DISCUSSION: Journey Fic Discussion

[CrystaI]

Again, there is a problem that most Pokemon fanfic writer relating the Pokemon World to our current Real-Life. Through I understand it can't help because the canon made it in the contemporary timeline equivalent to our current life style, additional point for the lack of black and white explanation regarding on the issues of cultures and community and social structure.

What I found the main problem of Pokemon fanfic, especially significant in many journey fic, is that writers included the canon's background ambiguity into their writings.
OK, the Pokemon main series game canon is not perfect but full of settings holes and plot holes, especially true that it lacks many important background information which shall form the basis world-building in order to establish a reasonable logical story. That I agree completely.
And as writers writing a story based on this narratively imperfect world, of course every single thing will just felt unreasonable, including that very issue of 10 year old (Or, whether it is 13/15/16/18 or much older age) become trainer and travel the world which is a background setting prerequisite required to start a general journey fic will sound like absolute absurdity in the writer's own eyes.

I'm taking the canon rule of one can start as a trainer from 10 year old onward (whether one go travel immediately is another question) in my current fic. But do you know what? In order for it to sound reasonable and logical in the reader's eyes where we are human beings from the Real-Life, I found that I had large amount of world-building works need to do before I even start to plan the story plot itself, and that is just to plug the background setting holes that were already established in the canon world, not yet mentioning I am doing more to include a bit of original setting in it. And in order to sound plausible, one need to state its world culture and social structure out clearly and explicitly within your story, when there is chance to do such exposition during the course of the story.

IMO, I think the problem is not about the plausibility of 10 year old becoming trainer or not, but more in the lack of explanation and lack of putting effort to make that canon rule sounds plausible.

And that's why, I don't just take the canon as it is for granted.

 

[AceTrainer14]

Sounds like we are all on the same page then.

 

[Beth Pavell]

It's all very well saying that the Pokémon world is likely to be different to the real one because of a) Pokémon and b) What's already in the canon. There's nothing wrong with that assertion in itself. The key question is still why and how it's different, and that does have to be given a reason. I don't think it's illogical to use the way things have worked in the real world as a guide, especially when it comes to things that are the same in both worlds. A human is still a human whether they're in Hoenn or France.

It is fair to say that suspension of disbelief goes both ways. You could argue that there aspects of the canon that shouldn't be as similar to the real world as they are. Actually, there is an upper limit to how logical you can make the world full stop, since the physics of pokémon attacks make absolutely no sense at all.

This all comes back round to that there's only so far you can push suspension of disbelief. It's a balancing act, and one of the ways you can buy back suspension i by ageing up the average journeyman trainer

 

[CrystaI]

I think there may be some confusion here. Pushing up the age of a specific character is a complete different issue from pushing up the universal starting age of being a Pokemon Trainer.

The government or whatever governing body of the Pokemon League may have accepted such minimum age limitation because they think children at that age is already independent enough to possess a pokemon of their own, hence provided such low limitation. But at the end of the day, it is down to each individual to decide when they will become Pokemon Trainer.
In Real-Life, the government says everyone can start to drive from the age of 18, are you really going to become a driver immediately and automatically your 18th birthday?

Also, despite the (anime) canon started "Everyone is Pokemon Trainer from the age of 10", but it really depends on how one interpreted that statement. Some just goes by the anime portrayal that immediately upon one's 10th birthday (or, at the next April after one's 10th birthday), one may immediately go to a professor ask for a starter pokemon and a pokedex, and then immediately go to travel the region as if it is an obligation. Some goes by the interpretation of one may officially possess his/her own pokemon starting from the age of 10. Some goes with the interpretation of one may apply for the Trainer Card starting from the age of 10. It may goes in different ways. Mine is the last approach.

And also, despite that the character may had started to begin as a trainer at the age of 10, whether one's fic story start at the point at the character's 10th birthday is another question. One may always thought of other reasons for the character to start out late, but one shouldn't defy the law of the background world just to provide reason(read: excuse) for one's story to start out late.
And also, I don't even think that protagonist didn't start at the age of 10 is something that important that need an explicit justification. Everyone had their own life, including the characters in any story.

I for one, is the one that believe in there is no limit in the ability of a fictional work to suspend one's disbelief. If there is a limit in suspension of one's disbelief, then there wouldn't exist any fantasy novels with a much crazier physics and logics than Pokemon World. And you know what? Such imaginary fantasy world existed in uncountable amount, not only in fanfiction, but also any of the published novel, official games, anime, manga, and any other format.
If a background setting in a story sounds so illogical that it cannot suspend the reader's disbelief in order for them to enjoy your work, it is then not the fault of such setting, but rather the fault of the author being unable to make such setting believable (No, not realistically believable, but simply logically believable).


TL;DR, so just to say, I personally don't think there is any problem with the canon rule of Pokemon Trainer start at 10, and I don't think it is something that illogical making the Pokemon World so far-fetched to the point of unable to suspend the reader's disbelief. The point is how one interpret and explain it, how one uses other world-building factors to support it, and how one adapt it in one's story.

 

[RuinExplorer]

I've actually read a few good journeyfics,Into The Wild, where Ash started off with a Swinub named Gore and a Bulbasaur was fascinating and I would recommend. The author is able to add a darker tone to the story with it coming off as contrived.

I'm actually found of the underlying story skeleton everyone seems to follow, what I hate is the 'oh so original stuff'. Like 'but my character didn't have one of the normal starters!' Cool but it's played off to make the OC cooler and doesn't seem to have a huge impact. The author tries throwing in these sorts of twists to be original but it just comes off as irritating.

 

[LuxrayOfTheWild]

I finally decided to do my own journey fic. Its here on the writers workshop and on Fanfiction.net. I decided to do a story following a more insecure kind of character as he deals with the conflict between his friends, family, and the main antagonist, who has yet to be decided.

 

[Beth Pavell]

I'd look at nailing down who the main antagonist is going to be and what his role in the story is. I know to my cost how much of a right pain it can be to try and deal with plot problems caused by making it up as you go along

 

[LuxrayOfTheWild]

I have a couple possible ideas! I was just putting up something in the Plot Bunny Zoo topic to discuss one of the possible main antagonists. I had another, but honestly at this point, it would just be "I NEED TO USE THIS EVIL CANON CHARACTER!"

 

[CrystaI]

Does anyone know any journey fic written in 1st-person perspective? Or rather, if there is even any Pokemon fanfic written in 1st-person? I don't think I had ever found any fic written in this way. Though I think, or I hope, there is some.

Because the reason is, it is not just about replacing "he/she/it" with "I", but it is more about narrate the story from the eyes of the focused character, hence 1st-person perspective will makes author thinks the story differently than in 3rd-person perspective, where it results in not only a different kind of storytelling but also story-writing, consequentially an entire different kind of tone and atmosphere of the story than what the canon depicted, because the story is now more character-centered than being plot-centered.

All the journey fic I had seen so far are all written in 3rd-person (Well, I'm not exactly a dedicated fanfic reader, I only go search fanfic once in a blue moon if on the whim, so my fanfic reading list is very limited. Though, I am a dedicated Japanese visual novel reader for those professional ones selling in book stores). So it makes the story feels more like about what a character does, rather than what the character think. Please also note the different in my usage of in/definite article (a/an VS the).
And because story were planned from an outsider POV, as a reader, it is difficult for me to relate myself into the situations of characters within the fanfic. Not even the official(?) Pokemon The Animation novel written by Shudo Takeshi.

I am yet to see any kinds of fan work about what does a trainer (or, whatever pokemon-related occupation it may be) think along his/her way journeying to reach his/her goal.....

 

[Beth Pavell]

Off the top of my head, kintsugi's {some rise by sin} comes to mind. Oh, hang on, and AetherX's Unpredictable

 

[Legacy]

You can also achieve that perspective of the main character with "third person limited" POV, where the reader knows only the thoughts of a certain character or characters (Harry Potter is probably the biggest example as the vast majority of the story is told through Harry's eyes, and there isn't much jumping around) as opposed to third person omniscient where you jump around.

I personally prefer to read third person, but obviously, that is just my preference.

Anyone think writing is first person is harder? I find that it is harder to stay away from inserting parts of myself into the story (the whole Mary Sue thing) when I do first person.

 

[Beth Pavell]

I use third person limited myself. I always seem to write inelegantly in first person, for some reason - third person limited tends to keep it nice and personal but with a little bit more room to breathe when it comes to setting the scene, and especially when it comes to vocabulary choice

 

[Legacy]

I haven't researched this, but I feel like third person limited is probably the most used.

Personally, the omniscient style is not enjoyable to read for me. I don't really even like reading things where there is more than one perspective.

 

[Jaypom]

I use omniscient because I want to treat like all four of my main characters have an equal say even though one trainer is really the driving force since it is his story. I can't bring myself to write in first person anymore though, since every professor I've had has always shouted to never use first person so I've been trained not to.

 

[Misfit Angel]

I always seem to write inelegantly in first person, for some reason

Same. Before I settled on third person for my shortly lived Union City Angels, I wrote the chapters 2 and 3 in first person, and my god, they were sooooooooooo bad. I always notice that when I try to write first person, I tend to go with endless sarcasm and terrible wit, and nobody honestly wants to read that.

 

[diamondpearl876]

All of my fics are in the first person (some with rotating perspectives) and are more character studies than anything focused heavily on plot. I feel that it's hard for people to get inside someone else's head, even a person that they themselves created, for reasons I won't really go into unless somebody wants me to. Somehow, it's never really anything I've struggled with personally - and instead, I struggle with things other people tend to find easier, such as plot/worldbuilding/description. Third person is where writing not only becomes troublesome for me, but also dull. If I'm not delving into a character's beliefs/emotions/thought process as much as possible, writing suddenly has no meaning for me.

 

[CrystaI]

Anyone think writing is first person is harder? I find that it is harder to stay away from inserting parts of myself into the story (the whole Mary Sue thing) when I do first person.

Is it so? For me personally, I rather wrote my super Mary-Sueish virgin work in 3rd-person omniscient. My second project which I think my writing had become much less Mary Sueish is 3rd-person limited. Now I evolved to write in 1st-person yet I don't have any problem of mind-set self-insert. Well I guess it depends on each individual writers.

So thankfully there does exist 1st-person perspective journey fic. I might have to check them out when I am in the mood.

 

[Ghostsoul]

Surprisingly, I have more practice in writing first person plural (we) and possibly even second person (you) than I do in third person. I think my writing style is more naturally drawn to first person writing, I need to describe the characters feelings properly, my writing itself has far more focus on internal states of mind than it does physical environment. Generally describing action is something I really need practice with though.

 

[CrystaI]

I guess everyone had already forget the existence of this thread, so I'm reviving it by referring to the recent topic discussed in the Cliche Thread, the "journey" aspect of journey fic.

Very obviously, because the main character was set to go traveling to many different places, hence the calling of journey fic. But, there is a fundamental doubt from me as I dig deeper into this genre. That is: Is journeying and traveling really a necessity to tell the story?
This may sound like a very stupid question, because it is no more a journey fic if character don't journey, and also I'm not saying that one should dump away the traveling aspect completely. So may be I shall rephrase my concern: When and why does your character traveling, how often one should travel, and where one should go?

Take the Pokemon Anime (bar the current SM saga) for example. Ash's main concern was to enter the league, hence he goes to different cities/towns and challenges the gyms at there. But other than this, he constantly goes out to the wild and/or helping other CotD. Fans called those episodes "filler" because it is, well, just there to fill the norm of the having an episode for that week, aka unnecessary unimportant. In FF.net, one may notice quite a lot of journey fics took the episodic structure of the Anime, which is having 2~6 chapters between the gyms or any important events.
At first glance this may seems like rather it was the problem of being episodic, but more of the problem deeper in the behind is, why the character needs to go to different places constantly, not allowed to remain in one place for a longer period? You may answer because gyms are set in different locations, but I can also counter this question with the answer of one can just go straight to the destination by riding a flying pokemon / teleport with the help of psychic pokemon / take public transport / stop wandering around in the bushes!

For example, being a pokemon trainer is, well very obviously, to train the pokemons. So why one need to go traveling on a day-to-day basis? Shouldn't one stay in one place and strengthen one's handheld pokemon by taking a routine training program? Even one needs to go to another place, why spend so much time on the walking itself rather than working on something else?
The way I see it, Pokemoon Anime's journey, was unfortunately done just for the simple mere sake of it without any much in-universe reason behind it. Ash was shown to traveling very single day very single episodes, not because he is on a gym quest, more because the Anime staff made him to do so, completely irrelevant to his dream of becoming Pokemon Master or his current status as a pokemon trainer or his goal to enter the league.


BTW, I think within the Pokemon fanfic community, there is a sub-genre called "trainer fic" instead (Although I never saw anyone branded their fic as such). Where just like its wording suggested, the focus is the trainer character him/herself instead of the journey itself, despite the story plot itself may still be gym quest and/or league challenge.

Hey, maybe I should rather branded my upcoming new fic as "trainer fic" instead of journey fic, because travelling and journey was really very limited, and the story are indeed focused on their own self.

 

[VeniaSilente]

For example, being a pokemon trainer is, well very obviously, to train the pokemons. So why one need to go traveling on a day-to-day basis? Shouldn't one stay in one place and strengthen one's handheld pokemon by taking a routine training program? Even one needs to go to another place, why spend so much time on the walking itself rather than working on something else?

"To train the Pokémon" is essentially one half of the story; the "utilitarian" or "immediate" half I would say. But at least the anime mas implied or pointed out in several occasions one of the benefits of travelling in that you get to meet people, and interact with them, make friends - and more importantly, build yourself character as a person, more than merely build up muscle on your Pokémon.

Perhaps that is why people in the Pokémon world are so much more mature than people in our world at similar ages - there, they are exposed to the diversity of the world starting at an early age, so they learn, at the best possible time (at about when the brain and the body can grow the most) to not let themselves be stalled by narrow, simplistic or debunked methods of training and of adventuring. Nowadays at least many of us ought to learn of that...

Added to that, travelling around means you get to go where the Pokémon live, and that way you can add variety to your team and learn how to battle them on their own terms.

That said, that works wonders as a starting step. We'll notice that, at least in the games, as Trainers start specializing, they also start clustering, maybe become more static (eg.: Aces found in groups, or Veterans and Rangers found in predictable places). Also makes some sense thinking of Trainers as people and Pokémon who spend resources, too. One would think the idea of travelling all around as part of one's "journey" is good for maybe two, three years, when it is treated more or less as a sport and spectactle; if you are going to continue on the path after that, you'd likely have to start seeing as a an athlete rather than as a hobbyist or a standard issue sportsman.