Review JN115: Opening! Masters Tournament!!

[Vengeful Ghost]

You took the words right out of my mouth That exactly why I've never liked Leon and his behavior which often lacks dignity

I thought you hated him because he reminded you of someone from the ghetto.

Acting like champions need to act with dignity and ”charisma” misses the point of this franchise where we have seen across multiple forms of media that even the most dignified champion may be deposed by some random child from a random town. That does not diminish the prestige of the position. Who needs to command authority when you are the authority?

 

[Queen Cynthia]

Not to be rude but can y'all stop psychoanalyzing a ten-year-old boy? LMAO. There isn't a deeper meaning to the things he is doing. He just does whatever comes to mind first.

I don't want to be rude either, but let me ask you this: If, in your eyes, we mustn't analyze Ash, then what's the point of this section of the forums in the first place? I mean in most of the threads here people discuss the show on a level that goes far far beyond what we get to see (or what the writers' original intention might have been). So what's the point of all this if it's just a "kids show"? (I hate that term). Or let me put it a bit more provocatively: Wouldn't it be kind of disturbing if mainly adults (most of the users here probably are grown-ups) regularly discuss about a show "for kids" if it didn't have any deeper meaning?

I thought you hated him because he reminded you of someone from the ghetto.

Yeah that too but it was mostly because of his cap that reminds me of some gangsta rap guy from the 90s. (You should have noticed already that I prefer those champions with dignified behavior and appropriate clothing )
But there are many other things I don't like about him. What I hate most are the "superpowers" given to him courtesy of the writers and in my opinion the terribly written battle against Alain in this episode has been the sad, negative climax of his character development (...so far! Who knows whatwill be next)

 

[Vengeful Ghost]

But there are many other things I don't like about him. What I hate most are the "superpowers" given to him courtesy of the writers and in my opinion the terribly written battle against Alain in this episode has been the sad, negative climax of his character development (...so far! Who knows whatwill be next)

Ah yes, the power scaling argument. “If the one I want to win wins, it’s because it’s only logical. If the one I don’t want to win wins, it’s because that character is the author’s pet.”

 

[Queen Cynthia]

Ah yes, the power scaling argument. “If the one I want to win wins, it’s because it’s only logical. If the one I don’t want to win wins, it’s because that character is the author’s pet.”

Sorry this is not the case
Let me rephrase what you said: If the one I don't want to win wins by a totally far-fetched and implausible victory, then it's because that character is the author's pet.
We saw how Lance totally dominated Leon in their first match (until the latter gigantamaxed Charizard and pulled the DEM card). So no, Leon isn't that strong to curbstomp another member of the Masters Eight the way he did. And considering we all know how strong and intimidating Alain is, the result of that battle makes even less sense. It's not the fact Leon won that I'm criticizing, it's the totally implausible way he did it, which should be considered an insult to the fans.

And btw. if we were talking about Cynthia here instead of Leon, I would say the same (believe it or not). I would not want Cynthia to simply destroy a worthy opponent from the Masters Eight in an illogical or undeserved way, either! Instead, I'd want them to put up a great and above all epic fight and finally, of course, I'd want Cynthia to show her power and win. But, again, this has nothing to do with how they completely messed up that first battle.

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

We saw how Lance totally dominated Leon in their first match (until the latter gigantamaxed Charizard and pulled the DEM card).

Actually, Leon was in control the whole time. His Charizard knew Thunder Punch all along, and he just waited for a proper timing to use it.

 

[Queen Cynthia]

Actually, Leon was in control the whole time. His Charizard knew Thunder Punch all along, and he just waited for a proper timing to use it.

We did watch the same battle, didn't we? Before Charizard G-maxed, Lance had clearly been dominant.
Anyways, I don't want to get lost in details, I mentioned that battle because back then, Leon was still portrayed in a relatively realistic way and we learned it's not that the Masters Eight members couldn't hold a candle to each other. And look where Plot Armor has brought us now.

 

[Vengeful Ghost]

Let me rephrase what you said: If the one I don't want to win wins by a totally far-fetched and implausible victory, then it's because that character is the author's pet.

I swam in the Star Wars fandom soup long enough to know that “far-fetched and implausible” are only qualifiers if someone doesn’t like the outcome of a given fight. It‘s rarely about how the fight is framed (which is always worthy of scrutiny) and more about how “this battle ended in a way I didn’t want, so I’ll write 50 essays as to why it’s a terrible battle and how I’m not hating the characters at all.”

 

[HiroHunter]

So this was the start to the master 8 huh...... Well fuck this i'm going to wait until Ash vs Leon comes out. Didn't have any hope for the master 8 to start with and now i'm glad I didn't.

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

So this was the start to the master 8 huh...... Well fuck this i'm going to wait until Ash vs Leon comes out. Didn't have any hope for the master 8 to start with and now i'm glad I didn't.

This battle suffered from not having the whole episode for itself. The following battles won't have that problem.

 

[HiroHunter]

This battle suffered from not having the whole episode for itself. The following battles won't have that problem.

JN has given me zero reason to give it a single benefit of the doubt and I don't have much reason to start now.

 

[Queen Cynthia]

I swam in the Star Wars fandom soup long enough to know that “far-fetched and implausible” are only qualifiers if someone doesn’t like the outcome of a given fight. It‘s rarely about how the fight is framed (which is always worthy of scrutiny) and more about how “this battle ended in a way I didn’t want, so I’ll write 50 essays as to why it’s a terrible battle and how I’m not hating the characters at all.”

I understand why you might think that way. But I can assure you it has little to do with the fact that I generally don't like Leon or that I didn't like the outcome of the fight. If you read my initial post, you'd see that I did indeed analyze the battle carefully (the way that I always do when writing a review).
And btw. I'm not the only one. Look at how the fandom reacted to this episode and the outrage and criticism it caused among many many fans. I'd say the vast majority hated how that battle was written, not necessarily the first part, but definitely the second part when Charizard entered the battle.

 

[Sai]

JN has given me zero reason to give it a single benefit of the doubt and I don't have much reason to start now.

Almost every other battle this series has gotten good treatment except a few (the Drasna one, and some parts of the final Bea match).

 

[PkmnTrainerV]

So I’ve been binge watching the PWT recently, and was about to write a glowing review… till this part. So, are you seriously telling me, Alain, who trained enough to defeat 10 mega evolutions in a row, who curb stomped the entire Kalos region and its gym leaders on a whim, his Charizard lost in TWO HITS? Seriously, they could’ve put up literally ANYONE to waste against Leon for the first round and they picked the character the audience is most invested in after Iris? All the while ruining his established power, training and dedication? Just when I thought the series was addressing my complaints…

I literally paused the episode when I saw the matchup because there was no way it would end well. Why not use Diantha here? Why involve Alain at all? In an ideal scenario he should be able to defeat any of Leon's non-Charizard Pokémon and give his Charizard a run for his money.