No, really. Why were aspects of Japan present in the anime deemed problematic?

[Norzan]

So rice balls aren't actually donuts? Brock lied to me.

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

So rice balls aren't actually donuts? Brock lied to me.

He even lied about his name!

 

[Galactic_V]

So rice balls aren't actually donuts? Brock lied to me.

What are "jelly donuts" next to a dead mother who suddenly comes back without any explanation whatsoever lol

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

What are "jelly donuts" next to a dead mother who suddenly comes back without any explanation whatsoever lol

It was his father though who said that, not him.

 

[Galactic_V]

It was his father though who said that, not him.

I know. I was just pointing out how the jelly donut thing is nowhere near as bad as Takeshi's mother coming back.

 

[Dogasu]

I must confess I'm struggling with the notion that a team using their Japanese translation skills to market a Japanese cultural output also loathes Japanese culture with a fury typically reserved for religious iconoclasm circa 1550. There's something to be said for having higher expectations of the target audience and their willingness to both understand and internalise other cultures, but no, I think it's a stretch that this team equates the Japanese language with pornographic material and the likes.

Notice I never said the message was intentional. But, if you're a Japanese American kid and you see your parents' or grandparents' native language *consistently* being expunged from Japanese imports then that's the feeling you're going to walk away with regardless of the localizers' intent.

Again, we native English speakers basically never have the same thing happen to us so it's harder for us to truly understand what that must feel like.

When it comes to their "Japanese translation skills," I think it was in one of the 4Kids movies' DVD commentaries where Michael Haigney or someone stated that they don't actually do any of the translating themselves and that all that work is done for them in Japan. The late 90s FUNimation Dragon Ball Z dub was done the same way. After the foreign licensor gets the translated scripts sent to them from Japan they go in and fix any grammatical or lip sync issues and make whatever rewrites / add in jokes, puns, etc. they want. I don't know how many Japanese speakers, if any, 4Kids had on their staff.

In any case, the idea that a company would profit off the work of a group of people it doesn't respect isn't the tiniest bit farfetched.

 

[Konja7]

I don't like dub editions, but I've never understand the problem with the riceball change.

The riceball is a common food in Japan. So, I wasn't surprised they replace it for a common food in USA.

After all, they want to convey the same feeling that the original with that food.

 

[fluffy-wooloo]

Notice I never said the message was intentional. But, if you're a Japanese American kid and you see your parents' or grandparents' native language *consistently* being expunged from Japanese imports then that's the feeling you're going to walk away with regardless of the localizers' intent.

I'm sorry I'm not trying to sound rude but it sounds like you're speaking for a minority that you don't actually represent because I remember that you claimed to be a blond non-Japanese person on your website. So how can someone who isn't Japanese or a descendant of them feel offended in place of actual Japanese-Americans? I understand empathy but this reminds me of when white people on social media get offended by perceived racism or bigotry towards another group of people and then try to speak for minorities even though those minorities might not necessarily be upset about the perceived bigotry. It's like hijacking and it comes across as condescending. I'd rather hear from actual Japanese-Americans about how they feel.

I actually agree with those who are saying that if 4kids was xenophobic or racist, they wouldn't have made dubbing anime such a big part of their brand.

 

[Everclear]

I don't like dub editions, but I've never understand the problem with the riceball change.

The riceball is a common food in Japan. So, I wasn't surprised they replace it for a common food in USA.

After all, they want to convey the same feeling that the original with that food.

The thing is that balls of rice don't seem that stereotypically Japanese. It's not something like sushi or wasabi that most people would think of when they imagine Japanese cuisine so I am a little surprised that 4Kids treated rice balls like they were unfitting for a cartoon.

 

[Hidden Mew]

I actually agree with those who are saying that if 4kids was xenophobic or racist, they wouldn't have made dubbing anime such a big part of their brand.

I don't think that making dubbed anime a big part of their brand would necessarily mean that they couldn't be xenophobic or racist. At the end of the day, they wanted to make money and jumping into anime to market them to kids at the time made sense with that goal in mind. They could still be xenophobic and that wouldn't matter since they just wanted to make a profit.

It's also quite possible that they weren't deliberately thinking of these changes as being racist or xenophobic at the time. I obviously can't say what they were thinking with these changes, but people can say or do racist things without intending to come off that way. I don't think it gives off the best kind of impression when they were so desperate to erase signs of Japanese culture or have some of their dubs take place in the U.S. instead of Japan. At best, it's talking down to their audience, assuming that they wouldn't understand what anything could be if it doesn't take place in America or has American food. At worst, it does come off as xenophobic to treat Japanese culture, its language and the country itself as something that would confuse kids. I don't think kids would have been so confused over something like a rice ball or knowing that Yugi and his friends in Yu-Gi-Oh! are actually Japanese high school kids that they couldn't follow either series. Even if they didn't intend to give those kind of implications with their changes, treating signs of other cultures like that would still be problematic to say the least.

 

[WyndonCalling]

The thing is that balls of rice don't seem that stereotypically Japanese. It's not something like sushi or wasabi that most people would think of when they imagine Japanese cuisine so I am a little surprised that 4Kids treated rice balls like they were unfitting for a cartoon.

To be fair, we're talking over two decades ago now - I think it may be easy to underestimate how much more the West has been exposed to Japanese culture since then, thanks in no small part to shows such as Pokémon (and thanks in overwhelming part to the meteoric rise of the internet). Even today, it's easy for invested fans like us to overstate the cultural awareness of the population at large.

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

I'm sorry I'm not trying to sound rude but it sounds like you're speaking for a minority that you don't actually represent because I remember that you claimed to be a blond non-Japanese person on your website. So how can someone who isn't Japanese or a descendant of them feel offended in place of actual Japanese-Americans?

So,what you're saying is, "You can't criticize xenophobia unless you belong to a certain ethnicity" am I right? Hardly disagree.

The thing is that balls of rice don't seem that stereotypically Japanese.

Who cares about if it's not? It's a japanese food.

I actually agree with those who are saying that if 4kids was xenophobic or racist, they wouldn't have made dubbing anime such a big part of their brand.

Why? Do you think they licensed those shows because of their love of japanese?

The riceball is a common food in Japan. So, I wasn't surprised they replace it for a common food in USA

Why? There is nothing to be afraid of foreign foods.

 

[JinksChow]

So,what you're saying is, "You can't criticize xenophobia unless you belong to a certain ethnicity" am I right? Hardly disagree.

Just to make sure, did you mean to say "hard disagree" or "hardly disagree"?

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

Just to make sure, did you mean to say "hard disagree" or "hardly disagree"?

English is not my first language, so I'm not sure what the difference is.

 

[swiftgallade46]

English is not my first language, so I'm not sure what the difference is.

“Hardly disagree” = “barely disagree”
“Hard disagree” = “disagree very much”

 

[marshiyanmisuta]

“Hardly disagree” = “barely disagree”
“Hard disagree” = “disagree very much”

Second one then.

 

[Dogasu]

I'm sorry I'm not trying to sound rude but it sounds like you're speaking for a minority that you don't actually represent because I remember that you claimed to be a blond non-Japanese person on your website.

White people calling out other white people for their problematic bullshit is not a bad thing though...?

 

[Johtoo]

This topic reminds me of the fiasco regarding a PS4 game: Ghost of tsushima. White people started complaining about a Japanese game made by Western devs, yet when it came to the reception of the game, everyone in Japan loved it. The game was even named as an honorary tourism ambassador for an island in Japan. Regarding Pokemon, I remember the English dub of the anime aired in Japan in the early days to help kids learn English This is where (i believe) the type wild English version originated from. What i'm saying is, no one here has the right to call the western dubbing practices problematic - only those who are from Japan or are Japanese. If these issues were truly problematic, they would have been called out from it a long, long time ago.

 

[Johtoo]

White people calling out other white people for their problematic bullshit is not a bad thing though...?

I think this falls along the lines of (this is not your fight). You don't belong to this ethnicity/race, therefore you should only be there as an ally - not the person leading the charge.
I mean, it's one thing to call out racism as a white person (where you actively see it), but it's another to make assumptions based off another culture without belonging to it yourself. But that's how I view it.

 

[JinksChow]

Regarding Pokemon, I remember the English dub of the anime aired in Japan in the early days to help kids learn English This is where (i believe) the type wild English version originated from.

I'm guessing that you are referring to Pocket Monsters Encore, which aired with both Japanese and English audio tracks. There's also Pokemon de English, which was the show after the show and teaches English more directly.

Also a bit of sidetracking here, I've been going through Video Research Lab archives to record Pokemon anime ratings for the Chinese Pokemon wiki, and I find it amusing that the rerun of Pokemon Episode 1 (under Pocket Monsters Encore) received higher ratings and also ranked higher than the original broadcast.