• Another scrumptious episode of Bulbacast has been uploaded to YouTube. Watch it here. I hope you don't feel desserted after watching this one.
  • Hello all! The forum staff have introduced a new rule set. We've reduced the number of rules, made trick language easier to understand, and have hopefully simplified the rules to make understanding them easier. Please have a read over the new forum rules here.

How would you change a Gym Leader’s team?

Lightning Flame Blast

Phantom of the orc
Joined
Oct 17, 2018
Messages
733
Reaction score
925
Pretty straightforward. Is there anything in a leader’s team from any of the games that bothers you? The pokemon, the movesets, abilities, levels, anything of the sorts.

I, for one, would change Flannery’s Torkoal so it had the Drought ability rather than White Smoke. That way it doesn’t need to waste a move slot in Sunny Day.
 

Dieter

Dieter
Joined
Aug 3, 2010
Messages
932
Reaction score
599
In Ruby and Sapphire, I'd give Tate & Liza an extra pokemon each, like they did in Emerald. It really is a shame they didn't use the Emerald team in ORAS. Considering they're the second last Gym Leaders, they should be somewhat of a challenge at least. And Claydol and Xatu worked fairly well as themed opposites, though it can't beat Lunatone and Solrock as a pair of course.

Strictly speaking not Gym Leaders, but I'd replace one of Phoebe's Dusclops with a Vileplume. I mean it's not until Gen V that all E4 members even adhere to their type specialisation, and a Vileplume would fit Phoebe's aesthetic. I think Glacia could have had a Medicham with Ice Punch too, I mean, if it was good enough for Candice...

And for ORAS as a whole, basing the gym leader rosters on Emerald rather than R/S would have been beneficial. Or a mix, that might have worked too.

And let's not even get into the Kalos leaders. For half of them, I can hardly remember what their signature Pokemon is. Viola and Korrina are fine, Ramos and Wulfric ok I guess (though forgettable). But why not reflect Valerie's Johto origin with a Togetic, Granbull, or Azumarill? Gothitelle might not be a Gen Vi Pokemon, but it would perfectly fit Olympia's aesthetic, yet it's not even on her team. Grant has both fossil pokemon introduced iun that gen, but neither fits his aesthetic or profession outside of being a gym leader very much. Ok, and I guess Helioptile is not too bad a choice for Clemont, there's that satellite like gadget he has... With Gym Leaders from other regions I at least remember their signature pokemon/line, even if they use previously introduced Pokemon like Falkner and Wattson, because it fits their aesthetic. And we haven't even covered their sucky movesets yet

somehow, I always end up complaining about Kalos, even though I find it a very interesting region conceptually ^^;;
 

RileyXY1

Young Battle Trainer
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
4,944
Reaction score
6,035
The teams of the Johto Gym Leaders are an absolute mess, so here's how I'll fix them:

Falkner
Hoothoot
Noctowl

Bugsy
Ledian
Ariados
Scyther

Whitney
Clefairy
Snubbull
Miltank

Morty
Haunter
Haunter
Misdreavus
Gengar

Chuck
Poliwrath
Primeape
Heracross
Hitmontop

Jasmine
Forretress
Skarmory
Magneton
Steelix

Pryce
Sneasel
Dewgong
Cloyster
Piloswine

Clair
Dragonair
Ampharos
Charizard
Gyarados
Kingdra
 
Last edited:

Silktree

Hardship
Joined
Mar 14, 2005
Messages
17,901
Reaction score
11,209
Falkner
Hoothoot
Natu
You've made his team weaker. The truth is that the only Johto Flying type that is neither too weak nor too strong to be a signature Pokemon, are Togetic, Murkrow, Ledian and Yanma. The latter three would feel off since their primary types stand out too much, so that leaves Togetic which should be fine without Roost. It's still arguably too bulky for this point of the game, so I wouldn't mind Pidgeotto staying.

Bugsy
Ledian
Ariados
Scyther
That would be pretty unfair to Chikorita users. Replace Ledian with Pineco.

Whitney
Clefairy
Snubbull
Miltank
That's two pure Fairy types. Replace Snubbull with Teddiursa, and maybe Clefairy with Wigglytuff.

Morty
Haunter
Haunter
Misdreavus
Gengar
Murkrow would be pretty fitting as a Haunter replacement to spice up the team.

Chuck
Poliwrath
Hitmonchan
Hitmonlee
Hitmontop
Bruno already covered the Hitmon theme. Why not Heracross and Primeape over Hitmonchan and Hitmonlee?

Clair
Dragonair
Dragonair
Dragonite
Gyarados
Kingdra
I wouldn't give her more than one Dragonair, or any Dragonite for that matter (that's what Lance is for). Ampharos is a fitting choice even without having it Mega Evolve, as is Arcanine (there is lava in her gym).
 

Lightning Flame Blast

Phantom of the orc
Joined
Oct 17, 2018
Messages
733
Reaction score
925
I would replace Wallace’s gym team with his Delta Episode team (either replacing the Gyarados with a Walrein or scrapping it altogether), just leveled down. You are at the 8th gym in a region packed with all sorts of different types, including electric and grass ones. You are expected to be able to handle something harder than a Luvdisc and a Sealeo by this point.
 

Lover

웃♥유
Joined
Jun 24, 2017
Messages
1,116
Reaction score
2,830
Clair
Dragonair
Dragonair
Dragonite
Gyarados
Kingdra
Jesus Christ. She was already a nightmare to battle against, even in HG/SS where her team got nerfed slightly by having one less Dragonair than in G/S/C. So why would you want her to have a Dragonite for the Gym battle? Kudos for using the correct name for her, though. I've seen far too many people misspell her name as "Claire".
 

NinjutsuSen

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Messages
548
Reaction score
605
Have some of the Johto Gym Leaders actually use Johto Pokemon. Four of them (Falkner, Bugsy, Morty, and Chuck) exclusively use Kanto Pokemon.
My attempt to make them better including levels:

Falkner:
Natu Lv9
Noctowl Lv11

Now people would say "Noctowl for the first gym is OP!". By that level it should only have Peck and Mud Slap as attacks, both physical and Noctowl's Attack base is low (50). It's rather tanky than dealing damage. Levels are kept low so after visiting Sprout tower (which is necessary to challenge the gym like in HGSS) you shouldn't have that much of a problem. Also don't tell me that Noctowl is underleveled. Falkner's Pidgeotto in his original team also was on Lv.9.

Bugsy:
Spinarak Lv15
Pineco Lv15
Heracross Lv17

Team completely changed. Heracross is the new ace, replacing Scyther. Fury Cutter, Rock Smash and Cut as it's moveset. Spinarak with moves like Toxic so spice things up. Pineco as a the staller of the team.

Whitney:
Snubull Lv18
Teddiursa Lv18
Miltank Lv20

Miltank does not know the move Milk Drink to make the fight against it a bit more easier.

Morty:
Haunter Lv22
Misdreavus Lv23
Gengar Lv25

Three instead of four Pokemon. In gen II there are only two ghost Pokemon lines so Gengar remains his ace.

Chuck:
Hitmontop Lv28
Primeape Lv28
Poliwhirl Lv31

Hitmontop as his ace seemed a bit too weak for me and I already used Heracross for Bugsy, so I decided to not change his ace.

Jasmine:
Forretress Lv31
Skarmory Lv31
Steelix Lv33

Reduced the levels quite a bit because I thought the 5 levels gap between Chuck and Jasmine was a bit too high since you could challenge both gyms back to back (I also would place two gym trainers in Jasmine's gym). "Better" Pokemon to compensate the level reduction.

Pryce:
Delibird Lv35
Swinub Lv35
Dewgong Lv36
Piloswine Lv38

Lack of Ice Pokemon in gen ÍI. Four Pokemon instead of three with Delibird having scout and status moves (Detect, Toxic, Swagger, Present). Blizzard for Swinub, Ice Beam and Earthquake for Piloswine. Dewgong with Surf and Ice Beam. Higher levels because you are forced to go the Chuck-Jasmine route first.

Clair:
Seadra Lv42
Gyarados Lv43
Dragonair Lv43
Kingdra Lv45

Changed two of her Dragonairs into Gyarados and Seadra.

League level range is 45-55. May post the teams later.
 

NinjutsuSen

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Messages
548
Reaction score
605
No? You can challenge Pryce as soon as you can use Surf. There's nothing preventing you from doing that.
And that's why I changed it so you're not overleved when you fight Pryce. Surfing to Mahagony Town immidiately after you beat Morty was a flaw.
 

RileyXY1

Young Battle Trainer
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
4,944
Reaction score
6,035
And that's why I changed it so you're not overleved when you fight Pryce. Surfing to Mahagony Town immidiately after you beat Morty was a flaw.
Even then, you can go to Mahogany Town even without Surf due to the existence of Mt. Mortar.
 

NinjutsuSen

Active Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Messages
548
Reaction score
605
Even then, you can go to Mahogany Town even without Surf due to the existence of Mt. Mortar.
Then place a roadblock on the Gate so nobody can enter the route until you've beaten Jasmine.
 

Yami-no-Game

Member
Joined
May 21, 2019
Messages
95
Reaction score
243
I'd give Morty a Misdreavus in G/S/C in place of his second Haunter. I'd also give Clair a Seadra to replace one of her Dragonair.
 

Lightning Flame Blast

Phantom of the orc
Joined
Oct 17, 2018
Messages
733
Reaction score
925
I have a tiny little gripe with Misty, Erika and Blaine’s team in RGBY in that I feel they could have showcased the starters like Gardenia did later on. They could’ve had Misty use a Squirtle, Erika use an Ivysaur and Blaine a Charizard. Nothing in terms of balance, but only a tematic thing.
 

Lover

웃♥유
Joined
Jun 24, 2017
Messages
1,116
Reaction score
2,830
I have a tiny little gripe with Misty, Erika and Blaine’s team in RGBY in that I feel they could have showcased the starters like Gardenia did later on. They could’ve had Misty use a Squirtle, Erika use an Ivysaur and Blaine a Charizard. Nothing in terms of balance, but only a tematic thing.
I wouldn't have had a problem with this, but I have to question if Misty and Erika really needed Starters on their teams given that Gen 1 already had a lot of other Water-types and Grass-types that they could've used.
 

Dieter

Dieter
Joined
Aug 3, 2010
Messages
932
Reaction score
599
I have a tiny little gripe with Misty, Erika and Blaine’s team in RGBY in that I feel they could have showcased the starters like Gardenia did later on. They could’ve had Misty use a Squirtle, Erika use an Ivysaur and Blaine a Charizard. Nothing in terms of balance, but only a tematic thing.
I like this, though tbf several of the Gym Trainers in Celadon use Ivysaur. So if not in a Gym Leader's team, having the Gym Trainers use starters would be thematically appropriate too
 

Lightning Flame Blast

Phantom of the orc
Joined
Oct 17, 2018
Messages
733
Reaction score
925
I wouldn't have had a problem with this, but I have to question if Misty and Erika really needed Starters on their teams given that Gen 1 already had a lot of other Water-types and Grass-types that they could've used.
As I said, just a theme idea. Both Misty and Blaine’s teams were pretty uncreative in the originals though, literally pre-stages and their evolutions and that’s it.

I like this, though tbf several of the Gym Trainers in Celadon use Ivysaur. So if not in a Gym Leader's team, having the Gym Trainers use starters would be thematically appropriate too
Do they? Huh, didn’t know that. Thanks for the info.
 

prog rocker

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 27, 2018
Messages
5,151
Reaction score
6,957
There's also a Super Nerd with a Charmander in Blaine's gym.
 
Top