Never played V generation games.

[Everclear]

Honestly you didn't miss much. The Gen 5 games are basically the Gen 4 games with slightly better graphics but that's kind of it. B/W are really overrated when it comes to their plot any ways. B/W2 are better but again you aren't really missing out even if you don't play them.

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

N is a very interesting flavour of rival

N isn't a rival. He's a villainous team boss.

 

[prog rocker]

N isn't a rival. He's a villainous team boss.

I don't think those two can be mutually exclusive.

 

[FinnishPokéFan92]

I don't think those two can be mutually exclusive.

Still, Bulbapedia doesn't classify him as a rival. He's more of an antihero than rival.

 

[Puddle]

To elaborate further on what I said about Black 2 and White 2's story, I think it is a good story by Pokemon game standards. In fact it might be slightly above average, with some good characterization, especially for Hugh (I won't spoil anything as the OP hasn't played the games yet). The only reason it pales in comparison to Black and White's story is because the latter is exceptionally good. Black 2 and White 2 are still great games, and I applaud Game Freak for making a true sequel rather than just rewriting an existing story like they did in Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon.

For me, the reigning monarchs of story are Sun and Moon, easily. It could just be the 3D graphics but I was much more invested in the trajectories of Guzma, Lusamine and especially Lillie - all of them have distinct arcs that leave them in a very different place at the end of the story, and their hang-ups and development revolve around self-perception and interactions with other characters. I felt Gen VII did well to have the plot's focus be almost entirely on humans, rather than the Pokémon.

The story in Sun and Moon is excellent (although I can't say the same about Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon), and I personally rank it as the second best story in Pokemon game history. The reason I like Black and White's story slightly more is because I feel it better serves the gameplay. While Sun and Moon's story does certain things better (for example, it develops several characters rather than just focusing on one), it also impedes the gameplay slightly by having too much extraneous dialogue.

If both stories were adapted into books or films, Sun and Moon's would win, no contest. But I think Black and White's story works ever-so-slightly better as a video game story.

 

[Esserise]

I'm going to give voice to some heresy and say that the Gen V story... wasn't that good. I certainly don't remember the majority of the game's events differing significantly from those of almost every other game, and for the most part I wouldn't say the characters undergo substantial growth, or have an arc. N is a very interesting flavour of rival, but functionally little different from Blue. Team Plasma has a smidge of depth but is still obviously 'the' evil team. Bianca and Cheren have very distinct personalities, but I was never particularly attached to them and wasn't moved by their personal situations. There's some great subversive sections in the late game, certainly, but that's the only section that sticks in my mind.

I'd pretty firmly disagree with the idea that N, Cheren, and Bianca don't go through arcs. I think the games are very clear about what each character is doing on a fundamental level. N has to break out of his sheltered upbringing and experience different viewpoints by being allowed to interact with the outside world for the first time, which eventually causes him to question and reject his indoctrinated beliefs. Cheren has to discover that strength alone and "being the best" are fundamentally pointless achievements if you can't put that strength toward a cause. And Bianca's whole purpose is to figure out what exactly she wants to do in life. She starts out easygoing and carefree, but experiences personal losses that help her discover what she appreciates most.

People do overstate the degree to which, say, the Gym Leaders in Gen 5 "are characters," sure, but the core cast get lots of focus and assessment.

This is a great point. I think my main issue with Plasma is that most of the time they act and behave like your run of the mill evil team. See, for example, how the Team Plasma members mistreat Munna in the Dream Yard.

I feel like this was very much intentional, though. I mean, they're literally dressed like crusaders and are said to steal peoples' Pokémon. You're not supposed to think they're good people, just that their underlying logic might have a point (and that's why we have N, to act as a more sympathetic proponent of that same philosophy).

Also I don't see how you can go with SM for 'reigning monarchs' of story. Like any other gen bar Gen 5, there is no real story and the one thing that is going on with the legends is just an awful reskin of Kyurem. Only positive thing is the characterization of some characters.

I like Gen 5's story more than Gen 7's, but Gen 7 is definitely still trying harder than other generations. I mean for me that's why the games have become borderline unplayable, because so much time is spent on character scenes and moments that end up making the gameplay drag. But I'm happy to praise its main character work almost as much as Gen 5's.

Specifically with regards to Necrozma, I feel like it's actually handled better in the narrative than Kyurem, which was introduced largely out of nowhere and Team Plasma just are in possession of it. All that fuss about working to obtain a Legendary Pokémon in BW, and now they can just mosey on over to the Giant Chasm and snatch one up? Necrozma on the other hand has a bespoke backstory that is articulated to us via the Ultra Recon Squad, who have a motive in wanting to heal their world and atone for what their ancestors did. And their world's people have a reciprocal relationship with Necrozma - it once gave them light, but then they became greedy and tried to siphon off too much. That corrupted Necrozma and turned it into a reflection of them, becoming insatiably hungry for light and taking every ounce it could from their world, and now it targets Alola. Neither party is unsympathetic (both the URS and Necrozma inherited a legacy they didn't ask for), but they are both also harmful in some capacity (URS being willing to sacrifice Cosmog in order to restore their world and Necrozma imperiling Alola's whole ecosystem in its thirst for light). Necrozma's impending freedom from the Megalo Tower is also used as a way to gradually build tension up to the climax in a way that Kyurem doesn't do anything comparable to.

Still, Bulbapedia doesn't classify him as a rival. He's more of an antihero than rival.

tbf Bulbapedia is a communal fan source, not an objective arbiter of the facts. I think it is largely indisputable that although N is formally a villanous team leader, he also has many traits in common with rivals. What exactly you do with this information is up to you, but when it comes to discussing the role of the character within the storyline and the gameplay, it warrants mention.

 

[WyndonCalling]

I'd pretty firmly disagree with the idea that N, Cheren, and Bianca don't go through arcs. I think the games are very clear about what each character is doing on a fundamental level. N has to break out of his sheltered upbringing and experience different viewpoints by being allowed to interact with the outside world for the first time, which eventually causes him to question and reject his indoctrinated beliefs. Cheren has to discover that strength alone and "being the best" are fundamentally pointless achievements if you can't put that strength toward a cause. And Bianca's whole purpose is to figure out what exactly she wants to do in life. She starts out easygoing and carefree, but experiences personal losses that help her discover what she appreciates most.

People do overstate the degree to which, say, the Gym Leaders in Gen 5 "are characters," sure, but the core cast get lots of focus and assessment.

I wonder if the graphics had an unexpectedly large impact on the weight of the story for me. I had to rack my brains to remember that Bianca... had an altercation with her dad?... who I seem to recall was a generic overworld sprite - I think? No wonder it never impressed upon me as much as Lillie's confrontation with creepy-grin Lusamine. Upon reflection, S&M's ability to convey facial expressions and body language really elevated it for me; another stand-out scene was Guzma's attempt to disband Skull.

 

[Esserise]

I wonder if the graphics had an unexpectedly impact on the weight of the story for me. I had to rack my brains to remember that Bianca... had an altercation with her dad?... who I seem to recall was a generic overworld sprite - I think? No wonder it never impressed upon me as much as Lillie's confrontation with creepy-grin Lusamine. Upon reflection, S&Ms ability to convey facial expressions and body language really elevated it for me; another stand-out scene was Guzma's attempt to disband Skull.

That's certainly been my experience. I think the level of expression afforded by the move to 3D has done wonders for the story aspect - the sprite games were fine in this regard, but for me, their strengths came almost entirely from the ideas involved and from the music backing up any particular moment. Giving your characters the ability to emote to the audience adds a whole dimension of communication that just wasn't there before, and I think they've been all the better for it.

 

[Galactic_V]

Since I've been having some time lately with all the Covid stuff, I'm replaying Diamond, Heart Gold, Black, X, Alpha Sapphire, Sun and Shield all simultaneously. In my opinion BW has the best story of all of them, then followed by SM. But I'm not that fond of this former one for some other reasons as I'm not that into the Alola region and, as others have said, cutscenes drag way too long, especially when you start the game and it takes forever to get your starter.

BW manages to get your attention story-wise and keep your main core Pokemon game's gameplay, which works better for me.

 

[PinkThunder]

I started to play Pokemon Black Yesterday,there's a Thread where I can tell us my experience playing in the forums?

 

[prog rocker]

@PinkThunder Here you go.

 

[Leaf_Ranger]

I understand that the story might be a little better in BW than B2W2 but the abnoxious friendly and slow paced start with the battles and small tutorials are just way annoying. Cheren and Bianca are just boring.

 

[Rocket Zigzagoon]

Yep, Black and White's story are quite thoughtful and complex, and while B2W2 somewhat returned to traditional-style plots, it does have emphasis on Team Plasma split and the infighting between them. That builds up the intensity of story before the Elite Four. Hugh is also an antihero substitute for the "rival" role due to his personal vendetta on Team Plasma, although this was mellowed down later.

And the disbandment of Team Plasma, although happened offscreen and post-game, was a neat sight to behold.

B2W2 has the larger selection of Pokémon than BW, and more post-game stuff after it.

When I am back from hiatus two years ago, I played B2W2 before I jumped to USUM.