• A new LGBTQ+ forum is now being trialed and there have been changes made to the Support and Advice forum. To read more about these updates, click here.
  • Hey Trainers! Be sure to check out Corsola Beach, our newest section on the forums, in partnership with our friends at Corsola Cove! At the Beach, you can discuss the competitive side of the games, post your favorite Pokemon memes, and connect with other Pokemon creators!
  • Due to the recent changes with Twitter's API, it is no longer possible for Bulbagarden forum users to login via their Twitter account. If you signed up to Bulbagarden via Twitter and do not have another way to login, please contact us here with your Twitter username so that we can get you sorted.

Review JN115: Opening! Masters Tournament!!

Yeah, I have no actual idea why Alain is here in the first place. I guess you could call him an honorary champion due to winning the Kalos League, but you could say the same for Virgil, Tobias, Tyson and even Jon. If they needed to fill an extra slot an actual champion from the games would have been better, even if they don't currently hold that title in the anime. (So basically either Wallace or Alder; they could have even used Gary if they didn't put him on Project Mew instead.)

My best guess is that because Alain is well-known for being a powerful Trainer both in and out of universe, they wanted to have Leon curbstomp him to make him look that much more powerful himself. And they also get double the Charizard marketing while they're at it. They still should have realized how fans feel about Alain by now though; how were they expecting people to react to Alain returning for another tournament arc and not having that long-awaited rematch with Ash?
 
Rewatched the ep with the subs, weirdly I like the battle a bit more now. The whole Mega Charizard fight really needed more time and to go into next episode, but I like the grass starter battle a lot. Don't mind Malamar being defeated quickly either. It's also more noticeable now which moves did a lot of damage and which didn't that I didn't catch in the first airing.

The whole opening ceremonies with the champions is the best part of the ep though, especially Iris with Cynthia/Diantha. Also liked the nods of Steven talking about Alan and Ash noticing everyone and the winks to Iris and nod to Alan. Lance and Diantha talking to each other was nice too.

The first half of the episode I'd give an 8/10, but the second half a 5/10, would have been higher if Mega Charizard X lasted longer into the next ep.
 
So got to see it myself now with subs.

Okay....

  • Interesting how Hop doesn't seem to know any of Leon's opponents personally like Goh does. Could be a fun contrast point
  • Alain's 'disrespect' to Ash is hardly that. You have to be looking for it.
  • Was Lance's G-Man status open knowledge, because they just mentioned it on a global stage.
  • Also they again emphasize the 'new' part of Lance's title, so that means while Ash was rising the ranks Lance regained his title.
  • Honestly a lot of fun in that opening scene: some obvious references, some more subtle ones, heck even Team Rocket referenced Poke Pelago with the rainbow bean that Morpeko was eating.
  • Honestly that Grass battle had a lot of thought at play. Leon seems to be going specifically to be unexpected, Alain can work with that, etc etc. Kind of makes me wonder if Leon's third Pokemon would not do well against Chesnaught and Leon decided to prioritize: maybe Rhyperior or Seismitoad.
  • So Air Slash, Dragon Pulse, Ancient Power, Fire Blast....those are Leon's move choices today.
  • Kind of interesting how Malamar moves a lot like Grapploct would. Wonder if Leon ever prepared for a Bea battle.
  • Oh....oh heck that was a sudden ending. That needed a few more solid skirmishes. Yeah....that ended badly. Rest of the battle was good, that ending was terrible.
 
Actually, Lance vs Leon had Max Lightning create an Electric Terrain, like it's supposed to.

Ah right, I forgot about that. I can't remember whether the Electric Terrain was explicitly acknowledged or not (like how Diantha acknowledged the speed boost from Max Airstream in this episode), but even if it was, it ultimately didn't matter since the Electric Terrain wasn't utilized after it was created. Meanwhile, Rillaboom's speed boost here can be clearly seen when it used Acrobatics to dodge Chesnaught's Gyro Ball.

Weirdly the Chesnaught vs. Rillaboom fight was actually pretty decent for what it was. It was the only real good battle in the episode, but people will overlook it due to the obvious ending.

Yeah, that fight was the highlight of this match. When Rillaboom pulled out its drum, I was wondering how it was gonna be moving around and battling with that thing. And then Leon just immediately Gigantamaxes it, allowing Rillaboom to use its gigantic drum without having to move around. During its G-Max phase, we also got to see a Max Move breaking through a regular protection move, and Chesnaught dealing with Max Airstream the same way Blastoise dealt with Regidraco's Twister a couple of episodes ago.

I was expecting Rillaboom to finish that fight in its G-Max form, but Chesnaught was still standing by the time it wore off. So Rillaboom immediately follows up with Acrobatics, a move that is not only extremely effective against Chesnaught, but is also significantly stronger when the user leaves behind their items. That was the perfect way to finish off Chesnaught, and it shows that Leon can definitely utilize his non-Charizard team members effectively.
 
You know what makes this worse, and I think someone did point it out. The fact that Marin was left in tears after seeing Alain lose. This is his first major loss and we won't get Alain cheering her up. That loss still should have been in the Kalos League and then he would have been able to cheer her up by saving her Chespin.
 
You know what makes this worse, and I think someone did point it out. The fact that Marin was left in tears after seeing Alain lose. This is his first major loss and we won't get Alain cheering her up. That loss still should have been in the Kalos League and then he would have been able to cheer her up by saving her Chespin.
Granted, that would've meant Ash won the Kalos League, and we all know how the writers feel about that. :p
 
Screenshot (14).png

Confirmation that not all rounds will be 3v3, probably just the first one.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if this was an intentional baiting in a major scale; hype up the fanbase with a possible Ash vs. Alain rematch, only for Alain to be unceremoniously eliminated right away in the hopes of destroying XY's reputation for good and disperse the fanbase.

I mean; jumping the shark on purpose just to get rid of your adult fanbase? At least it appears Japanese audiences were as offended as we are.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if this was an intentional baiting in a major scale; hype up the fanbase with a possible Ash vs. Alain rematch, only for Alain to be unceremoniously eliminated right away in the hopes of destroying XY's reputation for good and disperse the fanbase.

I mean; jumping the shark on purpose just to get rid of your adult fanbase? At least it appears Japanese audiences were as offended as we are.
I don't think that many people gonna be alienated: if this fandom somehow managed to survive Ash-Greninja, we certainly can survive this. Certainly the fact that main draw Ash is still competing will on its own be enough for people to keep watching.

That said, it'll definitely make a lot of viewers cynical about the rest of the tournament. A battle as one-sided as this was definitely not a good way to start.

Dangit, Alain, why is it that every single battle that involves you has to be controversial?
 
What makes this episode worse is that Ash never got to beat Alain.
2016 was our year!
Like now I’m mad about the Kalos League more than ever before…
Ash didn't need to be the one to beat Alain. The problem is that the battle was a bit rushed, though I still kinda like it regardless.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if this was an intentional baiting in a major scale; hype up the fanbase with a possible Ash vs. Alain rematch, only for Alain to be unceremoniously eliminated right away in the hopes of destroying XY's reputation for good and disperse the fanbase.

I mean; jumping the shark on purpose just to get rid of your adult fanbase? At least it appears Japanese audiences were as offended as we are.
At this point, we might as well call it Journey’ signature move with how often the’ve done it. Because why have actual fan service in a 25th anniversary series when you can use underhanded moves like bait and switch?
 
So, this was the start of the Masters Eight Tournament, an episode of extremes: The first part, the opening, was extremely exiting and well done while the second part, Leon vs. Alain, ewas extremely rushed and probably the worst battle I've seen in a long time.

First things first:
The entrance and the introduction of the Masters Eight was awesome! And, of course, Cynthia, our beloved Queen and Champion was here :love::notworthy:. She was introduced with "the authority on archeology and the Champion of Sinnoh". I totally loved when she said to Iris: "Go easy on me, ok?" What a humble, wonderful and angelic person she is! Wonderful! And finally, that selfie together with Iris and Diantha and Cynthia's victory pose. So nice! Cynthia fans couldn't help but enjoy the first part. Seeing our Queen again always fills my heart with pure joy!
Also, what I really liked were the short interactions between the champions. We need more of that!

If it hadn't been for Cynthia honoring the episode with her presence, I would now be much more outraged because, unfortunately, the writers totally messed up the rest of the episode with what will be remembered as one of the most rushed, most forced and worst episodes in a major tournament: Leon vs. Alain
I agree that Rillaboom vs. Chestnaught was still quite a decent battle with clever thinking and good moves from both sides. But then...what a public, unworthy dismantling of Alain! Here comes the one-hit-KO fest...
Malmar was a complete waste of potential. It is an extremely dangerous Pokemon that could have used its full range of psychological tricks like hypnotizing or manipulating its opponent. Even after being grabbed by Charizard, it would have been the perfect moment for Malamar to use a devastating close-range Psychic-type move because it was looking right into Charizard's eyes. I could think of some many possible and great possibilities how this battle could have been written. But no, Malamar was literally wasted...
And finally Charizard vs. Mega Charizard X, probably the worst battle I've ever seen! It's the same MCX that used to be a total, frightening beast back in Kalos and here we're supposed to believe it can easily be OHKoed by a single Dragon Pulse? No, this wasn't just bad writing, this was a complete offense and an absolutely unworthy slap into every fan's face. Yes, Leon might have won in the end anyways but all those eight great trainers are titans and do not deserve to be treated like random, ordinary characters! Instead their battles should be long and intense showdowns that keep you excited until the very last minute. What impertinence that "battle" was! Unforgivable! :mad:

In general this episode, the PWC and Journeys a a whole suffer from two major flaws:
First, they're trying to promote Leon at all costs and cement his title as the (allegedly) undefeated trainer at the expense of logic by giving him cheap, implausible victories. I've always hated Leon and I knew I was right. But now I hate him even more!
Second, the whole thing is just extremely rushed, that's all! If the PWC Masters Tournament is "the greatest tournament in the world" as described by the narrator himself,you just MUST NOT cram such a significant battle into 10 minutes. That's just impossible and it's what I meant when I called it a slap into every fan's face. The Masters Tournament itself deserves to be an arc of at least 15 episode if its concept isn't doomed to fail.

I deeply feel sorry for Alain would deserve so much better and I'd love to express my anger to the writers directly. Do you happen to know if they have some official social media account? I just can't leave it at that, not when the greatest trounament in the world is at stake!

I'll tell you something guys. We really need that two weeks break.... To recover from the shock!
 
I checked Twitter, both english and portuguese, and welp... no one liked it. And also I've heard the japanese fandom did not liked this.

It's definitely nowhere near on the caliber of the Ash-Greninja loss, but it's pretty bad.

Whatever credibility the writers had left evaporated with this ep I fear.
They're trying to generate buzz, but they're doing it in the wrong way. I wouldn't be surprised if in the next couple episodes, we find out Iris defeated Champion Cynthia and now she's having a rematch with Ash. Chances of that are low, but still. They're trying to generate buzz, but they're only generating negative buzz, and Iris defeating Champion Cynthia wouldn't help.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if this was an intentional baiting in a major scale; hype up the fanbase with a possible Ash vs. Alain rematch, only for Alain to be unceremoniously eliminated right away in the hopes of destroying XY's reputation for good and disperse the fanbase.

I mean; jumping the shark on purpose just to get rid of your adult fanbase? At least it appears Japanese audiences were as offended as we are.
I seriously doubt there was any malice behind this decision. It was tone deaf at best, cheeky at worst.

It seemed very formulaic; Alain is perceived to be a strong trainer, is a recent character that appeared within the last 5-6 years and needed to fill a slot in the M8, which was probably conceptualized before they started filling in exact participant slots. Alain has some background behind him and fits the theme of the tourney, being able to use one of the newly added gimmicks in the games.

Using Tobias as fodder makes less sense as he was designed just to be a Diablos ex Machina for the Shinoh league, Alain had background story but was basically slyly converted into a one for Ash in the Kalos league.

Leon is suppose to be the best of the best of the Champions. Despite people hating on him for being “unbeatable” he’s the only one of the Champions who does NOTHING but battles and is honestly the most realistic one of them to be at the top. I say this as a complete Cynthia simp. Story wise Leon should not struggle at all against Alain and they were additionally paired up for a Charizard match up (Alain admitted he enter to surpass his Charizard) and to not oversaturate the league with similar Pokemon. We already have 3 trainers using Dragonite.

Ultimately the problem comes down to how over the top the Mega Specials were written to portray Alain’s strength with his Charizard specifically.
 
Please note: The thread is from 2 years ago.
Please take the age of this thread into consideration in writing your reply. Depending on what exactly you wanted to say, you may want to consider if it would be better to post a new thread instead.
Back
Top Bottom