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Review JN118: Satoshi Goes into Battle! VS Daigo!!

Alola

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  • The announcer points out Metagross "predicting" Pikachu's moves (presumably with its supercomputer brains). Steven says pretty much exactly the same thing within seconds.
Ironically enough, through another Shiny Metagross, they actually showed this with an impressive visual in the DP saga for the base form. When the TRio were antagonizing the Metagross, it visually calculated the trajectory of Psychically controlled boulders, lending to the analytical processing powers of its four brains. For the first time, it wasn't just portrayed as a mechanical looking brute in battle.

Meta Calc 1.png
Meta Calc 2.png


But I wouldn't have known that that was happening here, along with the apparently drastic damage from Fishious Rend, based on the animation alone. Which is a shame as this was yet another unimpressive Metagross for Pikachu to ultimately, routinely defeat. Whatever happened to show and not tell?
 

R1ke

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I enjoyed the 2nd half a fair amount, it almost made me forget how bad the first half was. Dracovish and Aggron went down wayy too easily. Both of Cradily's battles were great, I loved its moveset and strategies. Great how Paul's training payed off against regular metagross, it's no joke making Steven recall his Ace like that. Also nice they acknowledged strong jaw+double damage from fishious rend. Imo Metagross' defeat was believable, taking a boosted fishicous rend, then z move lastly an iron tail

Unfortunately the animation just isn't there this series. Battles are so stiff and rushed, either at the start (this and Iris vs Cynthia) or end (Ash vs Raihan and Volkner). Idk what's going on, but I swear previous series could pace 3v3s in one ep much better. I like them borrowing game mechanics but it's so weird just seeing pokemon stand there and take hits (like Aggron with will-o-wisp)

I'm not a fan of how M8s been handled tbh. Not using reserves, rushing the first matchup, Ash not getting to interact with the champions much, now interrupting it with a Chloe two parter. Cameos are great tho
 

CharizardFan7

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Ironically enough, through another Shiny Metagross, they actually showed this with an impressive visual in the DP saga for the base form. When the TRio were antagonizing the Metagross, it visually calculated the trajectory of Psychically controlled boulders, lending to the analytical processing powers of its four brains. For the first time, it wasn't just portrayed as a mechanical looking brute in battle.

View attachment 162014 View attachment 162015

But I wouldn't have known that that was happening here, along with the apparently drastic damage from Fishious Rend, based on the animation alone. Which is a shame as this was yet another unimpressive Metagross for Pikachu to ultimately, routinely defeat. Whatever happened to show and not tell?
Great example! :giggle: I had actually forgot about that particular Metagross; that episode wasn't one of my favorites in DP (I'm not much of A Team Rocket Trio fan, sorry. :() That said, DP did the whole Metagross intelligence thing much better because they actually showed it happening, and let us figure out what was going on for ourselves. Like you said, whatever happened to show, not tell? (Oh, that's right. Journeys just forgot, that's all. Again. :cautious:)

Edit: After rewatching that part with Steven's Metagross "predicting Pikachu's every move" thing, I concur with you. If they weren't flat-out explaining what was happening, I wouldn't have any clue as to what was going on (and I'm pretty sure that's exactly what happened when I watched it for the first time unsubbed. o_O) Like you said, by telling, not showing, they actually made it more confusing. Uggggh. :cautious: (Whatever happened to "if it 'aint broke, don't fix it?" :unsure:) As everyone keeps saying, I think the anime was better in the past with their writing decisions as opposed to what we're getting now. :cautious:
 
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Konja7

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Ironically enough, through another Shiny Metagross, they actually showed this with an impressive visual in the DP saga for the base form. When the TRio were antagonizing the Metagross, it visually calculated the trajectory of Psychically controlled boulders, lending to the analytical processing powers of its four brains. For the first time, it wasn't just portrayed as a mechanical looking brute in battle.

View attachment 162014View attachment 162015

But I wouldn't have known that that was happening here, along with the apparently drastic damage from Fishious Rend, based on the animation alone. Which is a shame as this was yet another unimpressive Metagross for Pikachu to ultimately, routinely defeat. Whatever happened to show and not tell?
To be fair, they show Metagross ability when it was dodging all Pikachu attacks.



Great example! :giggle: I had actually forgot about that particular Metagross; that episode wasn't one of my favorites in DP (I'm not much of A Team Rocket Trio fan, sorry. :() That said, DP did the whole Metagross intelligence thing much better because they actually showed it happening, and let us figure out what was happening for ourselves. Like you said, whatever happened to show, not tell?
Honestly, I feel people overstimate "show, not tell".

I mean, this Episode show Metagross intelligence when it dodges Pikachu attacks, while they don't tell so much about this ability (or how it wotks).
 

flowerfun

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The battle wasn't half bad. It was a little too sluggish for me, plus a lot of the matches felt a little too rushed for me, a lot of the pokemon went down waaaay too easily, Dracofish got done dirty. Aside from that, I love how Ash uses what he learned from Paul's training in JN114 when fighting the mega Metagross, I also enjoyed some of the strategies they used here, such as Ash using Gleaming Light to get Gengar out of Cradily's Ingrain, and then Pikachu using electro web to contain the Ingrain for example. There were some fun and creative strats used here. I also liked Steven's reason for participating in the WCS, it's so he can become the number one trainer in the world, because being the number one trainer in Hoen isn't enough for him, I like that. Overall an alright battle, not the best but it's okay.
 
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KrspaceT

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Time to watch.

  • Oh hey, that blow between Dracovish and Metagross is a lot more impressive subbed than subless.
  • Paul knew how to create practice mons, doesn't he?
    Has the music been more subdued recently to anyone but me?
  • Honestly a lot of the complaints seem to be overblown so far (Meteor Beam/Dazzling Gleam collission)
  • 'Flaming Bolt of Lightning' and 'Greatest Partner'. Yes. Yes he is.
  • Just how fast does Iris change out of that dress to her casual clothes?
  • Well annoying the sub version I had cut out the Z-Move for some reason, but I know how that went. Honestly this and Iris are the standout battles of the first round, and I'd have to think on their rankings.
 

Twilight-Kun

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I wonder if dracovish's swift defeat had anything to do with the fact it couldn't breathe on dry land, so it might very well have keeled over from oxygen deprivation rather than actual damage taken (same with aggron taking more damage from Burn than actual attacks)

Also rather amusing that it's kept Water Gun all the way to the league
 

Handy Man

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Surprised it just occurred to me but, while it wasn’t in person, this is the first time in the series that Koharu has watched one of Ash’s battles. Took the writers long enough to make it happen.
Chloe actually watched Ash battle for the first time in JN112. This is the first time she watched a PWC match though.
 

nickdt

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So...

Dracovish's ability is Strong Jaw. Kinda clears up why it destroyed Iris's Dragonite so fast as well (Despite the 4x effective move, Ice Fang got powered up even more due to the ability).

I love Team Rocket here as well. From Jessie being angry Dracovish lost, to Jessie exclaiming Ash and Pikachu might win it all and all three being excited for that prospect.

Cradily was amazing in this battle (And i am glad it was chosen over Armaldo, considering Armaldo has appeared more and was a member of Nando's team during the league, where it got to shine against Ash for taking down Staraptor and having a draw with Quilava).

Aside from the Mega Metagross and Cradily sections, the battle was mediocore.

Also: Is Brocks Mega Steelix stronger than Stevens Mega Metagross? It shook off a Super Effective Inferno Overdrive and didn't even seem to be fazed by it.
 
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FinnishPokéFan92

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Would've loved to see the episode where Pikachu learned how to manipulate Z-Energy so it could use 10MV defensively rather than yet again having it do whatever the plot needs of it

Also hey, props to Metagross for being the first pokemon to dodge (most of) it

Which means Charizard is gonna dodge the whole thing, doesn't it
Probably. Or, as I'm predicting it will, just flat-out withstand it.
Or it could be that Ash doesn't a Z-Move against at all. Which is what I think will happen.
Well annoying the sub version I had cut out the Z-Move for some reason
I watched the same version. The guy who publishes the videos is just really afraid of copyright issues from scenes like those.
 
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:bulbaLove: The Best:
  • Ash beating seasoned generally-loved Champion for first time (official announced match, both have to gain by winning, Champion able to study Ash and his Pokémon beforehand)
    • Really, despite all the criticism, this is historic moment and should be treasured. There could be plenty things done better, but...I keep first season in my watch list on Netflix, because just selecting it as items triggers scene "Ash Ketchum is a boy from Pallet Town..." seeing Ash fanboying in front of TV watching Pokémons. And it ends with his mom reminding him of oversleeping. Which he does...and the rest is 25-year history. Nice touch reminding us with music during Z-Move, hopefully Dub version could pull it off also just like that.
:bulbaWave: Good:
  • Reggie and Paul watching Tournament properly at home with big TV and refreshments and more than 1 match apparently
  • Paul's training turning out to be rather prophetic...and Paul smiling!
  • Better "Diamond and Pearl" approach to battles with many characters explaining mechanics and tactics (I would still prefer the tempo and visuality of XYZ, but this is serviceable)
  • Cameos as usual (as heavy handed as they are)
  • Steven showing his more passionate side
  • Jessie wrestling with her emotions to cheer for Pikachu...like if we were man-handled by this little rodent so many times, he better be the BEST :giggle:
  • Although I very much like @cricketlaxwolvesbandy calling 10MVT "The Nuke" which 100% has fitted so far, they managed to evolve this move both mechanically and narratively. Hopefully we have not seen it last time, it gets more interesting this way
  • Not to sound an alarm and create havoc, but...Alain...SPOKE...to Ash
  • With no reserves, Infernape and Charizard being comforted and patted by Professor Oak is the best we will probably get - and in my head-canon also explains why Aggron went down so quickly after some burns, THEY tutored Gengar this move, so probably its effectiveness is off charts and Nurse Joy probably had to put Aggron in freezer post battle so he does not completely melt :cool:
  • As expected as the result has been, they managed to keep us at the edge of our seats till the end, kudos

:confused: Bad:
  • Personal one - Cynthia recognising Z-Move with open mouth unfortunately IMHO make her less likely to use one herself against Ash with Kommo-o, which would be nice touch otherwise, I think
  • Again, where is Lance? Was a helicopter waiting him outside the stadium minute after it was clear he lost?
  • Speaking of which, Iris, Alain, Steven leaving - you guys really have some better place to be? This is hard to grasp, because Journeys have been quite sold on "fandom" part of Pokémon, shown especially with Leon and Raihan. Having all Champions stay and by their presence promote the biggest Tournament would make complete sense. That brings the question how on earth are not these four not hammered by fans being outside of stadium together like that. (Yep, animation budget constraints, but still)
:bulbaFacepalm: Ugly:
  • Overshadowing - as great as this victory is - the whole PWC concept is diminishing it straightaway as expected, because there is Cynthia waiting right next. And even that is treated (by Ash!) like yep, I will watch myself, because I need to overcome this obstacle to GET TO LEON. This is expected, but nevertheless should be mentioned. Ash facing Steven outside this context would be Battle of the Decade and everybody would be giving him probably like 10% hope to defeat him and in case he would win, everybody would be overjoyed. With PWC it's like "well done, next one please". Little time and most of all, incentive, to enjoy this Ash's achievement for what it is.
 

InfinityHelios

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Ok, please tell me that I wasn't the only one noticing a severe lack of music for the majority of the 1st half of the battle? I swear, there was literally almost no music at all and it felt so dull and lifeless. I haven't been so bored watching a fight since about halfway through Bakugan Mechtanium Surge. Also, I find it quite strange how the characters are treating that Fishious Rend against Metagross. He looked no worse than how he was before that move connected. If they wanted to show how much damage it did the least they could've done was add a scratch mark.
 
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Queen Cynthia

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This was a mixed episode in my eyes.
There were several things before, during and after the battle that I didn't like but, all in all, it was a pretty good battle. So without further ado, let me go into detail:

What I didn't like:
  • First of all, what really really made me angry was the narrator's comment right at the beginning when looking back at Cynthia vs. Iris: By no means did Iris lose "by a narrow margin" but pretty obviously! The showdown was deliberately done that intense (both Pokemon having their eyes closed) so that it could be more exciting. But at no time during the battle was Mega-Garchomp close to being defeated. It was hardly fazed by that one Dragon Pulse that managed to hit and the Dragon Pulse-Draco Meteor-collision at the end only hit Haxorus because Garchomp was the one attacking while Haxorus couldn't defend against all the meteors. So writers, don't you make false statements to insult the Queen! :annoyedVoltorb:
  • Aggron went down way too fast. Here I have to disagree with some users saying that Aggron had already taken (much) damage, when it actually hadn't. By the looks of things, that collision between Heavy Slam and Dragon Rush only hit Dracovish hard, leading to its defeat. Apart from that, Aggron only got "hit" by the side effect of Gengar's Dazzling Gleam blasting away the rocks ( Btw. is "Rock Seal" actually "Rock Tomb" in English?). As the sorrounding rocks also softened the impact of Dazzling Gleam, Aggron shouldn't have felt much more than some shaking. So, the only real damage Steven's Pokemon was suffering from was Will-o-Wisp and this move definitely doesn't finish off a Pokemon that fast, but rather slowly and over many turns. I'd say we've got a prime example here what the Masters Tournament (unfortunately) is suffering from: A lack of time. In all four battles so far there has been that one Pokemon that needed to go down really quickly, so they could pack the whole battle into a 20 minutes episode. This is something I really regret.
  • All the defeated Champions were leaving at the end of the episode. Why? They could at least have stayed and keep watching the battles out of respect. After all, it's never too late to learn some new tactics or tricks here and there.
  • When Steven, Alain and Iris were talking to Ash about Cynthia, Ash was all like: "Yeah, don't worry, I know I can beat her. Don't make a fuss about it. All I care for, is getting to Leon". What sign of arrogance and disrespect for the Queen! :annoyedVoltorb: If there was one moment in all the 25 years where Team Rocket's phrase "the brat boy" was appropriate, then it's this scene. It's pretty clear to me Ash's success is starting to go to his head. If only our glorious Cynthia was allowed to curbstomp him...
What I liked:
  • Ash acknowledging Paul and his training. So, it indead was meant to prepare Ash for the battle. I guess Paul isn't that "bad" after all. Just wondering what made him change his mind after looking down on Ash for so many years.
  • Darcovish getting knocked out early. Sorry, I've never really liked it anyways.
  • Cradily vs. Gengar and Cradily vs. Pikachu: Certainly the best part of the episode because we got to see both powerful moves (from Steven's side) and "crazy tactics" (from Ash's side). Very intriguing and enjoyable battles for sure!
  • Pikachu vs. (Mega-)Metagross: Here it comes again, Pikachu the Metagross slayer! I liked how our friend Pikachu managed to overcome Metagross' ability to predict the trajectory of its moves by actively controlling the lightnings of 10.000.000 Volt Thunderbolt. Also, I appreciated very much that Metagross was still portrayed as a powerhouse that not even a Z-move could knock out immediately (It needed another close-range Iron Tail to do so). Nevertheless, Metagross could have battled a bit longer, because despite the priority bonus and Strong Jaw, Fishious Rend obviously didn't make that much damage (there wasn't even a scratch on Metagross) and Metagross had plenty of time to recover in its Pokeball.
  • The music in general. Nice to see the epic music from Cynthia vs. Iris wasn't an exception but they picked up where they left off last week.

Now my wish for the remaining battles is that they will at least be two-parters to take their extreme importance into account!

the days of Ash ever going on another gym quest are officially over. Even if the Scarlet and Violet series still uses Ash as the main character, Journeys really feels like the end of Ash’s character as we know him
Yes, you're totally right. That might indeed be the biggest surprise after the PWC. An Anime without Ash and well-known, popular characters like Cynthia would be sad for sure (Btw. I already started a thread about that topic).
 
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Twilight-Kun

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Or it could be that Ash doesn't a Z-Move against at all. Which is what I think will happen.
There is no way Leon isn't waiving the gimmick restriction after seeing how awesome and cool and gobuypokemongames they were so he can truly have a champion of a time
 

DashingFox

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Meh.

This wasn’t a bad match or anything but it was kinda underwhelming. I thought the last two M8 matches were overall better.

The things I did like were were Dracovish being able to land a powerful enough move on Metagross that worried Steven enough to call back his ace. Too bad the fossil only lasted about as long as a yawn afterwards. Also my most favourite part in the episode was Ash mentally thanking Paul for the training against Metagross and Paul watching from home smirking.. I thought middle of the match was probably the best part – for me Gengar and Cradily definitely had the most interesting showcases on each side. Also love how the Z-move didn’t immediately evaporate its opponent for once. The attempt to dodge it was very refreshing, and I like how it didn’t immediately end the match, even though Metagross was toast like 5 seconds afters.

Also lol that except for Leon (because unbeatable or whatever) that every champion that got the first KO in their respective matches ended up losing. I really hope the semi-finals and finals are just overall better. The battles so far have felt kinda stiff and the pacing is off. Also the cameos have been nice, don’t get wrong, but I’m hope the writers have gotten the majority out of their system now because cutting away to regional trainers/ the champions in the locker room/TR and or Hop & Go after every exchange of moves really messes with the flow. With the exception of Iris, all my favourites in the tournament still remain, so I hope the next rounds really give them some top tier battles.
 

Sai

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This episode had better animation than the first two. Pokemon were also constantly dodging and moving around, (besides Cradily, which made sense since it was ingrained with its roots on the ground), and Aggron/Dracovish was a straight charge battle. I feel the lack of dodging in Lance/Diantha's match was intentional, because it was written as Diantha slowly draining his opponent.

Here we have pokemon moving and dodging like any anime battle, but people claim this is stiff too...so I dunno?
 

cricketlaxwolvesbandy

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Massive respect for Pikachu. Dude shows up big in every league (except for Kanto and Johto but since Hoenn Pika has been Pikaclutch in big battles)
Put this one up with vs Alain as the most dominant Pika performances of all time
 

Nicolas721

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The beginning was really bad, Dracovish and Aggron's defeats made no sense.

VS Cradily was good and is possibly my favorite part of the first round. It's interesting how they turned a forgettable mon into a tentacle killing machine with a defensive strategy that Ash had to think well how to counter.

VS Metagross was okay. Nothing too special or hype-worthy but nothing too bad either. Seeing 10M Thunderbolt not being the finisher and being able to be dodged was extremely refreshing.

My problem with this round wasn't really the animation or the strategies but how interchangeable and boring the champions are. Except for Iris (and Ash if you want to get technical) all have a static serious personality and barely talk about their regions, their goals, their previous encounters with Ash...The Alola league has its flaws but the differences between the characters and their styles made it very entertaining.
 
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