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Bulbapedia said:The user smashes into the target at high speed. This move always goes first.
yes, sorry.By Mirror Move, @Matleo, do you mean Mirror Coat?
I always felt like there was something... odd, about Piplup, Prinplup and Empoleon being able to use Bubble and BubbleBeam. I can chalk it up to just Pokemon things, but I imagine it's weird to blow bubbles from a beak.
I didn't say that was the case, no x3 I do find that odd as well, but the Bubble/BubbleBeam thing was what first popped (do ho ho) into my mind before.but its not odd that to many of water starters and water pokemon are learning ice beam and too strong ice attacks?
There's no way to spin "It has vines" as a justification for anything but a Grass-type move. (especially not just "it can fight with its vines"-fighting is kinda how battles work)-fighting(??? it has vines to do some serious fighting moves you know?),
-dark(??? really should get something taking it vines can be used for it),
What good would a 30BP move do for coverage?-ghost (maybe lick ???)
I can see the use for coverage, but it seems to me that's exactly why it's not getting any-it'd overpower Charizard and leave Charizard the weakest of the Kanto starters. (also, no Grass or Poison type can learn Rock Blast or Rock Throw, so it's kinda hard to say Venusaur should be the first)-rock (rock blast, rock throw, rock slide, something???)
There is literally no correlation between Dual Chop and Cut. (plus, Cut is an HM-it's put on a lot of Pokemon so it can be accessible) The learners of Dual Chop are all bipedal, and Venusaur clearly isn't.-dragon (it should learn dual chop, it can use cut or not? or dragon pulse)
There's no way to spin "It has vines" as a justification for anything but a Grass-type move. (especially not just "it can fight with its vines"-fighting is kinda how battles work)
then what about shadow ball? so many pokemon learn it.What good would a 30BP move do for coverage?
I can see the use for coverage, but it seems to me that's exactly why it's not getting any-it'd overpower Charizard and leave Charizard the weakest of the Kanto starters. (also, no Grass or Poison type can learn Rock Blast or Rock Throw, so it's kinda hard to say Venusaur should be the first)
There is literally no correlation between Dual Chop and Cut. (plus, Cut is an HM-it's put on a lot of Pokemon so it can be accessible) The learners of Dual Chop are all bipedal, and Venusaur clearly isn't.
I never said "no Grass-type Pokemon should learn Fighting or Dark-type moves." What I said was this:other grass pokemon learn fighting and dark type moves.
There's no way to spin "It has vines" as a justification for anything but a Grass-type move. (especially not just "it can fight with its vines"-fighting is kinda how battles work)
Vileplume can learn one Dark-type move (Fling, which usually can only be used once in a battle) and no Fighting moves.many pokemon with similar typing and body, and vines can use those by using their vines and leafs.
I can't even understand what you're saying here.But some are leted out and thats why grass types have hard.
A) No Pokemon is going to take down every other Pokemon. That's why we have teams of six.Victribel line, Tangela line and Venusaur line would need more coverage(fighting against steel) now days seeing what harder oponnents they need to battle against.
Because some pure-Grass types can learn those moves. Doesn't mean every Grass-type should learn them-there's more to the moves Pokemon learn than just their type.Plus the anime showed many situations where pure grass types use fighting type moves.
Let me reiterate: I am not saying no Grass-type should learn Fighting moves. What I am saying is that it makes no sense to claim that vines alone are justification for an attack. You said this:Lame un-justification not learning a fighting type move becuase of vines,
Your only reasoning for Venusaur to learn Fighting-type moves was because it can fight with vines.-fighting(??? it has vines to do some serious fighting moves you know?),
Vines bound together are not as strong as flesh and muscle.the vines it uses as arms and forarm together
Why??? Venusaur isn't even weak to Bug.ok thats more reasonable, but on the other hand it should get some other coverage against the bug type(or a new grass move SE on bugs)
I could see that being justified, but I also don't think it's really worth adding in. Venusaur's already got STAB against Rock and Fairy, the only other types Steel is strong against. Why add in an attack to hit one type super effectively when Ice doesn't even resist its STAB?I wonder if it could learn a steel type move like iron head against the ice types?
"should be able as a grass/poison"? None of the others can learn Electric moves, either.I wanted something to let it take down flying. Or should be abble as a grass/poison plant learn a electric move for that? but what one? (no thunderbolt)
It's still got a strong Physical attack, and the Ground-type coverage. Not every Pokemon is gonna be the ultimate attacker, some moves are left out to keep them in check.It has one only physical ground moves, should get earth power in my opinion.
When every other Pokemon that learns the move is bipedal, and the move is only learned by leveling up. (or tutor in Gen 6)when do you need be bipedal if you have 2 strong vines to chop something?
None! It doesn't need a Dragon move!what other dragon move then would you suggest?
Your justification for Venusaur learning Fighting and Dark moves was entirely based on its vines, a plant-based part of the Pokemon. Other Grass-types have more reasons to learn those moves-a body built for more martial-arts based moves, or being of the Fighting or Dark types themselves.
Vileplume can learn one Dark-type move (Fling, which usually can only be used once in a battle) and no Fighting moves.
Victreebell can learn two Dark-type moves (one of which is Fling), and no Fighting moves.
Roserade learns no Dark or Fighting moves.
Amoongus learns two Dark-type moves and no Fighting moves. (It also has no vines or leaves)
That's every Grass/Poison line.
I can't even understand what you're saying here.
A) No Pokemon is going to take down every other Pokemon. That's why we have teams of six.
B) No Pokemon will have coverage across every other type.
C) Why are Steel types suddenly a "harder opponent"? They've been around for quite some time now.
Vines bound together are not as strong as flesh and muscle.
ok tusche, it has enogh normal type moves for that.Why??? Venusaur isn't even weak to Bug.
I could see that being justified, but I also don't think it's really worth adding in. Venusaur's already got STAB against Rock and Fairy, the only other types Steel is strong against. Why add in an attack to hit one type super effectively when Ice doesn't even resist its STAB?
should be able as a grass/poison"? None of the others can learn Electric moves, either.
It's still got a strong Physical attack, and the Ground-type coverage. Not every Pokemon is gonna be the ultimate attacker, some moves are left out to keep them in check.
None! It doesn't need a Dragon move!
Don't use Venusaur against it? It's a simply very bad matchup. It seems as if your sole target is that each and every Pokemon learns move of every random type ever.what if the oponent has a dual typing that resists its grass and poison moves?
How does Dazzling gleam make sense on Venusaur? There is nothing shiny, magic or fairy like in Venusaur. Infact, it's the opposite: full of poison, dirt (poison has dirt), and its just like a toad. Nothing magical there.then give it Dazzling Gleam against dragons.
no but check the list of physical/special moves it learns with power bigger then 60 base and what coverage do the other starter pokemon get through out generations?Don't use Venusaur against it? It's a simply very bad matchup. It seems as if your sole target is that each and every Pokemon learns move of every random type ever.
How does Dazzling gleam make sense on Venusaur? There is nothing shiny, magic or fairy like in Venusaur. Infact, it's the opposite: full of poison, dirt (poison has dirt), and its just like a toad. Nothing magical there.
no but check the list of physical/special moves it learns with power bigger then 60 base and what coverage doe the other starter pokemon get through out generations?
I think every Kanto starter has enough coverage and dosen't need more of it.
why did Venusaur get the less coverage then the other two?
check out what coverage type wise do they have. They can , it not? it also has a rivalry with them and others.
nice ideas with Typhlosion.
This is a ridiculous question because there isn't a need to give it a Fighting or Dark type move. It does fine with its current movepool, doesn't need it for its design, doesn't need it to keep up with other Pokemon of the same type, and has gone seven generations without gaining one. The only reason we're talking about it is because you want it to have a move of every type.if you would need to add it a fighting or dark type move what would you give it?
Ropes. Not vines.but using ropes with the right way with mass and jump techniques can make wonders.
Why use Normal-type moves when it gets STAB on Poison? Bug doesn't resist Poison, either.ok tusche, it has enogh normal type moves for that.
Grass-type moves would still hit Rock/Dragon, Rock/Grass, and Rock/Bug with regular effectiveness. Venusaur is not weak to any of their STABs.ice/steel? ice/poison? ice/dragon? rock/dragon? rock/grass? rock/bug? fairy/poison?
Dragon/Poison, Fire/Poison, Ghost/Poison, pure Poison, resist Grass and Poison, but are weak to Ground, which Venusaur has with Earthquake. (Bug/Poison is hit neutrally by Ground) The only combination I could see that would resist both without a weakness is Poison/Flying.what if the oponent has a dual typing that resists its grass and poison moves? how many do we have that can do that by now?
Battles aren't just about types. There's movesets, abilities, stats, items, and other factors to consider. There's no one answer to "would a Venusaur beat a Shedinja?" because the battle can go all sorts of ways. (and you shouldn't be looking to counter one specific Pokemon with it)what about Venusaur vs Shedinja? vs Aegislash? vs Kangaskhan?
vs Ditto?
Biological energy trees? ...So, photosynthesis?thats a little bad after 7 generations taking that acid batteries are known and scientist try to create biological energy trees.
Personally, I feel like it's got enough coverage with Solar Beam and Thunder Punch, but adding in Thunderbolt and Energy Ball to free up choices (don't have to force it to be a mixed attacker or to get sunlight) would help it get more use!I think Typhlosion needs: Scald (Emboar learns it, and Typhlosion's supposed to be a Volcano, so like Volcanion it should be able to learn it to), Earth Power, Thunderbolt (static electricity). It desperately needs this coverage. Maybe throw in energy Ball so it can hold its own against other Pokemon and making it a better choice than Delphox or Houndoom (which according to smogon are recommended to use in its place).