens after XYZ doesn't matter.

The inclusion of Pokemon in Ash's life was a fantasy as far as I'm concerned, but at the very least he did know Misty. And right now Ash is having a second dream, probably because he can't face the real world.

 

[Kallyle]

Honestly, who's to say the "Original Ash" won't come back later after all this? And this is only for the movie and the SuMo Anime? It's a bit too soon to say that we're completely done with the Ash we've known up till now~

Why would they bother jumping between continuities like that? To alienate not only the veteran fans, but also the kids growing up with SM? For heaven's sake: The 20th anniversary is not the right time for arbitrary decisions.

The most likely reason for this change is that they wanted to streamline the show and no longer be beholden to its history, considering how close Ash came to winning a league.

The writers could always pull a troll on us by revealing that we were going back and forth between two Ashs. After all, we have that portal in the games at the Alter of the Sunne/Moone that takes us to the other world. It's not that hard to have the two versions of Ash meet then an there. It's not likely, but it could happen.

 

[Silktree]

I get it. Six stages of grief and all.