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More prototype Pokemon from Gold and Silver revealed

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Seriously, BMGf? This story has been out there for two days now. Are we pretending it doesn't exist due to the illicit methods in which the files were obtained? I don't see how that's different than all the previous leaks...

Now, for those of you who really don't know, we have access to sprites from not only the Spaceworld 99 build of the games (only a few months prior to the final release, and yet...) but even from an early 97 build predating the famous Spaceworld 97 build.

Early 97 Protos.png
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There are 151 "new" Pokemon here in addition to all the Unown forms and a very weird Gloom. There wasn't enough space for all of these, so they had to cut 51 by the time Spaceworld 97 rolled around (Tajiri said as much in a 97 interview). Believe it or not, but the kokopelli Pokemon at the top is a Celebi prototype of sorts (we don't have names, but you'll see). Then you have Stantler which was removed by Spaceworld 97 only to come back two years without any changes. And a standalone Cyndaquil with crystals on its back? I thought I'd seen everything. Same for Elekid being a middle evolution, even though Magby and Smoochum didn't have their own babies...

For the Spaceworld 99 build, look here. Aipom (in Silver), Kingdra, Sneasel, Tyrogue (or rather Gong) and Hitmontop were still mostly unchanged from the previous Spaceworld build, while Furrett, Azumarill, Wobbuffett, Forretress, Sunkern and Dunsparce were clearly early in conception. Wooper and Celebi looked different than in 97 and the final release (or rather Wooper didn't exist back in 97, although Quagsire did). Also note that Agatha and Lorelei had new sprites:

Elite.png


Beta Celebi.png


Bears.png


It seems that there are also sprites from a 98 build, most importantly a Johto map which indicates that they had already retired the idea of a journey around Japan. There was no Cianwood, much like in the unused maps that carried over to the final release. But both Lake of Rage and Mahogany lacked gyms, so there were only 6, oddly enough.

There are more prototype sprites for well known Pokemon/characters, probably from 98 going up to 99?

98 sprites.png


Wobbuffett is weird both because the final sprite already existed (so why that mess in Spaceworld 99?) and there's a random blob thrown into the mix? The same website has all the known scratchpad sprites for trainers and Pokemon.
 
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The usual place for leaks. Nintendo actually ordered some people on Twitter to take these sprites down, but whatever. Fans have a right to know and they can only do so much to stop this.
 
The usual place for leaks. Nintendo actually ordered some people on Twitter to take these sprites down, but whatever. Fans have a right to know and they can only do so much to stop this.
4chan? If so, I have reason to have doubts about them. After the livestream incident, I'm kinda cautious about these types of things.
 
It's real. As said, Nintendo hunted people down on Twitter (specifically Dr. Lava, who is rather famous).. Plus, the leak includes the source code as well as many builds with minor differences. No one would have gone to this much trouble. I'd argue that the Red/Green leak from over a year ago is also real, despite the fake front sprites (that shouldn't have been added, but they admitted it right after the stream). That's neither here nor there, because there weren't nearly as many files in that case.

Scratchpad sprites for trainers and Pokemon. The highlights:

436.png
414.png
456.png


BMGf, could you act a little less dead? This is the biggest thing going on in the fandom right now (there is little competition, but still). You can discuss it while remaining skeptical.
 
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Seriously, BMGf? This story has been out there for two days now. Are we pretending it doesn't exist due to the illicit methods in which the files were obtained? I don't see how that's different than all the previous leaks...

Surely it's more a matter of audience? It's no surprise to me that people going to care more about leaks pertaining to a big-ticket upcoming game full of new stuff than they are about an arcane demo leak which for the most part just adds some extra detail onto a bigger demo leak that already happened a few years ago. I mean, I've got no compunctions about how this information is disseminated since it's ancient, and I love uncovering bits of history and all that, but I passed by this information on another forum a few days ago and mostly just registered it as "Huh, cool. More of that then."

At any rate, the viking longboat elasmosaurus is really cool, and I think I actually like the hybrid Celebi more than the finalized one that we've had all this time. It feels much more like a strange woodland creature and is a lot less cute, which I think help makes it feel more otherworldly. Cyndaquil makes me think of Alolan Sandslash.
 
I don't see any leaks about upcoming games anywhere, so the point is moot when people are discussing much more mundane things instead. There are 50+ "new" designs here plus prototypes, so even if they aren't your cup of tea, come on.

Sorry if I sound impatient.
 
I'm still cautious on it, considering that after the livestream /v/ turned against them, to the point of spreading malicious lies about Raciebeep, and possibly others.

However, if it comes with the source code like you claim, then it would turn everything bittersweet to me since that would mean a certain Glitch City post would be real, too.

In short, all this info came to light because someone hacked Nintendo on March 2018 (I think?). Apparently, what they did was steal assets from Nintendo. Three months later, Spaceworld is leaked. According to the Glitch City post, the assets also came with more info that Team Spaceworld could not share, including the tools to make the games. The guy was not sent to jail because reasons, so I wonder if he's the same guy still leaking things.
 
There are 50+ "new" designs here plus prototypes, so even if they aren't your cup of tea, come on.
I mean, there's really not much to comment on here unfortunately outside of, like, stating your opinion on a few designs. To my understanding, it's not as though this is revolutionary information that shatters our perspective of Pokemon, just some neat tidbits on the development of an old game. I definitely wouldn't call it "the biggest thing going on in the fandom right now" as intriguing as it is.

At any rate, some of the scrapped designs look rather interesting, such as the aforementioned crystalline Cynadquil, funky bird, and stork (I've always wanted a stork/heron/crane Pokemon). I don't know how far back GameFreak pulls scrapped designs from (pretty far back, no?), but it'd be neat to see some of these recycled in future generations (if they are legitimate), either as entirely new Pokemon or as regional variants and (pre)evolutions (Girafarig's beta design needs to come back somehow).
 
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LOL at Nintendo trying to take this things down. I understand that this is sensible information (the leak also includes emails between GF and Club Mario or whatever it's called) but it's also...22 years old! They are just making it more valuable.

Anyway, there were two leaks included, one of them is the black and white sprites, that I've seen sources differ on whether it's pre- or post-spaceworld, and another one from 1999 which shows some beta design of the Johto Pokémon. This Twiter account has a lot of info (including the sprites I'll talk about on the second part) and this Tweet shows on-point speculation about the b&w sprites.

My thoughts on the 1997 leak:

  • Manbo had 2 evolutions and Ikari had a preevolution, by Spaceworld they had merged because they lost their other family members. That's kinda sweet.
  • Natu and Xatu had a peacock middle evolution. 22 years later we don't have an actual peacock...
  • Original Pudi looks very cartoonish and much cuter than the other one.
  • The black butterfly and its preevo remind me of Burmy and Mothim, but I wouldn't be surprised if they ended up being Pineco.
  • The dragon ship reminds me of Lugia because of the markings and its association with water, but official information implies that Shudo designed Lugia for the movie. It's possible that Shudo just completed the design though.
  • Original Cyndaquil screams more Steel or Rock than Ice to me, if it was Ice it would have more cracks. Anyway, it's cool that its cute design lead it to being repurposed as a starter.
  • Drill Squid and Fighting chicken 1 from the RB beta have finally got their frontsprites shown.
  • "Komala was supposed to be in Gen II" trivia is going to spread like wildfire. But that seems to be the case, as both have similar proportions and are holding on something.
  • Songbird is really cute and it's a shame it was scrapped. The concept of a swan made of abstract shapes reminds me of Cresselia.
  • The Celebi situation is...crazy.
My thoughts from the other sprites from eclipse's Twitter:
  • Forretress looks better with a mouth on it, but I guess Gamefreak wanted some mystery surrounding it.
  • The blob that is with Wobbuffet eventually became Shuppet (Source) and Wynaut because Wynaut.
  • Mountain Piloswine looks better than the real one too.
  • Martial artist Politoed is cute.
  • Mommy Blissey looks great, apparently she would throw her eggs as missiles.
  • Honoguma became Teddiursa. So Honoguma lovers, give some love to the bear so eventually we all can enjoy Let's Go Teddiursa.
  • Shuckle looks like some kind of pot so the Apple worm inspiration is apparently wrong.
  • Ariados looks very Halloween-esque, I wonder why did they backtracked on that idea.
  • I will miss 4-legs Feraligatr forever.
 
The more I see them, the more nervous I am that they are real... I don't want my heart to break like it almost did with Inteleon.

EDIT: Also, we need someone to translate those Japanese entries.

EDIT 2: Also, am I seeing things right, or is there a 4-stage evolution line among the sprites :lapras:?
 
I'm still a little skeptical about the Spaceworld 1999 leak. I mean that event happened in August and the final versions of Gold and Silver came out like 3 months later; are we really supposed to believe that most of those beta designs were changed and finalized within that 3 month time frame?

The new 1997 leak at least feels more valid although a lot of those designs look so basic, like something that you'd see in Earthbound or in a fan game...
 
I'm still a little skeptical about the Spaceworld 1999 leak. I mean that event happened in August and the final versions of Gold and Silver came out like 3 months later; are we really supposed to believe that most of those beta designs were changed and finalized within that 3 month time frame?
I'm pretty that demos are usually based on earlier builds than those available at the time. Plus, the scratchpad sprites show that the final designs weren't far off. Anyway, these all came from the same source.

EDIT 2: Also, am I seeing things right, or is there a 4-stage evolution line among the sprites :lapras:?
I thought so too, but they're probably two similar lines like Clefairy and Jigglypuff. Well, that's the only reasonable explanation.
 
I thought so too, but they're probably two similar lines like Clefairy and Jigglypuff. Well, that's the only reasonable explanation.
Not sure. The game can handle more than four stages perfectly, at least judging by how in Pokémon Quartz they made a pretty tangled evolution line, so maybe it was considered but then discarded.
The new 1997 leak at least feels more valid although a lot of those designs look so basic, like something that you'd see in Earthbound or in a fan game...
Considering Creatures was once Ape, that feel is completely valid.
 
Honestly, the fourth one is a little too hideous compared to the rest. Isn't it a tree trunk? It could be a weird alternate evolution like Shedinja, though. I highly doubt that they would have made four stages a thing just for one line. Anyway, I'd like to see all of these come to life through fanart:

More 97 Protos.jpg


Skeletal Beast.jpg


The credit goes to Gooompy Art and Tovo, respectively. I'm also interested in the stork, dragon "turkey", salamander boat and the evolved boar whose face I can't make sense of.

There were signature moves called Gold Breath, Silver Breath, Crystal Eye and Mysterious Letter (which was apparently form-dependent). I assume they're from the 99 build, but it's odd because Ishihara once said that Crystal wasn't planned.
 
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There were signature moves called Gold Breath, Silver Breath, Crystal Eye and Mysterious Letter (which was apparently form-dependent). I assume they're from the 99 build, but it's odd because Ishihara once said that Crystal wasn't planned.
Can you show me where you saw this part. The site that hosted the sprites doesn't have that part.
 
Can you show me where you saw this part. The site that hosted the sprites doesn't have that part.
It's from the Twitter account Nicolas721 pointed out. There are other little nuggets, including this likely theory about the daifuku-like creature being a Pikachu prototype, which was different enough to be considered for GS (no such luck, though). They even have access to Game Freak's emails to beta testers and even Nintendo, but they aren't very interesting and there is no proper translation yet. To the surprise of no one, it turns out (except for Hiroshima conspiracists) that the script in beta Ruins of Alph didn't have any hidden meaning.
 
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It's from the Twitter account Nicolas721 pointed out. There are other little nuggets, including this likely theory about the daifuku-like creature being a Pikachu prototype, which was different enough to be considered for GS (no such luck, though). They even have access to Game Freak's emails to beta testers and even Nintendo, but they aren't very interesting and there is no proper translation yet.
So, I guess this means this and this were really true after all...
 
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