male gardevoir as transgender symbol

[Dr. Buni]

Gardevoir, to me, can equally represent someone who is biologically a woman but identifies as man (the appearance reflect their biological body, but the actual gender of M Gardevoir reflect what they identify as), or someone who is biologically a man but identify with the social role of women (M Gardevoir being M reflect their biological sex, but the appearance reflect their identity).

The fact that M Gardevoir is less caricatural and more ambiguous where Machamp is...well, it wouldn't know subtle if subtle hit it in the face with a clue-by-four made it a better choice. Gardevoir is kind of ambiguous (as in: it can represent multiple things). Machamp is to male caricatures as Jynx is to female caricatures. And if there was a M Jynx in the game, I don't think it would make a good transgender icon either.

Which is not to say we won't consider adding other options (though I'm afraid that we're never going to be able to cover all the myriad possible gender identities - there are only so many appropriate pokémon sprite, and constantly updating the list to add new terms take time and effort that we might not be able to afford).

Just that Gardevoir is not meant to represent specifically MtF or FtM at the expense of the other group.

Fair point and thanks for responding to the thread. I agree about the Machamp line not being perfectly suited to represent ftm transgender people. That said, should the suggestion of a ftm option be accepted, the Pokémon representative doesn't need to be Machamp. It could be any other often assumed to be male-only species by the fandom, like Alakazam (just an example, since one could argue Alakazam is almost as much as a caricature as Jynx, Machamp and others). There probably is a suitable Pokémon among the almost 800 currently known species.

 

[LordGarcholf]

Make a small ♂ (FtM) and ♀ (MtF) icon to mark the difference between them if it bothers? I'd stick to Gardevoir anyway, with or without the small difference.

If there's gonna be a change to mark the difference between these transgender groups, the decision should be made based on whom the symbol would represent; how many people of transgender group would want the change or not? I'm surprised there are more people of other groups concerned about the difference and the possible change.


Additional note: I wouldn't put so much weight on fandom's opinion as Gardevoir can be 50/50% m/f, the internet is full of this stuff already. Otherwise we could also consider Mewtwo's megas (I wouldn't support that as I see them gender-neutral), or Delphox, Lucario, Granbull...?

 

[Dr. Buni]

Delphox is (unfortunately, like every other starter) 75/25% m/f, so... I don't think it is the best example. And although I don't usually talk openly about my sexuality, I might not be someone of 'other group' I am sure you weren't referring specifically to me, though! By the way, I think a change would be nice, but I am not particularly bothered by Gardevoir representing transgenders as a whole.

 

[LordGarcholf]

Delphox is (unfortunately, like every other starter) 75/25% m/f, so... I don't think it is the best example..

True btw, forgot about that one. Thanks for pointing it out! Actually in addition to that, Granbull is 75%/25% f/m, yet there's variety in my loose list of examples if nothing else.

I'm also glad you saw my point of not pointing to anyone personally, as I mean no offense nor dismissal to anyone - otherwise I'd just say "irrelevant" or something like that.
I'm gonna clarify this to avoid possible misunderstandings as this is a sensitive topic to many; even if someone (like you) chooses not to express their gender (or sexuality etc), that's really everyone's personal right and choice, doesn't make their opinion worthless. And really, even as there are participants of male, female, genderless etc groups in this discussion, their opinions are valuable too, I had to point out that the change would concern transgendered people so more opinions from them would be appreciated and I wouldn't (personally) see any reason for the change if people of this group aren't worried about it.

In addition to this whole gender and symbols topic and implementation to possible changes, may I ask if there's more to this genders listing on forums than just making it easier to define pronouns? I understand this on social media etc (and if some people want to express it which is fine), but in a Pokemon community and if genders matter anything here. I might be just clueless due to not being here for long. If I have missed something relevant, feel free to enlighten me!

 

[Airalin]

Makes sense