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Mafia Philosophy

Spiders!
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I suppose so, but I really just prefer to know for sure if the person we're lynching is actually mafia, even if that means only 3 or 4 townspeople left.
 
Fire Chicken
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OK although in some games there are lots of mafia members and strange roles they have so leaving it until too late can be a problem. Starting to scumhunt right away is a better option as past games have shown. There have been debates about whether No Lynch is a good strategy but the consensus is that most of the time it isn't.
 
Spiders!
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I guess you're right, but I'll stick with my current strategy. At least, until it fails for me.
 
Ticking Time Bomb
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Why do people use meta as an argument? Or as a defence/accusation? I've seen it many times, and because sometimes from power players, I want to see what they think.

I think meta can change from one game to another, I dont think meta is set in stone. I could play spectacular in one game, create a meta, play like it for three games, then all of a sudden I play like something else. I've then created a new way for myself to play, so you using my old meta against me is pointless.
 
Fire Chicken
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Why do people use meta as an argument? Or as a defence/accusation? I've seen it many times, and because sometimes from power players, I want to see what they think.

I think meta can change from one game to another, I dont think meta is set in stone. I could play spectacular in one game, create a meta, play like it for three games, then all of a sudden I play like something else. I've then created a new way for myself to play, so you using my old meta against me is pointless.
Oh boy I can see this talk getting interesting quickly. Power Player Zexy signing in with the Pro-Meta Argument. Just wait until Power Player @Midorikawa attacks back :p

The thing with meta is that each player tends to have some tells, some tendencies on how they play as either alignment.

Meta can change but some things still stick around because that's how people are, there's a sort-of inertia in us, no matter how much we may want to look town as mafia it isn't that easy. People can learn to play differently but some fundamental things remain, and our meta reads can change too just as the players' styles change.
 
Vee Vee Eeeeveee!
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I think meta is an interesting defence... If I understand the concept of meta, it is basically a player's "usual behaviour" for a certain type. For example, Mido's usual aggressiveness at the beginning of a game.

Which means that I feel it is a valid defence. If a player is behaving just like their town meta, even if it appears weird to a player not familiar with them, then they are simply behaving like themselves. Again, Mido's aggressiveness may seem scummy, but that's just the way she is.
 
Fire Chicken
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It's not only a defense, it can be used to read other people and attack them too.

Each meta tell is only valid if used right, though; for example not "Zexy is town/mafia because he softclaimed" but instead "Zexy softclaims all the time, so his softclaim doesn't indicate alignment". Bringing this up because it's a common thing I've fought with Mido over several times especially Day 1.
 
I Stand Out
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But the problem with running on meta, to justify a player's scummy actions, is that they could truly be scum trying something, and you're just like "Yeah, what they did was bad, but that's just them.". Like CheffOfGames. He's been seen acting wild and scum-like. Sometimes he just not doing well, and just looks scum. You could easily be tempted to write is off as "That's just Cheff, it's what he does.", but then, a couple of times, he seriously was mafia. But you could've ignored him and let him go just because that's how he works.
This becomes super dangerous with power players like Mido, who know their meta, know we know their meta, so know they can play to it and be super dangerous scum. Mido's admitted it, she's hard to pick.
 
Fire Chicken
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Well meta reading is a tool just like most scumhunting methods are, it's not the only thing you should use, not what decides your read on a person alone. For example in the above scenario, in each game there would be some more evidence that pointed out CheffOfGames as mafia if he was indeed such, we never used meta only.

There's a reason I'm always paranoid about Mido, her thing is basically not being easily meta-readable. Thankfully there are more tools than just meta to read people and whenever mafia!Mido was caught it wasn't just because of meta alone ofc.

In other words, meta is good but not the only important thing. I may use it a lot and make it seem like I value it too much which gets on some people's nerves, but I'm never using that alone. I do value it but it's not everything. Others value it less and that's an OK playstyle to follow as well, it just doesn't suit me.
 
Gobble Gobble Gobble
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@Calvin ッ As Zexy said meta is a tool. People have quirks and it's best to know those because it helps read people. And like LG said I know my meta. I actually know how to tell the difference between my town self and mafia self, not that anyone else seems to notice it.

However it's because of facts like that that it shouldn't be used. It's more for minor things like Zexy s ridiculous softclaiming not being alignment indicative. Each game should be scumhunting without it save for minor things like Zexy idea of softclaiming. Especially since if you always use or you could make a mistake since players play styles are always evolving.

Meta is something to help, but then players like @Zexy use it and it alone at times. He had a pure meta defense in periodic table. It's not valid. It's the actions in the game that matter not in all.
 
Fire Chicken
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I know the differences between my town and scumy plays as well; a while ago everyone could tell and have me lynched as scum by Day 3 but then in PJ/AF I actually got better at it*

I don't use it and it alone as an attack. As a defense maybe, when I don't really have something else to defend myself with. The case against me in Periodic Table was basically misunderstanding meta things of mine and not being very active because I was sick.

*kinda off-topic but I've noticed that I tend to have good and bad times while playing mafia, wonder if anyone else got that too? for example there have been three notable streaks I was doing very well (two last year; TPP, MotW and MSW + SWRMM, Monty Python, Gen I, Paragon with only the unwinnable MSW2 in the middle) and one this year; POTUS I, PJ (kinda), ESB and AF) and one I was doing terribly (Gameshow, Layton, YGO Battle City Finals, Just a Minimafia, XY&Z, Solar System and AA:SoJ (I think I lead town well enough but we still lost), with only the SDR3 win in between where I died n1 and did nothing anyway). So I feel like my playstyle is changing once a while, for the better or the worse. although the long bad streak might have partly been mood-influenced, I feel like I should apologize to whoever was on my team for those games :(
 
The Paragon of Torna
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*kinda off-topic but I've noticed that I tend to have good and bad times while playing mafia, wonder if anyone else got that too? for example there have been three notable streaks I was doing very well (two last year; TPP, MotW and MSW + SWRMM, Monty Python, Gen I, Paragon with only the unwinnable MSW2 in the middle) and one this year; POTUS I, PJ (kinda), ESB and AF) and one I was doing terribly (Gameshow, Layton, YGO Battle City Finals, Just a Minimafia, XY&Z, Solar System and AA:SoJ (I think I lead town well enough but we still lost), with only the SDR3 win in between where I died n1 and did nothing anyway). So I feel like my playstyle is changing once a while, for the better or the worse. although the long bad streak might have partly been mood-influenced, I feel like I should apologize to whoever was on my team for those games :(
I think that happens with everyone, so don't fret xD
 
I Stand Out
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*kinda off-topic but I've noticed that I tend to have good and bad times while playing mafia, wonder if anyone else got that too? for example there have been three notable streaks I was doing very well (two last year; TPP, MotW and MSW + SWRMM, Monty Python, Gen I, Paragon with only the unwinnable MSW2 in the middle) and one this year; POTUS I, PJ (kinda), ESB and AF) and one I was doing terribly (Gameshow, Layton, YGO Battle City Finals, Just a Minimafia, XY&Z, Solar System and AA:SoJ (I think I lead town well enough but we still lost), with only the SDR3 win in between where I died n1 and did nothing anyway). So I feel like my playstyle is changing once a while, for the better or the worse. although the long bad streak might have partly been mood-influenced, I feel like I should apologize to whoever was on my team for those games :(
I wouldn't know. I've been scum once, and indep never. Seriously what do I have to do to get the RNG to spit me out as something besides Town? My only scum game was my second game. Can I not just be something else for a change?
 
Gobble Gobble Gobble
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I think the players in the game also decide how you play at times.
 
Museum Enthusiast
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I think the players in the game also decide how you play at times.
This is true, but not necessarily for meta reasons.
I will play a lot more seriously depending on the skill level of other players. For example, I am much more wary and paranoid if Mido, Elie, or HD are in the game with me. Not because of meta, but because each of them is devastating as an adversary.

Meta is the last refuge of someone without a legitimate case. On the other hand, meta may be the only way to catch certain players as scum, because some of them really are good at blending in as town and their actions seem towny.
 
Very Very Interesting
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I only think meta is applicable in certain circumstances. I like to use it as a semi-defence of another, for when they are accused of scumminess for something meta says is not alignment indicative for them.
 
played the correct frequency
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From experience, I find meta to be useful for discussion purposes but the reliance or even using meta as an offense or defense isn't really indicative of anything for reasons already stated. I find it more useful on how the use of meta is used to be a little bit better on figuring out reads.

However it's because of facts like that that it shouldn't be used. It's more for minor things like Zexy s ridiculous softclaiming not being alignment indicative. Each game should be scumhunting without it save for minor things like Zexy idea of softclaiming. Especially since if you always use or you could make a mistake since players play styles are always evolving.
Still laughing about Solar System Mafia on how Zexy softclaimed commuter.
 
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