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Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible new

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Pyradox

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

It's likely, and I considered that. But surely Game Freak aren't that uncreative? Otherwise Pidgey etc. would also be pure Flying.

Of course, it's also exceedingly likely they just won't let the damn thing learn Roost.
 

Polkadot Jolteon

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

Which would be horribly disappointing. I may sue them for that.
 

The_Uninvolved

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

It's supposed to be from the unrelated anime that's being advertised in the cover.

Well, but is too close of the new formes, and those are the only things in the cover that are outlined..

And it shares Tornadus's outline color.

So perhaps we shouldn't have been so quick to dismiss it?

It actually has a brighter outline than Tornadus, but the fact that it has an outline could make it related to Pokemon (being that the Kami Trio are only ones with outlines it seems).
I am not sure what it is though. It seems some like a group of knights to be honest. Perhaps a reference to a new Team Plasma ?
And thank you for clearing up what that shape was near Thundurus. It seems rather odd for a tail.
 

Polkadot Jolteon

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

It's supposed to be from the unrelated anime that's being advertised in the cover.

Well, but is too close of the new formes, and those are the only things in the cover that are outlined..

And it shares Tornadus's outline color.

So perhaps we shouldn't have been so quick to dismiss it?

It actually has a brighter outline than Tornadus, but the fact that it has an outline could make it related to Pokemon (being that the Kami Trio are only ones with outlines it seems).
I am not sure what it is though. It seems some like a group of knights to be honest. Perhaps a reference to a new Team Plasma ?
And thank you for clearing up what that shape was near Thundurus. It seems rather odd for a tail.

Original Dragon? Dun dun duh.


Roost (move) - Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia

[h=3]Generation V[/h] If a pure Flying-type Pokémon uses Roost, it will become Normal-type until the end of the turn.

Remember, this is B2/W2. This is essentially Neo Pokémon. It is changing everything as we know it. Who knows if it'll stay like that?
 

Pyradox

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

It's supposed to be from the unrelated anime that's being advertised in the cover.

Well, but is too close of the new formes, and those are the only things in the cover that are outlined..

And it shares Tornadus's outline color.

So perhaps we shouldn't have been so quick to dismiss it?

It actually has a brighter outline than Tornadus, but the fact that it has an outline could make it related to Pokemon (being that the Kami Trio are only ones with outlines it seems).
I am not sure what it is though. It seems some like a group of knights to be honest. Perhaps a reference to a new Team Plasma ?
And thank you for clearing up what that shape was near Thundurus. It seems rather odd for a tail.

Original Dragon? Dun dun duh.

Possibly, although we won't know anything more until we can figure out what the text says.

The main argument against the Original Dragon was that it had no placeholder data, yes? But neither do the Kami formes, meaning the Original Dragon may still be included in the game.
 

Polkadot Jolteon

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

It's supposed to be from the unrelated anime that's being advertised in the cover.

Well, but is too close of the new formes, and those are the only things in the cover that are outlined..

And it shares Tornadus's outline color.

So perhaps we shouldn't have been so quick to dismiss it?

It actually has a brighter outline than Tornadus, but the fact that it has an outline could make it related to Pokemon (being that the Kami Trio are only ones with outlines it seems).
I am not sure what it is though. It seems some like a group of knights to be honest. Perhaps a reference to a new Team Plasma ?
And thank you for clearing up what that shape was near Thundurus. It seems rather odd for a tail.

Original Dragon? Dun dun duh.

Possibly, although we won't know anything more until we can figure out what the text says.

The main argument against the Original Dragon was that it had no placeholder data, yes? But neither do the Kami formes, meaning the Original Dragon is still up.

That's why I set up this.
 

The_Uninvolved

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

It's supposed to be from the unrelated anime that's being advertised in the cover.

Well, but is too close of the new formes, and those are the only things in the cover that are outlined..

And it shares Tornadus's outline color.

So perhaps we shouldn't have been so quick to dismiss it?

It actually has a brighter outline than Tornadus, but the fact that it has an outline could make it related to Pokemon (being that the Kami Trio are only ones with outlines it seems).
I am not sure what it is though. It seems some like a group of knights to be honest. Perhaps a reference to a new Team Plasma ?
And thank you for clearing up what that shape was near Thundurus. It seems rather odd for a tail.

Original Dragon? Dun dun duh.

Possibly, although we won't know anything more until we can figure out what the text says.

The main argument against the Original Dragon was that it had no placeholder data, yes? But neither do the Kami formes, meaning the Original Dragon may still be included in the game.

The thing is that forme changes are not that problematic to create even if they are story based. But the creation of an altogether new pokemon is rather ambitious especially if it is only for a third version (in this case sequel). I don't know I am sticking to my knight theory until this leak is cleared up, other wise we are grasping at smoke.
 

The Outrage

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

Roost (move) - Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia

Generation V

If a pure Flying-type Pokémon uses Roost, it will become Normal-type until the end of the turn.

Remember, this is B2/W2. This is essentially Neo Pokémon. It is changing everything as we know it. Who knows if it'll stay like that?
I think you've missed the point entirely >_>

People were talking as if it would have been impossible for a pure flying type to learn Roost and would require the re-introduction of the ???-type, which was purposefully removed from Gen V. They've already accounted for what would happen. It is much simpler to keep the effect as-is, rather than re-introduce ??? for the sole purpose of this move, which creates further complication of it not existing in BW, meaning that when BW and BW2 communicate in battle, a player using Roost in BW2 will likely have to use the same effect as BW anyway (i.e., turn into normal type).

While there was no reason for the Kami Trio to get a new form, and it happened anyway, there's multiple reasons as to why Roost's mechanics won't be changed again. You're going to have to give a better argument than "anything can happen" in this situation, otherwise I can say it will turn into the light type with no prior evidence.

I mean, while I didn't predict the Kami Trio, I had been a strong proponent for the idea that Game Freak will introduce something new that we couldn't predict based on data structure since this is a sequel, thus would allow for stronger trade restrictions much like GSC-->RBY. However, unlike the introduction of a new move (which I could see if a Pokemon was forced to forget it like GSC), I don't see a good reason as to why the ???-type would be re-introduced after going through all the trouble of removing it.
 

Polkadot Jolteon

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

It's supposed to be from the unrelated anime that's being advertised in the cover.

Well, but is too close of the new formes, and those are the only things in the cover that are outlined..

And it shares Tornadus's outline color.

So perhaps we shouldn't have been so quick to dismiss it?

It actually has a brighter outline than Tornadus, but the fact that it has an outline could make it related to Pokemon (being that the Kami Trio are only ones with outlines it seems).
I am not sure what it is though. It seems some like a group of knights to be honest. Perhaps a reference to a new Team Plasma ?
And thank you for clearing up what that shape was near Thundurus. It seems rather odd for a tail.

Original Dragon? Dun dun duh.

Possibly, although we won't know anything more until we can figure out what the text says.

The main argument against the Original Dragon was that it had no placeholder data, yes? But neither do the Kami formes, meaning the Original Dragon may still be included in the game.

The thing is that forme changes are not that problematic to create even if they are story based. But the creation of an altogether new pokemon is rather ambitious especially if it is only for a third version (in this case sequel). I don't know I am sticking to my knight theory until this leak is cleared up, other wise we are grasping at smoke.
Well, duh. We are speculators, grasping at smoke is what we do.

You're going to have to give a better argument than "anything can happen" in this situation, otherwise I can say it will turn into the light type with no prior evidence.
And maybe you'd be right. We don't know.
 

The Outrage

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

You're going to have to give a better argument than "anything can happen" in this situation, otherwise I can say it will turn into the light type with no prior evidence.
And maybe you'd be right. We don't know.
Quite honestly, if you're going to keep using that logic, I don't see why we'd bother continuing on this topic. I've edited my comment above. Like I said, everything I've speculated, no matter how wild, had been logically explained (and even somewhat proven given that I speculated something like this could happen when everyone else was saying "no").

What you're proposing here causes direct conflict with BW coding since Roost exists in both games. While one can reconcile it by saying that in a BW/BW2 battle, Roost will turn you into normal types, one would have to ask the question: Why bother bringing ???-type back in the first place?

They can easily add any new formes and new Pokemon and even new moves in the sequels by restricting communications much like GSC did by either not allowing you to have these Pokemon that violate the old code in your party when communicating BW, or in the case of new formes, force it to revert back (this was the basis of my argument for the Original Dragon, but the logic falls in line here anyway). In these scenarios, no contradiction exists. However, no one is giving a good reason why ??? type would return. In fact, given the discussion so far, people assumed Tornados didn't get Roost because it was a pure-Flying and ??? didn't exist (which is why I posted that quote from Bulbapedia illustrating that it wasn't the reason).


???-type was such a rarely used placeholder that it didn't make sense why it existed in the first place when in all instances of its use, another type could have substituted for it (and the one move it could have been for, Hidden Power, wasn't, resulting in no Normal-type damage hidden power)
 

Polkadot Jolteon

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

Okay, let's put it this way.

How do you know there will even be a possibility of B/W-B2/W2 connections? It's more likely there won't be, due to the amount of rewriting done.

We don't need to prove anything. No one ever has. No one has ever had a reason to think anything either. It's like looking for a golf ball in the park, finding it, then figuring out that the ball wasn't your ball. What makes you think it's in the park anyway?

Look at Schrodinger's Cat. There is no way of telling what will be in B2/W2 until it is revealed.
 

The Outrage

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

The thing is that forme changes are not that problematic to create even if they are story based. But the creation of an altogether new pokemon is rather ambitious especially if it is only for a third version (in this case sequel). I don't know I am sticking to my knight theory until this leak is cleared up, other wise we are grasping at smoke.

It's not grasping at smoke. The Original Dragon was heavily referenced in BW. A new Pokemon can be handled much the same way GSC handled communications with RBY. It's actually not that difficult for Game Freak to figure it out given that they've done it already.
 

Pyradox

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

Okay, let's put it this way.

How do you know there will even be a possibility of B/W-B2/W2 connections? It's more likely there won't be, due to the amount of rewriting done.

They're the same generation. You can't say 'it's more likely there won't be because of the rewriting', as Shaymin's Sky Forme wasn't in DP. You can still trade between DP and Pt/HGSS, though. If you try to trade a Kami forme (for example) to BW, they'll probably revert it just before the trade. They've handled this sort of thing before, and BW not being able to connect with BW2 would be a pointless step backwards.
 

The Outrage

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

Okay, let's put it this way.

How do you know there will even be a possibility of B/W-B2/W2 connections? It's more likely there won't be, due to the amount of rewriting done.

Due to the amount of rewriting done? What they did here is much less complicated in terms of what they've done in GSC, and communication exists there. So, other then the fact that BW2 are still in the same generation, which makes even less sense to not be able to communicate (really, if they wanted to use that as an excuse, they could have simply left this for the 3DS), they've pulled off communication in more difficult scenarios in the past.

This isn't RSE where the Pokemon's data structure had been completely rewritten for every single species. Even then, it was more of a "I don't want to bother" issue since GSC introduced the special defense stat, which Pokemon in RBY did not have, yet were able to be transferred. Cables did exist for communication between GBA and GB so transfer could have been facilitated if they expanded on what they did with GSC.

Regardless, you're asking me whether there would be a possibility of connection between BW and BW2, but your only argument for why there wouldn't is that there's "too much rewriting", which I've already addressed. Now let us assume that there is too much. It still doesn't answer the question of why ???-type would be re-introduced other than the logic "anything can happen" when Game Freak has already shown that it has found alternatives to the problematic ???-type and no longer wish to maintain it.
 

Pyradox

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

Okay, let's put it this way.

How do you know there will even be a possibility of B/W-B2/W2 connections? It's more likely there won't be, due to the amount of rewriting done.

They're the same generation. You can't say 'it's more likely there won't be', because Shaymin's Sky Forme wasn't in DP. You can still trade between DP and Pt/HGSS, though. If you try to trade a Kami forme (for example) to BW, they'll probably revert it just before the trade.
Ahem.
View attachment 65380
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You were saying?

I'm not saying there isn't rewriting, I'm saying they'll still probably pull off backwards compatibility. There's a hell of a lot of new stuff. I'm not denying it. But they did it in GSC, what would make you think they can't do it more than ten years later?
 

Windchild

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

New locations have been introduced to previous regions, as have characters. The new Unova is to old Unova as Sinnoh is to Johto. They're different, but can communicate with each other, yes?
 

Polkadot Jolteon

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

May I draw everyone's attention to the fact there are two new Gym Leaders and the fact the half of the region is a bloody glacier.

It is not the same game anymore.

Sure, there may be Poké Transfer with B/W included to the list, but it would probably be difficult to make the two communicate. D/P/Pt was probably based off of a heavily modified Gen III engine, but they couldn't battle etc.
 

The Outrage

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Re: Kami Trio receiving new formes in upcoming games: CoroCoro cover reveals possible

Look at Schrodinger's Cat. There is no way of telling what will be in B2/W2 until it is revealed.

The two possibilities of Schrodinger's Cat was that it was either dead or alive. There wasn't a possibility that it was going to transform into an English-speaking Chimpanzee who just finished writing its third play. The possibilities of that experiment were confined by the reality it existed in--a cat trapped in a box with a vile of poison that was set to break at an indeterminate amount of time.

People like to assume Game Freak's actions are either set in a strict pattern, or when that pattern is broken, remains unpredictable. However, may I point out that these unprecedented sequels were able to be predicted because someone examined the confines of reality in the statement made that there would be no third version and Masuda's subsequent response.
May I draw everyone's attention to the fact there are two new Gym Leaders and the fact the half of the region is a bloody glacier.

It is not the same game anymore.

Sure, there may be Poké Transfer with B/W included to the list, but it would probably be difficult to make the two communicate. D/P/Pt was probably based off of a heavily modified Gen III engine, but they couldn't battle etc.
The "glacier" is merely the map being covered and an allusion to an unnatural event. Two new gym leaders are not unprecedented given that two years have passed in the game. This was the same amount of time required for Koga to become an Elite 4 member and Janine to replace him. If you honestly found new gym leaders surprising and unpredictable in a game pegged as sequels and not merely third versions (though, may I remind you that Emerald had a new gym leader)...

Pokémon Gold and Silver Versions - Bulbapedia, the community-driven Pokémon encyclopedia

You were saying? Nothing BW2 added compares to an entire region, and edited locations in Kanto, along with new species, new moves, a new stat, held items (need I go on?). You have honestly got to be kidding me if you think that. Going by your logic that any change in region should not facilitate communication, we should not be able to communicate between DPPt and HgSs given the dissimilarities between both >_>

There was no denial that new things were added and old things were changed. Don't treat me like an idiot by presenting to me old news. What I said was, the difference between BW and BW2 is no where near sufficient to be making the claim that you did.
 
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